William and Catherine 4

[Alisamer]

15 hours ago, sndral said:

As it is ‘personal reasons’ sounds so lame & frankly it sounds lazy. 

After hearing the sort of "personal reasons" Harry is capable of coming up with, frankly I don't want to know. I'm fairly certain William isn't likely to be dealing with a frostbitten pecker, but regardless.

I do agree something slightly more specific might have been better, if for no other reason than to reduce some of the crazy speculation. "William is a bit under the weather and is sad to miss the occasion, but doesn't want to expose others to his mild cold" might have worked, but honestly it could be "Louis snuck up and wrote on Will's face with pink and green markers while he was sleeping this morning and he doesn't want to attend looking like a Dr. Seuss character" or something similarly innocuous but valid enough. 

Was this technically a state occasion or a family one? That makes a difference to me whether it matters much whether he showed up or not. 

15 hours ago, tabitha2 said:

With things like these Royal Memorials, funerals, weddings  Etc it gets really tricky for older Royals Like Andrew who are related to Most of European Royalty. Is he representing Windsor family or The Royal family if he is  asked to be God Parent to some Lordling or minor Countess or Attend his friend Duke so and so’s funeral? 

Honestly I think things would be far worse if they had Andrew sneaking in the back door or something. The paparazzi would still be looking for him and the press would find ways to make sensationalist headlines no matter whether he walks in with the family or sneaks in the back and sits in the back row. A hundred years ago he would have likely had it very strongly suggested that he move away somewhere on his own accord, I bet. A few hundred years before that he might well have been sent to the Tower. (But not really, since I doubt he did anything Henry VIII didn't do... times were different.)

And if he moved away, I bet they'd be similar to how they are with Harry. Polite, arms-length, extending invitations to the important events even if they know he won't go (or if they don't want him to go, at least in Andrew's case).

And no I'm not conflating Harry with Andrew. Very different situations. But both in the end are royals who are in very different ways a headache yet who decorum and tradition requires be treated courteously. Harry's the distant disaffected son, and Andrew's the creepy brother. Unfortunately Andrew has stuck around close by and doesn't care to self-limit his visibility and seems happy to shove himself in front at royal events. 

[louisa05]

47 minutes ago, Alisamer said:

After hearing the sort of "personal reasons" Harry is capable of coming up with, frankly I don't want to know. I'm fairly certain William isn't likely to be dealing with a frostbitten pecker, but regardless.

I do agree something slightly more specific might have been better, if for no other reason than to reduce some of the crazy speculation. "William is a bit under the weather and is sad to miss the occasion, but doesn't want to expose others to his mild cold" might have worked, but honestly it could be "Louis snuck up and wrote on Will's face with pink and green markers while he was sleeping this morning and he doesn't want to attend looking like a Dr. Seuss character" or something similarly innocuous but valid enough. 

Was this technically a state occasion or a family one? That makes a difference to me whether it matters much whether he showed up or not. 

Honestly I think things would be far worse if they had Andrew sneaking in the back door or something. The paparazzi would still be looking for him and the press would find ways to make sensationalist headlines no matter whether he walks in with the family or sneaks in the back and sits in the back row. A hundred years ago he would have likely had it very strongly suggested that he move away somewhere on his own accord, I bet. A few hundred years before that he might well have been sent to the Tower. (But not really, since I doubt he did anything Henry VIII didn't do... times were different.)

And if he moved away, I bet they'd be similar to how they are with Harry. Polite, arms-length, extending invitations to the important events even if they know he won't go (or if they don't want him to go, at least in Andrew's case).

And no I'm not conflating Harry with Andrew. Very different situations. But both in the end are royals who are in very different ways a headache yet who decorum and tradition requires be treated courteously. Harry's the distant disaffected son, and Andrew's the creepy brother. Unfortunately Andrew has stuck around close by and doesn't care to self-limit his visibility and seems happy to shove himself in front at royal events. 

It was a family event. It was not public or a state event. The brouhaha every time he dares to exist is kind of exhausting. But the entire point of the internet seems to be to be exhausting. 

[Alisamer]

20 minutes ago, louisa05 said:

It was a family event. It was not public or a state event. The brouhaha every time he dares to exist is kind of exhausting. But the entire point of the internet seems to be to be exhausting. 

In that situation I see no reason for him not to attend. He's not legally limited from attending memorial services, and he's a member of the family. 

