Josh & Anna 58: Losing JB's Money All the Way to the Supreme Court

[Sops2]

There's a photo on Reddit purporting to be Anna at  Big Sandy Family conference, so this thread seems to be the best place to post part of this week's programme of speakers at the IBLP conference

It is livestreamed if any of you would like to find out what Gabe Cleator is talking about. ( Gabe seems to have taken over the post of golden boy from David Waller)

[FluffySnowball]

2 hours ago, Father Son Holy Goat said:

Do you mean fathers and sons everywhere or in the Duggar family?

I mean the Duggars in particular, although power imbalances between adult children and their parents aren't good in general.

So any grown child having to rely on mum or dad for employment is in a tough spot, but with all we know about JB Duggar, (his fixation on control and fundamentalism) this really is a recipe for disaster. Don't get me wrong, I have little sympathy for Josh, but even so, this is messed up. 

[Sk8ter]

3 hours ago, Sops2 said:

There's a photo on Reddit purporting to be Anna at  Big Sandy Family conference, so this thread seems to be the best place to post part of this week's programme of speakers at the IBLP conference

It is livestreamed if any of you would like to find out what Gabe Cleator is talking about. ( Gabe seems to have taken over the post of golden boy from David Waller)

"What is under your tent?"

My juvenile mind has run off with that in a very inappropriate manner  😄

[AussieKrissy]

9 hours ago, CarrotCake said:

I actually think that could be a very positive outcome for Anna and the kids. Since a man that wants to marry a divorcée and take in a bunch of kids from a felon is probably not a fundie.

Although she might be vulnurable for shitty men.

Yep perfect picking for a predator that wants access to her kids. (touch wood, don't want that shit out there in the universe, feel gross writing it). We already know Anna doesn't have the best taste in men (well her parents didn't). But she is an adult now and still doesn't leave....

1 hour ago, Sk8ter said:

"What is under your tent?"

My juvenile mind has run off with that in a very inappropriate manner  😄

same.... is this as talk about masturbation, well the sin of it anyway?

[QuiverFullofBooks]

On 4/8/2024 at 5:17 PM, Howl said:

If JB crosses the rainbow bridge while Josh is in prison, Josh will be in desperate financial straights when he gets out. 

I don’t think so. The Duggars are solidly wealthy now, and JB has Josh’s number. He’ll be a beneficiary of a trust, with a life estate in a home, and possibly a job behind the scenes. JB won’t let the grandkids suffer, and cutting Anna off would be cruel and dangerous (very bad publicity and a possible tell-all). And God help them all if Josh really had nothing to lose.

[Kiki03910]

3 hours ago, Sk8ter said:

"What is under your tent?"

My juvenile mind has run off with that in a very inappropriate manner  😄

You and me both!

"Look! It's a polterwang!"

[Cam]

11 hours ago, QuiverFullofBooks said:

I don’t think so. The Duggars are solidly wealthy now, and JB has Josh’s number. He’ll be a beneficiary of a trust, with a life estate in a home, and possibly a job behind the scenes. JB won’t let the grandkids suffer, and cutting Anna off would be cruel and dangerous (very bad publicity and a possible tell-all). And God help them all if Josh really had nothing to lose.

I sometimes wonder if any of JB’s other kids will write a tell-all memoir when he’s gone. Or would he stipulate in his will that inheritance is dependent on continuing loyalty. 

[Howl]

Gabe Cleator's talk: "What is under your tent?"

"Is that a tent peg, or are you just glad to see me."

Thanks, and I'll see myself out. 

[gustava]

We seem to assume that the decision to divorce or stay married is solely Anna's.  But why would Josh, after a decade in prison with little contact with Anna, want to return to her?  He's probably getting letters in prison from younger, more attractive women, and based on the Ashley Madison episodes, he will certainly be writing back.

[Sullie06]

On 4/9/2024 at 12:45 AM, AussieKrissy said:

Yep, I know. I have been working with offenders in and out of custody for over half of my life. 

Building is about the best bet for most offenders. 

Mining is another one that does take them. 

We don't have any mining jobs here but we have a LOT of factory jobs. We also have a couple reentry programs that work directly with a couple local businesses that hire almost exclusively people who are being release from prison or jail. 

