Joshley Madison Part 5 - Rehab and women and porn - oh my!

[Jana814]

I agree Josh is scum!!

[Cactus]

Yeah, I think that she's going with the "stand by your brother" because she thinks it will look good, but now that the tides have turned, I can see her deciding to get some revenge on Josh. He molested her as a little girl, she was forced to just smile and blame herself for it, then it comes out that he did that, she has to relive it on live television, her gravy train show gets canceled before she can launch her spinoff, THEN her brother has a ANOTHER scandal that further ruins her family's reputation and sends her further into obscurity when she really needs the money because her dad pimped her out to an unemployed wannabe frat boy and she has a kid on the way...yeah, this is going to be House of Cards-level revenge.

I'm now having way too much fun imagining Jessa as Frank Underwood. :lol:

[nokidsmom]

Between Josh & Pa Keller not even the picture perfect, sweet as pie Bates will be able to keep the dark side of their beliefs hidden.

I am sure the Bateseses are worried lest other people start looking at them.

[justbecause]

I actually think the other person is Jessa rather than Jill. Jessa was pissed about the article saying she has a "bittersweet" pregnancy. I'm guessing she realized that you cannot influence what is said about you if you don't talk. Also, I had a feeling (like many others if I recall correctly) that she and Ben were pissed at Josh in the weird interview episode of the Duggars (Digging in With the Duggars; where they showed poor, terrified Josie her bloody birth :cray-cray: ). I don't see Jill doing anything that was not JB approved. I don't see a spark in her at all...

Good detective work both of you!

[freejingerbeth]

He isn't getting any real therapy. I think you missed my point. They are only paying for the place to live and food, which is similar to the price of room and board at the University of Illinois.

I already know that he isn't getting any real therapy. I also am aware of what state universities are charging, for room and board, which is also too much. And, I was trying to point out that although the university is stating that the price is only for room and board, embedded in that price is the cost of other benefits, that the clients of this facility are not getting. However, my real question was centered around whether this facility is engaging in fraudulent activity, by either requiring people to turn over benefits, while still charging them the full amount. Also, are they requiring people to apply, who wouldn't normally have applied, so that they can get extra money?

[nst]

I actually think the other person is Jessa rather than Jill. Jessa was pissed about the article saying she has a "bittersweet" pregnancy. I'm guessing she realized that you cannot influence what is said about you if you don't talk. Also, I had a feeling (like many others if I recall correctly) that she and Ben were pissed at Josh in the weird interview episode of the Duggars (Digging in With the Duggars; where they showed poor, terrified Josie her bloody birth :cray-cray: ). I don't see Jill doing anything that was not JB approved. I don't see a spark in her at all...

omg that was such a weird episode to watch and such tense drama that you could feel between Josh, Ben and Jessa - and that was what two weeks before the scandal broke. - It was like he was taunting them and Ben just accepted it and what was jessa going to do - leap over to the other couch and strangle him. I think all the support Jessa pretends to give - I doubt she really gives it.

as for the bittersweet remark - she actually had Ben make a comment - because she can't do a video on her instagram or facebook- oh what I wouldn't see to hear say those words lol

I think it's both Amy and Jessa

Saturday is her day - this should be interesting

[Mr.Bowie]

This is for sale on their website, maybe this or a similar item? With a long modest skirt of course!

shop.reformu.com/product-p/wap-1.htm

:worship:

Ahhh, its a Co-ed facility. This should be fun! :P

[justbecause]

Has anyone ever heard this before?

"Anna's own relationship with her mother was odd from the beginning, the report claims: "Anna and her siblings were limited to one 15-minute session per week to share their feelings with their mom."

It is from Radar Online, not very reliable but this is new to me. 15 minutes with mom per week? That is very strange even for fundies. :wtf:

[ethel]

Has anyone ever heard this before?

"Anna's own relationship with her mother was odd from the beginning, the report claims: "Anna and her siblings were limited to one 15-minute session per week to share their feelings with their mom."

It is from Radar Online, not very reliable but this is new to me. 15 minutes with mom per week? That is very strange even for fundies. :wtf:

Not too surprising. I remember the Duggars talking about scheduled parent/child time in the early specials. It may have been longer than 15 minutes though.

I just think the whole thing is horrific.