It must also be exhausting for the royals to have to think about "optics" constantly. Oooh, he walked in front like a douche. We know he's a douche. The royals need a dude with one of those long shepherd's crooks to reach in and pull him out of the line of sight of the cameras, like that old comedy gag. 

People are wild. This is my fave Kate Middleton theory so far:

 

[viii]

37 minutes ago, louisa05 said:

It was a family event. It was not public or a state event. The brouhaha every time he dares to exist is kind of exhausting. But the entire point of the internet seems to be to be exhausting. 

It is listed in the Court Circular, which makes it an official event and not a family/private event. 

[sndral]

30 minutes ago, Alisamer said:

After hearing the sort of "personal reasons" Harry is capable of coming up with, frankly I don't want to know. I'm fairly certain William isn't likely to be dealing with a frostbitten pecker, but regardless.

I do agree something slightly more specific might have been better, if for no other reason than to reduce some of the crazy speculation. "William is a bit under the weather and is sad to miss the occasion, but doesn't want to expose others to his mild cold" might have worked, but honestly it could be "Louis snuck up and wrote on Will's face with pink and green markers while he was sleeping this morning and he doesn't want to attend looking like a Dr. Seuss character" or something similarly innocuous but valid enough. 

Was this technically a state occasion or a family one? That makes a difference to me whether it matters much whether he showed up or not. 

Honestly I think things would be far worse if they had Andrew sneaking in the back door or something. The paparazzi would still be looking for him and the press would find ways to make sensationalist headlines no matter whether he walks in with the family or sneaks in the back and sits in the back row. A hundred years ago he would have likely had it very strongly suggested that he move away somewhere on his own accord, I bet. A few hundred years before that he might well have been sent to the Tower. (But not really, since I doubt he did anything Henry VIII didn't do... times were different.)

And if he moved away, I bet they'd be similar to how they are with Harry. Polite, arms-length, extending invitations to the important events even if they know he won't go (or if they don't want him to go, at least in Andrew's case).

And no I'm not conflating Harry with Andrew. Very different situations. But both in the end are royals who are in very different ways a headache yet who decorum and tradition requires be treated courteously. Harry's the distant disaffected son, and Andrew's the creepy brother. Unfortunately Andrew has stuck around close by and doesn't care to self-limit his visibility and seems happy to shove himself in front at royal events. 

I think the but Harry did this or that which is way worse than William is a straw man argument. Harry has stepped down & receives no financial support from the British taxpayers or the royal coffers & doesn’t purport to represent them, so what he does/doesn’t do isn’t relevant to what William as the heir & a representative of the British people should or should not be expected to do. At some point attacking Harry to make William look better, & attacking Meghan to make Kate look better should end. I guess the tabloids keep doing it for the click bait, but you’d think folks would see it for what it is & lose interest.

What I see is that Charles has a legitimate health crisis & his wife & sister - both past typical retirement age, are sucking it up & soldiering on to support him in an admirable way. William, OTH, in prime working age w/ ample support staff is not. It never would have occurred to me to call in sick ‘for personal reasons,’ but I had a strong work ethic & felt I owed it to my employer/others affected to explain a last minute need to cancel. But perhaps my generation saw things differently & maybe it’s accepted practice these days to cite generic ‘personal reasons’ when you call in sick to work 🤷‍♀️. IMO if you want to keep it private cite a last minute scheduling conflict, or as I suggested minor illness don’t want to infect others. But, unless it was an illness, he should not have canceled, or, better yet, not scheduled it in the first place. He did the same last minute change of plans w/ the BAFTAs, in that case not committing to going until the last minute. William should realize that he needs to  prioritize duty right now in support of his ill father which may require some sacrifices & inconveniences. Of course after the bad press he got for his BAFTA faux pas maybe he’s a bit gun shy.

I realize that the image of the hardworking never complain never explain Windsors started with George V, Victoria disappeared from public view for years after Albert died, for example, but this last minute wishy washy changing plans from William seems contrary to that image.

[SoSoNosy]

I just saw an article on People.com that said Camilla drove up by herself, and that Andrew walked in front of a group of family.  He probably walked faster because everybody else was talking among themselves and maybe the conversation naturally excluded him.  

William could have had a case of the runs, everybody gets that after a dinner doesn't quite agree.

 

[louisa05]

3 minutes ago, viii said:

It is listed in the Court Circular, which makes it an official event and not a family/private event. 

