The Boyer Sisters, Part 2

[SilverBeach]

@refugee, check out the blog Unfundamentalist Christians, its on Patheos.

[Four is Enough]

Whew! Got through all of this!

 

For the record: I love turkey and we have turkey and sometimes ham on Christmas day, and then for glorious days after, cold turkey sandwiches on potato bread with mayo and salt, washed down with copious amounts of fruit salad, and cheese. After? Christmas cookies. Repeat.

@nausicca? or is it @nst? The dress is GORGEOUS.. silver or gold would work well with it as a wrap, and I think I read somewhere that metals are now neutrals and can be mixed. 

I did want to ask snarky sally why she thought a coping mechanism like emotional eating was a sin. I wish she would get some help.

If Gabe is reading this massive drift, I wonder what he's thinking.

I bite my nails and will not be having them done for Christmas.

 

[Grimalkin]

1 hour ago, formergothardite said:

Hey, this time Jessica only posted five pictures of herself! 

~one gazing thoughtfully into the distance

~one fake laughing

~one clutching a twig and gazing thoughtfully up at the trees

~one holding the dog and laughing

~one looking back at the dog. 

I think those shoes would be uncomfortable to walk in outdoors in the woods. 

    The fake laughing one made me laugh. It looks like she is practicing fake laughing in the mirror. 

    I like nice clothes and looking nice, and makeup and girly stuff too. It seems like an awful lot of time and energy goes into thinking about how you look. Kind of the fundie version of 12 year old girls posting duck face selfies.

[EmiGirl]

Technically,  when the Bible refers to gluttony it's referring to drinking alcohol, not eating.

[hoipolloi]

3 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

In the Bible Jesus never said a word about homosexuality being a sin.  You'd think if it were that important he would have mentioned it and someone would have written it down, but nope.  None of the four gospels mention it.

Yes. This is why I always ask the Christianist crowd what Jesus actually said about homosexuality, which is nothing.

IF they actually acknowledge that fact (and many try to avoid doing so), they pivot to the OT and blather things about biblical inerrancy while wearing their mixed-fiber clothing & cutting their hair at the sides.

[Palimpsest]

1 hour ago, EmiGirl said:

Technically,  when the Bible refers to gluttony it's referring to drinking alcohol, not eating.

Not according to Proverbs 23, 20-21:  drunkenness and gluttony are separate no-nos. 

"Be not among winebibbers; among riotous eaters of flesh: For the drunkard and the glutton shall come to poverty: and drowsiness shall clothe a man with rags."  

So they should all be vegetarians too.

[charmedforsure]

2 hours ago, formergothardite said:

Hey, this time Jessica only posted five pictures of herself! 

snip

I think those shoes would be uncomfortable to walk in outdoors in the woods. 

 

1 hour ago, Grimalkin said:

    The fake laughing one made me laugh. It looks like she is practicing fake laughing in the mirror. 

    I like nice clothes and looking nice, and makeup and girly stuff too. It seems like an awful lot of time and energy goes into thinking about how you look. Kind of the fundie version of 12 year old girls posting duck face selfies.

Oy. That outfit is so bland. It's like a giant yawn... The cardigan doesn't fit right (too big), and has way too deep/wide of a v to be paired with a collared shirt buttoned up all the way like that. The cardigan needs to be open for the right balance. 

The fake laugh picture and the one looking too enthusiastically at the dog remind me a little too much of women laughing with salad. 

[MarblesMom]

Winebibber.  Love it.  I should just change my user name to Winebibber.

[apandaaries]

Kinda bummed that snarkysally deactivated.  Since her Bible is so literally, inerrantly true, I wanted to ask her about her thoughts on the curse of Ham. Wonder if she also thinks that slavery and darker skin tones have a Biblical basis and should therefore be respected.  Oh, well.  

@Palimpsest, you really had a teacher who was a flat earther?  That is amazing to me.

[JermajestyDuggar]

3 minutes ago, charmedforsure said:

 

Oy. That outfit is so bland. It's like a giant yawn... The cardigan doesn't fit right (too big), and has way too deep/wide of a v to be paired with a collared shirt buttoned up all the way like that. The cardigan needs to be open for the right balance. 

The fake laugh picture and the one looking too enthusiastically at the dog remind me a little too much of women laughing with salad. 

Who knew salads were so funny?! They must be eating a Sid Caesar Salad.