[freejingerbeth]

But if people are required to apply for food stamps and then turn those over to the facility without getting a discount of the respective amount on the program cost, then the food stamps are NOT used to pay for the patients' food. It would be 100% profit for the facility.

Thank you! This has been my question, throughout the entire thread.

[PrairieGirl]

https://au.lifestyle.yahoo.com/who/latest-news/a/29371375/why-anna-duggar-married-josh-despite-his-molestation-past/

WHY ANNA DUGGAR MARRIED JOSH DESPITE HIS MOLESTATION PAST

Anna Duggar's parents gave their blessing for her to marry Josh despite his dark secret

Aparently one of the siblings spoke to Mr Keller and he said king David had affairs.

Worst dad of the year award...

Uh yeah, and King David was also a murderer. He sent the husband of a woman he lusted after to the front lines of war so Horny Kingy could have the wife for himself.

And I just popped in here to say that if you search the name "Josh Duggar" on google, the first three hits are:

Josh Duggar Rehab

Josh Duggar Police Report

Josh Duggar Ashley Madison

[justbecause]

Not too surprising. I remember the Duggars talking about scheduled parent/child time in the early specials. It may have been longer than 15 minutes though.

I just think the whole thing is horrific.

It is horrific. Just get's stranger and stranger.

I was just looking to see if it could be true, seems that is a thing with fundies.

I now have a visual of J'chelle sitting in the living room with a line of kids through to the dining room waiting for their 15 minutes.

EVERY aspect of these people is WEIRD. It keeps getting crazier. Like a soap opera, but not. :cray-cray:

[busdrivingmom]

I was talking to my husband about all this last night (he saw it on another gossip site) and I told him about the "I hope he(Josh) gets broken in therapy" quote and DH goes, you mean like a broken arm or leg? :lol: I told him Josh's spirit, and DH goes, oh I wish it was an arm or leg.

I wish Josh diahrreah from sugar free gummy bears or sugar free Peeps. I wish Anna and kids would leave him. I wish this family would just go away.

[lascuba]

Thank you! This has been my question, throughout the entire thread.

I could see them claiming that the program cost doesn't actually cover all expenses, and therefore EBT and other forms of public assistance for those who qualify is way for the center to to make up the difference as well allow them to charge such a low rate for those who need their "help."

[ClaraOswin]

Pretty sure Dillon spilled the beans on Amy being person #1...this is what he posted on his Instagram hours ago -

"Josh’s integrity is gone," the family member continues. "It’s scary. You never know who can have a double life. You really think you know someone. Josh was caught with his hand in the cookie jar and I hope he gets broken in rehab and gets the help he needs. I hope Anna finds the strength to make some changes."

I think the second person is Jill. Statement #2 sounds very PC and includes lots of talk about prayer and love for family that seems to fit Jill more than Jessa IMO. I also can't see it being any of the other Duggar kids because I imagine Jim Bob probably has his whole family on lockdown right now. However, it'd be easier for Jill and/or Derick to get away with it since they're currently out of the country.

I agree...definitely Amy.

I have a hard time seeing "sweet Jilly muffin" going against Jim Bob to be an anonymous source of anything. Jessa...maybe.

[ClaraOswin]

Not too surprising. I remember the Duggars talking about scheduled parent/child time in the early specials. It may have been longer than 15 minutes though.

I just think the whole thing is horrific.

That is so sad to me. I have just one child (and he's only 2) but I cannot imagine having to schedule time for him. I worry about him being an only child and getting TOO much time with me...ha!

[FundieFarmer]

I could see them claiming that the program cost doesn't actually cover all expenses, and therefore EBT and other forms of public assistance for those who qualify is way for the center to to make up the difference as well allow them to charge such a low rate for those who need their "help."

But if that's the case, would people who don't qualify have to buy all of their own food? So, it's basically $7,500 + food?

I'm really only familiar with the centers that offer all-things-included, so this is new for me.

[TL;DR]

But if that's the case, would people who don't qualify have to buy all of their own food? So, it's basically $7,500 + food?

I'm really only familiar with the centers that offer all-things-included, so this is new for me.

And if *that* is the case, shouldn't their rules say something like, "Feel free to bring your own food if you're a picky eater" rather than, "Hey, starve, we don't care. It'll make you more pious." I think they're shady allllll the way around, up, down, and center.

