Lori Alexander 57: The Wisdom and the Folly

[Lgirlrocks]

My dad wanted a daughter so badly. When my older brother was born he was sad he wasn’t a girl. Guess what? He got over it. My brother was born not breathing for the first 20 minutes of life. My dad still wanted a girl so my mom got pregnant again and my dad got his girl. I grew up a tomboy. Not because of my parents. I just liked getting dirty and playing with action figures and legos. I did play with dolls though. 

 

[louisa05]

10 hours ago, Red Hair, Black Dress said:

Niece was actually named for a man, part of an elderly childless couple who were an extra set of "grandparents" to BIL and Mr. Dress..  Her wardrobe growing up was boys polo shirts, boys khakis and sneakers. It largely still is.  For years until she graduated college BIL watched Niece's weight like hawk so she stayed skinny and underdeveloped (no breasts).

Part of desperately trying to please her father has caused Niece to become a doctor.  I have no idea whether it's what she wants or even if she knows what she wants or has ever even thought about what she wants. BIL wanted a son to follow in his footsteps so decreed she'd be a doc from the time she was about 7. She had absolutely no say in the matter. Niece has yet to develop a mind or opinions or interests of her own.  Her hobbies and interests are exactly the same as BIL's. She thinks whatever he thinks; she wants whatever he wants. It hasn't helped. He's never really reconciled himself to the fact she's not a boy.

Did I mention that both BIL and SIL are the worst helicopter parents ever?

SIL after years of ignoring her daughter suddenly latched on like a lamprey when Niece went off to college. BIL & SIL drove to the university every other weekend for 4 years.  Niece never made any college friends or participated in college life at all.  She lived at home through med school. Now she's an intern they fly to see her at least once a month. Niece still vacations with her parents.  She has never traveled alone or with friends. Outside of work she has no life of her own.

Niece has no people skills; couldn't read a room if you threatened her with a gun. She is a mix of brash, verging on rude, know it all overconfidence (BIL declared her a genius [no kidding] at an early age) and incredibly deeply insecure.

She was never taught the magic words "please" and "thank you" and rudimentary politeness/ manners because since she's a "genius" and the family is rich she was better than other people and didn't have to be polite.

@louisa05 like your niece she's not really a well adjusted adult.

The mom in this case is a helicopter parent who can't let go. Their son will be 27 next month and daughter is closer to 24 than 23. They both live at home. They went to college but had to have single rooms in the dorms, were not allowed to participate in any clubs or activities, and both left college with no friends from their time there. The daughter is supposedly student teaching--at her own high school which is across the street from the house. She doesn't seem to be student teaching based on her social media and when my mother asked if she is, no one answered. So we think that went awry somehow.  Mother and brother have terrified her out of driving, telling her she is incapable of being safe which ties her to home. The son got a degree in meteorology then proceeded to never apply for a related job and go back home to work at the grocery store job he worked in high school and summers.Mommy works at the store and got him the job. She manages his schedule with the boss and makes sure they have the same days off. When he was in college, she took vacation during his breaks so they could spend the whole time together. Because most college students want to spend spring break hanging out with their mommy. Especially boys. Mom decides when the kids get haircuts, handles their medical appointments, buys all their personal products without their input--and both complain on social media about not liking when she schedules things or not wanting a haircut or hating the shampoo she bought--yet at nearly 27 and 23, they seem to not even have the notion that they are adults and can say no to her. She also has a tracking app on their phones so that she can always monitor where they are and make sure that they aren't doing anything she disapproves of. And for extra fun, due to mom's blatant favoritism to the son and dad's tacit participation in that, the kids absolutely despise each other. 

It is a sad, sad situation all the way around. 

[nokidsmom]

Oh boy, hearing about helicopter parenting has me think of my cousin's only son, whose mother has overprotected him to the point that, at the age of 25, he still lives at home, does not drive and needs his dad to drive him to school or wherever he needs to go.   He has never worked, quit the state university after one year with near failing grades, is now taking one class in the evenings at the local college, but generally his days are spent at home with his mother and dog.  But his mother is happy because she's got her little boy always close by. 

The shame of it is that he was a pretty smart kid, he really had potential but mommy just couldn't let go of him.

