Gun Violence Part 2: Thoughts and Prayers STILL Don't Work

[Ozlsn]

@WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo? I hope your daughter is OK and never experiences a real life lock down. I also wonder just how many ambulances the population is willing to keep at the bottom of the cliff before they build the damn fence.

[WiseGirl]

Hoping I don't get a bucket, bag, and kitty litter when I go back.

https%3A%2F%2Ftime.com%2F5658266%2Fcolorado-district-kitty-litter-buckets-lockdowns%2F&psig=AOvVaw00ng2IhP3M_dAvvMpGrAgV&ust=1566736187766929

[apple1]

For most of this week, every time I click to open the Political page of this forum, I get not one, but two, NRA ads, usually both with Lapierre's large face but occasionally the smaller one with the don't-tread-on-me snake.

Gah.

[Howl]

Quote

A gun in a Columbus, Ohio, school that was part of a concealed carry program to *protect* students was removed from its unlocked case by two first-graders. The pistol was left unattended by a *trained* school official when she went to the restroom.

Just one aspect of this insanity of arming teachers.  A gun isn't a magic talisman of protection.  A strong middle school or highschool boy (or girl) could disarm a teacher in seconds and begin their shooting spree right there. 

That an armed teacher is a deterrent to anything is the height of (as noted above) idiocy.  

Now where was I?  I actually came over to post this good news: Florida man found guilty of manslaughter in parking lot shooting that led to 'Stand Your Ground' trial

Also this.  I've been reading "No Visible Bruises:  What We Don’t Know About Domestic Violence Can Kill Us"  reviewed here by The Guardian

Domestic abuse of some kind is typically found in the background of mass shooters and domestic homicides.  The most reliable predictor of eventual domestic homicide? Episodes of strangulation. 

Edited August 24, 2019 by Howl

[laPapessaGiovanna]

A propos of alarm bells. This teacher who has also been under a temporary restrictive order asked by an ex partner, during a lockdown drill he told his students that if he were a shooter he would have killed a thousand. And even explained how. Even if it really was an "innocent" joke as he claims, it is a sick thing to say to scared students. Luckily they had enough sense to report him.

Spoiler

A Florida high school teacher was placed on administrative leave after he told students he'd "be the best school shooter" with a "1,000 person body count."

The incident took place at Lakeland Senior High School, about 45 minutes from Tampa, on August 16 during a lockdown drill, according to a Polk County risk protection order.

Police interviewed 16 students about the incident. The teacher told students if he were a school shooter he'd plant improvised explosive devices (IEDs), then "fire a couple rounds and wait for everyone to hide, then press a button and boom -- everyone would die," accaccording to student testimony.

The teacher also said "he would put a bomb in the corner and put nails in it for shrapnel," another student told police.

CNN is not naming the teacher because he has not been charged. When interviewed by an officer, the teacher told police he was a former US Marine and that his statements were a joke.

"Being a former Marine he should be looked at as the person who will protect the students, and not make them question whether their teacher is looking to harm them," Detective Justin Conatser, who filed the risk protection order, wrote in his report.

Police searched the teacher's home and vehicle, but no weapons were found, court documents say.

The teacher has no criminal history, but a temporary ex parte risk protection order said the teacher "may be seriously mentally ill or may have recurring mental health issues."

The Polk County School District says the teacher is on administrative leave while they investigate the case. School District Superintendent Jacqueline M. Byrd said in a statement the district is "cooperating fully with the law enforcement investigation, as well as conducting our own internal investigation."

The teacher is due in court August 30 for a hearing on a final risk protection order.

You know who I can easily imagine boasting to "be the best school shooter"? Yeah you got it.

[fraurosena]

But... gun rights!

 

[47of74]

Another day and another fucking idiot

Quote

A Stamford man is under arrest after police say he fired his gun into a busy park.

On Wednesday night around 6:30 p.m., police say they received 911 calls about a man firing off two gunshots in their neighborhood, reports CBS2’s Alice Gainer.

When they arrived, they found 68-year-old James Denardo in his Cadillac with two guns he had just purchased: a loaded two-shot Derringer and a 9mm Beretta.

He told police “he wanted to see how they worked,” according to Stamford Captain Richard Conklin.

