Turpins 3: 2 Monsters, 13 Victims (WARNING abuse and torture)

[EmCatlyn]

1 hour ago, Sideways said:

From what I was able to gleen from the coordinator at Corona Chamber of Commerce, it seems the children are all still in the hospital.   The media is speculating on the children being moved.   

I just joined a Facebook Group on the Turpin family, and found this amazing blog from July, 2011 by the Turpin children's first cousin, Miranda Turpin.   There she discusses her trip to California and stay with the Turpin family, as well as [J-1] Turpin's amazing voice and songwriting abilities.   There was a video of [J-1] singing, but Miranda (or someone else) disabled it.   Still, you can read all about her impressions of her 12 cousins.

https://mirandaturpin.blogspot.com

While we are at it, if you care to find out more about the Turpins in the Facebook Group, here is the link.  It is a closed group and you must request to, but they approve it nearly immediately.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/214208709097328/?notif_id=1518670074126270&notif_t=group_r2j_approved&ref=notif

 

Thanks for the link to the blog.  There are many mysteries about this family, but a major one is how the parents seem to have allowed some forms of self-expression (journals and singing/songwriting) while doing everything they could to destroy individuality and growth in their children.  

I am especially interested in (and worried about) the oldest daughter (J-1) because there have been suggestions in the media that the hospital was particularly concerned about her well-being.  This is the daughter that went to public school (probably kindergarten, first and possibly second grade in Fort Worth and  third (and possibly second) grade in Rio Vista.

This oldest daughter is the one that told a neighbor that they weren’t allowed to tell people their names, but that a person could find out their names by listening to the siblings talking to each other.  This older daughter may have have been the Turpin daughter that reportedly tried to run away during the family’s last years in Rio Vista.

(The reason I think it may have been this daughter is that she would have been around the right age to want to know how to get a driver’s license and perhaps also the one with the most experience of the outside world.  She is five years or so older than the next oldest girl [J-3]. )

 Anyway, I wonder about her.  

I wonder about all of them.  

I am not sure that they are still in the hospital proper.  The news specifically said that the hospital had announced the adults would be moved to “assisted living” the next Thursday (a couple of weeks ago.). They may well have been moved to a satellite “physical rehab” facility.    These are skilled nursing facilities, so they could continue to have IVs and stuff like that if they needed.   Often these are in the same building or complex as either assisted living or long-term nursing homes, so I could see them being referred to informally as “assisted living.” But one has to be discharged from these, just as one has to be discharged from the hospital.

 

 

 

[LilMissMetaphor]

 

[Nikedagain?]

Do we know when the next court date might be? And is this cousin-blogger the daughter of the "fasting brother"?

[Elegant Mess]

4 hours ago, Nikedagain? said:

Do we know when the next court date might be? 

Next court date is Feb. 23

[EmCatlyn]

5 hours ago, Nikedagain? said:

Do we know when the next court date might be? And is this cousin-blogger the daughter of the "fasting brother"?

I believe she is the daughter of Randy Turpin, who wrote a book that praises fasting as a spiritual resource.  The trip she is talking about seems to have been the last time DT and his brother saw each other.   (They seem to have no other brothers.)

My guess is that Randy Turpin’s attitudes towards child rearing and discipline might seem abusive to most of us, and that his ideas about sin, guilt and so forth reflect the usual fundie intolerance, but it does not appear that he felt a need to keep his children totally under his control.

In other words, David and Louise seem to have crossed a line that Randy Turpin and the other family members are genuinely appalled.

 

[EmCatlyn]

Someone has started a fund to  raise money for the Turpin kids and plans to give the money to Randy Turpin (uncle).

Fund for Turpins

Quote

The funds will be utilized for food,clothing,education,health and so on. All funds will be donated to randy Turpin. The uncle of the 13 children and hopefully their new legal guardian.  [sic]

There is a picture of the grandparents and the kids (faces included) from a Disneyland trip which I suspect was around the same time as Randy Turpin and his family’s trip. (But only D and L and their kids are in pic with grandparents.)

The Turpin side of the family (as opposed to Louise’s siblings) have been pretty quiet since it became impossible to deny the truth of the allegations of abuse.  Randy Turpin did say he would try to become the kids’ guardian, but that was weeks ago, and this fund-raiser was started last week.

