The Truth About Ruth - Part 3

[SoybeanQueen]

I've seen this mentioned several times in several threads about her ex-husband having custody of all of the kids, so I just want to point it out again, in its own post, so it doesn't get lost among other drama.

If he legally adopted the children, it does not matter one iota in the eyes of the law if he is their biological father. He is their father in every legal sense of the word once the adoption takes place. Their biological father had to have relinquished his rights or have had them revoked in order for the adoption to take place. In many states, the birth certificate is even altered to rename the father (not saying that is right, but that's a whole other thread topic!). By looking at birth certificates, you would never know which of my children were adopted and which were not. Legally, same thing.

He's their father. Hence, he was able to get custody. Full stop.

[previously]

You probably have to make another donation to be a team member ;)

On a serious note, I am sorry you lost the money.

:clap:

[Minerva]

Oh FFS! Is this a SNARK site or isn't it? I cannot believe oil is being asked to be "kinder". Speaking for myself, part of the reason I like this site is it appeals to my inner bitchiness.

Let oil be oil. Has she ever asked anyone to change the way they write? If you don't like her, block her.

People are called out for being mean all the time (see the fat-phobia discussions, for instance). Not everyone likes it, but it certainly happens. Furthermore, if we're going to let oil be oil, we should apply the same to people who get pissed off when they're called stupid and openly mocked.

Also, for better or for worse, when posters try to derail discussions by posting inflammatory comments for the sake of posting inflammatory comments, they get jumped on around here. Some will tell you that this is an effective way to guard against trolls while maintaining the board's free speech policy, while others will tell you that it only feeds the trolls. But that is typically what happens.

[Lainey]

You probably have to make another donation to be a team member ;)

On a serious note, I am sorry you lost the money.

Probably! LOL! :lol:

Thanks. I'm just glad it was only $20. :?

[Shirley MacLaine]

Furthermore, if we're going to let oil be oil, we should apply the same to people who get pissed off when they're called stupid and openly mocked.

.

yeah, we're all just being Miley

[Curious]

Sounds like that person on GOMI is feeling a bit stupid and feels the need to blame someone. I would ask why they donated money if they doubted "Ruth's" validity. In my mind it seems pretty stupid to go with something because 2 people on the internets said it was okay. :lol:

Alecto never spoke for all of FJ, and Vyckie sure as hell never did. I first encountered "Ruth" when she started posting on TWoP as "ofduggar" and read her blog from the get go for some time before getting bored with it. I was always skeptical. And she was doubted many a time here in various threads. I never donated but I wouldn't go about calling people who did stupid. Except for maybe that GOMI poster.

I don't recall Alecto ever saying that she verified Ruth's identity and I know she never told any of the other mods/admins, which if she did know her real identity, (which obviously we don't think she could have now) I think would have been out of character for her. So I've looked through her old posts and I've found the following post by her:

http://freejinger.org/forums/viewtopic. ... th#p204456

Ignoring the obvious problems we have in hindsight about Alecto's "always being truthful with us," her post sounds to me like she was relying on Creaky Steel's interaction with Ruth as being her "verification."

I wish Creaky Steel would address this issue with us, but I imagine it's similar to Vyckie's and she talked to her on the phone or via email/chats and since she had no real reason to disbelieve her, she didn't.

[Mustang Sally]

Creaky posted earlier and did, in fact, confirm that her contact with "Ruth" had been over PM or email, and one phone call that didn't really go anywhere. I don't know if it was this thread or the other one in Chatter.

ETA - her post is in Chatter - viewtopic.php?f=10&t=18350&p=590166#p590166

[nerdymama1]

I want to make it clear my helpmeet hat is off for this post. This is my opinion as lilith.

My impression has been that people haven't been dog piled and shut down for questioning Ruth's credibility in the past. What did happen was that people asked for new information, and usually the person with the suspicions didn't have anything new to offer. So people got sick of every Ruth thread devolving into a debate about wether or not she was real, when nobody was bringing any new evidence to the table either way.

As soon as someone came forward with new information they were welcomed and heard, and these mega threads grew.

I think it's important to say this because FJ has a reputation for shutting down dissent and discussion that I think is entirely unfounded. There are few forums as lightly moderated and as truly committed to free speech as FJ.

Maybe now but it wasn't always like that. Someone would say, "How did x, y, or z happen?" and several posters would jump on them and accuse them of bullying and trolling and being fake and I don't even remember what all. I remember some very nasty things were hurled our way by people with nothing to add other than "I know she's real because I know she's real and you are a mean bully for thinking otherwise!" After a time or two of that, people who didn't want to get into a brawl shut up about it or posted their concerns in a very round about way. It seems like most people who seriously doubted RR simply avoided posting on RR threads. Whether it was intended to or not, the defensiveness definitely shut down most of the conversation.

ETA: Someone on GOMI linked to a thread on FJ where someone had brought up the TWOP post where ofDuggar claimed to be pregnant back in 2011. So there was some definite tiptoeing going on then.