It was not a state event. There was no precedence involved. And it was not public. Private events such as memorials are sometimes listed. The court circular is a record not a means of classifying anything. 

But the new thing in royal watching is to consider the official website a legal mandate, so of course the court circular is now, too. How tiresome. 

2 minutes ago, sndral said:

I think the but Harry did this or that which is way worse than William is a straw man argument. Harry has stepped down & receives no financial support from the British taxpayers or the royal coffers & doesn’t purport to represent them, so what he does/doesn’t do isn’t relevant to what William as the heir & a representative of the British people should or should not be expected to do. At some point attacking Harry to make William look better, & attacking Meghan to make Kate look better should end. I guess the tabloids keep doing it for the click bait, but you’d think folks would see it for what it is & lose interest.

What I see is that Charles has a legitimate health crisis & his wife & sister - both past typical retirement age, are sucking it up & soldiering on to support him in an admirable way. William, OTH, in prime working age w/ ample support staff is not. It never would have occurred to me to call in sick ‘for personal reasons,’ but I had a strong work ethic & felt I owed it to my employer/others affected to explain a last minute need to cancel. But perhaps my generation saw things differently & maybe it’s accepted practice these days to cite generic ‘personal reasons’ when you call in sick to work 🤷‍♀️. IMO if you want to keep it private cite a last minute scheduling conflict, or as I suggested minor illness don’t want to infect others. But, unless it was an illness, he should not have canceled, or, better yet, not scheduled it in the first place. He did the same last minute change of plans w/ the BAFTAs, in that case not committing to going until the last minute. William should realize that he needs to  prioritize duty right now in support of his ill father which may require some sacrifices & inconveniences. Of course after the bad press he got for his BAFTA faux pas maybe he’s a bit gun shy.

I realize that the image of the hardworking never complain never explain Windsors started with George V, Victoria disappeared from public view for years after Albert died, for example, but this last minute wishy washy changing plans from William seems contrary to that image.

The Protestant work ethic of never ever taking a day off for any reason has done no one any favors ever. Congratulations on being a loyal cog in the machine. If you died on the job, you would be replaced before you were buried. But you do you. 

The Royals actually do not take that much public funding--much of it comes from their own taxes now. And it has been reported multiple times that the King is okay with William prioritizing his family right now due to Catherine's own health crisis. He is also likely struggling himself between his wife being seriously ill and his father's cancer diagnosis. But clearly, mental health is always to be ignored. I'm doing my best to ignore mine as well since I can only get a diagnosis and no treatment. So I'll soldier on as we all should until an early grave. Never mind that there are no medals for that. 

[sndral]

15 minutes ago, louisa05 said:

It was not a state event. There was no precedence involved. And it was not public. Private events such as memorials are sometimes listed. The court circular is a record not a means of classifying anything. 

But the new thing in royal watching is to consider the official website a legal mandate, so of course the court circular is now, too. How tiresome. 

The Protestant work ethic of never ever taking a day off for any reason has done no one any favors ever. Congratulations on being a loyal cog in the machine. If you died on the job, you would be replaced before you were buried. But you do you. 

The Royals actually do not take that much public funding--much of it comes from their own taxes now. And it has been reported multiple times that the King is okay with William prioritizing his family right now due to Catherine's own health crisis. He is also likely struggling himself between his wife being seriously ill and his father's cancer diagnosis. But clearly, mental health is always to be ignored. I'm doing my best to ignore mine as well since I can only get a diagnosis and no treatment. So I'll soldier on as we all should until an early grave. Never mind that there are no medals for that. 

Actually I’m retired now & they did beg me to come back, write my own ticket etc.. I graciously declined all of their offers. 😂.There’s a difference between ‘never taking a day off’ and being reliable & scheduling your time off rather than last minute oops I can’t/don’t want to do that. William has support & resources that us cogs in the wheel can only dream of having, hence my expectation that he should do better.

Work/life balance is tough, I know, I was a single mom juggling a high stress job, I’m sorry things are difficult for you right now & hope they improve going forward.

Edited February 28 by sndral

[Destiny]

34 minutes ago, sndral said:

It never would have occurred to me to call in sick ‘for personal reasons,’ but I had a strong work ethic & felt I owed it to my employer/others affected to explain a last minute need to cancel. But perhaps my generation saw things differently & maybe it’s accepted practice these days to cite generic ‘personal reasons’ when you call in sick to work 🤷‍♀️.

