Bates 28: Defected Products Courtesy of the SOTDRT

[JermajestyDuggar]

It seems like a lot of these fundies aren’t saying they had covid until months after and they are fine by then. I think it’s a calculated moved.

[rebeccawriter01]

8 hours ago, TheGleeTeam said:

Unless I'm completely mixing things up, I believe in her pregnancy announcement she said she had Covid around when she had her miscarriage. This was in the magazine article that she said that, not on social media as far as I know.

US reported it with the pregnancy announcement and attributed it to her without quote. US writers aren't really known for being accurate, but Josie hasn't corrected them publicly or said anything that would suggest something different. 

[BullyJBG]

4 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

It seems like a lot of these fundies aren’t saying they had covid until months after and they are fine by then. I think it’s a calculated moved.

Of course. No one wants to tell stuff like that while it's still happening. And likely after one recovered, the others get it, and so on and so on. They want to make sure their PR people aren't infected or fear getting infected.

[just_ordinary]

I am not sure Kelly actually says that Tom died of COVID????

Her mother was surprised to get a positive result when she went into Hospital for her broken nose. So while Tom definitely might have died of COVID there is nothing in the post that really says that. It’s completely open as to why he died. I wouldn’t trust Kelly’s words either way and I can totally see her hiding it because of how they show themselves. They would probably get a lot of questions if they might have infected and the therefore basically killed him. COVID only ever gets address when they successfully recovered. And then it’s ok to say how extremely awful was. Doesn’t make them more careful though. I really wonder how they all get away with it so well. Such a wasted chance for Darwin to proof his theory to them I guess. 

Edited January 21, 2021 by just_ordinary

[justmy2cents]

@just_ordinary She did say that he went to the hospital, was diagnosed with Covid, and died while they were both in the hospital, implying that he died of Covid.

 

[Perrierwithlemon]

I think if Tom died of something other than covid, Kelly would have been very quick to point that out to fit her narrative. Like something along the lines of “See? People can die of other things, but not covid!” But, as it is, Kelly left her audience to draw their own conclusion about the cause of Tom’s death. She doesn’t want to come right out and say it like it is because it conflicts with her beliefs. If someone didn’t thoroughly read the caption, they’d never know Tom died (no pictures). 

Edited January 24, 2021 by Perrierwithlemon
Typo

[AussieKrissy]

Much smaller turn out than normal for the Bates family.... not a mask in sight... only the unborn matter to them. 
awkward as fuck they are the only ones. 

[SorenaJ]

Guns kill children. Not being vaccinated kills children. Coronavirus kills children. Homicide kills children. Hot having access to adequate health care kills children. Smoking kills children. 

What's their point? 

[Nothing if not critical]

41 minutes ago, SorenaJ said:

Guns kill children. Not being vaccinated kills children. Coronavirus kills children. Homicide kills children. Hot having access to adequate health care kills children. Smoking kills children. 

Abortion doesn't kill children. It kills embryos (and the occasional foetus).

Not to make light of a serious topic, but whatever your stance on abortion is, I feel it's important to make a difference between children that are already living and breathing and embryos in the early stages of pregnancy (which is when the vast majority of abortions occur).

I miscarried at 10 weeks 13 years ago. I grieved for what could have been and sometimes I'm still sad. But in no way does it compare to the thought of losing one of my kids. No way.

[SeekingAdventure]

Totally agree. Abortion does not kill children, it kills embryos that could become children at some point..

I'd be a little more sympathetic if they were like the best parents in the world and did everything for their children, including provide them with the best education, fantastic food, health care, overall common sense etc.. but considering how little fucks they give about their children, Kellys 'stepfather' (who, guess what, was an embryo once too) died of covid and he was mentionned in a bi-sentence. not much regard to that?

Insurrections kill people too, maybe not children, but let's say one of the two women who died was pregnant. In their view, that would've been a child too. Then, who killed that child? Trump, other insurrectionists, or was this just gods will?

I just can't with those people (and yeah, I know, that might've gone a bit ott)

 

I personally probably would not choose abortion for myself, but who knows, it depends on the circumstances. And me not choosing it personally does not mean I would stop anyone from having an abortion.

The only real issue with abortion that I have is that some people seem to think (i sadly know a couple of cases) that it is another kind of birth control, in the way of: well, i don't have a condom, screw it, if I get knocked up I'll get an abortion. That, in my eyes is just stupid. But then again, neither of these people I know are not really smart to begin with, and therefor it might be for the better..

[lumpentheologie]

The only real issue I have with abortion is people who want it not being able to get it. 

To me at least there's nothing morally objectionable about ending a pregnancy in the first trimester, nor one later than that when the fetus is not viable. In other cases I think it's always morally worse to force someone to go through with a pregnancy. That just strikes me as a kind of long term rape, and with the added burden of being responsible for a person you don't want. 

Edited January 28, 2021 by lumpentheologie

[JillyO]

8 hours ago, lumpentheologie said:

The only real issue I have with abortion is people who want it not being able to get it. 

