FJ fundie families sending their children to school

[mango_fandango]

Didn't Jim Boob attend Shiloh Christian School?

[Briefly]

5 hours ago, formergothardite said:

Homeschooling might go the way of courtship. I wouldn't be surprised if church schools start to rise again. 

We sent the Briefly daughter to Christian school for elementary.  The public school was not the best, the one she would have gone to was not very good and had large numbers of kids in each class.  We knew it was going to be a matter of "deprogramming" her on a regular basis until she got old enough to really understand things and we were right - it wasn't horrible, it is just the way it was. We picked the school we did because she was reading words before she was one year old and was speaking in full sentences before she was 18 months old, her reading ability was and still is extremely high.  When I was touring the schools, I heard the kindergarten class reading and it was very advanced.  At grade 6, we switched her to public school but it really was the best option for her when she went to elementary.  Her elementary school closed a few years ago and then the church that it was part of also did.  There have been a couple of Christian schools in the Tulsa area close.

[NachosFlandersStyle]

9 minutes ago, Briefly said:

We knew it was going to be a matter of "deprogramming" her on a regular basis until she got old enough to really understand things and we were right - it wasn't horrible, it is just the way it was...  At grade 6, we switched her to public school but it really was the best option for her when she went to elementary.  

This is pretty much my upbringing, except it was a Catholic school and the reason for sending me there had more to do with the fact that *all* of the kids in my extended family went to the parochial school so why wouldn't I? My dad at least was always very intentional with the "deprogramming," so I knew from the start that I needed to take certain classes and certain teachers with a grain of salt.  I got in so many arguments with the religious ed teachers.

I'm always a little surprised talking to friends who attended k-12 with how much of the experience I managed to avoid. I switched to public schools before they got into the real shaming about sex and orientation, for example. I don't have nearly as much "Catholic guilt" as most of my peers.

[Anonymousguest]

I homeschooled my older children (graduated 4 from homeschool) and send my younger ones to school. I have lots of reasons, but the biggest was that I was just worn out and my heart wasn't in it any more. I didn't feel up to providing my littlest one with the education and experiences I did with the older ones and that didn't seem fair. There is a big age gap and initially I thought I would only send her to school, but once it came time I decided I was done and everyone was going to school, lol. 

It's funny someone said something about the older kids being resentful in the families where the younger "got" to go to school, because that's not the case here at all. My middle one feels a little shorted that she is having to go to school. And I do feel guilty and selfish that the younger ones aren't being homeschooled. But I do believe that with where I am mentally this is the best choice for them. And definitely for me. I homeschooled for nearly 20yrs, I was ready to move on ( I now teach others people's kids, lol, so maybe I didn't move that far on).

I do have several friends who are in the same mindset. A lot of us are sending our younger kids to school after homeschooling for many years. It's less about discovering we weren't good at it or that it was hard, or that we couldn't give them the opportunities we thought they needed, but about realizing schools *can* provide those opportunities too, and we aren't as scared as we were when our older children were young. We don't have to be the ones doing it all. 

[chaotic life]

The 1980s were the homeschooling trailblazers, lots and lots of lawsuits and CPS cases fighting to legalize homeschooling. By the early 1990s, it was legal in all states in some form or another and HSLDA shifted to preaching fear that the days of persecution could return at any time. But early 90s was when fundies flocked to homeschooling, Home churching, SAHDs and family together focused lives in large numbers.

[Melissa1977]

It has been speculated that Shupes and Jeubs kids were sent to school because CPS was involved. So it wasn't their own decision really.

I don't think young fundies are going to send kids to school as a regular basis. My opinion is that many of the 2nd generation fundies will keep small/medium families (4-6 kids). Having less kids will make homeschooling easier. Plus they have never went to school themselves, so probably they have no idea of the experiences their kids could enjoy there, neither realise their poor teaching skills.

This said, there are some fundie couples who I can see willing to use schools, co-ops or whatever takes kids out of home for a while. 

