Michael and Brandon Keilen- Part 2

[VelociRapture]

I'm torn on whether to hope they have kids one day.

On one hand, infertility is horribly painful for a couple who wants children to deal with. And it's likely made worse by constant questions from loved ones, even if they mean well. Michael is clearly good with kids and Brandon seems to be as well. I think they'd make relatively decent parents and I have no doubts that Michael would love her children dearly.

But at the same time, they are deeply involved with IBLP - her dad is on the Board, he works at Headquarters, and they both seem to be true believers. Knowing what I do about their beliefs, I have a lot of trouble hoping another innocent child is born into this cult.

So I guess the best I can do is to say I hope they're doing well, they aren't suffering, and are finding happiness in their life right now. And that they continue to do so regardless of what the future holds. And if they do eventually have a child (or more) then I just hope they truly appreciate their child(ren) and don't rely on harsh punishments to keep the child in line.

[neurogirl]

PERFECT VelociRapture! Your thoughts sum up so well what I think many of us FJ-ers feel about M&B. I'm personally hoping that they DO have a very much wanted child (or a small number of children) but then LOVE THE HECK out of them and encourage them to live life to the fullest (education, exposure to the big wide world). Just...please don't be hateful Michael. Please please resist your programming and do better for the next generation.

[SassyPants]

I hope that in 5 years, they "catch" a baby or 2, and that they treat those children like the true treasures and miracle that is each child-

More is not necessary better; quality matters more than quantity.

I would never wish infertility on this young couple- her parents, yes. Baby hoarding is not admirable.

[Mela99]

I echo @VelociRapture. I couldn't wish infertility on anyone - 'cept maybe the Trumps.  Though it is very disconcerting to imagine little babies being raised in that cult. But as an infertile woman, I truly, deeply feel for Michaela. She's a product of her upbringing, and my heart breaks to think she could feel like a failure, unblessed by God, or a sinner because she's not pregnant yet.

[SuhrEnity]

And imagine the pressure she's probably getting from everyone cause it couldn't possibly be Brandon's fault. I wonder if they test the men or is spilling seed anywhere but inside the all holy uterus sinful to them?

[VelociRapture]

1 hour ago, SuhrEnity said:

I wonder if they test the men or is spilling seed anywhere but inside the all holy uterus sinful to them?

I would assume every sperm is sacred. So... 

1 hour ago, Mela99 said:

I echo @VelociRapture. I couldn't wish infertility on anyone - 'cept maybe the Trumps.  Though it is very disconcerting to imagine little babies being raised in that cult. But as an infertile woman, I truly, deeply feel for Michaela. She's a product of her upbringing, and my heart breaks to think she could feel like a failure, unblessed by God, or a sinner because she's not pregnant yet.

Exactly how I feel, but much more elegantly stated. 

I do feel for them very deeply, but especially Michael. I would hope she isn't being shamed or blamed, especially considering her sister's difficult journey to motherhood. It wouldn't surprise me if she is being blamed, even if the only person blaming her is her, but I really hope that isn't the case.

[melon]

I was talking to one of my sons about M+B and how they still have not had a baby,and soon it will be their 2nd wedding anniversary.

My son said," Well,how do they know it's her fault?Maybe it's his".

Is it 40% for male infertility?

[JemimaPuddle-Duck]

They never implied it was "her fault". I don't get the impression the Bateses are ignorant enough to think fertility issues only involve the woman. 

 

A lot of people who who are resistant to interventions start singing a different tune as the years drag on. Not always, of course, but I'm not yet overly concerned with Brandon's hope that the Lord is saying "not right now" instead of "no". They may not feel comfortable with any/many treatments, but I personally feel that they will eventually get themselves checked out if they don't conceive. 

 

[infooverload]

The whole waiting for God's timing robs them of any personal agency to determine if they can even conceive children. While I know Gothard teaches to not adopt; they still would have the ability to have an informed discussion. They could reason maybe God will bless us with a conception of our own, but maybe he's telling us the blessing is going to happen another way. This would lead to at least a starting of the conversation. Of all of the couples for this to happen to this is the one where it seems medical intervention is least likely to happen. Of course I could be wrong and as time goes on they'll pray and go seek medical intervention. Since I don't get UP have they asked Brandon any pointed questions about having his fertility checked, or has it been softball questions with them both looking sad and hopeful?

 

 

[Dandruff]

11 hours ago, SuhrEnity said:

I wonder if they test the men or is spilling seed anywhere but inside the all holy uterus sinful to them?

I should hope it's not considered sinful - those sperm would be sacrificed so that others might live.  Martyrs for the cause.  They should be remembered as heroes.

[LawsonBatesEgo]

Nailed it VelociRapture! 

I do have some sympathy for Michael because I feel like going "good thing you have fertility problems because of your beliefs" makes me a piece of shit. It's basically being happy someone is suffering because they have different beliefs to me, and that is a really crappy thing to do. Plus I think Michael didn't choose her upbringing and I'll always have a bit if sympathy for the oldest girl in a Quiverfull family - the level of responsibility forced onto them is truly unfair. And it saddens me to think she likely blames herself for not being 'blessed' while watching Erin, Alyssa and Whitney having kids, when she did everything 'right' according to her upbringing. 