To me at least there's nothing morally objectionable about ending a pregnancy in the first trimester, nor one later than that when the fetus is not viable. In other cases I think it's always morally worse to force someone to go through with a pregnancy. That just strikes me as a kind of long term rape, and with the added burden of being responsible for a person you don't want. 

One thing I would add to that, which I feel is too often ignored: Even IF you are opposed to people using abortion as birth control (an issue which I feel the right vastly overstates,  but whatever, YMMV) - what’s the alternative? Forcing those people to have babies as punishment? Babies should never be anything but loved and wanted. Forcing a woman to carry an unwanted pregnancy to term as punishment for behavior you don’t condone is horrifying on so many levels. 

[nausicaa]

On 1/24/2021 at 6:56 PM, AussieKrissy said:

Much smaller turn out than normal for the Bates family.... not a mask in sight... only the unborn matter to them. 
awkward as fuck they are the only ones. 

Who wants to tell them the annual D.C. March for Life was cancelled by its (diehard anti-abortion) organizers because they thought it was too dangerous and contrary to their pro-life message during a pandemic? (A move I commend them for.)

Yet here are the Bateses, yucking it up with no masks, soon to post some ski trip or cruise photos no doubt. Self-awareness just soars right over their heads, huh? 

[SeekingAdventure]

19 hours ago, JillyO said:

One thing I would add to that, which I feel is too often ignored: Even IF you are opposed to people using abortion as birth control (an issue which I feel the right vastly overstates,  but whatever, YMMV) - what’s the alternative? Forcing those people to have babies as punishment? Babies should never be anything but loved and wanted. Forcing a woman to carry an unwanted pregnancy to term as punishment for behavior you don’t condone is horrifying on so many levels. 

I think this is to big parts a response to my little rant farther up, so I'll add something.

 

I definitely do not want to force them to have children. Since I know these people, I am very aware that it is certainly the best thing if there are not more children added to these families, since there are already too many to handle. This might be a very controversial statement, or sound downright bitchy, I am very aware of that, but since I went to school with these people, and some of them started to sleep around (I do not say this lightly, there just literally is no other word to 13 or 14 year olds having sex with 5 or 6 different people in less than a month) very early.

So, in their case, abortion was the best option, I guess. It was also mostly not the first pregnancy, but the fact that all of our secondary school teachers knew that there had been several abortions in a class of 13 and 14 year olds, is just troubling, in my eye.

I would say, it might be smarter for them to actually figure out how birth control actually works, and that in many ways is also the parents responsibility.

 

So, in short. I do not say nobody should have an abortion, whoever wants to, may have, and I'd rather have it be legal, because let's be honest, people who want to have abortions will have them anyways, and if it's illegal, it's just a lot more dangerous for everybody.

And for the people who use abortion as birth control. I'd just say: why not use birth control instead. If they want to sleep with as many people possible, it should be in their interest to A) not get pregnant b) not get a STD and C) not spread STD's

 

 

Ps. I hope nobody is offended by my term of sleeping around. I really do not care if people are very sexually active, but if they take 0 precautions, and possibly spread diseases, that's just not ok in my eyes. And it's very much in the parents responsibility to educate their children about it. And if the parents don't educate their kids, and these have kids young, they will also not educate their children properly.. etc...

[SorenaJ]

Surely the alternative to using abortion as birth control is using birth control as birth control. 

[lumpentheologie]

I don't get the idea of 'using abortion as birth control'. Abortion is birth control. It controls whether you give birth, usually as a last resort. 

15 hours ago, SeekingAdventure said:

I definitely do not want to force them to have children. Since I know these people, I am very aware that it is certainly the best thing if there are not more children added to these families, since there are already too many to handle. This might be a very controversial statement, or sound downright bitchy, I am very aware of that, but since I went to school with these people, and some of them started to sleep around (I do not say this lightly, there just literally is no other word to 13 or 14 year olds having sex with 5 or 6 different people in less than a month) very early.

13 and 14 year olds can't consent to sex, so they're not 'sleeping around', they're being abused. One can hardly blame them for not taking precautions against getting pregnant. 

[SeekingAdventure]

@lumpentheologie

I do totally agree, i just was not sure how to phrase it.

The other people they were sleeping with were not adults though, more or less the same age, maybe a year or two older.. that does not make it better, but I definitely think that parents should educate their children, especially if said parents have several older kids who also had their kids when they were 14ish, and the parents themselves were teen parents as well.

Maybe, just maybe, at some point the parents should casually mention birth control etc..

[Grace]

15 hours ago, lumpentheologie said:

I don't get the idea of 'using abortion as birth control'. Abortion is birth control. It controls whether you give birth, usually as a last resort. 

13 and 14 year olds can't consent to sex, so they're not 'sleeping around', they're being abused. One can hardly blame them for not taking precautions against getting pregnant. 

When I was that age the few sexually active 13/14 year olds were having sex with other 13/14 year olds. So which one is the abuser? Children can't give consent to have sex with an older person (particularly an adult) but I don't think we can say every pregnant teen was abused.