[lascuba]

But if that's the case, would people who don't qualify have to buy all of their own food? So, it's basically $7,500 + food?

I'm really only familiar with the centers that offer all-things-included, so this is new for me.

I'm guessing no. Honestly, I think the $7,500 per person for 6 months is more than enough to cover food, utilities, and salaries of staff. They're not using professionals and what with them doing it all for Christ they probably pay very little. The EBT, etc. thing is just a way for them to increase their profits, but they'll spin it as a way to make up their "losses" since they only charge $7,500.

[Daisy4]

Has anyone ever heard this before?

"Anna's own relationship with her mother was odd from the beginning, the report claims: "Anna and her siblings were limited to one 15-minute session per week to share their feelings with their mom."

It is from Radar Online, not very reliable but this is new to me. 15 minutes with mom per week? That is very strange even for fundies. :wtf:

This isn't really new information. The duggars bragged about this as a way of showing that they really did have time to connect with each child, you just have to sign up and schedule it in advance!

Most fundies bought the home scheduling kit from the Maxwells. We have a whole section on that crazy family.

titus2.com/managers-of-their-homes.html

You could see the schedule on the wall at the TTH in the old episodes and they used to have it posted on their website.

[VeryNikeSeamstress]

Things I have been wondering as this unfolds:

If Josh emerges from reprogramming camp and Anna stays with him (regrettably this is what will happen) , will she have to become his full-time accountability buddies? I remember Jim Boob and GreenBlouse explaining the buddy system on an episode, and something was said about the husband and wife being 'buddies'. Will Anna be expected to follow him everywhere to make sure he doesn't sin again?

How do the other adult Duggar siblings really feel about all this? I'm not saying the other Duggar men would condone cheating, but I wonder if they have any resentment towards Josh because he's gotten away with depravity (I'm not talking about the molestation, I'm referring to porn and secret sex). I could also see there being resentment because of all the extra 'safeguards' that have been put in place as a result of Josh's actions, which leaves the other brothers with even less autonomy and privacy.

As for the single adult Duggar Daughters, I wonder if this has them thinking twice about everything they've been taught about marriage. I also wonder if any of them secretly think that Anna should leave Josh.

On a slightly unrelated note- I think I remember reading something about limited bathroom breaks at Josh's forced labor camp, and there being a rule about no more than 2 showers a day. If we send him diarrhea-enducing gummy bears it could make for a terribly messy situation for Joshy boy. :ew: :ew: :ew:

[freejingerbeth]

Just a few thoughts about the food stamp issue. I am not an expert by any means, but I have had some experience in this area. My understanding has always been that the requirement to turn over food stamp benefits very much depends on what type of program it is. Programs where individuals purchase and prepare their own meals do not (to the best of my knowledge) have this requirement for fairly obvious reasons. Half-way houses typically fall into this category.

As far as programs that provide meals go, here is what I have seen.

- Programs that are covered by health insurance do not, to my knowledge, require patients to turn over food stamps as the cost of meals is covered as it would be for any inpatient treatment. Of course, you need to really have a disorder that needs serious treatment to be in any type of recovery treatment that would be covered by insurance. To continue stating the obvious, to the best of my knowledge there would need to actually be licensed professionals providing the treatment. :shifty:

- Higher-end self-pay programs typically roll the cost of meals into the overall pricing structure, as the cost of food is fairly minimal in the grand scheme of things for such a program. It also may be that the percentage of clients in such programs that would actually qualify for food stamps is fairly low. Really not sure on that one.

- Low-end self-pay programs, "holdings"*, etc. that provide meals typically DO require clients to turn over their food stamps. Further, in my experience, these programs will require clients to apply for food stamps if they are eligible but not yet receiving the benefit. This makes sense to me for three reasons. First, food stamps are a government benefit given monthly to ensure the individual has adequate food. Food stamps actually "expire" after a given period (not sure how long) if not used. It makes sense for a benefit meant to fund food for a given individual each month to be spent doing just that - and that is what happens in these types of programs when the food stamp benefits are turned over. Second, the typical individual in a longer-term, low-end recovery program that qualifies for food stamps is usually not used to having large amounts of available cash. I don't think it is any secret that, while illegal, food stamps can be sold for cash if one knows where to go. Unleashing a freshly-recovered addict with what can easily equate to a pocket full of cash isn't an ideal plan if they are used to being cash poor. Third, if the individual is expected to stay long enough that food stamp benefits would start to expire, it makes good sense to use that money to feed the individual before that occurs.