[Red Hair, Black Dress]

@louisa05 So many similarities to Niece.  She drives, but is a very nervous, bad driver so no one will ever ride with her.  Not sure if Niece was forbidden to join clubs or activities, but never did. And with her parents there every other weekend there was never an opportunity  No friends at all from college or med school, nor internship either as far as I know.

BIL & SIL assume Niece will return home after internship/residency/ etc. to get a job. She has no will of her own so I presume she'll do what they want.  SIL Cannot. Let. Go.  She still picks out her daughter clothes (still nothing remotely "feminine") and Niece is not allowed to wear makeup.  For all I know SIL buys Niece's personal products  (deodorant, however, seems to be optional).  I do know that no one has ever suggested Niece wash her hair before it becomes stringy, greasy and  disgustingly nasty looking.

Niece is a difficult person to get to know.  Her arrogant, know it all, I'm better than you b/c my parents are really really rich manner coupled with her deep insecurity is really off putting.

BIL decided Mr Dress and I were bad influences when she was about 9 or so and severely limited our contact with her.  Not sure what Mr. Dress's offense was, but I was just wrong all around. Too smart, too confident, too good at what I do, not deferential to his "I am god" doctor complex ...  and the ultimate sin .... too feminine, too girly girl.  Niece told him I let her play dress up, get into my makeup and perfume and we'd have tea parties.  I'm sure that's what did it.

 

[lilwriter85]

12 hours ago, SongRed7 said:

I wonder this frequently — especially her family and college roommates who she has written about before.  In the AL blog days she was nutty but a little more tempered.  Now that she has more noteriety, people have to be aware of how toxic she is.  I wonder if people see her out and about what they think.    I wonder if any of her kids have their friends come up to them and say “dude! Your mom....WTF!?!” And the kids “I know, I know”. 

I think some people who knew her before she got into blogging, probably had some idea of how toxic she is. During the AL days, she did blog posts about how some people at one of her past churches didn't like her when she and/or Ken were paired to mentor them. After years of blogging, she has probably pissed off a lot of people in her life and some probably avoid her. I've wondered quite a bit, if her blog has fucked up some of Ken's relationships with his clients. Ken has also written some pretty fucked up things too especially about working women. I keep hoping one of his female orthodontist clients or women who work for his clients  go public with their contact with Ken.

[fluffy]

23 hours ago, Loveday said:

I just always find it so weird that she never, ever mentions major news stories unless they directly impact her, which in her small, sheltered, heavily gated world, is pretty much never.

I thought this too until election time ramped up. Then she can't post enough about how "Democrats are evil," and I quote. She has no basic understanding that people are not "evil" if they simply disagree with her. She will whip herself into a frenzy arguing that women are too emotional for politics. lol 

She is still lamenting what poor ole Kavanaugh went through. I've never seen a more political animal who simultaneously protests that women should not vote and we should not worry about current events because "this world is not our home." Within the same post, she argue Christians should not worry about politics and then lambast Democrats. She understand the world very simply: Her side is godly and those who disagree are evil and in the grip of Satan. That is the kind of simpleton language she uses.

She went to town on the refugees recently. She is much more concerned that we obey the laws of the land than act as Christ would toward the hungry, poor and disenfranchised. She had a meltdown when younger women disagreed with her and posted scripture to illustrate why they thought we should be merciful to refugees. 

Overall, I saw just how political and angry she is. It won't surprise anyone that she shows no grace to other opinions, no matter how thoughtfully articulated.

[Lgirlrocks]

Lady you don’t know what you are talking about. My mom was a “stay at home” mom. My dad worked two jobs and my mom worked part time. My parents only ever had one new car, they got a very good deal on it and my grandma helped pay for it. We never took fancy vacations. wore hand me downs, clothes we got as presents, or clearance rack clothes. My mom, a licensed barber, even cut out hair. Without both incomes we wouldn’t have made it. We were always lower middle class. We didn’t eat fancy $14 butter and bread like Lori does. Or live in an expensive house like lori does. We ate cheap food.   

[Sarah92]

Maybe Lori's idea of the world is skewed because of where she lives? Idk much about her area but maybe it's more common to see huge houses, new cars and designers clothes?  I know in the Midwest designer items aren't super common even in homes where both parents work. I think the most "designer item" I usually see is a Coach bag every once in a while. Designer makeup also isn't really popular in the Midwest. I own more makeup then most of the women I know and mines not designer or even mid range for most of my stuff. In fact, Lori's makeup is far more expensive than mine. Her clothes are also more expensive most likely. Phones are the biggest major expense I see here and while I think people should take care of their phones and use them longer to reduce waste (and also stop giving children phones) they've become a pretty big part of life for communication, work, and organization.