 

On 4/9/2024 at 3:01 AM, Giraffe said:

Once Josh gets out I could see people  reporting him for breaking parole. He's only got a decade left at this point. People will remember him when's released. If he goes back to work at the car lot there could potentially be families coming onto the lot. Would he leave when children are there? He's supposed to. But will he? Only if people report him. Even if the pedo gets/keeps a real job, JB will support him the rest of his life. He'll continue being The Golden Failure. 

Most likely the condition will be that he is to have no UNSUPERVISED contact with people under the age of 18. So, for example, if he's working at a car lot and a family comes in to buy a car, it wouldn't be a violation because he wouldn't be alone with those children. Their parents would be supervising him in that context.  

[SweetMamasCafe]

I remember watching the show years ago when Josh and Anna were courting/newlyweds and then the first few babies coming along. I liked Anna, she seemed to have a warmth about her and she must have imagined her life was going to involve a happy marriage and large family. She could never have known Josh would put her through everything he has.

I do wonder whether she'd ever consider divorce, but I think she'd feel she's the one breaking their covenant marriage. In a way I think the kindest thing Josh could do for Anna would be to divorce her and set her free from him.  But he's shown himself to be the sort of person who only thinks about himself and I doubt he's capable of the compassion needed to think of anyone but himself.

[SassyPants]

14 hours ago, QuiverFullofBooks said:

I don’t think so. The Duggars are solidly wealthy now, and JB has Josh’s number. He’ll be a beneficiary of a trust, with a life estate in a home, and possibly a job behind the scenes. JB won’t let the grandkids suffer, and cutting Anna off would be cruel and dangerous (very bad publicity and a possible tell-all). And God help them all if Josh really had nothing to lose.

I truly hope that JB will “not let the grandkids suffer.” I hope he is that benevolent. 

[Alisamer]

11 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

I truly hope that JB will “not let the grandkids suffer.” I hope he is that benevolent. 

Yeah, I'm not sure how that might pan out. First off, there are going to be a zillionty grandkids. I don't think he's the kind of wealthy that could benefit them financially all that much individually. I think he sticks by Josh just because of how Josh reflects on HIM, because it looks bad for someone marketing themselves on their religion to have raised a pedo and then abandoned them in prison. 

But also, politically, Jim Bob is one of those who tends to be "I got mine, screw you." He managed to come from little and grift, market, and promote himself from a tiny house with way too many kids to a giant house and a TV show because of those too many kids. That doesn't relate entirely to his own kids, but it could. 

If I, God forbid, were a Duggar child, I would not be counting on getting ANYTHING from JimBob. Ever. If it happens, it'd be a nice bonus, but I would never build my life counting on getting a windfall from him someday. I think anything he has when he passes will go to Michelle if she's still alive, into a trust for his favorites maybe with a small bit for each grandchild, and a large portion would go to whichever church or ministry he's associating with at the time. 

He's spending like crazy on legal help for Josh, and supporting all his kids for now, but I don't see him being the sort to want to leave a fortune for his kids to benefit from, and with the sheer number of kids and grandkids there are already it's going to thin out as it spreads. 

[Giraffe]

1 hour ago, gustava said:

We seem to assume that the decision to divorce or stay married is solely Anna's.  But why would Josh, after a decade in prison with little contact with Anna, want to return to her?  He's probably getting letters in prison from younger, more attractive women, and based on the Ashley Madison episodes, he will certainly be writing back.

I doubt Josh will divorce her. Why bother? He's already proven he doesn't have a problem cheating (and that's the least of his problematic sexual decisions*). I can easily see him taking the easiest, laziest path - staying with Anna while not even hiding his continued cheating. IMO They'll only get divorced if Anna ends it. 

*decisions & heinous crimes

Edited April 10 by Giraffe

[nolongerIFBx]

17 hours ago, Sk8ter said:

"What is under your tent?"

My juvenile mind has run off with that in a very inappropriate manner  😄

Sometimes you can be a little too clueless

[AussieKrissy]

Even if Josh divorced Anna would she feel free to move on or would she "remain married, in her mind" so that at least she is remaining faithful to her covenant marriage. 

Josh divorcing her might not make her as "free" as we think. It would be a start though, something that is out of her control that she can process and move on from possibly. 

[Coconut Flan]

Anna and Josh did not have a legal covenant marriage. 

[Expectopatronus]

9 hours ago, nolongerIFBx said:

Sometimes you can be a little too clueless

That might be an unintentionally apt description of their theology. 