Counterpoint: I'm a boss, and it's none of my business why someone who works for me won't be in as long as they give me enough notice to reschedule or take over any critical work*. I do not own them, and sometimes human persons have things come up that are none of my business unless they choose to share them with me. Obviously, a no-show would be handled differently, but someone saying, "Hey, I can't make it to work today," is enough information, and my team has plenty of work ethic.

William's personal reasons are none of our business.

*chronic absenteeism is also a different issue, as is a serious medical issue where some of the HR-ish things come into play like short-term and long-term disability and such.

Edited February 28 by Destiny

[Alisamer]

33 minutes ago, sndral said:

I think the but Harry did this or that which is way worse than William is a straw man argument. Harry has stepped down & receives no financial support from the British taxpayers or the royal coffers & doesn’t purport to represent them, so what he does/doesn’t do isn’t relevant to what William as the heir & a representative of the British people should or should not be expected to do.

Just to clarify, I personally was joking about the Harry thing. (Although I agree attacking Harry in comparison to Wills, or vice versa, is silly.) "Personal reasons" is more than enough info IMO. I don't need to know Wills has the runs or one of the kids is puking. I just especially think that's plenty of explanation compared to what Harry chose to share in his book. I don't need the TMI and I don't think the public should demand to see a doctor's note to excuse his absence, either. 

Now if it was the opening of parliament or something, then maybe. But a memorial service? For a random older family member that the majority of the country probably couldn't pick out of a photo lineup? 

I'm a hard worker and a team player. But there have been days when I just could not make it in to work. Mental health, burnout, whatever you want to call it. Maybe it was an actual illness just low level enough to make me too fatigued to get through the day. IDK. But I use all my vacation days and my PTO days and if I can't make it into work I can't make it into work. It's not a habit and if I'm not there I don't get paid, but I call in and say "hey I can't be there, this is what I remember might need to be done" and that's it. 

[sndral]

Reflecting on the ‘how much info.’ does an employer have a right to know question - my first job after graduating from undergrad gave you XX days off, whether you took the day off because you were sick, just didn’t feel like working, or had a 2 week scheduled vacation didn’t matter - it came out of the same bucket & that system actually reduced last minute can’t make it in calls I guess because folks preferred to save their time off for scheduled vacations.
Every job after that gave XX days sick, XX days vacation, & X days professional development, thus if I was taking from the sick days bucket I needed to explain that I was sick. If I wasn’t coming in due to a plumbing emergency at my house, that would come out of the vacation bucket. Plus, most of my government jobs required the proverbial ‘note from the doctor’ if you were out more than 3 days in a row.

[viii]

1 hour ago, louisa05 said:

It was not a state event. There was no precedence involved. And it was not public. Private events such as memorials are sometimes listed. The court circular is a record not a means of classifying anything. 

I didn’t say it was a state or public event. However, being listed on the Court Circular makes it an official event, and I’m not sure why you’re arguing against this very pointless point. 

[Destiny]

13 minutes ago, sndral said:

Every job after that gave XX days sick, XX days vacation, & X days professional development, thus if I was taking from the sick days bucket I needed to explain that I was sick. If I wasn’t coming in due to a plumbing emergency at my house, that would come out of the vacation bucket. Plus, most of my government jobs required the proverbial ‘note from the doctor’ if you were out more than 3 days in a row.

Jobs with sick time are somewhat rare outside of government these days, though I do work at one now. Even with that, I do not ask the nature of the illness. My people's juicy-poops-or-pukes-or-whatever-the-heck are none of my business. All I need to know is that you are sick and who's going to put the sick time in the system, me or you, and if you have any critical client meetings or projects I need to cover for you.

Even a note from the doctor doesn't explain the nature of the illness. Just that X was under a doctor's care and is eligible to return to work on Y date.

Our employers do not own us and it's a relationship that goes both ways. I find that treating my people like adults leads to them behaving like it, and absenteeism is vanishingly rare on my team. In the years I've worked here, unplanned callouts have happened very few times, because we have no problem approving the, "Hey, something came up and I can't make it in tomorrow."

A healthy work-life balance is critical to happy employees, and having been in a situation with unhealthy balance in the past, I will always do whatever I can to make sure that my people do not fall into the same soul-and-health-destroying traps I did. I'm really glad to see the old "work through it" crap is starting to die and I hope the next generation coming up keeps on this path.

