Jill & Jessa specials coming - MERGED

[Lewy]

2 hours ago, drivingmishcrazy said:

Well that's it for JD, I'm guessing he'll stay if for no other reason than out of guilt and a sense of obligation, and to prove he can be the man Josh never was. I see him being married by 30 or permanently celibate, but I suspect the first.

Joe sounds like he was terribly blindsided by all of this and it seems like he hinted at feeling betrayed and lied to but of course had to forgive or be accused of being a bad Christian. I doubt he knew or even still doesn't know the full extent of what Josh did to his sisters. Either the editing is good or he just seems like this was all news to him. I could see him going fundie lite in the future, he just seems like a cat who got the tablecloth pulled out from under him.

Seriously though, where is the outrage? I don't for a second believe that out of 19 kids that not even a single one is not absolutely and undeniably furious.

I think JD and Joe looked as angry as two people who have been raised to blindly follow their parents instructions/in a "keep sweet and always forgive" cult could look. If they were 'normal' guys with a normal upbringing, I don't think either of them would be giving Josh the time of day anymore.  

JD's 'I don't want to be like you anymore' is pretty much the ultimate insult for someone with their background and about as close to dragging him as JD can get away with. Joe looked angry, which makes sense because he seems quite close to Jinger in particular and she seems very affected by it. 

(And given how 'sassy' Tori Bates is for an ATI girl, I can easily see the two of them getting married and going plain old 'conservative christian' in the future). 

[HarleyQuinn]

They're still treating adultery like it's worse than child molestation. JD and Joseph kept saying "the first situation" and insinuating Ashley Madison is worse than fondling your underage sisters. It's sick.

I couldn't get the Jinger clip to play, and I have no interest in hearing anything from a Duhhhhhllard. 

[ChickenettiLuvr]

Hi, Vienna -- 
Well, it certainly wasn't easy to break out.  During teenage years, the cognitive dissonance became too much to ignore. So I started asking the hard questions. And demanding answers. Which immediately put me in boiling water, both at church and at home. "Good girls don't rock the boat. Good girls don't ask impudent questions. Good girls do what they're told and don't do anything to embarrass their families."  So I got sent to Jesus-college at almost the last minute because I couldn't be trusted to go to public university and still toe the party line. And kept asking hard questions because I refused to swallow any more bunk.

Mind you, I was the almost-perfect child, never once in trouble (too afraid to step out of line!). Graduated at top of my class because that's what was demanded. Told, "If you go and get yourself pregnant, don't bother to come home."  Sheesh! (Never mind that I was raped by someone from church youth group... Oh wait - that never happened. :/ )

The never-ending demand for perfection at every stage of life was exhausting. Be the perfect child, the perfect student, the perfect youth group member, the perfect college student, the perfect girlfriend/fiancee' (yes, I met the abusive ex at Jesus-college), the perfect couple, the perfect wife, the perfect daughter-in-law, the perfect mother, have perfect children, ad nauseum, ad infinitum.

I stayed in marriage-hell many years longer than I should have because good girls don't have marriage problems and good girls certainly don't get divorced!  I finally had such a spiritual faith-crisis + reached a mental-health breaking point that I literally couldn't take it one more day. I'd been spitting out the kook-aid for years and started screaming from the rooftops.

Fast forward to now  ... and my dear mother still plays the blame & shame card on a regular basis. She's a master at revisionist history, and she now spouts that "If you'd only told us what was going on, we would have helped you.  We did believe you about the childhood abuse, the rape, and the marital abuse ..."  Yeah.  

Quote

 

 

[Rachel333]

As another Duolingo enthusiast, I'd love to see a thread about it! I've finished four trees so far (I tested out of most of the French tree, then did German, Danish, and Esperanto from scratch) and am working on the Spanish tree now. I'm really looking forward to the Welsh and Swahili courses.

[JenniferJuniper]

1 hour ago, HarleyQuinn said:

They're still treating adultery like it's worse than child molestation. JD and Joseph kept saying "the first situation" and insinuating Ashley Madison is worse than fondling your underage sisters. It's sick.