 

[feministxtian]

I firmly believe Randy Turpin is in it for the $$$. Considering the guy is a bona fide nut job, I doubt he'd get custody/guardianship of the children, at least I hope not. Those children (and the kidults) are going to need therapy for years. From a totally non-professional point of view, at the very least, these kids are going to be dealing with the cognitive and physical aftereffects of the abuse for the rest of their lives. How many are going to be able to live independently? How many are in need of remedial education? The older kids may be better off intellectually, but what about physically? They're still hospitalized. That tells me they're still not in a good place nutritionally. How many were on TPN? How many have been able to advance to a normal diet? How many have food aversions? How many are still not able to properly metabolize nutrients? That stuff takes a LONG time to resolve. 

**as part of the pancreatitis community, I know more about nutritional/digestive issues than I should. Many CP (chronic pancreatitis) patients have issues with nutrition. I am thankful that my husband avoided most of the problems (although a g-tube has been discussed because of his inability to gain weight. His GI and endo are letting it go for now as long as he can maintain his weight w/o losing any more. He's almost 6 feet tall and has been as low as 119lbs)

[upkacrane]

3 hours ago, EmCatlyn said:

Someone has started a fund to  raise money for the Turpin kids and plans to give the money to Randy Turpin (uncle).

Fund for Turpins

There is a picture of the grandparents and the kids (faces included) from a Disneyland trip which I suspect was around the same time as Randy Turpin and his family’s trip. (But only D and L and their kids are in pic with grandparents.)

The Turpin side of the family (as opposed to Louise’s siblings) have been pretty quiet since it became impossible to deny the truth of the allegations of abuse.  Randy Turpin did say he would try to become the kids’ guardian, but that was weeks ago, and this fund-raiser was started last week.

 

Are you sure those are the grandparents? I seem to remember they were a random couple they met there, at DL. IIRC, this pic was posted publicly on the Turpin's joint FB profile and the lady from the picture commented something on the lines of "it was a blessing meeting your family. Such well-behaved children!".

 

[Sideways]

9 hours ago, EmCatlyn said:

Someone has started a fund to  raise money for the Turpin kids and plans to give the money to Randy Turpin (uncle).

Fund for Turpins

There is a picture of the grandparents and the kids (faces included) from a Disneyland trip which I suspect was around the same time as Randy Turpin and his family’s trip. (But only D and L and their kids are in pic with grandparents.)

The Turpin side of the family (as opposed to Louise’s siblings) have been pretty quiet since it became impossible to deny the truth of the allegations of abuse.  Randy Turpin did say he would try to become the kids’ guardian, but that was weeks ago, and this fund-raiser was started last week.

 

So far no donors.  There are only three legitimate funds for the benefit of the Turpin children, and this is not one of them.

On 2/14/2018 at 11:24 PM, EmCatlyn said:

 I am not sure that they are still in the hospital proper.  The news specifically said that the hospital had announced the adults would be moved to “assisted living” the next Thursday (a couple of weeks ago.). They may well have been moved to a satellite “physical rehab” facility.    These are skilled nursing facilities, so they could continue to have IVs and stuff like that if they needed.   Often these are in the same building or complex as either assisted living or long-term nursing homes, so I could see them being referred to informally as “assisted living.” But one has to be discharged from these, just as one has to be discharged from the hospital.

 

 

 

I received an email back from the coordinator of donations for the Turpin children, thanking me for the donations from my children's high school.   She mentioned a nurse from the "hospital" came to collect the donations and had personally told me they were still receiving hospital care.  It might not be for all of them though.  

[EmCatlyn]

6 hours ago, upkacrane said:

Are you sure those are the grandparents? I seem to remember they were a random couple they met there, at DL. IIRC, this pic was posted publicly on the Turpin's joint FB profile and the lady from the picture commented something on the lines of "it was a blessing meeting your family. Such well-behaved children!".

 

No, I am not sure they are the grandparents.  I did see them identified as the grandparents in another source (where the kids’ faces were blocked off), but that source may have been wrong,  I had only glanced at the DL facebook page before it got closed down.

I know nothing about the person who started the “money collection” except that he can’t be bothered to grammar/spellcheck and he seems to think Randy Turpin would make a good guardian.   