I have a suggestion about how he could see how his guns worked but it's not very nice.

[thoughtful]

I was driving behind a vehicle on the road the other day that had something like this in the back window:

Spoiler

?

[WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo?]

6 minutes ago, thoughtful said:

I was driving behind a vehicle on the road the other day that had something like this in the back window:

I've seen those in my city, unfortunately. There are also lots of vehicles (mostly trucks) that have the shape of my state turned into a gun, firing a tree/bullet. I hate it every time I see one. 

[WiseGirl]

Damn it! 

https://www.cnn.com/2019/08/31/us/odessa-texas-active-shooter/index.html

[Becky]

Holy hell.  I am heartbroken for the victims and their loved ones. ? We will get a bunch of platitudes and then the news cycle will move on, and nothing will be done. 

[Ozlsn]

Another day, another 20 people randomly shot. Two dead at this point, one is one of the gunmen (believe two shooters).

I just finished reading "A Good Month For Murder" by Del Quentin Wilbur which covers a police unit investigating murders in a county in Maryland during one month. What surprised me (well after just the sheer number they had in that month) was how many of the murders were shootings (pretty much all of them), and how few were family violence (none). I know this county is on the high side for crime, but it did make me wonder just how many shooting deaths barely touch the news on a daily basis.

[GreyhoundFan]

It looks like five have been killed and 21 injured in the mass shooting in Texas.

Spoiler

Five people were killed and another 21 were injured in the West Texas cities of Odessa and Midland after a gunman fled a traffic stop, hijacked a mail truck and opened fire indiscriminately on officers and civilians as he sped down Interstate 20 and Highway 191, police said.

Odessa Police Chief Michael Gerke said that the shooter — a white man in his 30s — fled a police traffic stop before hijacking a U.S. Postal Service truck and shooting randomly at drivers and pedestrians.

The spree ended when the gunman was shot and killed by police at the Cinergy movie theater in Odessa.

At least three police officers were among the wounded, Gerke said, and it remains unclear if the shooter had any political motive.

The shooting thrust the region into chaos much of Saturday afternoon, as it remained unclear where the shootings were taking place and whether they were being committed by more than one gunman. Odessa and Midland were placed on lockdown for much of the afternoon, and students at the University of Texas of the Permian Basin were ordered to shelter in place.

One local television station, KOSA-TV in Odessa, evacuated its studio live on air. Various municipalities and police departments publicly announced that there was an active shooter, fueling speculation that there may be multiple, simultaneous gunmen at different locations.

But Gerke told reporters early Saturday evening that they believe there was only one shooter and there was no ongoing threat.

“There are a lot of people hurt and a lot of people scared,” Odessa Mayor David Turner said in a brief phone interview Saturday afternoon as he raced back to the city from a holiday weekend trip to Fort Worth. “In a situation like this prayer is the most important thing. We’ll get through this.”

Fourteen of the victims were taken to Permian Regional Medical Center, according to CEO Russell Tippin, who told reporters that the hospital had spent much of the day locked down for safety.

Jen Ramos, 27, was in the middle of a weekend retreat for Texas Young Democrats in Midland, Texas, when she learned about an active shooter nearby. She scurried to the hotel’s ballroom — far from the entrance, and away from windows — where she stayed hiding alongside dozens of co-workers for more than an hour and a half before they received word that the lockdown had been lifted.

“The fact that our plans to grow and develop leaders turned into a lesson on gun safety,” she said. “Nothing is safe anymore.”

Texas Gov. Greg Abbott (R) said in a statement that he was “heartbroken over this senseless and cowardly attack.”

“We offer our unwavering support to the victims, their families and all the people of Midland and Odessa,” he said. “I want to remind all Texans that we will not allow the Lone Star State to be overrun by hatred and violence. We will unite, as Texans always do, to respond to this tragedy.”

This is the second mass shooting in Texas this month. On Aug. 3, a gunman opened fire on a Walmart in El Paso, killing 22 people and wounding a dozen more. In a missive published online, the suspect said he had driven to El Paso to target Hispanics. Patrick Crusius is in custody in that incident.

