Gun Violence Part 2: Thoughts and Prayers STILL Don't Work

[47of74]

Thanks!  I only have my self to blame, really.  I'm just so tired of these freaks. 
I'm in "Libtard" Massachusetts so no danger of running into him anytime soon.  He just left Vermont after having his annual one week visit with my aunt, his mother.  He didn't come down to see my mother.  Mercifully. 

Glad to hear that your chances of seeing him are nil.

My asshole tolerance these days is low enough to approach non existence.

[GreyhoundFan]

4 hours ago, Ozlsn said:

Ok so what is the rate of shootings under Trump compared to W.? Compared to Clinton? Compared to Bush Snr? And, of course, compared to these guys worst nightmare - Obama?

Because I feel like it's increased. And if that is correct I think that looking at who is radicalising people via Twitter, on TV, through the media is a good start. You preach discord and hate you get results apparently.

It has increased. The Washington Post has a wonderful interactive article that includes numbers, names, and weapons. I can't quote much here because it's interactive. It was quite informative. This is a small snip to give you an idea (if you hover over each bubble in the article, it tells you where it happened and how many people were hurt or killed.

[AmericanRose]

I observed that the graph is 2+ years old and we had 3 in the last week, but yeah. It's not Trump's fault. 
 

[fraurosena]

Sweet Rufus. 

I can't vouch for the veracity of this claim as yet.

[fraurosena]

 

[fraurosena]

[fraurosena]

Security cut off for ‘cesspool of hate’ 8chan forum

Quote

An online message board accused of hosting extremist content was temporarily inaccessible Monday after its cybersecurity provider cut off support for a “cesspool of hate” following mass shootings in Texas and Ohio.

8chan returned an error message after midnight California time, when Cloudflare Inc. said its support would end. There was no immediate explanation, but lack of security support would leave the site open to online attacks that might block access.

Police are investigating commentary posted on 8chan that is believed to have been written by the suspect in a shooting Saturday that killed 20 people in El Paso, Texas.

8chan’s operators said on Twitter that there might be “some downtime” for 24 to 48 hours while they looked for a solution.

The suspect in El Paso “appears to have been inspired” by discussions on 8chan, said Cloudflare CEO Matthew Prince in a blog post on his company’s site. He said a suspect in an earlier shooting at a synagogue in Poway, California, also posted a “hate-filled ‘open letter’” on 8chan.

“8chan has repeatedly proven itself to be a cesspool of hate,” wrote Prince. “They have proven themselves to be lawless and that lawlessness has caused multiple tragic deaths.”

Pity it's only temporary.

[fraurosena]

 

[Audrey2]

32 minutes ago, fraurosena said:

 

Well, he and the President are calling it a tragedy and sending thoughts and prayers. What more could they do?

[GreyhoundFan]

 

[AmazonGrace]

 

[TuringMachine]

Ugh I just got in an argument with a friend of mine who is anti gun control. 

Among his arguments:

More people die from cancer / car accidents / suicides / etc.
- right because we can only care about problems that cause the most deaths. Sorry but I don't value people's lives based on how many other people died the same way.

If we take away the 2nd amendment then we're basically like China who allegedly murders political prisoners to harvest their organs.
- honestly I didn't have words to describe how insane that argument is. I just told him that's the worst argument he's ever come up with about anything.

Rapid fire rarely impacts the situation of a mass shooting.
- the shooter in Gilroy was stopped by police less than a minute after he began shooting. He shot 16 people. Pretty sure his ability to fire many bullets in a short amount of time impacted the situation.

How many people are you even hoping to save in your ideal situation?
- More than 0! JFC, if no one is harmed and any number of people are saved that's win. How many people have to die before you consider their lives worthy of being saved?

[SilverBeach]

Anti sensible gun control people and the NRA are impossible to communicate with. Theirs hearts are hardened to the human impact of senseless, preventable gun violence.  I hate to wish bad on anyone but perhaps personally experiencing losing a loved one in a mass shooting would hock someof them to their senses. 

America has a rate of gun ownership and shootings that far oupaces anywhere on this planet. False comparisons to other forms of death causation are logic fails. 

[Audrey2]

1 hour ago, GreyhoundFan said:

 

1. The Ohio GOP is full of nuts. Just look at all the ? surrounding abortion that is proposed in the Ohio Statehouse.

2. None of the three things she mentions in the () surrounding the breakdown of the traditional American family actually affects the breakdown of the traditional American family. Gays and lesbians aren't going to say, "Gee we can't marry the person we truly love, so we'll settle for someone of the opposite sex just so we can live in a traditional American family (unless they are Fundie and have gone through conversion therapy, which doesn't really work.

3. The Relaxing of laws against criminals (open borders)- Hmmm..... all of these mass shooting criminals seem to have regular Caucasian last names, as opposed to Latino/Arabic (I hope I'm using the correct terms). Therefore, by her "logic" we should prevent any more Caucasians from immigrating, since this is the group who commits mass shootings.

I'm tired- think I'll skip the rest of her illogical "points".

[Alisamer]

25 minutes ago, GreyhoundFan said:

 

So she's written an entire paragraph explaining why white racist men are so insecure they decide to shoot up a walmart, and a large part of that paragraph boils down to "it's because we're trying to treat everyone like people with actual rights, like only white straight men used to enjoy". I think on that point she's probably right. She seems to think the answer to solving that is to go back in time and bring back the 80s frosty white eyeshadow to when only white straight men had actual rights. 

I think the answer is to realize these incredibly insecure angry white bigoted men are to blame, and to make it more difficult for them to commit these crimes.