 

My reaction as well.  I'm not surprised; just surprised they're actually admitting it.

The whole thing is sick.  What's next?  A talking head with Precious Blessing saying, "Josh was a very naughty boy"?

[lascuba]

3 hours ago, Whoosh said:

All I can say is that TLC is brilliant if they are doing what I think they are here.  I think they are releasing all these clips early enough that they have a full day and a half to quickly analyze the public reaction and then add footage, cut footage, even film new footage, allowing them to put the best spin possible on things based on what the audience wants and needs.  All of the commentary and attention all over the internet gives them such a huge leg up in their efforts to create and present a product that people will buy.  Well played, TLC, well played.  

Seriously. I'm all, "TLC, you magnificent bastard," with the way they're handling this. 

Hey, TLC, here's a suggestion from someone who hates you and the Duggar family if you want to shut people like me up (not me specifically, because I have a long memory and don't have a naive bone in my body)...when Jill and Jessa talk about the Megyn Kelly interview, don't let them pretend that the criticism was over them forgiving Josh and the family not being "perfect." They need to address their endorsement of their parents handling of the situation, their comments that brothers molesting their sisters is so common as to not be a big deal, and Jill's implication that her son will of course molest his sisters if she doesn't have the proper "safeguards" in place.  

[RabbitKM]

16 hours ago, Snarkylark said:

The black are the stretcher straps. The red most definitely looks like blood to me. 

 

Does anyone else find her smile to be incredibly creepy in this picture, considering the circumstances?

[halcionne]

3 hours ago, Selah said:

As a British viewer, is this likely to be on youtube or whatever? I'm waiting with baited breath and I better not be disappointed just because I live across the pond.

I'm sure it'll go up on youtube. 

I absolutely don't condone pirated entertainment, and I positively won't be looking for it, and I would never share any information I found about where or how to see such material in any pm's FJers might send me. Because that would be illegal, and I am a law abiding citizen, yes indeed. Try me.

[Lewy]

2 hours ago, HarleyQuinn said:

They're still treating adultery like it's worse than child molestation. JD and Joseph kept saying "the first situation" and insinuating Ashley Madison is worse than fondling your underage sisters. It's sick.

I couldn't get the Jinger clip to play, and I have no interest in hearing anything from a Duhhhhhllard. 

I wonder how much JD and Joe actually know about what happened, Joe especially (being under 12 both at the time and during the police investigation). I wouldn't be surprised if they were lead to believe it wasn't 'as bad' as it truly was.....and they still look furious.

But yeah, it's totally messed up how the ATI cult basically thinks cheating on your wife is worse than child molestation. Don't get me wrong, it was sick the way he endangered Anna's health by putting her at risk for STDs, but child molestation involves non-consenting minors. And they way they shame victims for being 'tempting' is just vile. 

[HarleyQuinn]

I always assumed that at least JD and Joseph would've had a fair idea of the molesting going on. JD for being older and Joseph for being so close to Jinger, but who knows. It makes me wonder if either of them actually read the police reports. JD being a rent-a-cop might actually have time alone to read something like that. Maybe even Joseph at Crown, depending on their internet filters there. 

[Emelsu]

Something in Jinger's video made me think. She said that a few weeks after their faces weren't on the cover of magazines they were finally able to go to grocery stores. Maybe I'm over thinking this... But could the kids maybe not have been allowed to go shopping because JimBob and Michelle didn't want them to see the headlines giving away the full story of what Josh had done?

There is no way the kids know the full story of either the original molestations and what went down or what Josh did with AshleyMadison.com, his facebook, and the cheating details. They were probably told some watered down story by their parents. I wouldn't put it past them to tell their kids Josh was under attack by whatever group the Duggars could blame when the molestation story came out. Making their kids believe he was being victimized.

 I wonder how the parents are spinning it to the kids this time around. If new things keep coming out about Josh and all the awful things he does, are the parents really going to keep the younger ones stuck at home so they don't learn what's happening?