Edited February 28 by Destiny

[louisa05]

50 minutes ago, Destiny said:

A healthy work-life balance is critical to happy employees, and having been in a situation with unhealthy balance in the past, I will always do whatever I can to make sure that my people do not fall into the same soul-and-health-destroying traps I did. I'm really glad to see the old "work through it" crap is starting to die and I hope the next generation coming up keeps on this path.

This. Gen Z is not having it and that's fantastic. They and younger millennials are pushing back against the come at 6 a.m., leave at 6 p.m teacher culture. There is a huge "work only your work hours" movement now and it's going to keep people in the profession longer. When I started, admins would go on and on about how you aren't a "real teacher" or " don't care about the kids" if you weren't in the building 12 or more hours a day. It is completely shifting and it is long past time. 

[Destiny]

5 minutes ago, louisa05 said:

This. Gen Z is not having it and that's fantastic. They and younger millennials are pushing back against the come at 6 a.m., leave at 6 p.m teacher culture. There is a huge "work only your work hours" movement now and it's going to keep people in the profession longer. When I started, admins would go on and on about how you aren't a "real teacher" or " don't care about the kids" if you weren't in the building 12 or more hours a day. It is completely shifting and it is long past time. 

I’m so here for Z not taking a lot of crap. Work culture in this country is fucked and I have hope that they will keep pushing for meaningful change. Every person should have access to PTO, paid family leave should be a thing, sickness shouldn’t mean you can’t pay the rent and on and on and on. I’m an old now, but I’m so proud of today’s kids and I’m so glad they aren’t falling into the unhealthy “if you aren’t working 60 hours a week you don’t care” and all the rest of the crap I did.

Edited February 28 by Destiny

[noseybutt]

7 hours ago, louisa05 said:

It was a family event. It was not public or a state event. The brouhaha every time he dares to exist is kind of exhausting. But the entire point of the internet seems to be to be exhausting. 

Nah, this is a problem with royalty period. 

In the US, our head of state is elected and when the POTUS is a drama queen, it’s exhausting.

With constitutional monarchies, anyone in the royal family can be exhausting because the system, by design, blurs the boundaries between private and public.

Just the way it is and has been, long before the internet.

 

 

[WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo?]

I've never had a job with sick leave or pto. The majority of my workplaces had 4 to 8 employees. If I called in sick to a veterinary clinic job, somebody had to come in on their day off to replace me, or 1 employee had to try to work 2 jobs that day. Same at the daycare, but they couldn't go below the city mandated adult to child ratios, so if no one could replace me, it got really tricky. And any time anyone took a vacation at either job, they didn't get paid, and we all had to work extra to cover for them. 

So I wasn't going to work sick because I wanted to be a terrific employee. I just needed to get paid, and I knew how much it sucked to cover 2 jobs when someone was not there.

I once told the vet at the one clinic how many cold medications I had taken so that I could come to work that day. (Decongestant, cough suppressant, and pain med, I think.) She said that didn't sound like a good idea. I almost asked her if she would rather let me cough all over her or pay the bills that I had coming due. 🙄 And I got bronchitis twice in the first year I worked in a daycare, because I caught every virus those germ factories sweet little 3 year olds had.

All to say, "Yay pto! Yay sick leave!" But I wonder how businesses with 2 or 3 employees can offer either, really.

Re: William. I don't know how much information he should share. The BRF is in such a weird, niche position.

 

[klein_roeschen]

8 hours ago, Destiny said:

I’m so here for Z not taking a lot of crap. Work culture in this country is fucked and I have hope that they will keep pushing for meaningful change. Every person should have access to PTO, paid family leave should be a thing, sickness shouldn’t mean you can’t pay the rent and on and on and on. I’m an old now, but I’m so proud of today’s kids and I’m so glad they aren’t falling into the unhealthy “if you aren’t working 60 hours a week you don’t care” and all the rest of the crap I did.

Even living in a country with mandated vacation time, paid (almost) infinite sick leave and strong (er) workers rights, we get the protestant work ethic shit. Because we invented that shit (Thanks Martin Luther for your "if someone isn't working, they should not eat" bullshit). I really hoped that with Covid we get a change in thinking that if you are sick, you stay home. But no, we are back at work above all else. Health, family, work life balance be damned. I'm happy with my 4 days a week (35 hours) and won't change anything by my chosing. It brings in enough money and I have enough free time.