 

*apologies if that joke made anyone groan too loudly.

[charmedforsure]

6 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Who knew salads were so funny?! They must be eating a Sid Caesar Salad.

 

*apologies if that joke made anyone groan too loudly.

You got a good loud snort of laughter from me. 

[Palimpsest]

15 minutes ago, amandaaries said:

@Palimpsest, you really had a teacher who was a flat earther?  That is amazing to me.

It was a very long time ago, at an international school where teachers were in short supply, and he was also a member of our church.  I came home from school one day and told my parents that Mr. T had said he believed the world was flat but he was going to teach the O Level geography syllabus anyway.  My father went ballistic.  He was not a flat earther and wrote a letter of complaint to the head.  Mr. T got told off.

At least, I think he must have been because after church coffee socials were rather awkward for months! 

[DaisyD]

5 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

Yes, Letters to the Romans, the Corinthians, and Timothy.  Paul had a lot of pen pals.

I googled it for you because Biblical translation is certainly not one of my strengths.  This article is interesting and seems pretty comprehensive on the different possibilities and propositions: https://www.westarinstitute.org/resources/the-fourth-r/what-the-new-testament-says-about-homosexuality/

I don't think I've ever sat down and read the Bible from cover to cover, but I had way too much of it thrust down my throat as an MK and can text battle pretty efficiently.  I'm at my best on the Synoptic Gospels and Acts though.  I actually got an A on my O Level Scripture exam - and my teacher was a flat earther who also taught me geography!

That was a very interesting read. Thank you!

As a side note, the term  "Sodomite" has always irritated me. This is what the Bible says was the sin of Sodom. "She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy. They were haughty and did detestable things before me." This would make Trump a sodomite, not gay men. Just sayin'.

@refugee I second the suggestion of Unfundamentalist Christians. I went to Unity in high school. We had both former baptist and former atheist congregants. 

[catlady]

2 hours ago, charmedforsure said:

 

Oy. That outfit is so bland. It's like a giant yawn... The cardigan doesn't fit right (too big), and has way too deep/wide of a v to be paired with a collared shirt buttoned up all the way like that. The cardigan needs to be open for the right balance.  

I was also thinking that the cardigan needs a different shirt under it, like a camisole in a bright color.  I like all the parts, but not together.

 

[MargaretElliott]

6 hours ago, DaisyD said:

Romans is taken from letters that Paul wrote, right? Doesn't it actually say that men laying with boys is the sin? That says pedophilia to me, NOT homosexuality. 

-snip-

Historical tangent time!

In Rome, the purest expression of beauty was considered to be a young teenage boy. It was VERY common for an older man to take a boy under his wing, teach him about the world, and, yes, have sex with him. A man could take a young male lover without any loss of masculinity or social status. It was just life. In my opinion, Paul could really be referring to either, especially since this was an extremely common type of relationship. Personally, I think an adult having a relationship with a teen is squicky, no matter the genders of those involved. 

Source: just took a class on the subject. Spent an inordinate amount of time talking about Classical morals.

[ViolaSebastian]

I had a math teacher that didn't believe dinosaurs once existed. It didn't come up much, being a math class, but asking him questions about it was a guaranteed way to derail the lesson plan and push the test back a day. 

[EmiGirl]

3 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

Not according to Proverbs 23, 20-21:  drunkenness and gluttony are separate no-nos. 

"Be not among winebibbers; among riotous eaters of flesh: For the drunkard and the glutton shall come to poverty: and drowsiness shall clothe a man with rags."  

So they should all be vegetarians too.

Thanks for this. Yep, I sin by gluttony then!

[Palimpsest]

3 minutes ago, EmiGirl said:

Thanks for this. Yep, I sin by gluttony then!

But only if you eat meat riotously. . .

Chew slowly and you might be OK.

[EmiGirl]

1 minute ago, Palimpsest said:

But only if you eat meat riotously. . .

Chew slowly and you might be OK.

There is no such thing as slowing eating meat at the brazilian steakhouse where I practice my glutton without shame. Infact, I say a prayer each time that says, forgive me Lord, for I know exactly what I'm doing." But does asking for forgiveness count when you're not really sorry and doing something completely intentionally?

[Pianokeeper]

I actually like Jessica's outfit a lot! Undecided about the individual wearing the aforementioned outfit. 