 I assumed he picked this picture (over some of the other available ones) because it made more of an “extended family” statement. (Maybe he thought they were the grandparents even if they aren’t.)  On the other hand, maybe he just couldn’t get his hands on a different picture.

What I found interesting is that this is an example of a type of person who cares about the children’s fate but sees it as a “family matter” and is setting out to raise money for the family.

 If Randy Turpin actually wants custody/guardianship, he will have a lot of support.  We may think he is a nut job, but his own kids don’t seem any worse off than most kids brought up in fundie-dom and he has had a “respectable” position as a preacher and president of a college. Furthermore, he is the father of the blogger who wrote about J1’s singing ability.   This may (or may not) mean that the Turpin kidults feel he would be the “right” guardian for him, and their opinions would probably be listened to.

FWIW, I don’t think Randy Turpin is in it for the money.  I think if he asks for custody it will be because of the image he is trying to present/preserve and maybe also because his parents pressure him.  

 

 

 

 

[wild little fox]

At the Facebook group about the Turpins someone did the math on the ages of the adult children. LT gave birth when she was 20 and then proceeded to have seven children in 11 years. This doesn't include the children who are currently minors. Looking at the numbers I'm overwhelmed with anger and sadness. The lack of common sense is shadowed by their lack of empathy in birthing so many human beings that have needs no one person has the capacity to meet. 

According to the post when the Turpins left Ft Worth the children were ages 11, 7, 6, 5, 3, 2, and 1.

[EmCatlyn]

1 hour ago, Sideways said:

So far no donors.  There are only three legitimate funds for the benefit of the Turpin children, and this is not one of them.

I received an email back from the coordinator of donations for the Turpin children, thanking me for the donations from my children's high school.   She mentioned a nurse from the "hospital" came to collect the donations and had personally told me they were still receiving hospital care.  It might not be for all of them though.  

Yeah, I didn’t think it was a “legitimate fund”— and I am glad it has no donors since I think people should be giving to the other funds.  I posted it as an example of the “keep them with family” perspective, not so anyone would donate.

As for the hospital, there was a news item saying that all the kids were discharged. 

Quote

The six youngest Turpin children will be released from the hospital and placed in two foster homes Thursday, a source told CBS News.

The 13 Turpin children, aged 2-29, will get split up into new locations to tend to their needs as they continue their recovery process, CBS News reported Tuesday.  http://dailycaller.com/2018/01/24/turpins-foster-home/    

 

Quote

With the children's expected release from the hospital this week, a source tells CBS News officials want to make sure they do not visit their parents in jail, fearing any conversations could taint the on-going investigation. 

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/california-couple-house-of-horrors-to-face-restraining-order-13-children/?ftag=CNM-00-10aab7e&linkId=47305281

However, this may have been a misinterpretation on the part of the media or the date of the discharge may have been delayed. 

If they are making an effort not to separate the kids, one child’s (or kiddult’s) lack of readiness may mean the whole group is kept in the hospital.   I do think that at this stage a lot of what they are getting is not going to be hospital care as much as physical, occupational and cognitive therapy.   Going from how these things were handled in my parents’ cases (medicare, not medicaid, but still.... ) there is generally a push to get the patient into “subacute” care as soon as possible.

In any case, it is no surprise that they are still under medical care.

@sideways, I am glad you got an acknoweledgment and information about the kids’ well-being. Thanks for posting.

[Crazy Enough to Join]

Do you think the Turpin family members (who are now looking at adoption) knew what was happening to the kids?

1. knew nothing, thought everything was awesome
2. knew something was off, but more in a you are weird kind of way rather than a bad way
3. knew the parents were harsh/strict/mean, but didn't think it rose to the levels of abuse

4. knew the kids were being abused, but didn't know it was life-threatening
5. knew about the life threatening abuse

I'm leaning toward a 3 or 4 for M1's brother because they VISITED the family and maybe a 2 or 3 for the rest of M1's side. I'm leaning to a 1 or 2 for M2's side of the family because they really had never seen the family in years. To me, that makes M2's side interest in adopting less creepy.

[EmCatlyn]

1 hour ago, Crazy Enough to Join said:

Do you think the Turpin family members (who are now looking at adoption) knew what was happening to the kids?

