Lyndsie and Daniel got another baby ALREADY???

[Mama Mia]

Assuming that the birth mothers were teens/very young .. I think it is very likely that this couple would have been chosen because of the traits that many are seeing as negatives. One income family = stay at home mom. Early Twenties = Not Old, energetic, etc. 30 something can seem awfully old to a teen, and I have heard a couple of teens complain that the "old" moms have themselves to blame for not having kids because they were too busy off having fun and now want to adopt. Not saying it's a good or accurate attitude, but it is definitely out there.

[QueenMother]

Horrible story, but at the same time, fathers do have rights to their children.... and shame on their social worker and/or lawyer for not preparing them.

Sad story.

When our daughter's mother lost her oarental rights we began the adoption process. our daughter had come to us through foster care, and while we had never before considered adopting, we knew she was ours from the first moment we saw her. Adoption was not to be. Her father, whom she had never heard of, nor he her suddenly wanted to remain her father when he learned of her. He was and still is serving time in a federal prison, but he does have his rights.

Our daughter spoke up and refused visitation with him at the prison, which ironically was close to our home. She had refused any contact with him and when she turned 18, she chamged her name to ours, and we did adopt.

She's not angry anymore, in fact she doesn't care at all. We do talk openly about him and her bio mother--she refers to her as a womb donor and wants nothing to do with either of them. We have found her bio brother and sister, both adopted out of state, and we all all good friends.

Our situation is different as this man was not wanted by his daughter, and she wanted to be free of him. The court said he had rights as her father and he got to keep the title.

I am struck that by the fact that things seem to always work out for Lyndsie and Daniel. They land on their feet and it's all rainbows in their world. I wish I could grasp onto a few of their rainbows.

[Milly-Molly-Mandy]

I can't see it as cruel when they are the mother until they relinquish. It is a case of hard decisions all the way around.

Absolutely!

[Clementine]

How come that so many babies are given up for adoption in the US? Is it because of personal beliefs that abortion is wrong, for social and financial reasons, because it is difficult to get proper contraceptives or abortions...?

There are 9 M people in Sweden and I think that 3-5 Swedish children are given up for adoption every year. Usually by mothers who have really difficult lives with mental illness and/or drug dependency.

But it's easy and inexpensive to get birth control pills, the morning after pill is sold OTC at all pharmacies, abortions are free and don't cost anything and young or poor mothers who keep the babies get help from the government with money and a place to live. Also childcare costs very little, maybe $50 per month if you have a low income, for full time nursery with all meals included. So nobody really has to give the baby up for adoption because they are poor or have no place to live or no childcare. They are encouraged to keep the baby and get help to do so.

Are there any studies about why so many mothers give their babies up for adoption in the US?

[MrsKay]

I've also had more than one request from a potential birth mom, to foster or adopt a baby, and I haven't even talked about adoption aside from it being something I'd like to do maybe a decade from now. The people have just picked me out as the first person with fertility issues that they know. I've turned them all down, because the moms didn't seem to be in a totally good frame of mind (they wanted me to adopt because they knew Social Services would take the baby at birth, or the father didn't want a baby, reasons like that, which weren't the reasons I'd want from a birth mom). I didn't want to involve my family in something that might leave us with no baby, or a birth mom harassing us, or anything that would disrupt the lives of the family I have. It's very possible that I could have had adoptions turn out well, but I'm not crazy enough to risk it. I'm betting Lyndsie is, and thankfully for the sake of the kids, who have to live with the potential for craziness, she's gotten lucky. Then again, I also lack the support of loads of people to help pressure a potential birth mother to sign away her rights and not come back.

ETA: I didn't read the whole thread before I posted, but this : rosylittlethings.typepad.com/posie_gets_cozy/2011/11/well-things-fell-apart.html was one thing that I was very much afraid of. I'm pretty torn on the rights of the fathers; I worry that they might be abusive assholes, but then again, I've seen some amazing guys go through bullshit with baby mamas, custody, adoption, etc. I just really hope no one was, or will be, hurt in Dan and Lyndsie's case.

[WonderingInWA]

In true snark, anyone have any guesses on when Lyndsie will start Aubrey on her makeup lessons and wearing lipstick? And certainly pageants are in her future! Daniel better work extra hard because those costumes and cosmetics are expensive! I feel really sorry for Ethan -- Lyndsie got her Aubrey (can't believe she recycled the name -- um, that's really tacky!). He got lucky and then he became a big brother to the baby Lyndsie REALLY wanted. So sad.

[WonderingInWA]

And I wonder who paid for the professional photography here? http://forthisjourneywereon.com/?p=175

Do you think she "Beggs"'d for it?

[formergothardite]

I wonder how she is going to react when Ethan gets jealous of the new baby and hauls off and tries (or actually does) hits her. I can see her flipping out.

[treemom]

They looks super duper happy. Would love to know the adoption story...