I hope they are able to have a small family. Emphasis on small. And I hope they stay away from stuff like blanket training. I think she'll make a decent parent simply because any baby she does have will be truly and genuinely wanted. Michael seems like someone who genuinely likes and would want kids regardless of her upbringing. 

[Melissa1977]

9 hours ago, Dandruff said:

I should hope it's not considered sinful - those sperm would be sacrificed so that others might live.  Martyrs for the cause.  They should be remembered as heroes.

and name them all

[HereticHick]

2 hours ago, Melissa1977 said:

and name them all

Caleb

[seraaa]

Michael and Brandon went down to the lake

 

[bal maiden]

Is she wearing a t shirt under swimwear?!

[JesSky03]

2 hours ago, bal maiden said:

Is she wearing a t shirt under swimwear?!

I doubt they did any swimming. Lake Michigan is freezing cold. We did a beach day at Lake Michigan in August, in 80 degree+ weather and we could only stand the cold water up to about our knees. Even our dog was shivering after 10 minutes of retrieving. 

[RosyDaisy]

The only thing I'm thinking about is the suffering a child will have being raised in that cult. That is what's truly unfair. No child deserves that. Also wanting a child badly does not mean one will be a good parent.

[JillyO]

Michael is asking for new themes and pattern ideas for her baby blanket kits. Someone comments:

Quote

Ladybug themes and baseball for summer! Also wonder woman theme! Boys get all the superheroes!

I'm dying laughing at the idea of Michael making anything Wonder Woman-themed.

 

[front hugs > duggs]

21 minutes ago, JillyO said:

Michael is asking for new themes and pattern ideas for her baby blanket kits. Someone comments:

I'm dying laughing at the idea of Michael making anything Wonder Woman-themed.

 

I actually saw that post and someone asked a question, to which Michael's response was "I'm searching for more gender neutral fabric."

I personally was shocked the term "gender neutral" was in her vocabulary (not from a SOTDRT standpoint, but from her patriarchal lifestyle).

[formergothardite]

23 hours ago, front hugs > duggs said:

I personally was shocked the term "gender neutral" was in her vocabulary (not from a SOTDRT standpoint, but from her patriarchal lifestyle).

It probably comes from discussions when a woman doesn't find out if she is having a girl or a boy. I don't know if it is becoming a trend(I'm behind on all of the trends ), but I know of three people who recently had request for gender neutral baby items to be given at their shower since they weren't going to find out till the baby was born. 

[JesusCampSongs]

5 hours ago, formergothardite said:

It probably comes from discussions when a woman doesn't find out if she is having a girl or a boy. I don't know if it is becoming a trend(I'm behind on all of the trends ), but I know of three people who recently had request for gender neutral baby items to be given at their shower since they weren't going to find out till the baby was born. 

Several of my (very politically liberal, very feminist) friends have done this in order to avoid getting deluged with hyper-gendered products and toys, especially "cute" clothing that includes sexist stereotypes or sexual innuendo. We're far from prudes, collectively, but no baby needs to be in a shirt that says "lock up your daughters" with a picture of handcuffs or a onesie that says "I hate my thighs." From a more practical standpoint, gender-neutral gear is a lot easier to reuse with subsequent children. 

One of my friends who is currently pregnant says that she has heard that if you don't announce the baby's sex, people are more likely to buy off the registry (and give you things you actually need) instead of showing up with random sportsball or princess outfits in tiny sizes that you may wind up never using. I don't know how much truth there is to that, not having kids myself. I'll ask her how her shower goes when it's time. 

[Glasgowghirl]

It's still common here for people not to find out what they are having while pregnant. About half my friends and family wait until the baby is here to find out. My sister got told accidentally by a nurse she was having another boy, when pregnant with my youngest nephew, she wasn't too happy.

[lizzybee]

Michael saying that she's with her hottie sounds weird and makes me uncomfortable. They make sexual feelings so taboo and under wraps that when they abruptly go in the other direction I feel...defrauded? 

[infooverload]

Michael saying that she's with her hottie sounds weird and makes me uncomfortable. They make sexual feelings so taboo and under wraps that when they abruptly go in the other direction I feel...defrauded? 

Oh good I wasn't the only one who was a little suprised, by that. Although not as bad as seeing the words sweet fellowship and going ick, now I need mental bleach because we all know what it means. I have to say I'm glad she is staying busy. I keep wondering how much longer they will be in the Chicago area.

[snickers34]

1 hour ago, lizzybee said:

Michael saying that she's with her hottie sounds weird and makes me uncomfortable. They make sexual feelings so taboo and under wraps that when they abruptly go in the other direction I feel...defrauded? 

Also, they have literally 0.0 sexual chemistry, so it's kind of uncomfortable. Like your dad hitting on your mom.