Washington Post story on family integrated churches

[MamaJunebug]

Doug Phillips quoted a large portion of it at VF.com, otherwise go here:

 

http://www.washingtonpost.com/on-faith/ ... story.html

 

It's reasonably balanced and objective. I'm glad to see the major media bringing this sort of thing to folks' attention.

 

The demographics of my congregation result in a low percentage of youth up to age 21. Some very astute parents are discussing how to keep their kiddoes interested and involved, and I have to confess, I mean to talk with them about some of the ideas of NCFIC.

 

Which ideas? Certainly not that daddy-o become the family's own little prophet, priest and king, but that as they near confirmation-class age (roughly 11-12, most are confirmed at ages 13 & 14), they're welcomed into the congregation as individuals who are able to grasp the concepts and doctrines we browse over in adult Sunday Bible class. That issues facing our congregation/churchbody today are things they can understand. That they can learn our denomination's history, and why we do things the way we do.

 

Then, of course, there will be the waterpark field trips and the service projects -- I hope, the projects done alongside adult Lutheran volunteers who serve people in their communities out of Gospel love.

 

Anyhoo, not exactly a dom-bashing post but just reflecting that the FIC movement has a couple of worthy elements to it -- ie., giving kids the credit for having a brain and a heart. And that's as far as I'll go to align with anything NCFIC.

[margiebargie]

Doug Phillips quoted a large portion of it at VF.com, otherwise go here:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/on-faith/ ... story.html

It's reasonably balanced and objective. I'm glad to see the major media bringing this sort of thing to folks' attention.

The demographics of my congregation result in a low percentage of youth up to age 21. Some very astute parents are discussing how to keep their kiddoes interested and involved, and I have to confess, I mean to talk with them about some of the ideas of NCFIC.

Which ideas? Certainly not that daddy-o become the family's own little prophet, priest and king, but that as they near confirmation-class age (roughly 11-12, most are confirmed at ages 13 & 14), they're welcomed into the congregation as individuals who are able to grasp the concepts and doctrines we browse over in adult Sunday Bible class. That issues facing our congregation/churchbody today are things they can understand. That they can learn our denomination's history, and why we do things the way we do.

Then, of course, there will be the waterpark field trips and the service projects -- I hope, the projects done alongside adult Lutheran volunteers who serve people in their communities out of Gospel love.

Anyhoo, not exactly a dom-bashing post but just reflecting that the FIC movement has a couple of worthy elements to it -- ie., giving kids the credit for having a brain and a heart. And that's as far as I'll go to align with anything NCFIC.

Well, I respectfully disagree with the bolded part. I don't think FIC's give kids credit for anything. We fundie watchers know all too well that this isn't about educating kids in their parents' religious tradition. This is about indoctrination. It is about making sure their kids are exposed to no outside influences. I have a major problem with that. I feel strongly that kids should be able to make up their own minds.

It is true that the younger generation (18-29) is leaving religion in droves. This shouldn't come as any surprise. Look at the Catholic Church child abuse scandals and the way thats been handled. The various other scandals (Ted Haggard, Eddie Long). Faith healing deaths. Extreme right-wing politics (church-state violations). Barbaric, outdated doctrine (hatred of homosexuals, poor treatment of women). Kids are not dumb.

[SimplyMe]

I hate how black and white fundamentalists are. It's as if if your kids go to Sunday school for 1.5 hours each week that you, as parents, are having no impact on your child's spiritual life. How do they draw that conclusion? My kids go to Sunday school each week while my husband and I attend our service. They do fun, age appropriate things while we listen to our sermon which is often not age appropriate for my kids' age. The times when they have gone to our service they are squirmy and bored and get NOTHING out of the sermon because it goes over their heads. I mean, let's be serious, what 4 or 6 year old isn't going to be bored listening to a church sermon? How is that beneficial to children? It's entirely about control and nothing more.