Edited January 31, 2021 by Grace

[SeekingAdventure]

Yeah, vut that was not really the point i was trying to make anyways. 

 

I just think if you can make the decision to have sex, and in this case, really it was decisions. Sadly, i went to school with these people.. Then you should be also old enough to make decisions to protect yourselves, both from stds and unwanted pregnancies. 

 

If you're not able to make these decisions you shouldn't be having sex, that's what i wanted to say. 

And yeah, abortion could be considered a sort of birth control since it doesn't lead to a birth, but i wouldn't necessarily expect someone to tell me: oh i have abortions if necessary, when asked about birth control. 

I'd consider that an extreme, last resort form. Most sensible people would probably use other methods first, and in case it fails and they cannot see themselves capable of carrying the child, abortion would be an option.. 

[lumpentheologie]

9 hours ago, Grace said:

When I was that age the few sexually active 13/14 year olds were having sex with other 13/14 year olds. So which one is the abuser? Children can't give consent to have sex with an older person (particularly an adult) but I don't think we can say every pregnant teen was abused.

I don't think every pregnant teen was abused, especially not for older ones. But kids under 15 are barely teenagers and I think they're not mature enough to give meaningful consent, even with each other.  I wouldn't call them child molesters for having sex with each other but I do think there's an element of abuse there, perhaps more for one teen or the other depending on the case. Possibly on both sides. 

[BullyJBG]

On 1/30/2021 at 4:37 AM, SorenaJ said:

Surely the alternative to using abortion as birth control is using birth control as birth control. 

Yes, if you don't have a condom, and must have sex, why not the morning after pill? Or is that only given to rape victims, who can prove they were raped?

[tanba]

5 hours ago, BullyJBG said:

Yes, if you don't have a condom, and must have sex, why not the morning after pill? Or is that only given to rape victims, who can prove they were raped?

Especially as a teen from a conservative family, it is often very difficult to obtain the morning after pill, as even in non-conservative states, you might need ID. It also costs money and isn’t really suitable for people without proper sex Ed who might have been told that pulling out works or sth.

[artdecades]

On 1/29/2021 at 11:06 AM, SeekingAdventure said:

I think this is to big parts a response to my little rant farther up, so I'll add something.

 

I definitely do not want to force them to have children. Since I know these people, I am very aware that it is certainly the best thing if there are not more children added to these families, since there are already too many to handle. This might be a very controversial statement, or sound downright bitchy, I am very aware of that, but since I went to school with these people, and some of them started to sleep around (I do not say this lightly, there just literally is no other word to 13 or 14 year olds having sex with 5 or 6 different people in less than a month) very early.

So, in their case, abortion was the best option, I guess. It was also mostly not the first pregnancy, but the fact that all of our secondary school teachers knew that there had been several abortions in a class of 13 and 14 year olds, is just troubling, in my eye.

I would say, it might be smarter for them to actually figure out how birth control actually works, and that in many ways is also the parents responsibility.

So, in short. I do not say nobody should have an abortion, whoever wants to, may have, and I'd rather have it be legal, because let's be honest, people who want to have abortions will have them anyways, and if it's illegal, it's just a lot more dangerous for everybody.

And for the people who use abortion as birth control. I'd just say: why not use birth control instead. If they want to sleep with as many people possible, it should be in their interest to A) not get pregnant b) not get a STD and C) not spread STD's

Ps. I hope nobody is offended by my term of sleeping around. I really do not care if people are very sexually active, but if they take 0 precautions, and possibly spread diseases, that's just not ok in my eyes. And it's very much in the parents responsibility to educate their children about it. And if the parents don't educate their kids, and these have kids young, they will also not educate their children properly.. etc...

Why does it matter if it’s the first abortion or the fiftieth a woman has? If you don’t think one abortion is bad why do you think multiple ones are? 

[imokit]

There's a lot of issues in conservative land with teens and birth control.  If you believe (or are taught) that sex outside marriage is a sin.  Then an unmarried teen can't access birth control in advance as that means they are planning (or are open to the idea) to sin by having sex.

It's much easier for them to justify to others (and their parents) an unintended pregnancy - I got carried away and I made a mistake and I'm sorry.  On the other hand if they are found with or getting birth control, its viewed as I knew I was going to have sex and break the rules and so I planned it and did things to make it safer.  A premeditated sin is worse than a heat of the moment sin.

Dangerous logic, but sadly true and accurate for a lot of these teenagers.

[lumpentheologie]

Small towns, even relatively liberal ones, can make it very difficult for teens to access reproductive care.  I was once forced to shoplift a pregnancy test in high school, not because I couldn't pay for it but because if I had bought it, between the cashier and the other people in line, it would have gotten back to my parents that I was having sex and might be pregnant. The morning-after pill would be just as difficult to buy, if not more. 

Over the counter morning after pills also cost $50, which is not doable for a lot of people. And you have to figure out how to go get one within two days, which can be difficult for people without cars.