Am not surprised they used the same name, my Mum always knew she wanted to name her first daughter Elspeth after her Mum who died when she was 3, she was pregnant with a girl, named her Elspeth Rose, miscarried at 20 weeks-& then 12 months later gave birth to Elspeth Kate.

I dont see a problem with it. It's not like she ever KNEW the first baby.

edited as missing a word....blaming it on the brain cells i killed at the work xmas party last night. oww.

Naming a baby after your mother is a bit different. (although I think reusing a name is fine even if it seems weird to me)

[luckylibrarian]

How come that so many babies are given up for adoption in the US? Is it because of personal beliefs that abortion is wrong, for social and financial reasons, because it is difficult to get proper contraceptives or abortions...?

There are 9 M people in Sweden and I think that 3-5 Swedish children are given up for adoption every year. Usually by mothers who have really difficult lives with mental illness and/or drug dependency.

But it's easy and inexpensive to get birth control pills, the morning after pill is sold OTC at all pharmacies, abortions are free and don't cost anything and young or poor mothers who keep the babies get help from the government with money and a place to live. Also childcare costs very little, maybe $50 per month if you have a low income, for full time nursery with all meals included. So nobody really has to give the baby up for adoption because they are poor or have no place to live or no childcare. They are encouraged to keep the baby and get help to do so.

Are there any studies about why so many mothers give their babies up for adoption in the US?

I think much of it has to do with cost and where you live. In a larger town or city, there are more resources available than in the more rural parts of the country. Birth control isn't free here in the US (yet), and abortion is often prohibitively expensive. Some areas don't have Planned Parenthood, especially since it has been defunded. Fundies do have a foothold in many areas - like where I live in rural SE Ohio. I think a lot of teens don't know about the many options for birth control - beyond condoms - because of abstinence only sex ed. When I was a teenager, I knew about the different methods of birth control, but I would have had no idea how to get them. We didn't have Planned Parenthood, and I would have been too afraid to go to a doctor and ask.

[lilwriter85]

Someone is probably funding the adoptions for them, a parent, or other relative. And who knows, maybe they have a trust fund or something and decided to fundraise anyway. It's pretty common with adoptions these days. When we were considering it, we planned on paying for everything ourselves. We were lucky and insurance covered IVF and it worked.

A relative funding the adoptions could possible with Daniel and Lyndsie. But I doubt their parents are funding it. Both are from large families in which they are 8 or 9 kids. I think both of their moms are/were SAHM's. Daniel's parents are older and I believe Daniel is one of the middle kids and I think most of his siblings are adults and the younger ones are teens. His parents seem to be ok finance wise. Lyndsie is the oldest child in her family and she still has several siblings that live at home and her youngest sibling s 3 or 4. Her parents still going to supporting kids for a long time. Lyndsie and Daniel probably don't have trust funds. They could have wealthy relatives who are lending them money. I think on the blog it seemed a bit implied that some of their relatives were well to do.

[bananacat]

Normally I think it's really cruel how some birth mothers can promise a child and then pull out at the last second. But after hearing about that woman - writing the baby's name in the sand? Pictures of themselves in pink clothes, monogrammed crap? Yeah, I think I'd pull back my offer too. Those people are so in love with themselves, I don't see how there is much left for the kids. It's like they are their latest toys - like, see my new purse? Ick. Just, ick.

And if they are on one income and took that many professional photos - holy crap, can you imagine what that must have cost? They are probably in debt up to their eyeballs but claiming it's all from God.

I never think it's cruel for a birth mother to make a promise and then change her mind. As hard as it is for the potential adoptive parents, it's a much harder ordeal for the birth mother in most cases. Even if the mother didn't plan the pregnancy and doesn't want to raise the baby, it's still incredibly difficult to give the child up in many cases (of course every case is different so so women never feel any pain and that's fine too). There's very often a hormonal bonding to the infant, and in any case the birth mother wants what is best for the baby. It's not all about the adoptive parents. Nobody is entitled to a baby, ever. And babies aren't products that you can buy. No matter how much money they spend expecting to get a baby, they still aren't entitled to getting a baby. Maybe birth mothers don't always have perfect judgment, but it's their right to decide which family is best for the child.

[Guest Anonymous]

I never think it's cruel for a birth mother to make a promise and then change her mind. As hard as it is for the potential adoptive parents, it's a much harder ordeal for the birth mother in most cases. Even if the mother didn't plan the pregnancy and doesn't want to raise the baby, it's still incredibly difficult to give the child up in many cases (of course every case is different so so women never feel any pain and that's fine too). There's very often a hormonal bonding to the infant, and in any case the birth mother wants what is best for the baby. It's not all about the adoptive parents. Nobody is entitled to a baby, ever. And babies aren't products that you can buy. No matter how much money they spend expecting to get a baby, they still aren't entitled to getting a baby. Maybe birth mothers don't always have perfect judgment, but it's their right to decide which family is best for the child.