Someone upthread mentioned that programs might require individuals to turn over other types of benefits. I am not sure what types of benefits that would be. To the best of my knowledge, no one is required to turn over many types of benefits including social security benefits. Again, though, my experience is limited.

* "Holdings" are facilities that exist in some areas that are designed to house or contain individuals during the period between inpatient recovery or rehab stays (covered by insurance) and acceptance into a half-way house. These types of facilities may go by different names in different locations. Based on my experience (which is limited) and my limited knowledge of RU, this program sounds an awful lot like a "holding" to me (though it replaces 12 step meetings and education with fundie type activities). :shifty-kitty:

-Edited because it just wasn't long enough and I needed to babble a bit more on one topic :o

Thank you so much, for all of the information. I think you, or Mama Mia mentioned in a different post, that it would not be legal for a facility to receive food assistance, if the clients are making their own food. Maybe I read incorrectly? I believe this facility does indeed, require the residents to do the cooking. From what both of you said, $7,500. is not expensive for treatment. Obviously, I had no idea how expensive treatment could be. Although it appears to be legal, I believe charging someone for a treatment program, and collecting their food assistance, is wrong. I believe it would be better to simply suspend the benefits, while they are in treatment, and let the money stay in the system, for someone else. I think many other taxpayers would agree with me. Additionally, while other programs may charge more, I believe that they are also providing licensed counseling, healthcare, drug tests, etc., and they are for-profit companies. This program seems to be under the umbrella of a church. Therefore, they shouldn't be making any profit, from the clients. In my opinion, they amount they are charging, for basically a bed, and food, which they themselves are cooking, is more than needed, to simply break even. But, I am basing my opinion only what my own family bills are, so maybe I am wrong. Finally, it seems odd to me, that a state government would not require a program to be licensed/accredited, before approving food assistance funds to be turned over a program. :shrug:

[justmy2cents]

That is so sad to me. I have just one child (and he's only 2) but I cannot imagine having to schedule time for him. I worry about him being an only child and getting TOO much time with me...ha!

I read that article and what's really odd is that the siblings are/were discouraged from sharing their feelings with each other. When Anna started courting Josh she couldn't share with her siblings and was only allowed to share with her mom during that weekly meeting. Were they afraid that talking to an unmarried sister would stir up that sister's desires? Just weird.

As for the source of that article. I agree that Amy is the first source for all the reasons stated by others here but I think the 2nd source is Daniel Keller. The idea that Josh needs to be broken is something Daniel mentioned on Jessa's FB page before his comments were deleted. He said Josh wouldn't truly be broken til Anna left him and he went to Rehab so I think that's him. I just can't imagine any of the siblings talking to the press.

[church_of_dog]

I was talking to my husband about all this last night (he saw it on another gossip site) and I told him about the "I hope he(Josh) gets broken in therapy" quote and DH goes, you mean like a broken arm or leg? :lol: I told him Josh's spirit, and DH goes, oh I wish it was an arm or leg.

I think "broken" is another one of their jargon words like "purposing" -- there is another family quote floating around re Josh and the AM situation that includes the word "brokenness" and it's used in the same context, as a positive thing in this context.

I read it as similar to the AA concept of admitting one is powerless over the addiction and needs help.

[FundieFarmer]

I'm guessing no. Honestly, I think the $7,500 per person for 6 months is more than enough to cover food, utilities, and salaries of staff. They're not using professionals and what with them doing it all for Christ they probably pay very little. The EBT, etc. thing is just a way for them to increase their profits, but they'll spin it as a way to make up their "losses" since they only charge $7,500.

I agree that it's enough, and I still think $7,500 for a bullshit Jesus-hab program is a lot. It's outrageous to me that they'd then use EBT to increase their income, especially when their "students" are doing manual labor all day long too. I agree with FreeJingerBeth; I would think they're more than breaking even. Do any of y'all with experience know if there are any major hidden costs we're missing thinking about? I wouldn't be angry about seeing some financials from this place :shifty-kitty:

I'm a spreadsheet nerd, don't mind me.

Also, thanks y'all for all of your info. I've learned stuff I never expected just in this conversation alone. You really can learn something about everything on FJ!