Got verbally abused by my first fundie today!

[moodygirl86]

UPDATE: Rang the local cops this morning and explained what happened. The woman I spoke to was very nice, and assured me I was right to tell them, even if the incident seemed relatively minor to me. She thought the van sounded very distinctive, so they should have no trouble locating him if needed.

ETA: Bit of a tangent, but I've just remembered that after Sophie Lancaster was murdered in 2007 for being a goth, they brought in new legislation that attacking someone for following a subculture is now classed as a hate crime.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-la ... e-22018888

I don't know how I feel about that - it's nice that being an individual is now a protected right, and I'm in no way comparing this poor woman's murder to what happened to me yesterday. But I also believe Sophie's murderers would have either attacked her for another reason, or attacked another passer by - because they were violent people. (Thankfully, they got life imprisonment a year later.) And Mr Pretend Christian would have either thrown water at me for another reason, or picked on another passer by he disliked, because that's the sort of person he is. I remember one or two people at the time saying "well, she and her boyfriend made themselves targets" and I was furious! They should have been allowed to dress however the fuck they wanted! It's no better than blaming rape victims for wearing a short skirt. So that's why I've got mixed feelings about this hate crime legislation - although it means well, I also worry it could lead to victim blaming, despite it now being legally protected. Assault is assualt regardless of why the perpetrator has done it.

[salex]

Yeah, good catch! I know what you mean about Cabinetman.

To be honest, I'm not that concerned about him being a stalker. Birmingham's a MASSIVE city by UK standards, and you can walk around for weeks without bumping into anyone you know. It's second only to London in size. As for attracting him, I'm the first to admit I don't blend in. I'm taller than average at 5"7 and my hairstyle is shorter and spikier than most women my age (20s). And punky clothes aren't an uncommon thing to see in this city, but they're not the average either, so I admit that anyone who wanted to pick on me could spot me easily. But then I'm a defiant cow by nature and on principle refuse to blend in or hide myself away. He won't get to control me, neither will anyone else. I've done nothing to be ashamed of, and if that's what he wants me to feel, he'll be waiting till Judgment Day.

And with a van like his, he'd have to be damn stupid to pull the same crap on the same person twice! I'm fairly confident that this is going to be a one-off, at least with me. But I'll have a word with the authorities tomorrow and make them aware of his behaviour.

I hope I didn't come across as judging your clothing or suggesting you tone them down-- because when I say something attracted him to you, I was not thinking about the clothing as much as something less definable-- body type, walk, age, something--since, as you say, punky clothes aren't uncommon. My guess--if you had been a male, he'd not have said anything. If you had not been his "type" he probably wouldn't have said anything either. That is the only reason I'd be aware if I saw his van again. I was not suggesting toning down, only being aware.

I'm glad you called the cops. It most likely will go nowhere, but angry hate filled men attacking women who are minding their own business deserve to have attention aimed their way.

[moodygirl86]

I hope I didn't come across as judging your clothing or suggesting you tone them down-- because when I say something attracted him to you, I was not thinking about the clothing as much as something less definable-- body type, walk, age, something--since, as you say, punky clothes aren't uncommon. My guess--if you had been a male, he'd not have said anything. If you had not been his "type" he probably wouldn't have said anything either. That is the only reason I'd be aware if I saw his van again. I was not suggesting toning down, only being aware.

I'm glad you called the cops. It most likely will go nowhere, but angry hate filled men attacking women who are minding their own business deserve to have attention aimed their way.

Oh no, that's fine! I understood you weren't passing any kind of judgment. I agree if I was male, he would have thought twice. The fact he called me a slut would suggest he's a misogynistic prick, and thinks his religion justifies those horrible attitudes to women. I've also been told the way I carry myself stands out - lots of taller-than-average women I know (as in 5"5 or over) stoop, as if they're self conscious about it, whereas I'm perfectly comfortable with my height/body in general and have always walked tall with my head up, as my mum taught me to do when younger. So that might be another thing that makes me noticeable. Other women have criticised me for this as "men won't like you if you're too confident" but my argument would be that I don't really want anything to do with someone who's intimidated by confident attitude or body language anyway!

So anyway, no worries, I knew what you meant. And thanks for the advice.

[JaChelle Sugar]

Wow, good on you for smartmouthing that guy! Round of applause for you and women like you who manage to keep your heads and wits when confronted with hate.

[antwan]

I was walking home from the city centre and was passing a traffic jam in the direction I had just come from. Somebody in a red van threw some water - which splashed on the pavement beside me - and screamed "DEVIL WORSHIPPING SLUT!" I whipped round to confront the driver of the van who was glaring at me with genuine hate in his eyes. His wife and young daughter - about 12 or 13 - were in the van with him, and that's when I noticed a halo sticker underneath the driver's window. I guessed he probably wouldn't have had the balls to do that on foot, so I decided to take advantage of the rush hour jam to see if we could have a constructive discussion.

ME: "You talking to me?"

HIM: "Yeah!"

ME: "What makes you assume I'm a devil worshipper?"

HIM: "Because you're dressed like a goth." (Today I'm wearing a black hooded jumper, blue jeans and black boots, along with a spiky choker. I also had black eye make-up on, red lipstick and black nail varnish. I have a ring through my bottom lip and short black spiky hair).