I won't be surprised if Dillards eventually go to school (because Derrick realise his boys are not learning enough at home and feels insecure or ashamed), Whitney (if her friends kids go to school, and especially if all sisters-in-law marry and she has to teach herself), and others. 

[mango_fandango]

Someone on here claimed to know of the Shupes/used to associate with them (whether they actually did or not is another matter) and said that Erika was diagnosed with health issues, vitamin deficiency or something and that’s why she couldn’t homeschool anymore, she was just exhausted physically. Obviously there is no proof of this, but the poster did say that Karen was engaged and going to have a courthouse wedding which did turn out to be true, so who knows.

[Rik_Bik]

I think there might be a trend towards private Christian schools just from observing members of my own family. My three fundie cousins where ADAMANT that they would homeschool their children (one of them having been homeschooled themselves) and all of their children are now enrolled in the same private, conservative Christian school. It does at least provide a decent education, if biased, and is well established in our city.

Of course this is just my family, but none of their fundie friends homeschool either. I imagine the fundiest fundies will still homeschool regardless. 

[Melissa1977]

1 hour ago, Rik_Bik said:

I think there might be a trend towards private Christian schools just from observing members of my own family. My three fundie cousins where ADAMANT that they would homeschool their children (one of them having been homeschooled themselves) and all of their children are now enrolled in the same private, conservative Christian school. It does at least provide a decent education, if biased, and is well established in our city.

Of course this is just my family, but none of their fundie friends homeschool either. I imagine the fundiest fundies will still homeschool regardless. 

But you need a lot of money to go to private schools. Many fundies seem to have very modest salaries. Maybe they can twist their beliefs and send kids to public school in order to "minister" AKA free schooling and free time for a genuinely tired mom. 

One fundie I would loooove to see sending kids to school is Joseph Maxwell. I know it is almost impossible, but he's the only Maxwell I can remotely imagine doing that and it would be great to see. 

[ophelia]

 

17 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

ETA: and no more frumpers! If you compare a lot of these fundie families to 10 years ago, I would barely recognize them. Actually that would be kind of fun to do!

Sometimes I miss the good ole days of matching frumpers and then I scroll through the Maxwell blog archives.

15 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Overall I don’t think the Duggars have changed all that much. And I assume it’s because of the show. I always wonder what their lives would look like if they never got a show on TLC.

I'd also say that the Duggar's haven't changed much. Nowadays they seem more fundie than the Bateses. When the Bateses where first introduced in an episode of 17KAC the girls were still wearing this matching, colorful prarie dresses. It also seems to me that the Bateses are a little bit more worldly than the Duggars, but I might be wrong.

[WiseGirl]

19 hours ago, bea said:

imagine that by the time you’re on baby 6 with no end in sight, the lure of sending 4 of them off for school every day becomes tempting. I’ve only got two and Sept 4th cannot get here fast enough.

Ah summer, when true teacher appreciation occurs. 

Hopefully the trend of sending their children to schools continues. At least they are not home all the time.

As a teacher I often see students switching from homeschooling during the middle school years and often it is a difficult transition (not any people ever say "I wish I could go back to my middle school years").

This also seems to be the age when parents start switching their children from religious schools to public schools when it becomes apparent to them their child has a learning disability/difficulty. That is hard for the child as they often already feel "stupid" by the time they end up at public school, which breaks my heart. (As an aside, fortunately some of the Catholic schools in my area are starting to recognize the need for some special needs services and are starting to provide that, especially for students on the autism spectrum).

[formergothardite]

1 hour ago, ophelia said:

. It also seems to me that the Bateses are a little bit more worldly than the Duggars, but I might be wrong.

I think they have always been a bit more worldly* than the Duggars, they have just recently started hiding their fundie side. They no longer show that they are deeply involved with IBLP, but they still are. They are basically the face of it and travel a lot to lead Institute activities, but looking at their social media and reality television you wouldn't have a clue they were so heavily involved with a religious cult. 

