Counting On - Part 9: Even the Flashbacks Have Flashbacks

[lascuba]

6 hours ago, ChairmanMeow said:

I just saw the stupid ad AGAIN and it said the shows premieres in Australia on May 19th. Wtf? It's the same scenes every time! I don't even think QF is a big thing here. 

Mr Meow said "So if I f**k my sister do I get a show? And isn't this the learning channel? What am I learning here how to be a scumbag?" 

I swear he reads here too but doesn't admit it  

Thank you all who answered my question, I'm gobsmacked they need a prayer closet. What happened to God is everywhere?

Isn't the prayer closet thing a Biblical reference? I'm not sure because I don't remember seeing that in the Bible myself, but way back when the Duggars first mentioned the prayer closet, I remember people online (TwoP, maybe?) saying that there was some line in the Bible about how it's better to hide in a closet to pray rather than do it publicly for show. Of course, the Duggars also pray publicly for show. And advertising having a prayer closet in one's home completely defeats the supposed purpose. But expecting deep reading and understanding of metaphors from the Duggars is completely ridiculous, so Imma let that go.

[ChairmanMeow]

I can't agree with you more! Why show the world a prayer closet unless you want people to think you're devout?

As a spiritual person I pray. In my head. My God can hear me. I don't feel the need to tell the world. But then my God loves and accepts everyone so I guess I'm going to hell by Duggar standards.

[foreign fundie]

Yes, Jesus told people to go to the inner room to pray as opposed to praying on the street corners. He added that 'God who sees you in the hidden place will reward you in public.' He would usually pray in a solitary place himself,  up a mountain side.          

So the point is, to not do christian things in order to be seen by others. Which is, now I come to think of it, the best biblical argument against a reality show as a ministry. The Duggars' whole life is a ' prayer on a  street corner.' as it were.

[EmCatlyn]

25 minutes ago, foreign fundie said:

Yes, Jesus told people to go to the inner room to pray as opposed to praying on the street corners. He added that 'God who sees you in the hidden place will reward you in public.' He would usually pray in a solitary place himself,  up a mountain side.          

So the point is, to not do christian things in order to be seen by others. Which is, now I come to think of it, the best biblical argument against a reality show as a ministry. The Duggars' whole life is a ' prayer on a  street corner.' as it were.

"Praying on the street corner" might be a good post title.

[Ungodly Grandma]

4 hours ago, lascuba said:

Isn't the prayer closet thing a Biblical reference? I'm not sure because I don't remember seeing that in the Bible myself, but way back when the Duggars first mentioned the prayer closet, I remember people online (TwoP, maybe?) saying that there was some line in the Bible about how it's better to hide in a closet to pray rather than do it publicly for show. Of course, the Duggars also pray publicly for show. And advertising having a prayer closet in one's home completely defeats the supposed purpose. But expecting deep reading and understanding of metaphors from the Duggars is completely ridiculous, so Imma let that go.

I doubt there were closets in Biblical times. 

I can't find that verse (no surprise there!) but agree it was meant to discourage the kind of bragging about prayer that the fundies specialize in. Once again, they miss the point. But as you said, expecting deep reading and understanding from the Duggars is ridiculous.

[Buzzard]

2 hours ago, foreign fundie said:

Yes, Jesus told people to go to the inner room to pray as opposed to praying on the street corners. He added that 'God who sees you in the hidden place will reward you in public.' He would usually pray in a solitary place himself,  up a mountain side.          

So the point is, to not do christian things in order to be seen by others. Which is, now I come to think of it, the best biblical argument against a reality show as a ministry. The Duggars' whole life is a ' prayer on a  street corner.' as it were.

Wait, you mean jesus wouldnt approve of them god bothering people on youtube or, you know, ON TLC?

[quiverofdoubt]

32 minutes ago, Buzzard said:

Wait, you mean jesus wouldnt approve of them god bothering people on youtube or, you know, ON TLC?

What about derrick god bothering in dangerous cintral merica? is he actually in a church? i'm picturing him literally on a street corner thumping a bible.

[Ungodly Grandma]

34 minutes ago, quiverofdoubt said:

What about derrick god bothering in dangerous cintral merica? is he actually in a church? i'm picturing him literally on a street corner thumping a bible.

Wearing a sandwich board and possibly a tin foil hat.