[louisa05]

1 hour ago, Sarah92 said:

Maybe Lori's idea of the world is skewed because of where she lives? Idk much about her area but maybe it's more common to see huge houses, new cars and designers clothes?  I know in the Midwest designer items aren't super common even in homes where both parents work. I think the most "designer item" I usually see is a Coach bag every once in a while. Designer makeup also isn't really popular in the Midwest. I own more makeup then most of the women I know and mines not designer or even mid range for most of my stuff. In fact, Lori's makeup is far more expensive than mine. Her clothes are also more expensive most likely. Phones are the biggest major expense I see here and while I think people should take care of their phones and use them longer to reduce waste (and also stop giving children phones) they've become a pretty big part of life for communication, work, and organization.

I buy some pretty expensive make up. So what? And I have an expensive bag. But I bought it with Christmas money and have had it for three years come January. I have an iPhone. Because I have to have an app to get work. No phone, no work. But the phone is three years old. And my plan costs $45 a month. If you're paying "hundreds", you have a bad plan or several phones on the plan--and probably some kids who don't need an expensive phone or possibly any phone at all.

But all of that said, I really don't want to hear about the cost of the stuff I work to buy from Lori who brags about stuff that costs 4 times what I pay for anything. I've never paid $75 for a skirt nor would I consider that price a bargain.  And, at the end of the day, I work to pay the utilities and buy the food. And I save up extra for stuff I want. Mr. 05 pays the house payment, insurance and car expenses and saves up extra for stuff he wants. She would never bitch about a man doing that. So she can shut it about women who do it. 

[Coconut Flan]

1 hour ago, Sarah92 said:

Maybe Lori's idea of the world is skewed because of where she lives? Idk much about her area but maybe it's more common to see huge houses, new cars and designers clothes?  

Quite possibly.  I call our area a "bubble."  Gardeners and housekeepers are common, exceedingly common.  I have both.  The guy comes to my house to detail the car regularly and that isn't unusual.  Manicured lawns and flowerbeds are the way things are.  It's just what is done.  I'd say everyone in the area has some designer items unless they have an objection to them.  I'm not much into that, but I'm retired and don't have reason for much designer wear.  I do have some fairly pricey make up that I don't use often.  Lori seems a bit on the pampered side, but not the most extreme one around.  One woman who lives fairly close to Lori will only shop at Jimbo's or Whole Foods.  Lori will go to Costco and the regular grocery store.  Some people don't even shop, they have almost everything delivered.  I don't tend to talk about it because yeah it's a bubble and I know it's a privilege and all that.  

Reading the next post again, $75 for a skirt is not unusual for a lot of the neighbors.  The only thing that would stand out with Lori is that she doesn't have much of anywhere to wear it.  

 

 

[Lisafer]

4 hours ago, Red Hair, Black Dress said:

@louisa05 So many similarities to Niece.  She drives, but is a very nervous, bad driver so no one will ever ride with her.  Not sure if Niece was forbidden to join clubs or activities, but never did. And with her parents there every other weekend there was never an opportunity  No friends at all from college or med school, nor internship either as far as I know.

BIL & SIL assume Niece will return home after internship/residency/ etc. to get a job. She has no will of her own so I presume she'll do what they want.  SIL Cannot. Let. Go.  She still picks out her daughter clothes (still nothing remotely "feminine") and Niece is not allowed to wear makeup.  For all I know SIL buys Niece's personal products  (deodorant, however, seems to be optional).  I do know that no one has ever suggested Niece wash her hair before it becomes stringy, greasy and  disgustingly nasty looking.

Niece is a difficult person to get to know.  Her arrogant, know it all, I'm better than you b/c my parents are really really rich manner coupled with her deep insecurity is really off putting.

BIL decided Mr Dress and I were bad influences when she was about 9 or so and severely limited our contact with her.  Not sure what Mr. Dress's offense was, but I was just wrong all around. Too smart, too confident, too good at what I do, not deferential to his "I am god" doctor complex ...  and the ultimate sin .... too feminine, too girly girl.  Niece told him I let her play dress up, get into my makeup and perfume and we'd have tea parties.  I'm sure that's what did it.