*IMO this is because they came to IBLP has college educated adults who worked their way up through the ranks of IBLP until they eventually helped take over,  while the Duggars came as people who jumped into this because they had been convinced a miscarriage was caused by them sinning and never seemed to have the goal to take over IBLP.

[JermajestyDuggar]

Do any fundies “home church” any longer? The Maxwell’s nursing home church. So that’s kind of close. It seems that they all have found churches to attend and I’m glad. They need to make friends outside of the cult. 

[formergothardite]

The Bates are the closest to home churching. They started their own church which Gil pastors. I don't think their adult children attend it, though. 

[JermajestyDuggar]

12 minutes ago, formergothardite said:

The Bates are the closest to home churching. They started their own church which Gil pastors. I don't think their adult children attend it, though. 

And I can’t blame them. If I attended a church, I would want it to be large enough for a nursery or cry room. Along with lots of activities and vacation bible school. The Bates kids are social creatures so I’m sure they want to go to church to see their friends and socialize. It’s much easier to keep your kids sheltered when they are shy or not very outgoing. Your kids will be influenced by others outside of your control if they are constantly socializing with new people. 

[CatholicLite]

3 hours ago, ophelia said:

 

Sometimes I miss the good ole days of matching frumpers and then I scroll through the Maxwell blog archives.

I'd also say that the Duggar's haven't changed much. Nowadays they seem more fundie than the Bateses. When the Bateses where first introduced in an episode of 17KAC the girls were still wearing this matching, colorful prarie dresses. It also seems to me that the Bateses are a little bit more worldly than the Duggars, but I might be wrong.

Definitely! Based off of their instagrams most of them look almost normal. If I didn't know who they (the Bateses) were, I probably wouldn't give them a sideways glance.

[Petronella]

I agree that when families who have railed against the evils of school end up sending their kids there, that represents a significant shift in their philosophy of life (even if, like Erika Shupe, they pretend it doesn't). But I just want to put a hand up for homeschoolers who always intended to do it only until a certain age, or for a specific period of time, or for one specific child and not necessarily the others.

Putting formerly homeschooled children into school, or sending some children to school while others were/are still homeschooled, doesn't *necessarily* mean that the family has "changed their mind" about homeschooling. We had a good experience homeschooling, and when our kids got older they had/have a good experience at school, as we had always generally intended, no hypocrisy or change of mind needed.

But people who are hypercontrolling and criticize others and preach homeschooling as a moral issue? Oh yeah. That shift to sending the kids to school is seismic.

I hope more fundie families continue the trend of loosening up.

 

[CatholicLite]

Here's my hot take: they're still going to believe their destructive beliefs, no matter what. However, they'll have to alter their appearance, be it through altering modesty standards, real school, etc, so that they can blend into the world just enough that you can brush off what they say. They will become more "worldly", yet keep on saying the world is sinful and fallen.

Sure, they might even soften their beliefs a tiny tiny bit. But, ultimately, there's not going to be much change. It'll be extremism peddled as good Christianity, with all their faux-modesty and humble bragging.

[JermajestyDuggar]

7 minutes ago, CatholicLite said:

Here's my hot take: they're still going to believe their destructive beliefs, no matter what. However, they'll have to alter their appearance, be it through altering modesty standards, real school, etc, so that they can blend into the world just enough that you can brush off what they say. They will become more "worldly", yet keep on saying the world is sinful and fallen.

Sure, they might even soften their beliefs a tiny tiny bit. But, ultimately, there's not going to be much change. It'll be extremism peddled as good Christianity, with all their faux-modesty and humble bragging.

I think some fundie families are starting to do this and I can imagine more to follow. However I do believe it will be harder to keep all their children in the fold when they are allowing so many worldly influences. 