[viii]

1 hour ago, AussieKrissy said:

Even if Josh divorced Anna would she feel free to move on or would she "remain married, in her mind" so that at least she is remaining faithful to her covenant marriage. 

Josh divorcing her might not make her as "free" as we think. It would be a start though, something that is out of her control that she can process and move on from possibly. 

I don’t know the Duggars’ belief on divorce, but some Christians don’t believe divorced people can get remarried. So Josh divorcing her would lead to nothing but an empty, lonely life. At least her children have their cousins this way. 

[marmalade]

14 hours ago, Sullie06 said:

We don't have any mining jobs here but we have a LOT of factory jobs. We also have a couple reentry programs that work directly with a couple local businesses that hire almost exclusively people who are being release from prison or jail. 

 

Most likely the condition will be that he is to have no UNSUPERVISED contact with people under the age of 18. So, for example, if he's working at a car lot and a family comes in to buy a car, it wouldn't be a violation because he wouldn't be alone with those children. Their parents would be supervising him in that context.  

I believe a,condition of supervision is that supervisors are predetermined. Anna, obviously. But some stranger on a car lot won't pass muster. He would have to pass that sale on to Jed, or whomever he is working with (who would have to be approved by the court). 

[CarrotCake]

17 hours ago, SassyPants said:

I truly hope that JB will “not let the grandkids suffer.” I hope he is that benevolent. 

He already made his kids suffer, I don't expect it will be any different from his grandkids.

[Sullie06]

8 hours ago, marmalade said:

I believe a,condition of supervision is that supervisors are predetermined. Anna, obviously. But some stranger on a car lot won't pass muster. He would have to pass that sale on to Jed, or whomever he is working with (who would have to be approved by the court). 

So here our sex offenders have different conditions for different forms of supervision. For example, him actually spending time and interacting with juveniles (his children, younger siblings, nieces/nephews), yes anyone who is going to supervise him has to be approved by Probation/Parole. They have to come in, with valid ID and have a meeting with the PO, they have to have a working knowledge not only of what he did, in detail, but have an understanding of the conditions of his release. You can have several people who are approved supervisors. 

The second form of supervision is your basic adult supervision. So if an offender is in a store, a restaurant, his place of employment, locations like that, he doesn't have to leave just because someone with children walks in. As long as there are no unsupervised minors in the location and the offender is not interacting directly with the children, they don't have to leave. For example, we have SO's who work in restaurants, Usually back of house, but not always. Obviously  families with children come into the restaurant but they are allowed to work there because there is no reason for the SO to be unsupervised with those kids. 

Also, in terms of employment, we often have whoever is in charge or in the case of an SO being an owner of a business, whoever they work closly with (so for Josh a brother) be a PO approved supervisor. 

[Ashley Ocean]

I remember reading long ago about families hiring experts to spirit their children away from cults like the moonies. I wonder if there are any experts who could entice people away from the IBLP cult? There are certainly people who make that journey for themselves, but I don't see Anna doing that. She's all in on IBLP, even with the misery it has brought to her life. That one brother offered her sanctuary in Josh's early scandal, but I always thought he did that for attention and didn't really have much to offer her. 🤷‍♀️

[noseybutt]

2 hours ago, Ashley Ocean said:

I remember reading long ago about families hiring experts to spirit their children away from cults like the moonies. I wonder if there are any experts who could entice people away from the IBLP cult? There are certainly people who make that journey for themselves, but I don't see Anna doing that. She's all in on IBLP, even with the misery it has brought to her life. That one brother offered her sanctuary in Josh's early scandal, but I always thought he did that for attention and didn't really have much to offer her. 🤷‍♀️

Kidnapping Anna would be illegal, one of many issues the “spiriting away” industry has encountered.

More importantly, Anna has agency and the capacity to make choices. Maybe not as much as other people raised in better circumstances, but she’s still a grown ass woman with no significant cognitive impairment or mental illness that puts her out of touch with reality.

She gets to choose and those choices have consequences.

I agree she is all in on IBLP and it’s hard to watch. To me it’s a reflection of someone never exposed to healthy love and nurturing.

[Ashley Ocean]

53 minutes ago, noseybutt said:

I agree she is all in on IBLP and it’s hard to watch. To me it’s a reflection of someone never exposed to healthy love and nurturing.

I guess the 15 minutes a week of one on one with her Mom wasn't enough to give her the strength of character to make good choices in life!