sex-obsessed fundies--does this count as an example?

[Spartan89]

A little OT, but this reminded me of something that happened to me a couple months ago. I was at a good friend's college grad party, and some of his relatives are fundie lite. I went inside to use the bathroom (the party was in the backyard) and a two year old boy was in there alone, door open, struggling to get his pants off and put his bathing suit on. He was getting stuck and asking me for help. Since I was a preschool camp counselor for years, naturally I thought nothing of helping him step into his swim trunks. The door was open the entire time. As I was helping him, his mom came in and yelled "Thomas! We don't take our clothes off in front of girls!!!" and proceeded to glare at me and step in front of her son to shield him from my view.

This was so upsetting to me because the child was only 2! It's not like he was purposely stripping in front of women of something. And seriously, making me feel like a perv for helping a two year old get dressed? It was embarrassing for me.

[AnnoDomini]

That's something to think about before you have a baby. My 15 year old would be very uncomfortable with changing a baby diaper, period. He's never had to, despite having four younger siblings. He's never given a baby a bath, or did their laundry, or fed them either. He's their brother, not their parent.

That's as it may or may not be, but it doesn't give her more 'energy'. Coulda woulda shoulda doesn't help with the here and now, you know? Besides, she's one of those women who doesn't believe in birth control and says women who use it are 'in rebellion against God' and 'selfish' for not wanting children.

[AnnoDomini]

Though I can't fully claim to not be abnormally sex-minded. the other day, a boy I'm crushing on read some lines in a play that included 'sex' and 'lust'. I'm sure I blushed. Not to mention my still-iffy relationship with male genitals.

[emmiedahl]

That's as it may or may not be, but it doesn't give her more 'energy'. Coulda woulda shoulda doesn't help with the here and now, you know? Besides, she's one of those women who doesn't believe in birth control and says women who use it are 'in rebellion against God' and 'selfish' for not wanting children.

Changing a baby diaper does not require an immense output of energy. It's not running a marathon. It takes maybe 5 calories? I'm sure she is sick of changing diapers, especially if she has more than one using them at the moment. Seriously, would that be a good reason to not cook dinner or bathe the children? Is she running a farm or something physically demanding in addition to raising her kiddos? I have a hard time developing too much sympathy for parents who delegate child-raising to other children. It's not that I don't feel the pain, it's that I feel worse for a baby who has to be cared for by a squicked-out teenaged boy who would rather be anywhere else.

[AnnoDomini]

Her kids do most of the cooking,and kids don't need nearly as many baths as most people think they do. When they need baths, I think she has an older kid keep an eye out. Most of her kids are old enough to bathe themselves anyway.

She's also big on 'mental energy'. It's not just the physical.

[emmiedahl]

So her kids are doing the childcare and cooking, but she is the one who is tired?

Fundies just have a very different outlook, I guess.

[AnnoDomini]

So her kids are doing the childcare and cooking, but she is the one who is tired?

Fundies just have a very different outlook, I guess.

Chemical brain thing. To her defense, it's not like diaper changing, bathtime and cooking are the extent of mothering.

[emmiedahl]

If physically caring for your children is not an important part of parenting, then what the hell is?

To be fair, I read this as an outsider to fundie culture. To show you how this looks to me, consider the following example from another American subculture: A black woman lives in government subsidized housing with her six kids from several different daddies. She does not work or go to school, nor does she clean her house or provide most of her children's care. She lives on a tight budget, mainly welfare and food stamps. Her older kids take care of the younger ones in between school and whatever else kids do. She lays on her couch all day chainsmoking and watching Maury, claiming that she is just too tired to get up. Moreover, she is having unprotected sex and thus is likely to be pregnant with yet another any day now.

You probably don't think that is okay. But consider: both women are doing what is normal in their time and place. Both are probably stressed out and tired. Both are failing as parents. The only difference is that your example thinks her lifestyle is superior to all others and that other people should be doing the same thing. The stereotypical ghetto mom is smart enough to know that this situation sucks and is in no way ideal.

[raineymott]

So her kids are doing the childcare and cooking, but she is the one who is tired?

This is my mom. Us kids did everything, and mom got all the "breaks" and naps and everything. My dad said she got whatever she wanted because she "took care of us for so long" (well, actually, until I was about 7 or 8!).

[BlackHawk]

Ha, wish my mom was like that...I'm certain I've changed more diapers in my life than she has. Lol (oh and the boys in our house NEVER changed diapers. Dad did very rarely (only if he was babysitting...and even then he usually left them for when us girls got home).

This is a line of thinking that bugs the shit out of me. Dads help create the children (or have a hand in the choice of adopting the child) and thus dads don't babysit! Dad is a parent. If dad has a hard time changing the diaper, dad shouldn't be a dad.