ME: "It's a free country and I'll wear whatever I feel comfortable in, thanks. Also, if you're going to judge a book by its cover, would you mind using the correct insult? I'm a punk rocker, not a goth. And goth isn't the same thing as devil worshipper - one's a style/music genre, the other is a religion. As a punk, I don't worship anybody - I do what I want as long as it harms no one else, but I'm ultimately a law unto myself."

HIM (really aggressively): Well I'm JUDGING you! Don't tell me how to practise my religion!

ME: What's your religion where you get to dictate how people dress and chuck water at them? Do you keep a supply to chuck at people you don't like the look of? How mature of you - that really proves your superiority to me, doesn't it. And why does how I dress affect you?

HIM: I'm a Christian and God tells me when people have got an aura of death and evil about them.

ME: Yeah, course. Knock on the door of any psychiatric hospital in the UK and tell them that. They won't even let you home for your toothbrush!

HIM: Anything else to say?

ME: Just that Jesus Christ - who your religion is named after - said NOT to judge people. So you've fucked up all round, haven't you. I suspect the God you think is talking to you actually sounds like Satan roaming the world in one of his many guises, so if anyone's a devil worshipper it's you."

At that point, the traffic got moving again and he yelled as he drove off, "I WILL see you again!" I shouted back "Wow! Like I'm REALLY quaking!" to which he gave me the finger. It had felt good talking back to him, but I'm slightly disconcerted at how much he hated me without knowing me. Honestly, the amount of anger you can invoke in some people just by your clothing/taste in music/haircut or whatever is unbelievable. It reminded me of animals in the wild who if they don't understand something, they just throw a rock at it. And the best bit was, the wife put her arms round her daughter's head to shield her eyes and ears from the exchange that took place between me and Headship, but she didn't mind the girl witnessing her dad throwing water at me like a spoilt kid who didn't get his own way. Throughout the conversation, the wife spoke only to say "Yeah!" in response to her husband's insults like a faithful helpmeet. No mind of her own at all. I was tempted to offer her my sympathies over her choice of husband but didn't think she'd appreciate it.

And maybe I could have avoided it all by ignoring him, but he was my first proper fundie I've really met - apart from the local vicar when I was a kid who was a positive pussycat in comparison to this nutter today. I wanted to understand why he thought the way he did, but just got a load of Christianese parroted at me. Still, at least I was open minded enough to try, and didn't prejudge him the way he did me.

I am a Christian, and I assure you, I'm APPALLED at how these people treated you. I'm not even sure "fundie" is the right term for this man. I'm thinking Westboro Baptist (or for those who are old enough, the kid who was on Oprah, years ago, who was taught to take his bible to school and call girls whore mongers, etc.) These people do NOT represent Jesus Christ, nor do they represent Christianity. But they CLAIM to, and do immeasurable damage in the process.

I attend a large, non-denominational church. Our doors are open to all. We do not try to "sell" Christianity, and would never suggest that anyone was unwelcome because they looked (or even thought) differently than we, as a body of believers, do. The drummer in our band does not look like the "typical" person in our church. His head is shaved, he has piercings and a goatee, and he is tatooed over most of his body, including up the back of his neck and onto the top of his scalp. I love that he is among us, and that he feels at home with us. Jesus would have gladly welcomed him, and we should do no less. We are no more "worthy" than he is. You are no less valuable than that man and his family. Why, oh WHY do some people think they have the right to assault, verbally abuse, and degrade others? Really, I'm horrified that you were so cruelly treated. That man does NOT represent the heart and mind of most Christians, not even most fundie, legalistic Christians. He was just plain UGLY. :cry:

[Arete]

It also sounds like this dude could have been very drunk or high. I have certainly known misogynists, but none of them throw things at women in public in the middle of the day, no matter how much they despise them. Ditto with extremely judgmental and legalistic Christian men. This is a straight up out of control, violent asshole, and the woman and child with him are probably regular targets for his rage. You did right to report this to the police.

[Rescinded and Mended]

moodygirl86, I am so sorry this happened to you. No one has the right to judge you on the basis of your appearance, especially to the degree where said person believed he had the right to attack you. I will echo 16strong's sentiment and am just grateful he didn't hit you with anything stronger, like acid. I hope the guy is caught and arrested before he can do this or worse to anyone else. I'm glad you told him off. It might be too much to expect that he learned to behave better in the future, but at least he knows now that there are people like you who aren't willing to simply roll over and take it. Kudos to you!

And I think crazyforkate is right, this definitely calls for cake.

[moodygirl86]

Thanks everybody!

Antwan, you're a true Christian, and your church clearly embraces and respects the fact that we are all different. Also, I want to steal your drummer for my band, lol!

R&M, what a beautiful cake! Hello Kitty is so cute, and I love her punk choker and skull ribbon!

[samurai_sarah]

Sorry that happened to you, but good for you, for standing up to him! Whether Christian or not, that's just rude. It shows a complete lack of manners and basic respect. Most of us learn by age 3 that throwing stuff at others is unacceptable!

So, well done you! Keep it up. :)

[moodygirl86]

Sorry that happened to you, but good for you, for standing up to him! Whether Christian or not, that's just rude. It shows a complete lack of manners and basic respect. Most of us learn by age 3 that throwing stuff at others is unacceptable!

So, well done you! Keep it up. :)

Cheers Sarah! And I'm sure if it had been the other way round, he'd have called his old friend Percy Kewshun!