Kim at LiaS--is she joking about her gun?

[snickerz]

It has been proven again and again, when guns are outlawed crime increases. When gun ownership is legal crime decreases.

It has been proven again and again, when loaded guns are accessible in homes with small children, tragedies can happen.

[Glass Cowcatcher]

It has been proven again and again, when loaded guns are accessible in homes with small children, tragedies can happen.

And this is what makes me so mad about the 2nd amendment pushers. These accidents, and every person injured or murdered by a formerly responsible gun owner, is an acceptable sacrifice so some other people can have the right to carry a weapon(s.)

[LIzzieB]

I think that gun ownership laws in the USA are insane. People feel unsafe because they think criminals might have guns, so they get one themselves. I feel that an incident is far more likely to escalate violently if each party thinks that they other might be armed. The risks to family members from the guns in the house seem to outweigh the likelihood of being shot by an intruder.

Australian gun laws are very tight. You have to have a license, which outside of the police and army, are usually only granted to farmers and sport shooters. The laws are so strict that if you use a gun as a prop in a theatrical performance, it must be handled by a license holder and locked in a gun cabinet, even if the gun is a fake, made out of wood and doesn't even have a proper barrel! The idea is that guns be kept off the street as much as possible. Shootings do happen here, but they are far less common than in the US.

US members, does the idea that there are people like Kim wandering around with concealed weapons freak you out?

[liltwinstar]

US members, does the idea that there are people like Kim wandering around with concealed weapons freak you out?

In short, yes.

I do admit that I have a terror of guns. They freak me out. I don't even like being near cops (even though I have no reason at all to fear them) just because they carry guns.

That said, I do recognize that some people are responsible gun owners. For example, my father in law likes guns and used to hunt (he's the type to eat every bit of meat and then tan/preserve the hide if possible so the hunting doesn't bother me). He has guns, he knows how to clean/care for them, he knows how to shoot them and use the responsibly, and when he's not using them, they are locked up (unloaded) in a safe. When my husband was old enough, he taught him how to be safe around them too (never,ever point them at people, always check for yourself to make sure the gun is unloaded even if someone assures you that it is, etc). So if every gun owner was like my FIL, I wouldn't worry. Problem is, some people fancy themselves vigilantes and those folks freak me the f**k out.

[Clementine]

How common is it that people are attacked in their own homes, since so many Americans seems to think that it's safest to carry a gun at home?

I got an e-mail from FlyLady where she wrote that she is "prepared" if somebody enters at home and a lot of housewifes cheered her on. It felt a bit surreal - I subscribe to her to learn more about feather dusters and shiny sinks and I got gun propaganda.

Unless they are members of a criminal gang, it seems like the risk of a shooting accident would be a lot higher than the risk of being attacked inside the home...?

[JesusFightClub]

What Clementine said.

I like guns and shooting so I get people might want to have a gun for sport purpose (or even for defense outside the home). But why the fuck carry INSIDE YOUR HOME? What good is that going to do?

Even in the event of a home invasion, like the bad guys are going to be unarmed. They also are dedicated to doing a wrong thing or many wrong things to you. Just because you have a gun doesn't mean you have the advantage. And your house is a small environment.

When I was little I wanted to join the Army when I grew up (politics, disability and the height requirement made this impossible :)) and I went to martial arts class and got to practice shooting with BB guns and rifles. One day an instructor came to talk to us, he was an American policeman (used to be). We were very enthralled and wanted to hear his stories.

He said "You know what? Run away or try to escape and don't be dead. Gun battles and knife fights are only for films." He also told us what a real gunshot wound looks like and said "If you can't do that to another person I don't think you should ever carry a gun." (He was talking about America.) He reckoned most people knew if they could or not even if they didn't admit it.

He told us many other hints and tips but these seem relevant. Can she be sure she would fire? If not, she shouldn't have a gun. And is a house full of kids the best place to be toting about loaded weaponry?

