Is it just me or is every 'Traditional Catholic' a jerk?

[Hane]

Several years ago I went with a friend to a Latin Mass, and we had no idea that this was a pre-Vatican II congregation. Thankfully we had our shoulders covered, but we were asked to put on little lacy mantilla things on our heads. We walked in, and men were on one side and women on e other. The mass was mostly performed with the priest facing the altar. Then for communion....yikes. Everyone went up to the altar railing and knelt while the priest put the host in your mouth. The Catholic Churches I went to always to had you get in a queue and the priest put the host in your hand.

Except for the gender-segregated seating, this is pretty much what a normal Roman Catholic Mass was until the early '60s. Until the late '60s, hats (or other headcovering) for women and girls was mandatory; as hats phased out, mantillas or other small lace headcoverings got popular with many--then nobody wore hats anymore. I was old enough to notice all the changes as they happened: "audience participation" during the Mass in Latin (the priest taught us how to pronounce the appropriate responses, and what they meant in English--I thought it was fun!), the altar "turned around" so the priest faced the congregation, the elimination of the altar rail and kneeling to receive communion, the option of receiving the host in your hand, the gradual introduction of English, "guitar" Masses, "living room" Masses (like the ones at the campus Newman House and student center--my mom's Catholic Mothers' Circle meeting even had a living room Mass at our house once).

[Cran]

For one time, I can base my assumptions ona resonable number of people I know, being a theologian and all. Great *g*

So:

1) I wouldn't say that ALL Catholics, like someone stated, are assholes, but of course, some are. Because they are assholes, not because they are Catholic.

2) Then there are "traditional Catholics". I'm making a distinction between those Catholics who do not call themselves traditionalists, but quietly prefer the Latin mass, praying lots of rosaries and mind their own business. Those can be idiots or not, as in 1). ;)

And 3) the Traditionalists who take pride in identifying as such, making a great fuss about being so traditional, going to Latin mass and observing the old customs (who are also frequently, to varying degrees, sedevacantists, meaning that they think the current pope is no "true pope" but an invalid one). Thinking the "old church" pre-Vatican II was better and has since strayed from the "true faith" , they do tend to think their ways are better and holier than those of other Catholics, and people who have a sense of false superiority and who are smug about it are, imho, always jerks.

[fluttershies]

For one time, I can base my assumptions ona resonable number of people I know, being a theologian and all. Great *g*

So:

1) I wouldn't say that ALL Catholics, like someone stated, are assholes, but of course, some are. Because they are assholes, not because they are Catholic.

2) Then there are "traditional Catholics". I'm making a distinction between those Catholics who do not call themselves traditionalists, but quietly prefer the Latin mass, praying lots of rosaries and mind their own business. Those can be idiots or not, as in 1). ;)

And 3) the Traditionalists who take pride in identifying as such, making a great fuss about being so traditional, going to Latin mass and observing the old customs (who are also frequently, to varying degrees, sedevacantists, meaning that they think the current pope is no "true pope" but an invalid one). Thinking the "old church" pre-Vatican II was better and has since strayed from the "true faith" , they do tend to think their ways are better and holier than those of other Catholics, and people who have a sense of false superiority and who are smug about it are, imho, always jerks.

[fluttershies]

Except for the gender-segregated seating, this is pretty much what a normal Roman Catholic Mass was until the early '60s. Until the late '60s, hats (or other headcovering) for women and girls was mandatory; as hats phased out, mantillas or other small lace headcoverings got popular with many--then nobody wore hats anymore. I was old enough to notice all the changes as they happened: "audience participation" during the Mass in Latin (the priest taught us how to pronounce the appropriate responses, and what they meant in English--I thought it was fun!), the altar "turned around" so the priest faced the congregation, the elimination of the altar rail and kneeling to receive communion, the option of receiving the host in your hand, the gradual introduction of English, "guitar" Masses, "living room" Masses (like the ones at the campus Newman House and student center--my mom's Catholic Mothers' Circle meeting even had a living room Mass at our house once).

[Coconut Flan]

I don't think very many Catholic churches are built with altar rails any more at least in the US. None of them around here have them unless they were built before around 1970.

[fluttershies]

I don't think very many Catholic churches are built with altar rails any more at least in the US. None of them around here have them unless they were built before around 1970.

That's probably why - in Anglican churches it's definitely to do with the age/layout of the building than how traditional the worship is. My aunt and uncle's very traditional church does not have people kneeling at the altar rail as the congregation is very small and sat around the nave altar rather than the high altar.

[2xx1xy1JD]

There seems to be a bit of confusion about what the OP meant by "Traditional Catholic", so I want to clarify that. A Traditional Catholic is NOT just a religious Catholic. Instead, it's a breakaway group that rejects the reforms of Vatican II. Catholics who simply prefer traditional services have been accommodated somewhat within the Catholic church, but those who openly disputed the Vatican II documents broke away and are not in good standing with the main Catholic church.

Vatican II produced a number of documents. Among them was Dignitatis Humanae, which supported religious freedom, and Nostra Aetate, which stopped labelling modern Jews as Christ-killers and generally encouraged better relations and respect between Catholics and those of other religions.

So, if someone is a Traditionalist Catholic, it's reasonable to wonder what part of Vatican II, with its wacky idea of religious freedom and not hating others of different faiths, they don't like.

Mel Gibson is a traditionalist Catholic. 'Nuff said.

[Cran]

There seems to be a bit of confusion about what the OP meant by "Traditional Catholic", so I want to clarify that. A Traditional Catholic is NOT just a religious Catholic. Instead, it's a breakaway group that rejects the reforms of Vatican II. Catholics who simply prefer traditional services have been accommodated somewhat within the Catholic church, but those who openly disputed the Vatican II documents broke away and are not in good standing with the main Catholic church.

If this definition is used, I think it would be less confusing to use the term sedevacantist, or talk about the Society of Pius V., because, a most answers show, also a great number within the church identify as traditionalists.