1. knew nothing, thought everything was awesome
2. knew something was off, but more in a you are weird kind of way rather than a bad way
3. knew the parents were harsh/strict/mean, but didn't think it rose to the levels of abuse

4. knew the kids were being abused, but didn't know it was life-threatening
5. knew about the life threatening abuse

I'm leaning toward a 3 or 4 for M1's brother because they VISITED the family and maybe a 2 or 3 for the rest of M1's side. I'm leaning to a 1 or 2 for M2's side of the family because they really had never seen the family in years. To me, that makes M2's side interest in adopting less creepy.

I don’t think any of the relatives want to adopt.  I think they feel they ought to at least say they want to adopt.  

Even if you focus only on the minors, that’s five or six kids to add to a  household.  How many of us could take in that many people—never mind the problems the kids will have r even the costs.  It is something that they feel they have a duty to do.

As for what the extended family knew or didn’t know, I think that many of that family may do things that we consider abusive but they would not dream that anyone could do some of the things the Turpins did.

The Turpin side saw the kids a few times, but that doesn’t mean they guessed the extent of the beatings and that the children were being starved.  Young people can be thin, look younger than their ages, etc. and not be abused.

I have pictures of myself at 23 looking about as thin as the eldest Turpin in the Disney photos.  (I was living on my own, supporting myself, and cooking and eating with pleasure.)  I was carded well into my late thirties.   

Excessive politeness, strict rules, and daughters who stay under the father’s “sphere” until they find their mate would seem normal to many fundies.  The oldest boy was supposedly going to college. The next oldest could have allegedly been learning a trade or whatever.  So there were no real “warning signs.”  

I don’t think one side of the family is more to blame for not seeing “warning signs.” The Turpins kept them at a distance and told them what they wanted them to hear.

 

 

[luv2laugh]

It may sound like they’ve raised a good amount of money but it will be gone very quickly with all of the costs over the years. Some of these kids may be on disability their whole lives. 

[EmCatlyn]

The DA in charge of the Turpin case spoke to the

Quote

Riverside County District Attorney Mike Hestrin said Friday, Feb. 16, that he plans to put some of the 13 children of Perris torture defendants David and Louise Turpin on the witness stand to testify against their parents if the case goes to trial.

 He explained that the young people won’t have to testify at the preliminary hearing, but that for the actual case, they should be heard.  He mentioned that the children’s journals, which “reflect the thoughts and impressions of the victims,” are going to be useful.   Lastly, he says that the tipline has provided a lot of information.

The article also mentioned that 12 I-Pads and 2 Amazon Fires had been donated for the children, and that Fender guitars had donated 13 guitars.  (I hope they thought of a child sized guitar for the 2yr old.  )

Link to article.

Oh, and elsewhere in the news, the two Turpin cars have been stolen but one was recovered already because the car had LoJack.

[EmCatlyn]

Someone on websleuths posted a link to a timeline for the Turpins that includes birthdates and moves and known trips and significant facebook posts.

I particularly like that it includes the timing of some of the facebook comments since the “when” is sometimes as significant as the “what.”

I am hesitant to post the link here because in disclosing the birthdates it also included the names of the victims.  

If the FJ admins say it is okay, I will post the link.  Otherwise, PM me and I will forward.  (Or go over to page 11 of the current Websleuths thread on the Turpins.)

 

[EmCatlyn]

9 hours ago, EmCatlyn said:

Someone on websleuths posted a link to a timeline for the Turpins that includes birthdates and moves and known trips and significant facebook posts.

I particularly like that it includes the timing of some of the facebook comments since the “when” is sometimes as significant as the “what.”

I am hesitant to post the link here because in disclosing the birthdates it also included the names of the victims.  

If the FJ admins say it is okay, I will post the link.   

 

I’ve been told that it is okay to post.

Many of us know the names already, from other sources, but I think we are right to continue to refer to these young people without bandying around their names.

Timeline of major Turpin events known so far

 

[EmCatlyn]

Just want to note that on the timeline to which I posted a link earlier, where one of the last entries states that the “Turpin children receive a scholarship,” the description is misleading.

A fund  for their education has been set up, but there is relatively little money in it at present.   It is more that money is being collected for their education.  

So far theTurpin children have not “received” a scholarship.

 

[Rosalie]

This case from Norway isn’t nearly as grotesque as the Turpin case, but has made major headlines here. 