For the most part, these mass shooters are not stealing guns, they're buying them legally, or borrowing them from family members or friends who bought them legally. I can think of literally no reason whatsoever that any civilian in the united states could ever, ever, need the capability to kill double digit numbers of people in less than 2 minutes. 

Hunting? Don't need an assault rifle, and that's unsportsmanlike anyway. Live on a farm? A shotgun and a single rifle is more than plenty (I grew up with one of each leaned in the corner behind the back door, and they were used maybe 5 times in the entire decade we had the farm). Defending your home from intruders? Burglars don't come in big groups. 

These ridiculous military weapons seem to be the equivalent of an aging man buying a sleek expensive sports car. Look at my gun, see how big it is. Look how manly I am. Sometimes it literally boils down to "women won't sleep with me so I'm gonna take my overcompensation and kill people with it!" or "I'm angry other people are getting equal rights, it makes me feel less special!"

I just don't get it. Nobody needs to be able to shoot that many bullets in that short of a time outside a war. Why in the world are these guns even available to buy?

(I'd prefer ALL guns be very heavily regulated, but starting with the military style assault weapons should be a no-brainer, IMO.)

[Glasgowghirl]

18 hours ago, dramallama said:

‘No Way To Prevent This,’ Says Only Nation Where This Regularly Happens - The Onion

When we as a nation, through our inaction, decided that 5 and 6 year old children in their kindergarten classrooms at Sandy Hook Elementary were acceptable losses on the altar of unlimited gun rights, it was over then. If that didn't spark change, nothing will. This is going to keep happening. This is the new normal. People will keep acting shocked and saddened every time, offering their fucking useless thoughts and prayers, until it happens again. And again. And again. Welcome to Hellworld.

One class of young children in getting shot in my country was enough for the UK government to take action. Two gun laws were passed a year after the shooting by John Major and then Tony Blair's government's, school security was stepped up, security in public buildings was increased as well. 

It's not even full control people are asking for it's just better vetting processes and the restriction of the sale of powerful assault weapons. 

[Mama Mia]

God, just got in a heated argument with very loved younger family member , a guy, with addiction problems, who has spent his teens and 20’s between jail, his mom’s and hanging out on the streets, virtually no formal education or employment. He can be incredibly sweet and funny and helpful - but holy fuck - he has bought into virtually every single possible conspiracy theory on the internet. Like if you can think of one, he has bought it. FEMA camps, vaccines, weather control, shooting hoaxes to take away people’s guns,  on and on and on.  Until I went off on him about the anti-Mexican parts of the Gilroy and El Paso ones and how that was making me more afraid for some of our family than others, but afraid for everyone, he was oblivious to anything but the possibility of some idiot conspiracy. I know other family members and friends - mostly in that age group, but some much older, who are drifting in that direction. Some white, some not. Mostly men but some women. What the actual fuck is happening??? 

[thoughtful]

11 minutes ago, SilverBeach said:

I hate to wish bad on anyone but perhaps personally experiencing losing a loved one in a mass shooting would hock someof them to their senses. 

I'm sure some of them would still find a way to love their guns and blame the death on something else. 

I never understand gun-love thinking. I've lived in the US for more than six decades, and have never seen a gun in person, other than in a police officer's holster, and a set of hunting rifles a former student had locked in a case.

I know some other hunters, and folks that have livestock to protect. So I'm not naive enough to think that nobody I know owns guns, but they are not brandished about or gloated over. Nobody with whom I've ever discussed the issue IRL believes that anyone needs assault rifles or a whole collection. The gun-loving culture is an idiotic mystery to me.

From what I've seen (and I admit I'm no expert), a clear majority in the US favors stricter gun control.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/1645/guns.aspx

It seems to be the fucking politicians that keep us in this cesspool of death.

[SilverBeach]

1 hour ago, thoughtful said:

I never understand gun-love thinking.

Me either. 

[fraurosena]

2 hours ago, SilverBeach said:

I hate to wish bad on anyone but perhaps personally experiencing losing a loved one in a mass shooting would hock someof them to their senses. 

I don't think it's necessary or even helpful for them to lose anyone in a mass shooting. The only thing that might help is if they are part of the public being shot at themselves. (Not hit, mind you, just present and in perceived danger). Let them be scared of losing their very own lives. 

Once they've been on the receiving end of things instead of wet-dreaming of shooting that assault weapon of mass destruction themselves, then they might, just might, alter their way of thinking. 

[fraurosena]

She's right.

 

[dramallama]

2 hours ago, thoughtful said:

From what I've seen (and I admit I'm no expert), a clear majority in the US favors stricter gun control.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/1645/guns.aspx

It seems to be the fucking politicians that keep us in this cesspool of death.

The politicians bought and paid for by the NRA.  Follow the money, and you have your answer as to why nothing is done despite widespread public support for reasonable gun control legislation.

[47of74]

A Branch Trumpvidian tweeted something stoopid bout guns.

And promptly got her ass handed to her multiple times over.

[Glasgowghirl]

7 minutes ago, 47of74 said:

A Branch Trumpvidian tweeted something stoopid bout guns.
 

 

And promptly got her ass handed to her multiple times over.

 

I have never been in a situation where I've felt I've needed an assault rifle or any gun for that matter. I work in Glasgow City Centre and have witnessed violence finishing work late at night and while it can be intimidating, I don't think a gun would improve the situation, if anything it would make it worse. 

I do think what causes people to carry mass shootings needs to be looked at too, especially in teens but that should be done as well as gun legislation not instead of. Even a few pro 2A people I have spoken to on twitter are wanting stricter legislation and a few of them voted Trump but they are saying they won't again.

[GreyhoundFan]