This. You have said it beautifully. I think that adoption agencies and every other professional involved should be required to spell out in detail that adoption is about finding families for children, not children for families, and that there can be no guarantees because there is no entitlement.

[Rosa]

How come that so many babies are given up for adoption in the US?

We have the highest unintended pregnancy rate in the industrialized world, bad sex education, not a good social safety net for mothers of young children (you would not believe the number of homeless young families in my city, which is a pretty affluent place - one of the perennial volunteer opportunities at the downtown homeless shelter I support is "child care room staff"), no paid maternity leave, and a strong anti-abortion culture - and of course many crisis pregnancy centers that are *very* happy to hook a mom up with potential adoptive parents.

[Sprocket]

In all things stalking, it turns out that I used to live about 20 mins from Daniel's late grandparents. But then again, GA is a relatively small state....

Oh, and it looks like Lyndsie did/does have a job after all. She's a "booking agent".

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Extended- ... 956?v=info

[lilwriter85]

In all things stalking, it turns out that I used to live about 20 mins from Daniel's late grandparents. But then again, GA is a relatively small state....

Oh, and it looks like Lyndsie did/does have a job after all. She's a "booking agent".

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Extended- ... 956?v=info

I remember Lyndsie mentioning the band that some of Daniel's siblings are in. I think her booking agent job for the group is a part time thing.

[Mama Mia]

I think the relatively large number of adoptions is related to the complete lack of virtually everything listed as provided in Sweeden.

Combined with a huge amount of consumerism / materialism that convinces people that if you don't /can't provide the "best" of everything ( or at least a middle class existence ) --you will be a failure.

AND - that you are a failure and shouldn't be a parent if you need government help with providing the basics ( if you are lucky enough to get some modicum of government support - which is difficult in the first place )

AND - a strong belief that if you have a child in your teens you will never complete school, never get a good job and so on and so forth.

Even with all of that the rate of children who are voluntarily placed for adoption is pretty low. I'm sure it varies by region.

ETA - I don't think any of these are good things ..just stating why I think women with unplanned pregnancies might be more likely to relinquish their children here. Also why they are more likely to get pregnant.

[lilwriter85]

And I wonder who paid for the professional photography here? http://forthisjourneywereon.com/?p=175

Do you think she "Beggs"'d for it?

I was thinking the same thing. Lyndsie probaby did "Beggs"d for it lol. It was probably same the photographer who shot the wedding.

[Guest Anonymous]

I can't imagine having a photographer present when the family is united with a newborn child.

When my niece was born, her very jealous brother spent the day in a daze, and no amount of 'big brother presents' could shake the fact that his little world had changed forever and he wasn't immediately thrilled. I can't imagine how her would have reacted if he'd been changed into best clothes and marched into a photoshoot. :|

[lilwriter85]

I think little Ethan might be used to various photoshoots since L&D like taking pictures all the time. Aubrey will probably be used to constant picture taking by the time she is 1 and I think she will be in toddler pageants.

[Witsec7]

These serial xtian adopters seem to have a direct link to some kind of baby faucet. They defy the reality of adoption as related by some FJ posters. I cannot help but think that there is something askew and missing from the stories.

[masagoroll]

These serial xtian adopters seem to have a direct link to some kind of baby faucet. They defy the reality of adoption as related by some FJ posters. I cannot help but think that there is something askew and missing from the stories.

I think they must be doing private adoptions from "good Christian girls" who get pregnant as unmarried teens. The parents of the church-going teens are all to eager to get rid of the shame by adopting the baby out and then praising their daughters as selfless anti-abortion examples. :roll:

I went to evangelical Christian private school, and a buttload of girls from there got pregnant shortly after graduation!

[ThisOlGirl]

These serial xtian adopters seem to have a direct link to some kind of baby faucet. They defy the reality of adoption as related by some FJ posters. I cannot help but think that there is something askew and missing from the stories.

I was thinking the same thing, except I was thinking along the lines of buying a baby. I don't know if that actually happens, or if it's just some sort of urban legend, but the first thing I thought was "Well, maybe if L&/or D's parents had some extra cash laying around, and they know how much L&D want a baby..."

NOT saying that's what they did or that they came by their daughter illegally. Again, I don't even know if some kind of baby black market really exists. That was just what popped into my head.

[NurseNell]

NOT saying that's what they did or that they came by their daughter illegally. Again, I don't even know if some kind of baby black market really exists. That was just what popped into my head.

Yes, the black market still exists. I think the more likely scenario is a private adoption through their church or friends. An agency would not place a 2nd child so soon, would not place with a couple so young, and would not place with someone whose cancer was so recent.

[desertvixen]

AND - a strong belief that if you have a child in your teens you will never complete school, never get a good job and so on and so forth.

I think this is a valid fear, especially since we have a lack of social supports for women in these areas, and if the woman does not have a supportive family, she will face a lot of struggle.