John Shrader Part 11 - God's Grifter Falling Apart

[PopRox]

21 minutes ago, Gobsmacked said:

Now I have a picture of yellow feathered big bird prancing around with John's face above his beak. 

Yuk and double yuk!

I read that while eating...now I'm suddenly not hungry anymore.

[Gobsmacked]

Sorry PopRox !!

[Milly-Molly-Mandy]

So the low is over and he's high again 

It's actually very interesting watching this from a mental health point of view. Great for any psychology students to see how a narcissists (for sure) & possibly bipolar person's mind works. 

But really, poor Esther. Does she have any insight or is she so submissive she thinks John is normal/amazing? I do wonder. 

[Grimalkin]

.....Praising through the pain.......

Now that's some mellow dramatic shite right there. 

[marmalade]

Mellow? Hardly. Johnboy is in your face. No allusions with that one. He either wants your sympathy or your money. Typically both. Simultaneously. 

[Coy Koi]

4 minutes ago, marmalade said:

Mellow? Hardly. Johnboy is in your face. No allusions with that one. He either wants your sympathy or your money. Typically both. Simultaneously. 

I'm sure she means melodramatic, and yes, he definitely is that!

[nastyhobbitses]

7 hours ago, Milly-Molly-Mandy said:

So the low is over and he's high again 

It's actually very interesting watching this from a mental health point of view. Great for any psychology students to see how a narcissists (for sure) & possibly bipolar person's mind works. 

But really, poor Esther. Does she have any insight or is she so submissive she thinks John is normal/amazing? I do wonder. 

I think Esther is smart enough to see that something is deeply, fundamentally wrong with her husband, but she's not exactly in a position to say or do much about it. I'm sure he holds onto the travel documents and money, and I don't know what their vehicle situation is. Free Esther!

[Howl]

Not one word about any of his children.  Of course, it's not appropriate to plaster your kids all over the internet, but to not even refer to them in a general way is a bit shocking.  "The kids and I did X", or "the kids and I had a great time going to the Z in Kafue", or "the kids are making lots of friends with the local children" or "Esther is a fantastic wife and mother of our wonderful children".   

Yup, it's the trials and tribulations of J-Boy 24/7. 

ETA: added "tribulations". Who could get forget that John undergoes lots and lots of those?

@nastyhobbitses said, 

Quote

I think Esther is smart enough to see that something is deeply, fundamentally wrong with her husband, but she's not exactly in a position to say or do much about it. I'm sure he holds onto the travel documents and money, and I don't know what their vehicle situation is. Free Esther!

Esther was raised to worship her husband, see the world through his eyes, efface her needs and wants, and have a ton of kids.  Critical thought (in every possible meaning of that phrase) isn't allowed in her mental ecology. I think if she had a negative thought about John, she'd be in the prayer closet in a heartbeat, or confessing to John that she is being body-slammed by Satan. 

With 11 young kids (is that the current body count?) to raise and feed + breast feeding at least one baby, with how many still in diapers?, zip support from family or friends, and a generally useless husband, she might be too tired to think about much of anything. 

We had a barely toddling sweet little guy at our house for an hour or so last week. He was interested in everything, but his  attention span was roughly 30 to 45 seconds before he was ready to move on to something new and hopefully (for him) that something new could be put in his mouth.   To meet the needs of 11?  I literally can't imagine. 

[Palimpsest]

9 hours ago, nastyhobbitses said:

I think Esther is smart enough to see that something is deeply, fundamentally wrong with her husband, but she's not exactly in a position to say or do much about it. I'm sure he holds onto the travel documents and money, and I don't know what their vehicle situation is. Free Esther!

I genuinely fear that Esther is as drunk on the kool-aid as John and sees nothing wrong with their way of life.  Right now her QOL is probably the highest it has ever been since they married.  And Esther does not seem smart at all.

For Esther, children are a blessing from the LORD.  If one of the children dies from a preventable disease on their misbegotten "mission" her reaction may well be, "the LORD gave, and the LORD hath taken away; blessed be the name of the LORD." 

[Coy Koi]

32 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

And Esther does not seem smart at all.

I don't get the impression that any of the ones I know about in her family are the least bit smart. I honestly can't imagine what could possibly give someone a different impression.

[Bethella]

3 hours ago, Howl said:

With 11 young kids (is that the current body count?) to raise and feed + breast feeding at least one baby, with how many still in diapers?, zip support from family or friends, and a generally useless husband, she might be too tired to think about much of anything. 

The current body count is 10 but she's about due for another pregnancy. 

 

[Howl]

25 minutes ago, Bethella said:

The current body count is 10 but she's about due for another pregnancy. 

Well, it would be 11 immatures to care for, if one includes John. 

[Gobsmacked]

Esther has been raised on fundie-aid by two perpetually grinning idiot parents, but surely something humane and normal must lurk in her brain to tell her that SOMETHING is amiss with her current situation. Somewhere her natural instincts must kick in in and say ENOUGH??