[sophie10130]

Every time you see a Christian Action^tm from the Duggars, it's praying on a street corner. Whether it be them praying at meals, donating food, talking about the prayer closet, talking about Bible time.

The Bible obviously does not put it in these terms, but I think of it as intrinsic vs. extrinsic motivation. Are you doing it because you know in your heart of hearts it's good and true? Or are you doing it for an external reward? 

The only kind of Christian Action^tm I want to see is honest, true, unapologetic love and care for every person. 

[EmCatlyn]

1 hour ago, Ungodly Grandma said:

I doubt there were closets in Biblical times. 

I can't find that verse (no surprise there!) but agree it was meant to discourage the kind of bragging about prayer that the fundies specialize in. Once again, they miss the point. But as you said, expecting deep reading and understanding from the Duggars is ridiculous.

This link includes the verse and also an explanation of the metaphorical/symbolic meaning of "closet."  What is a prayer closet?

(Note that the owner of the website is of the Baptist, "the Bible is inerrant and comes from God" persuasion.  And he is an "end time is near because the state of Israel has been founded" as well as one of those who feels Christians should come closer to Jewish practice/tradition. But  his explanation of the prayer closet is still useful.)

[anotherone]

1 hour ago, EmCatlyn said:

This link includes the verse and also an explanation of the metaphorical/symbolic meaning of "closet."  What is a prayer closet?

(Note that the owner of the website is of the Baptist, "the Bible is inerrant and comes from God" persuasion.  And he is an "end time is near because the state of Israel has been founded" as well as one of those who feels Christians should come closer to Jewish practice/tradition. But  his explanation of the prayer closet is still useful.)

I don't get this kind of thing because did he really learn that from God (God appeared and spoke to him directly), or did just some guy tell him that (a priest, teacher or parent? or a guy on a street corner?)

[EmCatlyn]

42 minutes ago, anotherone said:

I don't get this kind of thing because did he really learn that from God (God appeared and spoke to him directly), or did just some guy tell him that (a priest, teacher or parent? or a guy on a street corner?)

It is all a matter of faith.  Whoever told him, he trusted.  If he was taught this as a child (by his parents, like the Duggar kids were) or read an argument that impressed him, or fell under the spell of a charismatic leader, the guy believes that the Bible was sent to people by God and that God has made his wishes known in it.  Personally, I think there are a lot of people who want "clear instructions" from a higher power, and they want to find answers to everything in it.  So they trust and have faith in the inerrancy of the Bible.

[Analytica49]

On 2016-05-05 at 10:57 PM, Carol said:

SNIP Didn't have any complaints about what anyone said at the orphanage, I believe Jill and Jessa were expressing genuine emotions about kids.  Yes, they weren't politically correct but I think they were open about their feelings.

SNIP

I'm slowly trying to catch up, but I felt I had to comment on this.

I think there's no doubt that Jill and Jessa were "expressing genuine emotions about kids." The point is, what do those emotions reveal about Jill and Jessa? They reveal that they see children, especially children who are poor and not white, as collector items. They want to collect them. This is not about making the lives of the children themselves better. This is about the fact that Jill and Jessa have almost nothing else to make their lives meaningful except amassing a big family.

They don't really deserve plaudits just because they are "open about their feelings." So what? Those feelings have been produced by a lifetime of socialization into a bizarre cult, a cult that urges them to have "feelings" about children, but fails to help them to recognize that the children themselves have feelings.

[CorruptionInc.]

On 5/13/2016 at 4:17 PM, ChairmanMeow said:

I just saw the stupid ad AGAIN and it said the shows premieres in Australia on May 19th. Wtf? It's the same scenes every time! I don't even think QF is a big thing here. 

 

Why is this show coming to Australia again?! 

[Miggy]

Matthew 6:6. We did this today in bible study. Many translations say closet rather than inner room. 

Our interpretation is that when you pray, you should do it in a way that just involves you and God. Praying in a way to impress other people means you have already been heard (received your reward) and will not be heard/answered by God.

So, if the Duggars are praying and the camera happens to film them, it's ok. If Derrick is out on the streets praying sincerely for an individual or group, that's ok too. If they are praying just to show off that they pray, then that's not really praying.