 

And you said this niece is in med school, right? I am sad for her and horrified at the same time. Somebody who cannot think for themselves, cannot read a room, and has an arrogant attitude...well, I wouldn't want that person for my doctor. I've been treated by doctors like that, and it wasn't fun. 

[louisa05]

20 minutes ago, Coconut Flan said:

 

Reading the next post again, $75 for a skirt is not unusual for a lot of the neighbors.  The only thing that would stand out with Lori is that she doesn't have much of anywhere to wear it.  

 

 

Lori considered the $75 denim skirt a bargain, though. I see plenty of stuff in those price ranges around here. Not at all uncommon. Stores considered mid-range like Banana Republic, Loft, Express, J. Crew, etc...are going to be around that price or higher for skirts and dresses. But no one I know considers that price a "bargain". 

[louisa05]

5 hours ago, nokidsmom said:

Oh boy, hearing about helicopter parenting has me think of my cousin's only son, whose mother has overprotected him to the point that, at the age of 25, he still lives at home, does not drive and needs his dad to drive him to school or wherever he needs to go.   He has never worked, quit the state university after one year with near failing grades, is now taking one class in the evenings at the local college, but generally his days are spent at home with his mother and dog.  But his mother is happy because she's got her little boy always close by. 

The shame of it is that he was a pretty smart kid, he really had potential but mommy just couldn't let go of him.

Helicopter parenting doesn't create independent young adults. There are kids I taught who graduated nine years ago or more who are still living at home with their helicopter parents and working the same part time jobs they had in high school. The entire Millennial generation gets stereotyped as lazy because of those kids among them. But it isn't their fault and it isn't laziness. It's because they were never allowed to learn how to be independent or how to cope with the world. My nephew's "fiancee" is the same. She lives in an apartment with her sister and they both have jobs, but mommy and daddy rented the place and control their finances and make all of their decisions. She is almost 24, allegedly going to get married in less than a year, and can't choose where she lives, where she goes, how she spends her money or anything. 

[freealljs]

When I see pics of Lori, I see a shriveled up 70 year old prune with no fashion sense, who over-color treats her hair and needs to have internet-free days. She is way too old to be stressing over her husband’s wandering eye for women in thong bikinis and yoga pants. She should be grateful for what she has and stop passive-aggressively tearing her family and neighbors to bits with her Insecurities about weight, food, independent women, educated women, and those who are happy. 

 

[Coconut Flan]

19 minutes ago, louisa05 said:

Lori considered the $75 denim skirt a bargain, though. I see plenty of stuff in those price ranges around here.

She wouldn't be the only one.  We're two hours or so away from Beverly Hills, Brentwood, and Bel Air.  Plus we're not too far south from Orange County where the bubbles and enclaves are even worse.  Just south of us is a much "worse" if you think of it that way enclave where a $75 skirt would probably be unacceptable to wear to some of the residents.  Some people fall into the "abyss" more than others.  My daughter's MIL ordered one of those playhouses that you see the stars have in the backyards for granddaughter.  She forgot their backyards are quite a bit larger than average.  We don't consider her quite normal though.  Anyone have any ideas what to do with a playhouse that has to be constructed and will take up half of the level land in the backyard?  We've considered a bonfire, giving it away, having it "stolen," and putting it in her yard.  

Back to Lori she lives a very short distance from the outlet mall where she can routinely get designer wear half or more off which she may well consider a good bargain.  

[Sarah92]

40 minutes ago, louisa05 said:

Lori considered the $75 denim skirt a bargain, though. I see plenty of stuff in those price ranges around here. Not at all uncommon. Stores considered mid-range like Banana Republic, Loft, Express, J. Crew, etc...are going to be around that price or higher for skirts and dresses. But no one I know considers that price a "bargain". 

Exactly! To be fair, I don't think it's wrong to buy expensive things, some of my dresses are probably about sixty or so.  But I don't pretend that it's a bargain and for me that's quite expensive. And I think that's what gets me about what she does, she pretends to follow her advice but her lifestyle doesn't reflect being frugal. And that's okay, if she has the money she can spend it how she wishes. She doesn't have to be frugal and there isn't anything wrong with her expensive items. I just wish she wouldn't pretend that she wasn't researching away on her laptop (guessing a Mac) eating her expensive cookies, bread, and butter while telling women how to live frugally. Also she can stop judging women for having the exact same things she has but have worked twice as hard to get. 