President Trump tweeted Saturday night that he had been briefed by Attorney General William P. Barr. “FBI and Law Enforcement is fully engaged,” he wrote.

A spokeswoman for the FBI’s field office in El Paso said federal investigators were on the scene, and that as of Saturday evening it was still not certain whether the incident had any nexus to international or domestic terrorism.

Speaking to reporters at Joint Base Andrews in suburban Maryland, Vice President Pence said “our hearts break” for the shooting victims.

He said he and Trump had spoken about the shooting and that the administration remains “absolutely determined to work with leaders in both parties and the Congress to take such steps so that we can address and confront this scourge of mass atrocities.”

He offered no specifics.

 

[thoughtful]

3 hours ago, GreyhoundFan said:

Odessa Mayor David Turner said in a brief phone interview Saturday afternoon as he raced back to the city from a holiday weekend trip to Fort Worth. “In a situation like this prayer is the most important thing.

No, mayor Turner, it's not. Really, it's not.

[fraurosena]

? ???

 

GOP. Guns Over People.

[fraurosena]

 

[fraurosena]

Word.

 

[fraurosena]

 hypocrite.

 

[Ozlsn]

1 hour ago, fraurosena said:

 hypocrite.

 

Oh FFS. Then Do Something that will help. Restrict what can be legally sold. Enact cooling off periods. Require background checks to buy a firearm at gun shows. Require registration of weapons. Require a licence certifying that you have been trained by an accredited instructor before you can legally own weapons. Mandate a 5 year jail term per illegal weapon found in your possession. Require 10 trees to be planted and certification of that before you get a gun licence. Require weapons to be locked securely in a gun safe when not in use. Require ammunition to be stored in a separate gun safe. 

Need more ideas from around the world? Try googling.

[Becky]

Today on the road I passed one sign for an upcoming gun show, and another sign advertising a raffle giving away 31 guns in 30 days.  Just buy a ticket, get a chance to take home a gun....  I guess with no questions asked?  This country is awash in guns. 

[Ozlsn]

7 hours ago, fraurosena said:

 

I always find it blackly amusing that it's harder to buy Kinder Surprise eggs than guns. 

[Briefly]

The day before the shooting in the WalMart in El Paso, I went to a local WalMart.  I live in Broken Arrow, which is a small town right outside of Tulsa.  It was maybe early to mid afternoon.  As I was walking out, there was a police officer just inside the door and he was talking to what was probably the manager and a few other employees.  I figured it must be a shoplifter issue, which is not uncommon.  But when I went out the door of the store, there were several police cars, at least two fire trucks and a couple of ambulances.  Several of the officers were talking to each other, what little I overheard made me think that there had been a crank call or possibly a 911 hangup which always gets responded to.  I didn't give it any thought until the next day, when we went to dinner and the restaurant had CNN on their overhead tv's.  It would have gotten my attention anyway, but my first thought was what if the calls in El Paso had been dismissed as a hoax or a swatting?  With the number of shootings that we have had, and may well have in the future, I sure hope that there is never a case where the authorities assume it's just a hoax at first.  Kind of like the story of the boy who cried wolf.

And yet Walmart still sells weaponry.

There is an Oklahoma law about to take effect.  It takes effect November 1st.  Basically, anybody can get a gun and they can then carry it openly.  Not much in the way of regulation at all. https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/oklahoma/articles/2019-02-27/permitless-gun-carry-bill-heads-to-oklahomas-new-governor  There was a petition drive to put the issue to a vote, which was sponsored by the many people who are against it.  Who knows if it will even get to the vote stage, but this is Oklahoma and the gun worship culture is very strong here.  I am not anti-gun, I have access to them and have fired them myself.  But I am seriously against the permitless carry.  Some people simply do not need them.

[GreyhoundFan]

Two more people have died.

Spoiler

ODESSA, Texas — Law enforcement officials have identified Seth Ator, 36, as the shooter who killed at least seven people and wounded 22 as he drove through the cities of Odessa and Midland in western Texas on Saturday.

According to officials, police received multiple calls about Ator’s gold sedan driving erratically on Interstate 20, a highway that connects the two cities. When Texas Department of Public Safety officials attempted to pull him over about 3:15 p.m., he opened fire.

