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"Ride, Sally, Ride" (or Sex Rules): A Masterwork by Doug Wilson


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I just read the recaps @Marmionlinked to. We are in for a wild ride, guys!!

This is ... something else for sure.

 

Thank you, @Hanefor your heroic efforts. Do you need rescue ferrets?

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Hi, friends!  I'm summarizing Doug Wilson's latest pile of dreck so you don't have to. This precis is long, because the freaking book is. It took considerable labor to chip through the author's overbl

Oh. How much less interesting than it could have been. I wondered the same! This reminds me of the hardline pro-life views. Statistics show that there are fewer abortions under liberal gov

As far as I can tell, this premise is of the “slippery slope caused by allowing gay marriage” type (rather than the more interesting “what would a robot have to do to be considered self-conscious and

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Silly @Marmion! Don’t you realize that if the Right Kinds of Christians (TM) get voted into office in the red states, *everyone* will become super moral and give up porn and sex dolls and rush to get married and pop out tons of pretty white babies? It will be just like magic! Or Dougie’s wishful thinking. Who knows?

Oh, and regarding the Abundant Billboard Porn Dougie insists is rampant in the blue states: There are a few VIP stores (stands for “Very Intimate Pleasures”—I call them “PIV”) in my area. Local folks appealed to their zoning boards to ask the VIP folks to be discreet in their advertising (no displays in their shop windows, no boobacious models on billboards), and VIP readily agreed. And has Dougie been in Times Square any time in the last 30 or so years? It’s like a freaking ad for family-friendliness!

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On 11/8/2020 at 12:26 AM, Letgo said:

Such poor writing. This HAS to be a self-published book. 

Doug's outfit* in Moscow, ID has a publishing arm called Canon Press, which is now a separate private company owned by Doug's son, N.D. Wilson.   

Canon Press published this book.  N.D. is a fairly prolific writer of YA fantasy fiction.  Why he let his father's drivel out the door is anyone's guess. 

*When I say outfit, Doug Wilson has a mini empire of churches, schools, a college, a "seminary", a biblical counseling center and who knows what else. 

 

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hoipolloi
18 hours ago, Howl said:

Canon Press published this book.  N.D. is a fairly prolific writer of YA fantasy fiction.  Why he let his father's drivel out the door is anyone's guess. 

Guessing here that nobody edits Doug's work, not even N.D.

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Ride, Sally, Ride, Chapter Five—Though Father and Mother Forsake Me

Benson and Roberta

…in which Ace’s parents kick him out of the house.  Well, actually, Benson and Roberta come to Ace’s room, where he’s reading a book by a seventeenth-century theologian named Turretin, who thought Calvin was the bee’s knees. (Dougie loves chucking in little tidbits like this, so we can see how much more Learned he is than the rest of us.) As Roberta looks on tensely, not saying a word, Benson tells Ace that, in light of Ace’s refusal to apologize for the destruction of Sally, Ace should move out. You can tell this is upsetting to Roberta, but being a Good Christian Wife, she just sits there with her yap shut.

There are many pages of theological blab in which Dougie proves that Benson is “intelligent but simple,” and that Ace is WAYYY smarter than his old man. Benson and Roberta leave, and Ace gets a phone call from Stephanie, whose father has given him some files to read. She senses his dejection, and he tells her he needs a new place to stay. They agree to meet at a coffee shop in the morning.

He gets there before her and orders a coffee for each of them. He rises as she enters.  She looks at the two coffees and says, “How thoughtful. How sweet. How presumptuous.” Because feminist cuntishness has no doubt infected her.  When he pulls out a chair for her, she accuses him of trying to make a scene out of one of those old movies “you can stream from the…bad side of town? One of those dark web movies?” Because we lefties are bound and determined to shield innocent eyes from Cary Grant and James Stewart.