 

[EyeQueue]

On Friday, May 13, 2016 at 10:37 AM, quiverofdoubt said:

What about derrick god bothering in dangerous cintral merica? is he actually in a church? i'm picturing him literally on a street corner thumping a bible.

He should hit the summer music festival circuit. With his beard and bandana he would fit right in. It's a mission field ripe for the soul harvest, with all those godless heathens dancing to a beat.

[ChairmanMeow]

3 hours ago, CorruptionInc. said:

Why is this show coming to Australia again?! 

I can't imagine anyone here is interested! Can you? Btw fellow Aussie 

Does TLC take into consideration ratings around the world or just the US? 

[Miggy]

ATI is growing here  so I would imagine that is the market for Duggar shows. (Two of my fundi-in-laws started homeschooling with ATI this year.)

[paulypepper]

All of this prayer closet and inner room talk hit a switch in my brain about these little booklets we had laying around the house when I was little. I finally remembered the name. The Upper Room. It was/is a daily devotional guide. Now I'm wondering what religion I was raised under, for I have to admit I didn't pay a whole lot of attention.. Though we didn't have a prayer closet, I do remember hiding in the closet a lot as a child which was even sillier as my brother is 10 tears older than me and was never at home so who the heck was I hiding from? It wasn't my parents...

 

[nausicaa]

2 minutes ago, paulypepper said:

All of this prayer closet and inner room talk hit a switch in my brain about these little booklets we had laying around the house when I was little. I finally remembered the name. The Upper Room. It was/is a daily devotional guide. Now I'm wondering what religion I was raised under, for I have to admit I didn't pay a whole lot of attention.. Though we didn't have a prayer closet, I do remember hiding in the closet a lot as a child which was even sillier as my brother is 10 tears older than me and was never at home so who the heck was I hiding from? It wasn't my parents...

 

I know The Upper Room is available at some Episcopal churches. 

[Elegant Mess]

10 minutes ago, paulypepper said:

All of this prayer closet and inner room talk hit a switch in my brain about these little booklets we had laying around the house when I was little. I finally remembered the name. The Upper Room. It was/is a daily devotional guide. Now I'm wondering what religion I was raised under, for I have to admit I didn't pay a whole lot of attention.. Though we didn't have a prayer closet, I do remember hiding in the closet a lot as a child which was even sillier as my brother is 10 tears older than me and was never at home so who the heck was I hiding from? It wasn't my parents...

 

The Upper Room is also seen in Christian Church ( Disciples of Christ ) circles.

[Four is Enough]

My grandmother attended a Church of Christ and read the Upper Room "religiously". She even gave some to my mother to read. As a devotional, they weren't horrible.

 

ETA" I just googled it and it's apparently still available.

[albanuadh_1]

Spoiler

 

We are United Church of Canada. My mother and g'mother read the Upper Room.

[anotherone]

7 hours ago, Miggy said:

ATI is growing here  so I would imagine that is the market for Duggar shows. (Two of my fundi-in-laws started homeschooling with ATI this year.)

How can you stand it?  Does it drive you nuts and you want to say something, or can you just brush it off?  I'm so glad that none of my relatives were very into religion.  We're from a northern US city (no bible belt) and relatives were Catholic, but no one took it that seriously and many just went to mass on major holidays.  So enough religion to feel connected to a community, but not a ridiculous amount.

I feel that I missed a bullet though.  My sisters and I were friends with a set of sisters (Catholic families tended to be big), but somehow the parents converted into some bible based cultish group.  My friend would invite us to Fri evening prayer sessions.  I went because I heard we could meet boys there, but it actually was hardcore speaking in tongues and all that.  You can't imagine how shocking it was to see each person around the room babbling away, then fainting, with me horrified that soon it would be my turn and I was supposed to, well, perform.  They skipped us young teens but still.

I never happened to mention what went on to my mother, she just thought it was an innocent church group.  But in retrospect she probably would have yanked me out of that in no time.  I was lucky I had the opposite reaction and didn't get sucked in, because I could see that happening too like my friend and her sisters.  I keep an eye out for that kind of stuff now.

[SwishySkirt]

12 hours ago, Miggy said:

ATI is growing here  so I would imagine that is the market for Duggar shows. (Two of my fundi-in-laws started homeschooling with ATI this year.)

Ugh, really?! Exclusive Bretheren are definitely the only fundies I've encountered. I do know a few fundie-lites though.