A 13 year old girl died while in her mother’s custody two years ago. The girl was suffering from severe anorexia, and had been admitted to hospital. In August 2015 the mother started homeschooling, and moved with the daughter to a cabin in another municipality. She reported relocation to other municipalities several times during the autumn, and even though there was opened case at CPS, she flew under the radar because of all the relocations. 

The girl received no medical aid this autumn, even though she lost 20 kg in just three months. When she died, she only weighed 21 kg, and her BMI was only 8,8.

The mother blamed her daughter’s anorexia on bullying from her classmates, but police investigations had these allegations refuted. 

State prosecutors claim that the mother failed to get help for her daughter and actively tried to keep health care officials at a distance, and that she can be blamed for the daughter’s death. If found guilty, she faces 15 years in prison for criminal child abuse. (Maximum sentence in Norway is 21 years).

http://www.newsinenglish.no/2016/01/03/mother-charged-in-teenagers-death/

http://www.newsinenglish.no/2017/04/24/lommedalen-tragedy-unfolds-in-court/

[EmCatlyn]

According an article in the Desert Sun the RIverside UHS foundation has raised $307,820, the Corona Chamber of Commerce has raised $190,000 and there is a GoFundMe from the City of Perris that has collected $38,000.  More money is expected from the restaurant fundraiser yesterday.  In short, there is over half a million raised so far.  (Not a lot among 13 kids, but better than nothing.)

Quote

“We set this up to support the siblings into the future. We don’t have an estimate of total needs because we believe needs will evolve over time," said Nicole Orr, the foundation's senior director of development. 

I find the statement “support the siblings in the future,” encouraging.  IIRC, I have worried that medical and other care that could be covered by the state might have to come out of this fund, making it meaningless.  But it seems the fund is meant for long-term needs beyond what medicare and disability might cover. Let’s hope, anyway.

The same article confirms that all the children and kiddults are still under some kind of hospital care but would not give details to protect their privacy.

 

[EmCatlyn]

(Since there is no real news about the Turpins,  I have been looking at some articles I didn’t pay attention to originally.). 

An article from late January in the UK Mirror, with the headline that the Turpin parents visited Taco Bell every day, reports that the usual “order was four Mountain Dews . . . and a root beer.”   D and L apparently went in and ate food more seldom than they picked up these drinks.  

(See Mirror article)

Maybe it is just me, but I can’t imagine two adults consuming 5 large fountain drinks by themselves with nothing else to eat.  If the report is accurate, it is just one more oddness about the Turpin parents.

Were the sodas for themselves or did they split them among the kids?   I wonder if the Mountain Dew was given to the starving kids  for “breakfast” in the early afternoon when they woke up.   With its high caffeine and sugar content, MDew   is a good stimulant.  Four 30 oz cups divided among 12 kids would provide roughly 10 oz apiece.  That would be enough to hydrate and energize without providing any real nutrition.

But I have no ideas about the root beer (Did one or both parents like rootbeer?)  And I wonder why they would buy more expensive drive -through sodas instead of buying sodas at the grocery store.

The same article also reports that  Louise would go to the grocery store “deli” to buy slices of pizza or sandwiches for herself.  And it adds 

Quote

“The kids were really quiet and didn't say anything and the whole family smelt really bad.“

it is hard to know how much of the above is factual, but it definitely raises questions about food and the parents.

[EmCatlyn]

From ABC News online

Quote

It is not immediately clear where the children, who range in age from 2 to 29, are now. They were hospitalized immediately after their rescue and since then county authorities have declined to discuss their whereabouts or condition.

Riverside County has obtained a temporary conservatorship for the seven adult siblings, who declined to speak with reporters through their attorneys.

"Our clients need time, space, and privacy while they receive services and begin the difficult process of rebuilding their lives," Caleb Mason, an attorney for the siblings, said in a recent statement.

Apparently the young people are being represented by different attorneys, and apparently the seemingly contradictory information about their whereabouts (in assisted living/foster care or still hospitalized) is deliberate, to protect their privacy.

 

[SuperSluth]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/calif-siblings-allegedly-held-captive-making-progress-lawyer/ar-BBJuxFT?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=ientp

Good update...there have been modifications made to the hospital for the 7 adult children to make it more comfortable for them, have outdoor space, etc. Learning to make choices....breaks my heart.

[FJismyheadship]

Court date is today, isnt it? Curious to see what happens.