This is a pet peeve of mine (indulge me, we are talking about guns ;)) I really hate when people that never saw a gun in their lives come across like using one is like being in a video game. For example after the summer riots last year in the UK, loads of people in internet forums were complaining about the police. Granted so do I but they were saying "pussies, direct headshots to any rioters or looters would stop them". Some were calling for all police to have this power. And they complained that the police were able (though they didn't) to fire rubber bullets at the belt buckle or below. "Why not live ammo at the head?"

Even if we set the moral aspect of this aside, what the fuck. We do have armed police in the UK but they are used tactically. TACTICALLY. This means "not wading into the middle of fifty people looting a shop and trying to kill them all with shots to the head."

Police where they are armed here don't automatically go for a headshot to take someone down. It's incredibly difficult and if you miss you are fucked. You can't do this in a riot situation unless you are positioned away from the battle centre (maybe a sniper) or incredibly lucky.

This is why we have things like Mozambique/Failure to Stop. A lot of advocates of this are, personally, wankers. But the point behind it isn't "kill the person with a headshot just liek Battlefield lulz".

You can guarantee all the stupidest Internet vigilantes in the UK would be prancing around with weaponry if they could here.

*rant mode off*

[sugaree]

Jeez. I don't even like to wear my bra around the house.

[Deleted03]

I think it's incredibly stupid. But I'm also very much against allowing guns too. Can you really kill a snake with a gun? Wouldn't you be better off carrying a shovel with you? Because seriously is she going to fire inside? What if one of the kids wants to save the snakey?

I think it's a stupid decision for her to carry around the house. It sounds like she does not want to take care of the babies. Is she sitting down with her gun in the back? Is she breastfeeding while carrying a gun?

[MonkeyMomma]

I just feel so uncomfortable with guns around my kids that I cannot imagine having them in the house.

My grandfather loved guns and collected certain antique ones. When he died, the family divided up the guns. Two of them were supposed to be given to me, but they are in my mother's storage unit. I cannot keep my kids out of my makeup and shoes, how could I bring a gun into this house?

This, exactly. I have no problem, politically, with concealed carry. MonkeyPoppa and I have discussed getting a gun at some point, but always with the caveat, "NOT WITH A TODDLER IN THE HOUSE." I mean, jeez, Monkey has already figured out how to unlock my phone to get to the "Twinkle Star" app.

[Swamptribe]

As I said before, some people treat a gun like a penis substitute. By that I mean, they feel very powerless in their lives, and hanging on to a gun, bragging about having one, dragging one around pointlessly lets them feel empowered. "Look at me, I'm badass, I have a freakin gun." It's almost a bully thing.

I've been around guns all my life, taught my kids to shoot. I sold guns for a living Most gun owners are responsible, decent people. Sadly, a good percentage are nut cases. They are little people mentally who own guns because the gun makes them feel like a tough guy.

Just last week, we had an incident in my neighborhood. Heard the police sirens and choppers. Then I got a reverse 9/11 call telling me there was a man with a gun in my neighborhood and to evacuate. I was home alone, didn't evacuate because I figured I already had a defensible position. Locked the doors, grabbed my big knife (useless, I'm not V, but it had a psychological effect), and sat tight. Later, one of my regulars at work, a retired marine, asked what I would have done if the guy broke into my house. Told him I'd been out the back door and gone. He said I was damn smart:)

Now, this guy had already broken into one unlocked house. The owner found him snoring in her closet. She ran and got two neighbors, both ex-cops, who came over with guns. Both guys ended up shot, the criminal ended up shot, but got away, stole a couple of cars, ended up in my small town (closer than I'd like to think) went into another unlocked home and had a standoff with the police.

Having a gun is not the great panacea that so many seem to think it is. Two retired police officers, experienced in handling a weapon, were shot by the 'perp' in this case.

[Swamptribe]

I think it's incredibly stupid. But I'm also very much against allowing guns too. Can you really kill a snake with a gun? Wouldn't you be better off carrying a shovel with you? Because seriously is she going to fire inside? What if one of the kids wants to save the snakey?