It’s mentioned that, though Ace had gone to a Christian school and Stephanie had gone to a “government” school (yes, Dougie calls it exactly that), the schools had been forced to conduct sex ed courses from third grade on—so they felt a sense of “complete freedom” in discussing sexual matters. So Stephanie, in noticing Ace’s feeble attempt at getting the waitress’s attention, calls him out for “leering at that barista’s rear end.” He says he wasn’t. She says girls know when they and other girls are being checked out. Ace says such observations aren’t always infallible, then points out that lots of the women in the café are wearing tight jeans. He says that they “live in a time when the men are gawkers and the women are exhibitionists….Men have always liked looking, and women have always liked being admired….The thing that is so screwed up about our time is that women have gotten to the point there they can display themselves in a most shameless fashion, desperately competing with the porn ladies and the sexbots, all while reserving to themselves the inscrutable right to be mortally offended if some man they don’t like takes them up on their open invitation, the invitation that is being extended to everyone in the general public who has a working pair of eyes.” See, guys?  This may be a reason why it’s been several days since my last synopsis—I came damn near throwing my iPhone at the wall after reading this.

Ace tells her that he “works hard at not being a pig.” When Stephanie asks him, he admits her jeans were too tight when he first met her, but he approved of her “tailgate derriere.” (Excuse me while I run for some Pepto—I’m getting sick to my stomach.) Stephanie conflates his self control not with godliness but low testosterone. He stiffly replies, “That’s as may be. Perhaps you may want to check  with the young woman I eventually marry. If I choose wisely, she won’t tell you anything about it. But she and I will know.”  Take THAT, Stephanie, you feminist whore! But then he apologizes, and so does she, of course.

She tells him that her father is offering him their basement apartment to stay in. Out of the blue, she tells Ace she’s a virgin. He asks whether that’s because her father became a Christian when she was in high school. She says she isn’t despite her libertarianism, but she’s been thinking about it. The libertarian men have turned her off because some are interested only in women and pot, and the others are economics nerds:  She had no interest in being “the five hundredth woman for any of the first group, and even less interested in being the first woman for any of the second.”

Ace tells her he isn’t a virgin. Stephanie is surprised, and warns him that the prosecutors will be interested in the details of his sexual history. He says he’s aware of that.

As she drives home, Stephanie berates herself for telling Ace she’s a virgin—and is even more upset because she knew she wanted him to know.

Sara Arrives

Sara has found herself a nice apartment and a temp job at a law firm. She’s able to handle the phone system without attracting undue notice—the people at her office just assumed that she hadn’t used their particular phone system before, and she was a quick study. During her three weeks there, the people liked her so much they threw her a going-away party.

Connor The Evil Gay Prosecutor finds himself in need of a receptionist because his receptionist decided to take a vacation. (She gets away with this because of Colorado’s “Byzantine labor laws” and the fact that she’s the mistress of Connor’s boss.) He calls Sara’s temp agency just as she walks into the agency’s door, they offer the job, and Sara is at Connor’s office in “just under forty-five minutes.” (This convenient bit of plotting is worth of “Serena’s Serenity” itself.)  

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4 hours ago, Hane said:

Benson tells Ace that, in light of Ace’s refusal to apologize for the destruction of Sally, Ace should move out

Goodness me, being asked to leave because of criminal behaviour. How shocking. Good luck in the private rental market.

4 hours ago, Hane said:

Ace tells her that he “works hard at not being a pig.”

He's failing badly.

4 hours ago, Hane said:

Stephanie conflates his self control not with godliness but low testosterone.

Personally I think it's more to do with women being repelled by him.

4 hours ago, Hane said:

Ace tells her he isn’t a virgin.

But is he a liar? Or, of course, a rapist.

4 hours ago, Hane said:

She’s able to handle the phone system without attracting undue notice

There are many sentences I never thought I would ever read, and this is one of them.

4 hours ago, Hane said:

Sara is at Connor’s office in “just under forty-five minutes.”

Wow, a plot hammer (like a device, but they hit you over the head with it).

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Petronella
5 hours ago, Hane said:

He gets there before her and orders a coffee for each of them. He rises as she enters.  She looks at the two coffees and says, “How thoughtful. How sweet. How presumptuous.” Because feminist cuntishness has no doubt infected her.

Ugh. It would be different if they frequently met up this way and knew each other's orders; it's quite another to cavalierly choose for her, putting it in her court to either drink something she doesn't want or to be "unappreciative" of his "just being nice." Why not just be patient and wait for her? Oh, sorry, is my feminist cuntishness coming through?