 

[infooverload]

I figure we are better off when John doesn't mention the children. Remember the incident of the cake topper being to defrauding? His focus was on the topper rather than the work his daughter did in decorating said cake.

[Howl]

1 hour ago, infooverload said:

I figure we are better off when John doesn't mention the children. Remember the incident of the cake topper being to defrauding? His focus was on the topper rather than the work his daughter did in decorating said cake.

Heh, good point.  We should never mis-underestimate John's ability to well, be John. 

[Palimpsest]

 John's church is So Super Speshul, Separate, and Scriptural it needs Supernatural Sustenance.

Quote

Special Prayer Request

The laws here in Zambia have changed in the past several years to where if you want to register a church or mission you have to be underneath one of three "Mother bodies." Catholic, Evangelical, they are all doctrinally compromised. Not one is Biblical, or follows the Scripture faithfully and carefully.

If done this way, you are then considered a "branch" of one of those doctrinally corrupted "Mother bodies."

Others may, but I cannot, for the Bible is clear in II Cor. 6, Amos 3:3, and many other Scriptures in teaching Separation, especially applied to ecclesiastical separation.

We are asking the Lord, if it His Will, to supernaturally make a way for us to register independently, and be obedient Scripturally.

This is interesting.   Catholic, Evangelical and what?   

Quote

Our family is legally here under a work permit from Liberty Baptist Mission, but our desire is to have an independent registration if the Lord wills.  We've been pursuing this now for two years, asking, seeking, and knocking.

So being under there legally under Liberty Baptist Mission is not good enough for John.  Or Liberty Baptist doesn't appreciate him enough? 

Quote

We've obtained recommendation letters from two other legally registered Independent Baptist missions, Liberty Baptist mission and Independent Baptist mission (Both were registered before this law change).

We know that our Almighty God can open doors that no man can shut if it's His Will.

I'm not necessarily asking you to pray for a specific outcome, but that the Lord's Will be done in our lives and ministry in this matter.

Thank you faithful prayer partners.

Waiting patiently upon the Lord,

Bro. John Shrader 

 If he doesn't get his own registration then could he get kicked out?  And, is it just me, didn't he just imply that Liberty Baptist was doctrinally corrupt? 

And he's printing 10,000  more tracts.  He put up a video to "prove" it.  Please pray that the printer doesn't break down.

[nastyhobbitses]

31 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

 John's church is So Super Speshul, Separate, and Scriptural it needs Supernatural Sustenance.

This is interesting.   Catholic, Evangelical and what?   

So being under there legally under Liberty Baptist Mission is not good enough for John.  Or Liberty Baptist doesn't appreciate him enough? 

 If he doesn't get his own registration then could he get kicked out?  And, is it just me, didn't he just imply that Liberty Baptist was doctrinally corrupt? 

And he's printing 10,000  more tracts.  He put up a video to "prove" it.  Please pray that the printer doesn't break down.

I mean, the law is technically restricting exercise of religion, but I do like that more and more African countries (Botswana, South Africa, now Zambia) are demonstrably fed up with white American so-called missionaries' bullshit and are telling them to quit it with their hateful rhetoric, and to come with an established organization or not come at all.

But you know that if Zambia tells him that under the new law, he needs to find an actual job or GTFO, he'll go crying to the US Embassy in Lusaka about discrimination and how horrible his life is now that he can't be utterly useless, if not actually detrimental, to the community he's glommed onto.

[BlessingsVonFundiePants]

"Also, Zambia requires pastors to have papers of training/education. If we get registration our Bible Institute/College could legally issue those papers, satisfying the government requirements for the men we are training here in the Biblical local church, without them having to pay money and spend time going to a parachurch "Bible College."

Only John could be outraged that Zambia would like anyone purporting to be an expert in religion to have some form of formal qualification before they recognise and endorse them to educate other people on that religion. I can print out a degree in engineering in my home office - I can then apprentice others and give them an engineering degree too - but the government isn't going acknowledge me as an engineer or my  graduates as engineers unless I can prove I'm f***ing qualified. This does not oppress my right to be an engineer if I want to study my butt off and put in the effort - it merely prevents me from impersonating an engineer with the intent deceive other people. 

[Palimpsest]

23 minutes ago, BlessingsVonFundiePants said:

without them having to pay money and spend time going to a parachurch "Bible College

The horrors!  Yeah.  John wants no restrictions and absolutely no-one teaching his followers other than himself.  They might wander from John's Truth and that is the only Truth.

I found an article - and the law isn't so new.  It seems that some older registered missions were grandfathered in but there is a clamp-down on charlatans, both home grown and people like John.

 http://allafrica.com/stories/201508030224.htm

Quote

 

The position of church mother bodies, the Council of Churches in Zambia (CCZ), and Zambia Episcopal Conference (ZEC), on the increasing clandestine activities by fake men of God is already known.