[CTRLZero]

I ran into my fundie former neighbor recently.  She had eight children,  and while she was my neighbor, she was a mover and shaker in the homeschool community.  She gave interviews in newspapers, loudly proclaiming to the world that no one else (i.e., evil public schools) would be raising her children, blah blah blah. 

Fast forward to today.  The first four of her children were homeschooled until high school, then they went to a Christian high school.  The family moved across town (hallerluyeyaw!), and I think it was because she had given us such grief about not homeschooling (and limiting our family size) that when her own energy and enthusiasm gave out, and she did start putting her kids into public schools, she didn't want any witnesses, lol.

Other observations:  Her oldest four all moved out of state (I wonder why).  Even though the patriarch is college educated and holds a high-paying professional job, the parents discouraged college, so the eldest are working warehouse type jobs that don't require degrees.  They are doing well for themselves and working hard, just not in anything that requires a college degree.  The youngest are doing well in public schools.

So...I think the homeschooling movement was a bit of a fad, and even some of the most vocal proponents fell by the wayside.  I know several other families like this (although, to their credit, they didn't give the rest of us heathens grief for making different choices).

[EmiGirl]

3 hours ago, formergothardite said:

The Bates are the closest to home churching. They started their own church which Gil pastors. I don't think their adult children attend it, though. 

I have a friend who visits their church several times a year and would go regularly if they lived closer. 

[Lurky]

I've said this in the Shupe and Jeub threads, but I don't understand how parents who've brainwashed their kids into thinking public school is dangerous and bad and evil can turn around and send them there, without completely confusing their children.  How do you go from being told that it's full of Satanic influences, and that the HS experience is so superior in every way to realising school is just.... school?

And I really feel for the older children in Fundy families - especially the ones who remember a pre-Fundy life, and bear the brunt sister-mom-ing their siblings, being beaten, having inadequate education etc etc and then watch the reins relax so much for the younger ones.  It seems so unfair!

[JermajestyDuggar]

3 minutes ago, Lurky said:

I've said this in the Shupe and Jeub threads, but I don't understand how parents who've brainwashed their kids into thinking public school is dangerous and bad and evil can turn around and send them there, without completely confusing their children.  How do you go from being told that it's full of Satanic influences, and that the HS experience is so superior in every way to realising school is just.... school?

And I really feel for the older children in Fundy families - especially the ones who remember a pre-Fundy life, and bear the brunt sister-mom-ing their siblings, being beaten, having inadequate education etc etc and then watch the reins relax so much for the younger ones.  It seems so unfair!

I remember Chris Jeub justifying their choice in sending their children to a public charter school. He said public schools have gotten better since they started homeschooling and the particular charter school was better than most in his opinion. Of course he now teaches there. I bet that’s what these fundies do. They tell their children this particular school is better than the rest of those heathen public schools.

[formergothardite]

25 minutes ago, EmiGirl said:

I have a friend who visits their church several times a year and would go regularly if they lived closer. 

Does she realize their involvement in a cult? I wonder how open they are about their true beliefs for people who are casual acquaintances.

[Leftitinmysnood]

Homeschooling is still a growing movement in my area, but I'm seeing even the fundies bending to the siren call of the charter schools. My kids are all in charter programs. Some attend on campus 2-3 days a week for classes in multiple subjects, labs, and field trips. They do the rest of their work at home the other days and I grade it, but all the (secular) books and lesson plans come from the school. Others attend a more flexible charter, where I see many fundie/fundie light families. We get funding that we can use for private lessons, sports, non-religious textbooks, field trips, and supplies. If you are quiverful, it's hard to look down on $2000/kid, even if it comes from the government with mandatory supervision of work samples. Another local option is the hybrid religious home/classroom program. I am reminded of a Chicken Little article in World magazine almost 20 years ago where they worried all the homeschoolers would be under the control of the government via vouchers. Don't get me wrong, you can still screw up your kid's education this way, but they will encounter other people and the teachers have to talk to the kids and are mandated reporters.