[ark]

I love how she says she not ashamed. How do you sleep at night when you know you've stolen thousands of dollars from people through faking a sad story on the internet? Disgusting.

People who can perpetuate these scams have to have no conscience at all. I would not be sleeping and have a perpetually upset stomach.

(Edited for gross grammar)

[Pinkzebra54]

First real entry is up: http://www.truth-about-ruth.com/lets-ra ... d-for-all/

I hopefully will be able to write two more tonight, including an entry that will tie all the identities together. Be patient with me. I am middle-aged and my bifocals are steaming from over-use. But the ball is rolling. Share any link to any entry any place you like and my site is creative commons - use the material however you like, just link back to me.

Brilliant! I just took a look and the information is so comprehensive and well-organized - thank you so much!! I must admit that I felt shocked looking at M/R's real name; don't know why - it just made everything so legitimate. And then seeing "her" picture - well, I'm feeling very p.o.'d that we were taken for a ride.

Yes, I'm one of the bigger donors and I really felt that I was helping a lost soul start a new life. Having you and the others put so much thought and time into uncovering this helps reduce the sting. Thanks again. (Insert "blowing kisses" emoticon).

[Curious]

:violin:

ETA: She deleted ALL of the comments on her "A Plea" post. Guess the scrubbing has begun.

As is my habit, I have about 40 tabs open and one of them happens to be the "A Plea" post. The comments have all been saved up to the point I last refreshed the page before I went to bed.

[Lainey]

I must be a right bitch, because I don't care if she's "sick." Sometimes people do bad things not because they're sick, but because they're bad people with no conscience. I'm not sure why everyone insists that if someone does something wrong, they must be sick.

[Curious]

Pelargonium posted this on the GOMI thread:

ETA: Anyone think this could be? I hate to think so; it was Creaky Steel's vouching for "Ruth" that really gave me pause. I'd hate to think she's just another of Our Lady of Perpetual Hardship's many personalities.

We have done a little checking on this and have no reason to think CS is anyone other than who she has always claimed to be. Her ip does not resolve to anywhere near any of the RR stuff and does resolve to where she claims to live. Her story has always been consistent (HA..the word I was looking for yesterday finally comes to me!).

We haven't done a massive investigation, but my PERSONAL feeling is she likely talked to RR on the phone or via email or chat and since she had no reason to disbelieve her she didn't.

I do wish she would address the issue though because her silence makes her look guilty, even if she's not, I fear.

[Lainey]

She did, Curious. On the Chatter thread. Mustang Sally linked to it up there somewhere^.

[KitCatCadillac]

Well, I've been obsessively following the Ruth threads for days and days, but now I can say I'm officially lost. At this point, anything beyond "Razing Ruth is a scam" and my brain just starts making obnoxious farting noises.

[thoughtful]

I never read Ruth's blog, or closely followed the threads about her, and, when people start repetitive bickering, IRL or online, I tend to leave. So I don't have an accurate memory of the arguments about whether Ruth was fake or real.

But the fact that people keep repeating that it was the people who believed her who got mean is . . . I'm having a hard time coming up with a word . . .interesting? Unusual?

Most of the "mean girls" stuff I remember from Yuku and the early years here were people leaping down others' throats for not being mean or suspicious or tough enough. The Meanies seemed to always be the people screaming "Troll!" and assuming people were fake or lying.

And I don't know why I even feel the need to post about it -- it just intrigued me.

edited for riffles

[Shirley MacLaine]

Well, I've been obsessively following the Ruth threads for days and days, but now I can say I'm officially lost. At this point, anything beyond "Razing Ruth is a scam" and my brain just starts making obnoxious farting noises.

ahahahahaha

keeping up with the threads is helping me right my sleeping schedule... I'm so effing tired but it's helping me hang in there

[Curious]

I totally agree.

I normally agree with this and am not fond of it. I think in this case, it was used as a "tell" for people to know they had found the right information since we are not allowing the posting of names and her facebook has her real name (including in the link). I'm not saying there weren't other things that could have been used, it's just the feeling I get for why that started.

Apparently, it did lead to a useful conversation about bras for some members, so I guess it wasn't all bad ;) FJ where thread drift is legendary.

[Melissa19128]

For those whose heads are spinning reading these threads, this blog breaks the whole thing down rather nicely:

http://www.truth-about-ruth.com/

[Curious]

I'm questioning whether RR has really not been here since July 5th as her IP address indicates to the admins. Based on her latest post apologizing to FJ she obviously has some inkling that the jig is up. Therefore, she either found out herself by reading here or heard the news on another board. Either way, I would find it very hard to believe she wouldn't be following this thread like a hawk. If she's scrubbing her posts she is obviously getting the information from somewhere about "how" to scrub them so that they look more authentic and everyone here has basically outline all of her inconsistencies for her. Is it a possibility that she is still reading here under another username?