[hollywood]

Was there a JD and Joseph clip released that I am missing by these comments?

[MayMay1123]

1 hour ago, RabbitKM said:

Does anyone else find her smile to be incredibly creepy in this picture, considering the circumstances?

tried copying the pic with the post, but it apparently isn't happening... to me, it looks like the stretcher board she is laying on is red and the sheets aren't covering that portion. i would think they would have enough super pads and chux that blood wouldn't be all over like that...and yes, my God that smile is creeeeepy!

[mebeforee]

I feel really bad for JD and Joe, it seems like their whole worldview has been shattered in a way that the girls' hasn't... it's clear that they can't reconcile Josh's actions with their values at all. I'm guessing the girls long ago knew that Josh wasn't 'perfect' from their firsthand experience, and the boys in the family probably never had a second thought about Josh's past crimes because it didn't really impact them personally. I agree with those who think the parents probably glossed over that stuff.

 

Something Jessa said made me think, though. She said that the stuff from when Josh was a teenager didn't hit them as hard because it was something they'd gotten closure over years ago, and that the family had moved on. That does make sense to me. The Ashley Madison 'scandal' was a new offense, something they weren't expecting and had to process while the whole world was watching them, which never happened with the molestations. I also found it interesting how Jill said she was upset not because they had gone out and defended Josh after the information about the molestations came out, because she would have done that anyway, but that she was upset that Josh had allowed them to do it. I think they felt really betrayed by him letting them put their own repuations on the line to defend him without feeling guilty or moved to confess what he was doing behind their backs. That kind of selfishness is probably pretty unique to Josh in their family, most of the other kids don't have the luxury of making things all about them in that way.

I don't think I've ever heard JD speak his thoughts as coherently as he did in that clip, either. He and Joe have always been kind of close mouthed, but when JD talks, I usually think he comes across as pretty goofy. He seemed to have a very clear understanding of what he felt and why he felt it. I was impressed, and also that he apparently actually told Josh that he didn't want to be like him. He seems like someone who really does try to live by his principles, which I think is kind of nice (in spite of the fact that my principles are totally different from his).

[Screamapillar]

29 minutes ago, hollywood said:

Was there a JD and Joseph clip released that I am missing by these comments?

It was on the People site yesterday. BTW, your new avatar looks like Ben is conducting an exorcism on Jessa. I laughed, but I also felt bad for her, so that makes it okay! 

[HarleyQuinn]

This comment from that JD and Joseph articles wins the internet for today: 

"

The Duggars are no better than the Kardashians. They just hide behind pilgram dresses and hairspray instead of latex and silicone."

[Chickenbutt]

Anyone think that deep, deep down in their souls, JD and joe wanna beat the sh$t outta Josh?

[vienna]

2 hours ago, Emelsu said:

Something in Jinger's video made me think. She said that a few weeks after their faces weren't on the cover of magazines they were finally able to go to grocery stores. Maybe I'm over thinking this... But could the kids maybe not have been allowed to go shopping because JimBob and Michelle didn't want them to see the headlines giving away the full story of what Josh had done?

There is no way the kids know the full story of either the original molestations and what went down or what Josh did with AshleyMadison.com, his facebook, and the cheating details. They were probably told some watered down story by their parents. I wouldn't put it past them to tell their kids Josh was under attack by whatever group the Duggars could blame when the molestation story came out. Making their kids believe he was being victimized.

 I wonder how the parents are spinning it to the kids this time around. If new things keep coming out about Josh and all the awful things he does, are the parents really going to keep the younger ones stuck at home so they don't learn what's happening?

I think their strategy is: Accountabilty among siblings. Never let a child be alone anywhere, only together with siblings who will rat them out when one does soemthings against the rules. Jill seems to have been the best at this Job.