[Palimpsest]

11 minutes ago, EmiGirl said:

There is no such thing as slowing eating meat at the brazilian steakhouse where I practice my glutton without shame. Infact, I say a prayer each time that says, forgive me Lord, for I know exactly what I'm doing." But does asking for forgiveness count when you're not really sorry and doing something completely intentionally?

Not according to my Evangelical Missionary (Fundyish) upbringing.  Sorry, you are doomed to a place of great heat.  Please be sure to say hello to me when you get there.

[laPapessaGiovanna]

6 minutes ago, MargaretElliott said:

Historical tangent time!

In Rome, the purest expression of beauty was considered to be a young teenage boy. It was VERY common for an older man to take a boy under his wing, teach him about the world, and, yes, have sex with him. A man could take a young male lover without any loss of masculinity or social status. It was just life. In my opinion, Paul could really be referring to either, especially since this was an extremely common type of relationship. Personally, I think an adult having a relationship with a teen is squicky, no matter the genders of those involved. 

Source: just took a class on the subject. Spent an inordinate amount of time talking about Classical morals.

Sorry but you may be mixing some things. What you described was typical of Greek culture.  Roman culture of the origins didn't approve homosexuality and had definite streaks of homophoby. It changed a bit (or a lot depends on the matter) through the contact with Greece and the Middle East in general. Rome conquered Greece when its own culture was still felt raw and unrefined therefore intellectuals were very deferential towards everything Greek.  This process of assimilation of Greek culture in Rome took a long time (roughly all the last part of the Republican era) and while certain aspects were quickly and quite easily integrated without much afterthoughts (eg deities and myths) others were never really part of mainstream Roman culture and were shared only among the elites and the intellectuals, appreciation of homosexuality was one of those. As most subjects that were mostly an interest of intellectuals and elites it is way overrepresented in historical sources such as texts and works of art. And even then orationes talking about those new and very bad "mollitiae" versus the glorious "antiqui mores" and "mores maiorum" (the old ways, inheritance of Rome's founding people) abound. Indulging in honosexual relationships and other foreign mores was often an accusation and an insult in Rome, especially during the Republican age, it never was in Greece. Glorification of homosexuality and integration of homosex relationships into the educational process of youths as an important step for the development of balanced adults was never really a part of Roman culture. That happened in Greece. And, quite surprisingly considering the generally misogynistic and repressive tones of Greek culture towards women, this was probably true among aristocratic women too as testified by Saffo's poetry, sadly not many other proofs remain of this feminine part of Greek culture.

Source: five years of classic (latin and greek) studies. 

[MargaretElliott]

@laPapessaGiovanna, that's very interesting. I may be mixing some things up (you have more experience than I!) but while the origin of these attitudes were definitely Greek, I was specifically referring to the Romans because that's who Paul was writing to during the first century AD. I should have been more specific. I didn't know the extent/popularity of homosexual relationships in Greek vs. Roman cultures. I wish my professor had been as specific as you. Thanks!

[NikeKnees]

9 hours ago, Palimpsest said:

I completely agree with the bolded.

I think she wrote that after I went to bed, but yes it was ignored.

Unfortunately as I was catching up this morning and reading all the contradictions, obfuscations, and wilder claims in her other posts I completely discounted it.  Trolls like to play on our sympathies and this was sounding more and more like a return visit by a known troll.

It is never wrong to show compassion but please remember that people can and do lie on the internet.

Gahhhh! I hate to think that people would lie about something so serious and traumatic just to "play on sympathies." I can be pretty Polly Anna naive so I appreciate your comment. 

[laPapessaGiovanna]

8 minutes ago, MargaretElliott said:

@laPapessaGiovanna, that's very interesting. I may be mixing some things up (you have more experience than I!) but while the origin of these attitudes were definitely Greek, I was specifically referring to the Romans because that's who Paul was writing to during the first century AD. I should have been more specific. I didn't know the extent/popularity of homosexual relationships in Greek vs. Roman cultures. I wish my professor had been as specific as you. Thanks!

Your point still stans since the NT original language is greek and considering Paul's origins he was familiar with Greek culture. Although not as much with the classic culture I was referring to in my previous post as more probably with some greek subcultures that even if very underrepresented in our sources (because prevalent among the lower parts of society namely women and poors) were very important in laying the cultural foundation for the future development of Christianity eg the orphic cults.