Ator shot an “AR-type” rifle at troopers, striking one of them. He then fled and drove west on the highway while shooting at pedestrians and motorists.

At one point, he hijacked a Postal Service van in Odessa, killing the driver.

Ator eventually exchanged gunfire with police officers at the Cinergy movie theater in Odessa, where he was killed. On Sunday, officials suggested he might have been planning to continue his assault inside the movie theater.

Investigators are still searching for a motive in the shooting. Ator, an Odessa resident, lost his job on the day of the attack, though investigators do not necessarily view that as a triggering event, said an official, who requested anonymity to discuss the ongoing investigation.

They are exploring whether Ator’s mental health might have played an issue, the official said. It was not immediately clear whether Ator had a specific diagnosis. He had been previously charged with two traffic misdemeanors, according to a public records search.

At a Sunday news conference, Odessa Police Chief Michael Gerke said officials are investigating how the shooter acquired his weapon.

Gerke declined to identify Ator by name. “I am not naming the subject,” Gerke said at a news conference held at the University of Texas of the Permian Basin on Sunday. “I refuse to. I am not going to give him any notoriety.”

He said officials don’t believe this was an act of domestic terrorism.

The police chief also refused to describe a timeline of events. “It’s a very chaotic situation,” he said, that is “all being pieced together.” Police and FBI officers are investigating at least 15 crime scenes. Amid the mayhem, the Midland Police Department warned about two possible shooters. But officials said the reports were due to the gunman switching vehicles.

Officials said the dead ranged in age from 15 to 57. They included the postal worker whose vehicle was hijacked, a former math teacher adored by students; a 15-year-old who celebrated her quinceañera just a few months ago, and a 25-year-old killed outside his home.

Among those injured were at least three police officers and 17-month-old Anderson Davis, who was hit by shrapnel in her right chest. Family members say she has a hole in her bottom lip and tongue and that her front teeth were knocked out. The child is in stable condition, according to Hailey Wilkerson, a friend of the family.

“She did have surgery. She did come out of surgery and she is doing great, and they may let her go home today,” Wilkerson said. She said Davis’s mother is “still in shock.”

“They’re an amazing family. You don’t ever think something like this will happen to somebody you know personally,” Wilkerson said. “All they want was for their baby to be better.”

Several of the victims are being treated at local hospitals. The Odessa Regional Medical Center treated five people. Three have been discharged, and two remain in critical but stable condition, said Madison Tate, a spokeswoman for the hospital.

Residents of Odessa and Midland spent much of Saturday afternoon on lockdown. Even after officials announced the shooter had been killed, many stayed home that night. The streets were quiet, and many restaurants were closed. Delivery drivers were sent home, and the stores that stayed open were drive-through only.

By Sunday, the mood had shifted from fear to mourning. Across the state, flags were lowered to half-staff. In Odessa, neighbors donated their blood and local restaurants offered free meals to first responders.

This was Texas’s second mass shooting in August. A gunman killed 22 people and injured dozens in a massacre at a Walmart in El Paso on Aug. 3.

At Sunday’s news conference, Texas Gov. Greg Abbott (R) made a reference to El Paso, along with other mass shootings that have rocked the state in recent years. In 2017, 26 people were killed by a mass shooter at a baptist church in Sutherland Springs, the deadliest mass shooting in Texas history. He also referenced a school shooting in Santa Fe and a 2016 shooting of police officers in Dallas.

“The status quo in Texas is unacceptable,” he said Sunday. “Action is needed.”

Christopher Combs, a special agent in charge of the FBI’s San Antonio Division, said nearly 200 federal agents are on the ground in the area, assisting local officials.

He said they would stay as long as they were needed and “we will then get ready to go to the next active shooter."

It’s “an unfortunate statement to make, he said, “but it seems like that’s what we do. We respond to one after another of these horrible events.”

 

[AmericanRose]

Then there's this asshole.

 

Edited September 1, 2019 by AmericanRose
'cause I didn't know how to embed.

[Howl]

Yeah, fuck that guy.  His former aide for three or four years was arrested for solicitation of a minor (12 years old).

Report: Texas House member's former chief of staff charged with solicitation of a minor