[Lewy]

3 hours ago, HarleyQuinn said:

I always assumed that at least JD and Joseph would've had a fair idea of the molesting going on. JD for being older and Joseph for being so close to Jinger, but who knows. It makes me wonder if either of them actually read the police reports. JD being a rent-a-cop might actually have time alone to read something like that. Maybe even Joseph at Crown, depending on their internet filters there. 

They may not want to know the finer details of it all. I feel like in their position, I wouldn't want to read the 'nitty gritty' details of my sisters being sexually assaulted. 

2 hours ago, mebeforee said:

Something Jessa said made me think, though. She said that the stuff from when Josh was a teenager didn't hit them as hard because it was something they'd gotten closure over years ago, and that the family had moved on. That does make sense to me. The Ashley Madison 'scandal' was a new offense, something they weren't expecting and had to process while the whole world was watching them, which never happened with the molestations. I also found it interesting how Jill said she was upset not because they had gone out and defended Josh after the information about the molestations came out, because she would have done that anyway, but that she was upset that Josh had allowed them to do it. I think they felt really betrayed by him letting them put their own repuations on the line to defend him without feeling guilty or moved to confess what he was doing behind their backs. That kind of selfishness is probably pretty unique to Josh in their family, most of the other kids don't have the luxury of making things all about them in that way.

That actually makes sense and why they seem to be focusing on the scandal even more. While the molestation scandal was new to the 'public' (despite the whisperings in their community/FJ), it is something that was years ago to them while the Ashley Madison scandal was new to them and us. It might explain why they seem a bit more focused on it, because it is something they are dealing with now while they actually largely 'dealt with' the molestation years ago. 

(I say 'dealt with' because no way were those girls given the proper support they needed....)

[Percy]

2 hours ago, mebeforee said:

Snip

I don't think I've ever heard JD speak his thoughts as coherently as he did in that clip, either. He and Joe have always been kind of close mouthed, but when JD talks, I usually think he comes across as pretty goofy. He seemed to have a very clear understanding of what he felt and why he felt it. I was impressed, and also that he apparently actually told Josh that he didn't want to be like him. He seems like someone who really does try to live by his principles, which I think is kind of nice (in spite of the fact that my principles are totally different from his).

I agree, especially if the story about JD getting the film crew into trouble for drinking is true.  JD seems to believe in the teachings of the cult and tries to live by them.  What Josh did was incomprehensible to JD.

[crazysnark]

Something Jinger said made me think Anna is considering a divorce. She said something along the lines of our family not looking the same, or looking way different than we ever imagine years to come. This could translate that Anna and Josh wont be together and there will be way less M kids than imagined. One can only hope. I wish they would have dealt with this privatly. Poor M kids are going to have a whole mini series reminding them of how shitty of a father their dad was/is. Just seems cruel to me. 

[xlurker]

As to a divorce, as much as I hope for it I don't believe it will come to pass, I took it as Jinger referring more to a possible shunning of Josh--or maybe just the circumstances they now find themselves in.  

And Jessa's creepy smile?  I think she's just happy that at the hospital she can get some pain meds

[Percy]

1 hour ago, crazysnark said:

Something Jinger said made me think Anna is considering a divorce. She said something along the lines of our family not looking the same, or looking way different than we ever imagine years to come. This could translate that Anna and Josh wont be together and there will be way less M kids than imagined. One can only hope. I wish they would have dealt with this privatly. Poor M kids are going to have a whole mini series reminding them of how shitty of a father their dad was/is. Just seems cruel to me. 

Where did you see this? I have tried various clips but could not find Jinger.

[Alicja]

I've seen lists that say Polish is the most difficult language to learn, because it has seven cases and seven genders plus difficult pronunciation.

I think English speakers often assume Asian languages are more difficult because there are characters to learn and the tonality, but there are no cases, genders, and grammar is fairly simple.

claritaslux.com/blog/the-hardest-language-to-learn/ has more detail.

Hungarian has seventeen cases, IIRC

[goldfishgoddess]

OMGGGGGG one hour away.

I've seen the latest promo and it's going to be quite the little dog and pony show.