Leaders of these church mother bodies are on record as having repeatedly condemned the vices perpetuated by unscrupulous people claiming to be men of God and the need to restore sanity in the manner God was worshipped in the country.

 

The goal seems to be to get all churches affiliated with one of the 3 (doctrinally corrupt)  "mother bodies" to ensure some vague oversight.

The Council of Churches:  http://ccz.org.zm/

Evangelical Fellowship in Zambia (EFZ): http://www.efz.org/

Zambia Episcopal Conference (ZEC): http://catholiczambia.org.zm/

They all look quite respectable to me.

I can't find "Liberty Baptist Mission."  There is a Liberty Baptist Ministries in Kalulushi, Copperbelt, Zambia.  I suppose they might have sponsored him originally.   As for an "Independent Baptist Mission" writing a letter of support - only Rea's "Solid Rock" church came up when I googled.  I expect he is having the same problem! 

John is such a special snowflake.

[formergothardite]

Rea hasn't mentioned this, which makes me think he is probably going to quietly cave and just sign up under a mother church if he can't get his own independent church going. 

Since this isn't a brand new law, I wonder if the church John is under is trying to clamp down on him in some way and John is not going to have it. John doesn't like being told what to do. 

John wrote this about getting out from any other church:

Quote

This could also be a help to our family as missionaries,

Wonder what is in this for John, besides having no oversight. 

Quote

 The church here in Kafue should own it's own property, not the missionary. In order to own property or even open a back account, a church must be legally registered. 

Is it possible that this is a way for him to get the property away from whoever actually owns it since it clearly isn't John? His converts seem to be jumping ship pretty fast and John will be up a creek without a paddle if the convert who owns all the land decides to leave. 

Both Rea and John are frantically printing out thousands of tracts. 

[CTRLZero]

1 hour ago, BlessingsVonFundiePants said:

but the government isn't going acknowledge me as an engineer or my  graduates as engineers unless I can prove I'm f***ing qualified.

But John has proof he's qualified.  See here:

 

It came from the holy sub-saharan printer.  I'm sure government officials will be duly impressed.

[Palimpsest]

17 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

Is it possible that this is a way for him to get the property away from whoever actually owns it since it clearly isn't John? His converts seem to be jumping ship pretty fast and John will be up a creek without a paddle if the convert who owns all the land decides to leave. 

I think he thinks he owns it.  Back when he "bought" the land we did a bit of research and it seemed as though foreign nationals were not allowed to buy land.  The whole thing seemed to be far too "providential."  We also looked briefly into the difficulties of registering as a church - and it seemed that one or more nationals had to be involved.  I really can't remember the details.

The links may be back in the archives.  I'll see if I can find them later.

[formergothardite]

11 minutes ago, Palimpsest said:

Back when he "bought" the land we did a bit of research and it seemed as though foreign nationals were not allowed to buy land.

Rea, a while back, mentioned that he couldn't buy land to build a church. On some level John has to know he doesn't own that land, but I can see him convincing himself that he does. It would serve him right if the real owner got fed up and kicked him out. 

[Palimpsest]

1 hour ago, formergothardite said:

Rea, a while back, mentioned that he couldn't buy land to build a church.

Did he explain why?

One of John's leg-humpers is really anti-ebil gubmint.  The same one who asked why he should register the church:

Quote

 

XXXX Then wouldn't the government then be able to come in and control what goes on if it's registered? Would that not be giving them rights to what should be God's? I guess I'm not understanding.

John Esther Shrader I agree and share those same concerns. As of now, the government is not exercising any control over the churches. If that were to ever happen, our church plants would surrender/give up their property rather than violate or go against the Word of God.

 

John, If you share those concerns, then why did you get a Visa and residency permit and "buy" property?  The government knows you exist and could exercise control over your "church" at any time.  Wasting donor money yet again.  

The leg-humper doesn't seem to understand that John is vulnerable as a foreign national in Zambia.  He's not likely to get a slap on the wrist for breaking the laws.  Technically there is freedom of religion, but unregistered religious groups can be fined and members imprisoned for up to seven years.   Interesting info here: https://www.state.gov/documents/organization/208422.pdf

 

 

[BobTheWalrus]

On 14/04/2017 at 4:28 AM, Milly-Molly-Mandy said:

But really, poor Esther. Does she have any insight or is she so submissive she thinks John is normal/amazing? I do wonder. 

She may not think things are amazing, but she has been raised to believe that her husband is her ruler, and that she has to submit to his every whim. And if she doesn't then it's her fault things are bad because she wasn't submissive enough.

I can understand her not having any insight. I know I didn't realise how bad things had got in my marriage until other people highlighted it, and I did a lot of reading around mental health issues and saw that my husband's behaviour was a much more serious problem than I previously thought.  When I was able to educate myself and compare to others, I pretty quickly went from "I'm not very happy" to "crap, this is very serious and I need to push for change." I don't imagine Esther has either one of those opportunities, and certainly her parents would be encouraging her to "just pray and love him more" rather than getting genuine help.