[Coconut Flan]

6 minutes ago, Sarah92 said:

And I think that's what gets me about what she does, she pretends to follow her advice but her lifestyle doesn't reflect being frugal. And that's okay, if she has the money she can spend it how she wishes. She doesn't have to be frugal and there isn't anything wrong with her expensive items. I just wish she wouldn't pretend that she wasn't researching away on her laptop (guessing a Mac) eating her expensive cookies, bread, and butter while telling women how to live frugally. Also she can stop judging women for having the exact same things she has but have worked twice as hard to get. 

Exactly.  She's both so out of touch and hypocritical that she preaches that which she would never do on her own nor likely ever have to do.  Is Lori out of place where she lives and how she lives?  Not at all.  But is she a witch about everyone else?  Yep.  

[feministxtian]

I'll admit right now that I LIKE having extra cash again. Yeah, I treated myself to an iphone X, a new laptop, new clothes bought somewhere other than Walmart or the 2nd hand store and blew a bundle on shoes. I'll even admit I like driving the almost new, bells, whistles and gadgets SUV. Tough shit to anyone who decides to talk shit to me about it. I went without for way too fucking long to treat myself every now and then. BUT...I don't turn around and tell everyone else to do the opposite of what I do, nor do I make snide remarks about people who do what I do. 

Now, I probably wouldn't pay 75 bucks for a skirt, but I did get a pair of 80 dollar jeans for 17.99 at Ross. 

Lori spews bullshit from inside her little privileged bubble. I have no problem with people who are blessed enough to live in that bubble, but don't be a hypocrite and say that by getting rid of a cell phone and cutting back on groceries you can live on one income. 

I've pretty much been on both sides of that bubble...not quite up there with some folks but life was definitely easy. Then I lived on the side where I was rolling pennies for toilet paper (that sucked by the way). Now, we're climbing back to the edges of the bubble. I hope and pray that after January we can dive into the bubble in a big way...but we'll see what happens then. It'll be nice to not have a mortgage or a car payment. Yet, even after that, I'll probably still be a pretty cheap (not frugal, CHEAP) person. I've never been to Whole Foods, haven't been to Trader Joe's in ages (the nearest one is quite a ways away dammit), might hit up the Sprout's they're building down here, but will probably continue to do most/all of my grocery shopping at Smith's where I like having the gas points add up. I'm cheap AF even now...we have money in savings, a little to play with and can stop worrying about money, most of the time. 

I gotta tell ya though, a straight time paycheck looked pathetic after those sweet OT checks...OT is supposed to pick up again in January, that $$ will be used to try and pay down my car and if I don't pay it off w/the $$, refinance it maybe w/a lower payment. 

[Lgirlrocks]

There is nothing wrong with spending money on luxury things that you can afford. I have a problem with Lori and her group not wanting kids to go to college, live on one income, and pop out kid after kid. It can’t always be done. As I said above both of my parents worked, my dad two jobs. My mom stayed home with us during the week. No daycare but we had baby sitters every once in a while. Usually older kids my parents knew that were saving for something. My dad was an electrician and waited tables on the weekends. We could not have lived on just my dads income unless he worked two full time jobs. 

I hope something pops lori’s privileged bubble. She couldn’t have lived the way she preaches. 

Lori I know you say that you are teaching biblical womenhood but what you teach isn’t described in the Bible. Women can work if they want/need to. Nowhere does it say women can’t. Nowhere does it say women can’t have goals. Proverbs 31 women both worked and managed her house, servants. 

[lilwriter85]

I'm sick of Lori's fangirls using the "Keeping with the Jones" excuse or theory for why many households have two incomes. There are different reasons why couples chose to have to two incomes and sometimes it has nothing to do with wanting designer clothes or gadgets. 

Yes, there are two income households where they have designer clothes, iPhones, and other expensive things. But, some of those families may also be putting money into savings accounts, retirement funds, or education plans. 

[Sarah92]

When I got my new job, I bought a new used car. I need reliable transport for when I'm on call and my other car needed too much work. I also bought a velvet blue couch because I wanted it and it is fantastic. 