5 hours ago, Hane said:

So Stephanie, in noticing Ace’s feeble attempt at getting the waitress’s attention, calls him out for “leering at that barista’s rear end.” He says he wasn’t. She says girls know when they and other girls are being checked out. Ace says such observations aren’t always infallible, then points out that lots of the women in the café are wearing tight jeans. He says that they “live in a time when the men are gawkers and the women are exhibitionists….Men have always liked looking, and women have always liked being admired….The thing that is so screwed up about our time is that women have gotten to the point there they can display themselves in a most shameless fashion, desperately competing with the porn ladies and the sexbots, all while reserving to themselves the inscrutable right to be mortally offended if some man they don’t like takes them up on their open invitation, the invitation that is being extended to everyone in the general public who has a working pair of eyes.” See, guys?  This may be a reason why it’s been several days since my last synopsis—I came damn near throwing my iPhone at the wall after reading this.

ARGH I HATE THIS "argument" SO MUCH.

Existing with boobs and ass attached is not "an invitation." IT'S JUST NOT.

"Men have always liked looking, and women have always liked being admired"--NOPE NOPE NOPE. Depends on who's doing the looking and in what context, I promise you. (Note to Doug: "at work" is not sexytime context.)

Also, open letter to Doug Wilson: I'm not "desperately competing with the porn ladies and the sexbots," thanks. I'm just living my life.

And given that the sex bots seem to be pretty low-tech, how attractive can they be that he thinks women are "competing" with them??

5 hours ago, Hane said:

Sara has found herself a nice apartment and a temp job at a law firm. She’s able to handle the phone system without attracting undue notice—the people at her office just assumed that she hadn’t used their particular phone system before, and she was a quick study.

Sara is the former Mennonite, right? It sounds like the implication here is that Mennonites don't use phones, and that she was able to cover up her inexperience with all phones as just inexperience with this specific system. I know that Amish and Mennonites come in different varieties; is "no phones" typically a Mennonite thing? I had a Mennonite midwife with my first child (plain dress and all) and she had a phone. I'm just curious for info from anyone who knows more than me.

5 hours ago, Hane said:

He says that they “live in a time when

I'm leaving the quote unfinished because just the first part is enough to set my hair on fire. As soon as someone says "nowadays" or its equivalent I already hate what's coming after. It's nearly always the start of a comparison of a supposedly degenerate now with some supposedly pure olden days, and it betrays a depressing lack of understanding actual history, psychology, current events, and human nature.

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Zebedee

Haha, @Petronella - I use "nowadays" - or rather, "in the olden days" all the time (I'm 41) and 99% of the time it's about how stuff now is so much better! "In the olden days" drives my mum nuts. Then again, all the young types I talk to, use "in the olden days", so I can kind of see her perspective.
 

Stephanie started off sounding quite cool. She's just beginning to sound like she's going to turn into some awful judgmental hypocrite. Which is presumably when she converts (if she does, I'm waiting for a plot twist). Why do these people make being Christian sound so deeply unappealing?

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Petronella
2 minutes ago, Zebedee said:

Haha, @Petronella - I use "nowadays" - or rather, "in the olden days" all the time (I'm 41) and 99% of the time it's about how stuff now is so much better! "In the olden days" drives my mum nuts. Then again, all the young types I talk to, use "in the olden days", so I can kind of see her perspective.

Well, if we're talking technology or social systems or specific laws or something, I can see how that would be fitting! I think maybe I sometimes use it when talking about how information was gotten, pre-internet. You're right.

But when it's being used to describe human behaviour it makes me roll my eyes.

Our church has various members take turns leading prayers in the service, and that person gets to write them themselves, within a general structure. There was one guy who went on and on about immoral "nowadays" compared to virtuous times past, and, well, he was never asked to pray again. My husband started helping with prayers around that time, and lots of people found him at coffee hour after his first turn to thank him. They didn't specify, but I had the definite feeling it was "we're so glad it's you and not the other guy"! 😄

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Zebedee

@PetronellaI can see why they preferred your husband!
I kind of use "nowadays" about humans too. Not that I think people are different now, intrinsically, but lots of so-called unacceptable things "in the olden days" are accepted "nowadays". So, it's almost exclusively a positive comparison for me. And you're right, there's a certain type of person who uses it negatively - generally tells me who to avoid, if they think unacceptable things nowadays are increased intolerance for homophobia, racism, sexism etc.