You don't have to kill the snake, not at all. My kids were always taught to avoid them. I also once scooped a copperhead out of my garage with a snow shovel and let it go in the woods. Looked out of my kitchen window one day and a couple of wild dogs were after my goats. Chased after them with a broom. A neighbors dog actually came over and joined me, ran those strays over the hills. My eldest son wrote an essay titled "Bubba the Hero" for school; got an A. So no, living in the country is not an a 'must have gun' thing. Plus, most of the snakes I've seen were while living in the suburbs. (oddly enough,we had guns, just never used 'em)

[Deleted03]

You don't have to kill the snake, not at all. My kids were always taught to avoid them. I also once scooped a copperhead out of my garage with a snow shovel and let it go in the woods. Looked out of my kitchen window one day and a couple of wild dogs were after my goats. Chased after them with a broom. A neighbors dog actually came over and joined me, ran those strays over the hills. My eldest son wrote an essay titled "Bubba the Hero" for school; got an A. So no, living in the country is not an a 'must have gun' thing. Plus, most of the snakes I've seen were while living in the suburbs. (oddly enough,we had guns, just never used 'em)

On top of that I'd bet none of them ever took self defense class. I can tell you the day I have kids, they all go through that.

[MotoMamaMess]

Eh. Breastfeeding and carrying a gun is no big deal- it's not like you carry it across your nipples. I've done it and it didn't interfere or seem weird at all.

I just don't think it's that big a deal. Lots of people carry all the time, even when they're home. I have some friends who carry almost everywhere (except the shower- that's pretty ridiculous.) There was a very very nasty home invasion in the town next to mine a few years ago- during the day. It was horrible, and that's the reason one of my friends cites for carrying all the time. (Although she doesn't have kids.)

It's a cultural thing. Some people think it's really weird to carry, others think it's really weird not to. Kind of depends on how you were raised, I've found.

[dawbs]

How common is it that people are attacked in their own homes, since so many Americans seems to think that it's safest to carry a gun at home?

I got an e-mail from FlyLady where she wrote that she is "prepared" if somebody enters at home and a lot of housewifes cheered her on. It felt a bit surreal - I subscribe to her to learn more about feather dusters and shiny sinks and I got gun propaganda.

Unless they are members of a criminal gang, it seems like the risk of a shooting accident would be a lot higher than the risk of being attacked inside the home...?

I think that the people who reasonably get freaked out are people who live in very remote areas.

I don't really live in a remote area, but I do live in the country, I could easily expect it to take an hour for emergency services to arrive if theyr'e in the 'wrong' part of the county when I call.

(we do have guns in the house...but mostly because sometimes there are critters. No, we're not hillbillies out popping off animals for fun--the last time we killed anything, my dog got into a fight w/ a 'possum--Dog was fine, possum was injured and needed to be put down [i don't think it was rehab-able, and there weren't good options--putting it down was the humane choice]. A gun was more humane than any of our other options. And that's why there are long-guns in the house--we actually sold the hand-guns before my kiddo was born. Except for the collector-thingys from the Mr's grandfather, which are safely locked in a gun-safe.)

[starfish]

I think Kim is "out there". Given that the woman gave birth on a deck covered in chicken poop, and Perry the wonder-husband dropped the baby, nothing really surprises me about that family....

but did anyone else follow the story of Sarah McKinley, the 18 year old widow from Oklahoma who shot an intruder on New Year's eve after he broke into her home? she was alone with her 3 month old baby. These creeps had apparently been stalking her, because they knew her husband had died of cancer and likely had narcotic/pain meds in the house. A couple of her dogs had been killed and they came around previously to offer their sympathy. Anyway, the two goons tried to break into her house. She called 911 and asked them if she could shoot the intruders if they broke in. The dispatcher told her that they couldn't tell her what to do, but to protect that baby.

The guy busted in and she shot him with a shot gun. He died with a knife in his hand. The other guy ran off and later turned himself in.