We do "God time" with our kids each day where we read scripture and do bible studies that are suitable for their ages (our church provides us with these materials). We aren't depending entirely on their Sunday school teachers to provide all of their spiritiual guidance.

I think the NIC people's concern has nothing to do with youth maintaining their Christian faith as it is that someone might expose their child to an idea outside of their fundie biblical worldview. Heaven forbid a kid converse with another kid their age, they might get some crazy worldly ideas, like listening to Christian rock or something- the horrors!

And I'd love to ask Mr. Brown about the thousands of kids who, like my husband and me, came to know Christ because we were invited to youth group activities. My parents weren't church people, they never would have introduced me to the gospel, but they were ok with letting me go to my friends' church activities which led me to become a Christian. The NIC views are so narrow. Do they not think at all about the hundreds of thousands of kids who don't have perfect little traditional families with a perfect father who can be their spiritual leaders. What then? Are the S. Browns and D Phillips of the world going to take all those children under their wings? Yeah, I didn't think so.

[gustava]

Often those teens who move away from organized religion come back when they have their own children. NIC is just another way for men to control their own families.

[hoipolloi]

Interesting that the article does not mention that Divided and the NCFIC got the boot from D6.

[MamaJunebug]

Interesting that the article does not mention that Divided and the NCFIC got the boot from D6.

That omission disappointed me!!!

Margieb argie's disputation w my idea is a valid one. I think I was imputing to the FIC'ers my own goals for including young'uns in the adult classes. Good call-out, mb!!!

[hoipolloi]

That omission disappointed me!!!

Me too! And I'm curious as to why neither D6 nor Scotty Brown said anything.

ETA: NCIFC's reticence is especially interesting considering all the guy-bluster about their ouster from D6 emanating from Douge's Blog & the NCIFC blog?

[margiebargie]

What's d6?

[hoipolloi]

D6 takes its name from Deuteronomy 6:7 (d6conference.com/whatisd6) wherein the faithful are told to "Love God, treasure His Word, and teach this to the next generation."

Coincidentially, the Wartburg Watch has posted the first of what they say will be several articles on da boyz of VF & NCFIC (thewartburgwatch.com/2011/09/15/is-sunday-school-unbiblical/).

[Not sure I needed to break links for these two sites but did so anyway.]

[margiebargie]

Ah. Thank you.

[gustava]

D6 takes its name from Deuteronomy 6:7 (d6conference.com/whatisd6) wherein the faithful are told to "Love God, treasure His Word, and teach this to the next generation."

Coincidentially, the Wartburg Watch has posted the first of what they say will be several articles on da boyz of VF & NCFIC (thewartburgwatch.com/2011/09/15/is-sunday-school-unbiblical/).

[Not sure I needed to break links for these two sites but did so anyway.]

Thanks for link to wartburg. Good site that's new to me.

[maybeizfundie]

I like being able to have our kids with us in church, but I do think the NCFIC style gets way legalistic. At 2-3, our kids start going to Sunday School (and participating in an age segregated children's choir, eep!). They return to the adult worship service at 13, and they are welcome to stay in those inbetween ages if that's what they and we as their parents want.

I like the middle of the road thing we have going, and for sure our kid's and our family's spiritual lives have not suffered for it.

I will say that I can understand why people are drawn to NCFIC. I think they likely are coming out of churches where children are strictly forbidden in service (if you bring a baby in, a bouncer, er, usher, will demand that you remove the annoying little thing :( ), and where the congregation is stringently divided. We've been to a few places like that and I hated it. So did the kids. On the first visit to one place, I was supposed to leave my children with complete strangers for more than 3 hours (Sunday School and Service). I rebelled and kept the 2 year old with me, but even so I knew that wouldn't be tolerated if we became more than just visitors.

[GenerationCedarchip]

Thanks for link to wartburg. Good site that's new to me.

Wartburg is a great site - the archives are definitely worth a browse.