I also got as much insurance as I could through my job because I never had that luxury really. I almost cried tears of you when I got a check up because I was kicked off Medicaid at 19 and went over six years without one. But what Lori doesn't understand is healthcare is a luxury for people, especially families. Additionally, poverty prevents people from having opportunities and encouraging women not to work and stay in poverty hurts children.

I work primarily with children from low income families and I've seen of much this limits them. It's hard to teach going outside and playing with a ball as a coping skill when their parents can't afford one or a child can't color because there isn't any material in the house. A house gets bed bugs? Whelp good luck getting rid of those because you can't afford to take care of them. Cockroaches? Same story. That's how some people live.

[SuperNova]

Mr. Nova and I are frugal because we like nice things. We've slowly accumulated for the last 15 years to have what we have now. We don't live beyond our means but what we do buy isn't usually in our income level. We bought one piece of high end mid century furniture at a time by saving money or using layaway with no interest. We never dip into savings or use credit for furniture. I've built an investment wardrobe by buying one high quality piece at a time. I spend a small fortune on a pair of jeans and then wear them for the next ten years or more. It's probably been at least five years since I've bought jeans. I aim more for style rather than trend to get the most bang for my buck and save money by sewing as much as I can.

I believe in the high/low method. Shop at thrift and dollar stores as often as possible so you can save money for the good stuff. Not everyone who has nice things is dissipating their income or living beyond their means. Mr. Nova and I have both been homeless and poor at different points in our life. We don't try to keep up with anyone, we're just making ourselves happy and sometimes that means buying nice things.

@Sarah92 a blue velvet couch sounds lovely!

[klein_roeschen]

One of my coworkers could easely stay home with her kids because her husband earns enough. She works parttime in the morning, when her kids are at school/ daycare, she loves her kids dearly and is a very good mom, but she needs to do something besides being a mom. And I understand it. When I was at home the first half of this year, I almost got crazy with boredom. And while my welfare was enough for living frugally and even allow me small threats here and there, the extra cash with working is very welcome. And I didn't change my spending habits with more cash. I still go grocery shopping at the discount supermarket across the street, still live with my brother to share the costs. And my so called new car is 14 years old instead of the former beeing 17 years old. And while commuting with public transport is possible, the commuter ticket would be around the same costs than my car, but would cost me 2 more hours a day. Frugallity is so ingrained in me that i debate with me about new winter boots and a warm coat. Logically I know that I need these, but everytime I look for that and see the prices, I say nope to expensive. And I speak about 60 € coat.

[wallysmommy]

I am single, have a good paying job, and will probably be leaving it on 12/31.  It's time for me to exit out.  I've worked for the same company for 22 1/2 years.  At 59, I can draw my 457(b) with no penalty.  I picked up some online teaching jobs to use my doctorate.  I have a nice car -- it's paid off and 6 years old.  It will run me until the wheels fall off.  I shop at Walmart, Ross, T J Maxx, and Marshalls.  When you are fluffy, the clothes at high end stores don't fit.  Even Dillard's 16s and up look like mawmaw clothes.  I shop where I am comfortable, without keeping up with the Joneses.  One of our worries is a lot of us shop at Dress Barn so we have to watch that we don't buy the same clothes and look like Bobsey Twins around work.  We call Nieman Marcus -- Needless Markup.  

Lori just chaps my hide all the way around.  As my dad would say, if you gave her an enema, you could bury her in a shoebox.

[delphinium65]

9 hours ago, feministxtian said:

I'll admit right now that I LIKE having extra cash again. Yeah, I treated myself to an iphone X, a new laptop, new clothes bought somewhere other than Walmart or the 2nd hand store and blew a bundle on shoes. I'll even admit I like driving the almost new, bells, whistles and gadgets SUV. Tough shit to anyone who decides to talk shit to me about it. I went without for way too fucking long to treat myself every now and then. BUT...I don't turn around and tell everyone else to do the opposite of what I do, nor do I make snide remarks about people who do what I do. 

Exactly.  If you can afford it, enjoy it. I don't mind Lori having nice things, it's her 'do as I say, not as I do,' holier than thou attitude that pisses me off, flaunting her wealth before her followers while telling them to be content with what their husbands provide, even if that means inability to pay basic expenses like rent and groceries.