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Ace says such observations aren’t always infallible, then points out that lots of the women in the café are wearing tight jeans. He says that they “live in a time when the men are gawkers and the women are exhibitionists….Men have always liked looking, and women have always liked being admired….The thing that is so screwed up about our time is that women have gotten to the point there they can display themselves in a most shameless fashion, desperately competing with the porn ladies and the sexbots, all while reserving to themselves the inscrutable right to be mortally offended if some man they don’t like takes them up on their open invitation, the invitation that is being extended to everyone in the general public who has a working pair of eyes.” See, guysThis may be a reason why it’s been several days since my last synopsis—I came damn near throwing my iPhone at the wall after reading this.

Ohmygod.  This should be one of those things that a pig like Dougie thinks but doesn't say out loud or put in print.  Would he prefer that we wear burkas?  (Never mind.  Yes, he would.  Either that or skirts to our ankles, blouses buttoned to our throats, and a nice, big sweater to smooth out all of the possibly offending upper bits.)

 

Ace tells her that he “works hard at not being a pig."

Nope.  Ace is just a pig.  I see no evidence that he attempts to be otherwise.

 

He calls Sara’s temp agency just as she walks into the agency’s door, they offer the job, and Sara is at Connor’s office in “just under forty-five minutes.” (This convenient bit of plotting is worth of “Serena’s Serenity” itself.)  

This made me laugh out loud.  There are some people (and, in my life, most of them have been men) who claim you can get anywhere either in "under 15 minutes" or "under 45 minutes".  I'm not sure if it's to make the world seem smaller and more accessible or whether it's a lead-in to a discussion on routes to drive to get this  "exceptional" time.  I've just never understood why it's a thing.

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Petronella
7 minutes ago, Xan said:

Ohmygod.  This should be one of those things that a pig like Dougie thinks but doesn't say out loud or put in print.  Would he prefer that we wear burkas?  (Never mind.  Yes, he would.  Either that or skirts to our ankles, blouses buttoned to our throats, and a nice, big sweater to smooth out all of the possibly offending upper bits.)

This is what’s so interesting! No, I don’t think he would prefer burkas because he wants to look. He likes admiring women’s bodies. And he likes looking down on us for being so slutty. The idea of “if I’m virtuous and cover up will you respect me then?” isn’t really an option, because they don’t want a society in which they’d have to respect women. The inequality is part of the point.

Edited by Petronella
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4 minutes ago, Petronella said:

This is what’s so interesting! No, I don’t think he would prefer burkas because he wants to look. He likes admiring women’s bodies. And he likes looking down on us for being so slutty. The idea of “if I’m virtuous and cover up will you respect me then?” isn’t really an option, because they don’t want a society in which they’d have to respect women. The inequality is part of the point.

Good point.  He couldn't feel superior if we were all covered up.  I guess that's the whole point of misogyny -- they get to feel superior to half of the human race.

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Sometimes I get the feeling that Doug Wilson has created his entire world to work for his sexuality and  his obsession with young women's bodies and the tension with how sexuality is defined and bounded in Christianity.  

The drivel that is this book is entirely unnecessary and doesn't inform anyone about anything, except Doug and what he thinks about women, which is he wants you to know that he'd simultaneously like to be f**king anything in skirts as long as they are young and attractive, while hiding behind his altar.  He's creepy as hell. 

When you consider that he protects sexual predators, one of whom abused babies and young children and two who abused teen girls, you really have wonder what the actual f**k is deeply wrong with this man. And those predators are only the ones we know about. 

Katie Botkin, cousin to the Botkin sisters and who spent at least some time in the Doug Wilson environment, said that the young men in Christ Church were some of the most obnoxious and sexually aggressive guys she's has ever known. 

If you want to know how the Botkinetti might have turned out if their humanity and creativity hadn't been suffocated by their father beginning at birth, check out Katie's web site: kbotkin.com

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Petronella
5 minutes ago, Howl said:

When you consider that he protects sexual predators, one of whom abused babies and young children and two who abused teen girls

Wait...babies??? Not sexually, please tell me it wasn't sexually...

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1 hour ago, Petronella said:

Wait...babies??? Not sexually, please tell me it wasn't sexually...

It was. One of the predators whose marriage he arranged did this, and IIRC is thought to have victimized his own child.

@Petronella, Ace explains his pre-ordering the two coffees by saying they were small enough that he could have drunk them both in case Stephanie hadn’t shown up or had wanted something else, but I didn’t want to bother chucking in yet another instance of his/Dougie’s smugness.