 

 

[just_ordinary]

Sick leave sounds very much like an USA thing to be honest. Here you are sick as long and often as you are. The only question is who pays your salary for those days. Many employers pay your wage 100% for some time. After that your health insurance pays you sick leave as long as it takes. When you are healthy again you go back to work. Your employer is not privy to the medical reason. You could hand in a sick not every week with no prognosis how long this will go on. Our “sick note” for work specifically doesn’t list a diagnosis and only says you are not able to work. Granted sick days as in if you are sick more you loose your job or it eats up holidays are pretty much illegal. Obviously most employees do elaborate and tell their employer if they aren’t coming back to work for a longer period. But that’s their discretion.

While most employers have no problem giving a day or two for “personal reasons” that would most likely mean death of someone, moving, caring for a sick family member or court appearance or similar. You would have to disclose the reason to HR but not further. But there is no law around it that protects your right for “personal days” as it does holidays.

So Wiliam not attending for personal reasons is a bit of a grey zone. It’s fine. We don’t need to know. But he has a history of not pulling his weight. So pulling on short notice out for not medical reasons will raise eyebrows.

[Loveday]

6 hours ago, klein_roeschen said:

Even living in a country with mandated vacation time, paid (almost) infinite sick leave and strong (er) workers rights, we get the protestant work ethic shit. Because we invented that shit (Thanks Martin Luther for your "if someone isn't working, they should not eat" bullshit). I really hoped that with Covid we get a change in thinking that if you are sick, you stay home. But no, we are back at work above all else. Health, family, work life balance be damned. I'm happy with my 4 days a week (35 hours) and won't change anything by my chosing. It brings in enough money and I have enough free time.

 

 

To be slightly fair to good old Martin Luther, he didn't originate it, he just turned the Bible verse into practically a salvation issue, which it is not! (But try telling that to the Puritans and other Protestant religious groups who elevated it to an art form in colonial America!🥴)

 

[louisa05]

43 minutes ago, just_ordinary said:

So Wiliam not attending for personal reasons is a bit of a grey zone. It’s fine. We don’t need to know. But he has a history of not pulling his weight. So pulling on short notice out for not medical reasons will raise eyebrows.

We don't know that it wasn't a sick day. He has three young germ factories living in his not very large house. And as we have well learned in the last two months, a member of the BRF claiming to be ill then neglecting to provide the public with a full medical history, video of their doctor visits, daily photos and any other proof of illness Twitter or tabloids desire creates havoc. At this point, Catherine could produce a broadway level production about her surgery on the long walk at Windsor Castle displaying her incision and people would be on socials claiming it is all "very mysterious" and "odd" and "something is not right". If William called out with a stomach bug or bad cold, that would not be enough information. 

[viii]

34 minutes ago, just_ordinary said:

So Wiliam not attending for personal reasons is a bit of a grey zone. It’s fine. We don’t need to know. But he has a history of not pulling his weight. So pulling on short notice out for not medical reasons will raise eyebrows.

That's the real issue here. If William was a hard worker, then I think a situation like this would have garnered a lot less attention. However, because he already has a pretty solid track record of being incredibly lazy and flaky, the pressure is building. He doesn't have the leeway he did when he was the Duke of Cambridge. There's a lot more expected of him and so far he hasn't delivered much. 

[SoSoNosy]

I just read an explanation of Andrew's "leading" the way in.  They went in reverse order with the lowest rank first, like they do on Commonwealth Day.  Or so Hello Online says.

[louisa05]

4 hours ago, SoSoNosy said:

I just read an explanation of Andrew's "leading" the way in.  They went in reverse order with the lowest rank first, like they do on Commonwealth Day.  Or so Hello Online says.

It seemed that they just walked. They likely met up in the castle to walk over together. In the absence of Charles, Camilla, William and Catherine, it seemed precedence was ignored. 

Imagine people getting worked up on a regular basis about the order you walk in....

 

[WhatWouldJohnCrichtonDo?]

11 minutes ago, louisa05 said:

Imagine people getting worked up on a regular basis about the order you walk in....

Now I'm flashing back to my childhood, when my brother and sister and I rode in our old Suburban. The first kid in to the back seat didn't get a window that opened, the second kid was stuck between 2 siblings, and the last one in got the best seat, with a window that actually rolled down! We were excessively polite, and each tried to get in last. "No, you can get in first. No, you."  At least we didn't have reporters who cared which of us got "the good seat".