Maybe she found out because her friend, Calladus, has been here? Just a wild guess. If one of my friends suddenly said "soooo I see that yet again you are being accused of running a scam and they don't seem to be insane like the Gosselin fans," that would probably be an indicator to me that shit has hit the fan.

Just guessing there though.

Believe me, we are watching things much (much much much) closer than normal and we have NO reason to believe that there are any socks at this time. Let's face it, she obviously wasn't using any proxies, so we have no reason to think she set up a sock under any proxies either. If you can't be bothered to proxy your "main" persona, you probably aren't going to be assed to do it with others. No one is going to be searching for the other ones trying to out you if they think you are fake. They are going to be researching the person they actually think is the fake. That is the one you need to be hiding.

We will continue to have "stepped up" procedures for the forseeable future.

[Minerva]

Maybe she found out because her friend, Calladus, has been here? Just a wild guess. If one of my friends suddenly said "soooo I see that yet again you are being accused of running a scam and they don't seem to be insane like the Gosselin fans," that would probably be an indicator to me that shit has hit the fan.

Just guessing there though.

Believe me, we are watching things much (much much much) closer than normal and we have NO reason to believe that there are any socks at this time. Let's face it, she obviously wasn't using any proxies, so we have no reason to think she set up a sock under any proxies either. If you can't be bothered to proxy your "main" persona, you probably aren't going to be assed to do it with others. No one is going to be searching for the other ones trying to out you if they think you are fake. They are going to be researching the person they actually think is the fake. That is the one you need to be hiding.

We will continue to have "stepped up" procedures for the forseeable future.

What if RR has a sock on FJ that she's just been hiding by using a different computer than her own? Like a library computer or something?

[Curious]

I'm trying really hard to figure out what she hopes to gain by deleting the blog. It's copied so not to hide her tracks, she is not so naive as to not know twebs are forever.

To appear 'oh poor me,' to her supporters? Look what the bullies did to me.

Really can't figure it out.

She sounds like a moderator of a forum. Not somebody talking about themselves or their life. Oh wait because she is not :lol:

It would make more sense to say. 'I am going to remove some of the comments from my last post because etc.'

Just me? Or does it read that way to anybody else?

I haven't said this previously because I didn't want to give her ideas, but it's clear she doesn't really learn from past mistakes so I'm going to go ahead and say it anyway.

She was outed by IPs during the Penn Mommy scheme, but made no effort to mask her IP here. I suspect that she is pulling the posts because they were not quite as organized during the reveal of the Penn Mommy thing and they didn't have backups of everything, so she was able to delete things and have them disappear. Since the blog isn't indexed no one can go back and find those entries (in her mind). The Penn Mommy stuff is pretty hard to find. There are a few quotes buried on other blogs that come from people that happened to have their google readers open, but mostly that stuff has been erased.

She probably doesn't realize that we are actually organized here. I think she never really spent much time on FJ or on RR. She logged in, posted her tale of woe and then forgot about Ruth until it was time to dust her off for another round of sympathy. Part of her problem during the Penn Mommy thing was she was too invested. She posted TOO much, she had too many socks and there were too many writing samples to compare.

So she changed up some of the things she did, probably the things that in her mind got her caught, but not the "hard evidence" type stuff.

This is just the feeling I have gotten from doing a metric shitton of reading about this stuff over the last few days.

[Curious]

Does anyone have treemom's RL email? SHE should be asking for a refund!

TM is on vacay, but I can get in touch with her.

[previously]

I haven't said this previously because I didn't want to give her ideas, but it's clear she doesn't really learn from past mistakes so I'm going to go ahead and say it anyway.

She was outed by IPs during the Penn Mommy scheme, but made no effort to mask her IP here. I suspect that she is pulling the posts because they were not quite as organized during the reveal of the Penn Mommy thing and they didn't have backups of everything, so she was able to delete things and have them disappear. Since the blog isn't indexed no one can go back and find those entries (in her mind). The Penn Mommy stuff is pretty hard to find. There are a few quotes buried on other blogs that come from people that happened to have their google readers open, but mostly that stuff has been erased.

She probably doesn't realize that we are actually organized here. I think she never really spent much time on FJ or on RR. She logged in, posted her tale of woe and then forgot about Ruth until it was time to dust her off for another round of sympathy. Part of her problem during the Penn Mommy thing was she was too invested. She posted TOO much, she had too many socks and there were too many writing samples to compare.

So she changed up some of the things she did, probably the things that in her mind got her caught, but not the "hard evidence" type stuff.

This is just the feeling I have gotten from doing a metric shitton of reading about this stuff over the last few days.

That makes a lot of sense, Curious. Did she make money during the Penn Mommy stuff?

[Curious]

She also deleted the post about her father's death.

It doesn't do her much good to edit her father's death or the details around Rachel's story because she's posted about them here, herself. She can't delete or edit those posts.