Ace talks and acts like a 55-year-old privileged white guy who *knows* he’s doing everyone a favor by bestowing his refined and intellectual worldview on us all. It’s a sign of Dougie’s delusion that he puts himself in the persona of the brash young 20-year-old hero instead of a 50-something secondary character.

Edited by Hane
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Columbia

You know, this coffee shop scene is a great example of overall patriarchal views of women: small external formalities of kindness (buying the coffee, pulling out the chair to sit down) but with a deeper overall spirit of disdain and dislike. Think of Doug Phillips’ Titanic Society lauding the men who gave up their seats on lifeboats for women and children, while Dougie is simultaneously grooming the nanny. In the hands of a skillful writer this passage could be used to explore the contrast between someone who says they’re not a pig but really is, and someone who actually isn’t. Wilson is not a skillful writer, and doesn’t care two shakes about women, but he’s inadvertently made an excellent example of hypocrisy and false repentance that would do nicely in a sermon, if Wilson ever cared to think about anything other than himself. 

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@Columbia, whenever I think of DPIARBT and his boner for the Titanic tragedy, I’m reminded of this article comparing the Titanic and Lusitania disasters. The “courtly” women-and-children-first Titanic behavior he touts was only possible because the Titanic went down rather slowly—nearly three hours vs. 18 minutes, which dictated people’s behavior.

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4 hours ago, Xan said:

Good point.  He couldn't feel superior if we were all covered up.  I guess that's the whole point of misogyny -- they get to feel superior to half of the human race.

Yes. That’s why he makes such a point of Sara the Former Mennonite getting a makeover from Stephanie. Sara has to have a pure, virginal Christian past, a perfect platform from which she can be re-manufactured as The Right Kind of Christian (TM)—aka Dougie’s exact brand of Presbyterianism.

Also, women in Dougie’s world are only worthy of the high privilege of his chivalry if they follow the strict norms he sets out for their attitudes and behavior.

Edited by Hane
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3 hours ago, Columbia said:

You know, this coffee shop scene is a great example of overall patriarchal views of women: small external formalities of kindness (buying the coffee, pulling out the chair to sit down) but with a deeper overall spirit of disdain and dislike. Think of Doug Phillips’ Titanic Society lauding the men who gave up their seats on lifeboats for women and children, while Dougie is simultaneously grooming the nanny. In the hands of a skillful writer this passage could be used to explore the contrast between someone who says they’re not a pig but really is, and someone who actually isn’t. Wilson is not a skillful writer, and doesn’t care two shakes about women, but he’s inadvertently made an excellent example of hypocrisy and false repentance that would do nicely in a sermon, if Wilson ever cared to think about anything other than himself. 

This puts me in mind of the poem "My Last Duchess" by Robert Browning.  In Browning's case, the speaker was skillfully shown to be a hideous person just through his monologue.  Doug is doing it less skillfully and totally without knowing that he's doing it.  That makes Dougie look extra-stupid.  (I'd love it if he had a fan that lurked here and let him know what we think of his writing.)

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1 hour ago, Hane said:

One of the predators whose marriage he arranged did this, and IIRC is thought to have victimized his own child.

He likely has victimized his own child; the court set up a procedure where he was to have a chaperone with him at all times when he was in the presence OF HIS OWN CHILD when he moved back in with his wife.  I'm sure that fell by the way side at some point. 

How this guy did not end of in prison for life is due 100% to Doug Wilson's machinations.  Also, they petitioned the court to allow him to attend family style events where his previous victims were present, but who had outgrown his preferred age group.  The reasoning was they were too young to remember the abuse and wouldn't be triggered by his presence and he was no longer interested because they were too old.

Folks, all this stuff happened.  Welcome to the depths, but not the extent, of Doug Wilson's profound moral depravity, 

 

 

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@Howl, *THIS* right here is my problem with most fundies’ “all sins are created equal, just ask God for forgiveness and you’re home free” theology. It puts “forgiving” on the shoulders of traumatized victims. 
Re the “you’re asking for it” attitude re women’s clothing choices: Long ago in the Yuku days, one of us posted about being raped by a stranger. She said, “I was wearing a big puffy down coat that made me look like a caterpillar.” I’ve mentioned the time my daughter was dressed just like Jackie Kennedy on her way to Mass and she was getting ogled and her personal space invaded at a train station.

Dougie can fuck right off. I’ll have more to share later.