I remember being asked to change my cousin's diaper when I was younger. It's not that her mom couldn't do it, it's not that her mom minded doing it, but her mom was dealing with her other child's emergency. (Cousin fell and busted her lip wide open and ended up needing 7 stitches). I see no harm in asking for help at that point as I was the only other person in the room. My aunt called my mom, but baby was prone to blistery rashes if not changed when wet. I saw nothing wrong with that. I changed her diaper, was a bit weirded out (I was like 9?), then my mom got there and took over caring for baby. I see no harm in asking for help, even from a sibling or cousin, if need be. But having the siblings do everything simply because you don't want to? That's wrong.

[raineymott]

This is a line of thinking that bugs the shit out of me. Dads help create the children (or have a hand in the choice of adopting the child) and thus dads don't babysit! Dad is a parent. If dad has a hard time changing the diaper, dad shouldn't be a dad.

Yeah, exactly! (I agree with the rest of your post too but I wanted to address this.) I think my husband can't wait to change our baby's diapers! Lol He takes care of me when I'm upset/craving/irritable/tired, but I think he really can't wait until the baby is born so it feels more like he is a part of it rather than an observer. Which I think is cool.

[emmiedahl]

The double standard with dads is alive and well. A relative stayed with a us a week ago. Essential background: my husband's school hadn't started fall session yet AND he didn't work that week. Meanwhile I was working full time and in the middle of a semester. Relative commented that I was so lucky that dh did half the childcare and housework. She commented regularly, like every time he washed a dish or changed a diaper.

Can you imagine called a man 'lucky' that his wife did half if he was working and going to school and she wasn't????

[apple1]

Her kids do most of the cooking,and kids don't need nearly as many baths as most people think they do. When they need baths, I think she has an older kid keep an eye out. Most of her kids are old enough to bathe themselves anyway.

She's also big on 'mental energy'. It's not just the physical.

I am bumping this thread because of its relationship to another current thread.

[apple1]

Chemical brain thing. To her defense, it's not like diaper changing, bathtime and cooking are the extent of mothering.

I have seen on another thread that this mom is menopausal. Thankfully, no more babies will be created to be raised by their siblings (or to stress out this "tired" mother).

This whole thing just yanks my chain.

[AnnoDomini]

Yes, she's menopausal, and cries when she touches another woman's baby because she herself won't be having any more. I must confess to having a tiny twinge of 'why aren't we enough?'

I apologize for not making it known that this was my family--I'm more comfortable sharing certain things now than I was then.

[emmiedahl]

So the mother cannot/will not care for the children she has now and she is sad that she cannot add more work for her teenagers?

[AnnoDomini]

She just loves babies.

[apple1]

She just loves babies.

You need to know that healthy people connect cause and effect. And that babies grow up.

I personally JUST LOVE babies. I really do. The period of time when my own girls were babies seemed way too short to me.

But my 2nd pregnancy was high-risk and the doc warned me that any subsequent pregnancy would be high-risk. Plus, 2 was pretty much all we could afford financially (and the subsequent years have verified that). So- we took permanent BC measures.

I'm a Grandma now, and I dearly LOVE my grandchild. I would LOVE more grandchildren (someday). But my daughter is in a difficult financial situation right now. I have even meddled :o so much as to "remind" my daughter not to slack off on her BC.

Cause and effect. Choices and consequences. Everything in life has them.

[emmiedahl]

Count me in as someone who loves babies and yet will not be having any more.

Because I cannot morally justify pawning off my children on other children, 5 are enough. That is the most that I can care for while doing other necessary life things.

[Childless]

My husband, who basically raised his siblings, had to do all the diaper changes, baths, etc. He never said he was squicked out. He just did what needed to be done. Mostly, he talks about being upset that he was delegated to the parent role as a teenager. When he finally graduated, he moved out and never went back. He was in his thirties before he ever wanted kids of his own. He was tired of raising children by the time he hit 18. In my opinion, that was far more damaging than having his "purity" challenged by diapering babies.

[masagoroll]

I think that is stupid. I can understand the dude feeling uncomfortable, but that is a gross way to describe it, because it makes it sound like every other person who has done the same thing is being creepy, too. He could have worn gloves-- as a childcare teacher, we wear gloves when we change diapers and put on ointment.

How old was this person?

And, knowing that this happened in your family...who did end up changing the diaper/putting on the ointment?

[AnnoDomini]

He was 23. My mother ended up doing it.

[masagoroll]

I think that a 23-year-old man should be fine with changing diapers and not being immature about it.

HOWEVER, I just read the related thread and read that the kid is actually 10 years old and I can see how that might seem more weird. I have never changed a diaper of a kid older than 3!

[AnnoDomini]

Plus, my father gives them a super-embarrasing 'talk' about sex that basically makes them want to never have anything to do with a woman ever. Or something.

[Brainsample]

We've been here and talked about this before, no?

Look, if the kid is that worked up about putting diaper ointment on his sister and thinks that it is sexual, then I'm very glad he refused.