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forgetmenow
4 hours ago, Howl said:

 

He likely has victimized his own child; the court set up a procedure where he was to have a chaperone with him at all times when he was in the presence OF HIS OWN CHILD when he moved back in with his wife.  I'm sure that fell by the way side at some point. 

How this guy did not end of in prison for life is due 100% to Doug Wilson's machinations.  Also, they petitioned the court to allow him to attend family style events where his previous victims were present, but who had outgrown his preferred age group.  The reasoning was they were too young to remember the abuse and wouldn't be triggered by his presence and he was no longer interested because they were too old.

Folks, all this stuff happened.  Welcome to the depths, but not the extent, of Doug Wilson's profound moral depravity, 

 

 

I believe that the "chaperone" was his wife, with other family members as back-up.  IIRC, he admitted a sexual attraction to his own child during a meeting with his parole officer.

And, lest we forget, this is the same predator who abused at least one of the Sproul kids (by their own testimony) while he was a boarder in their home and prior to that, multiple children in his own home church.  It was said that Spanky knew of this when he set the predator on his merry way to Wilson's church, and seems likely that Spanky would have relayed this to Doug, but since neither of them care...

Furthermore, this is only one of the rapists he protected.  Another of his seminary students groomed and sexually abused a 14 year old girl.  But of course, this was ok, because she "looked and acted older."

Edited by forgetmenow
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Yes, all correct, @forgetmenow.  In addition, in this past year a prominent member of Doug Wilson's congregation was accused of grooming and molesting a teen girl in Logos school.  This is what she wrote: 

Quote

“I was raised Christian and attended Logos School, a Christian high school. While in high school, I suffered sexual abuse at the hands of my church doctrine teacher, a respected elder of the church affiliated with my school.

Even after his misconduct was discovered, Christ Church still allowed Jim B. Nance to serve communion. He remains an active member of that community while I was told to clean out my closet of slutty clothing, but I only owned school uniforms.

The school decided to deal with the issue internally instead of immediately bringing the situation to the police. Because of this choice, I suffered additional years of abuse. The nightmares from that time still keep me up at night. I cried out to God over and over again. I begged him to end it or just to let me die.

The shame I bore from what was happening to me was multiplied by feelings of guilt over my apparent sin. Jim fostered this notion using it to further torture and shame me into silence.” —Emilie Dye 

 

Edited by Howl
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forgetmenow
1 minute ago, Howl said:

Yes, all correct, @forgetmenow.  In addition, in this past year a prominent member of Doug Wilson's congregation was accused of grooming and molesting a teen girl in Logos school.  This is what she wrote: 

 

Ugh, I had repressed that story.  I think I remember it unfolding on a FB thread, right?  IIRC, at least one of the guy's kids was all,  "Well, I forgive him, it's in the past, etc."

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      Mela99

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      · 3 replies
    • mango_fandango

      mango_fandango

      I may or may not have a slight obsession with LM Montgomery 
      Yes, they’re all in the same edition, Virago Modern Classics. I even have a couple of the other books she’s written on my “want to buy” list...

      · 9 replies
    • Destiny

      Destiny

      Well, that “announcement” was so shocking that I’m going to go do dishes now. 
      Zzzzzzzz
      · 6 replies
    • LittleOwl

      LittleOwl

      Happy Thinking Day / Founder's Day to any FJ Guides and Scouts 
      · 4 replies
    • mollysmom

      mollysmom  »  ofMatthew

      I came to your page because I realized I hadn't seen you in awhile and I wanted to make sure you're ok but apparently you are here and posting! So I guess I'll just say hi! ♥️ 
      · 2 replies
    • nst

      nst

      You all know I work for a church. Well on Saturday 1pm cdn time a lady with stage 4+ lung cancer is going to end her life through maid. So I am kinda feeling dumpy. If you all could just pray for her in whatever way I would appreciate that.
      · 8 replies
    • Kailash

      Kailash

      Good morning! It’s still cold here in Kansas but it’s supposed to get above freezing today. What are you doing today? I’ll put my list in the comments. Add yours if you like. 
      · 12 replies
    • mollysmom

      mollysmom

      So far 2021 hasn't been great. Dealing with identity theft & going through a divorce all at the same time. I realize it could be much worse but man does this suck. 
      · 4 replies
    • finnlassie

      finnlassie

      My anti-depressants are working
      · 3 replies
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