Church Prays for Deceased Baby for 15hrs B4 Calling 911

[Joan of Snarc]

Found an interesting post by Sean Morris, asking for guidance (or maybe just affirmation?) on the 'biblical premise' that women must not wear pants. So, even just three years ago, the Church of Wells senior pastor and leader hadn't yet fully shaped his doctrine on "the sisters" wearing pants in his church.

It's very long, so I excerpted just the primary paragraphs for background to Sean's question.

No! Say it ain't so! This bunch write a long, windy justification for some kind of bullshit? Can't be....

:orly:

[byHisgrace58]

guess spell-check must be an abomination also.

[apple1]

I shudder to think what will be wrought by the hand of these sociopaths.

THAT. As I said earlier in this thread, David Koresh and Jim Jones sounded more normal in their earlier days. The whole thing is very concerning. I so hope that byHisgrace's family, as well as other families, can somehow extricate themselves from this mess before even more tragic events occur.

[gulag]

They don't think women have different looking pants than men? Have they BEEN to a clothing store? No, scrap that: have they ever even walked down the street?

Oh, they addressed that. A convincing(?) argument in about 1,000 words.

What About Culture on Designed Gender Distinction?

For centuries in our culture, the unique male garment, which was public and constant, for the purpose of distinction, was the pants or trousers. The woman distinguished herself from the man with the skirt or dress. When women began wearing pants or trousers, the distinction was not replaced, but removed. Women began wearing pants at the expense of the distinction, not for distinction.

For arguments sake, let's say that now both men and women both wore pants, like we are saying that in Old Testament Israel, they both wore robes. Some would argue that since they both wore robes, we can both wear pants. That makes some sense at first glance. However, the point of Deuteronomy 22:5 was that there was a male-only robe that was distinct from a female-only robe. The woman would not put on the man's robe and the man would not put on the woman's robe. This did not relate to size differences or even fit (tightness or looseness), but some clear, public, designed distinctions that made them purposefully different. That has not occurred with pants. The point of pants was to remove the distinction.

Our culture has not replaced the distinct female garment, the dress, with a new one, pants. Men wear pants. Now women wear pants. Some will say, "But women wear women's pants." But no distinctions have been designed in women's pants for the purposes of obeying God's requirement in Deuteronomy 22:5. We haven't said as a culture or as Christians, "Well, women's pants shall always have the zipper on the side." Or, "Women's pants must always be of a pastel color and men's pants must always be either dark brown, blue, or black." We have made no distinctions between the two. Sure, women will wear pants that are more feminine looking---in color, in embroidery, or unfortunately in tightness---but these are not designed distinctions. Women can and do wear pants the same color, material, embroidery, and sewing as men.

Again, the point of pants on women was to remove the distinction. This attacked the image of God in men. This attacked God's design. That's why the person who does so is an abomination to God. It is a personal insult to God. This should be a serious issue to Christians. It should be about God and not about fitting in with the world.

No great surprise - patriarchal Christians have all the answer to everything when it comes to their privilege.

Never mind the culture and fashion of the day in Ptolemaic Egypt and Israel in 100 BC. A trifling detail; really, it was all about setting the stage for contemporary Christian doctrine.

~~

From an Indiana evangelical church newsletter:

Kokomo Christian Fellowship - Senior Pastor Monthly Newsletter - May 2010. Pastor Nicky Farmer

"Brother Ryan Ringnald, one of three young men of God from Texas shared his personal testimony with us, describing how the Lord saved him out of a religious background, even to the extent of being persecuted for his religion and going on a missions trip to a foreign country, yet the Holy Spirit was not in him, and as such he was “none of His†(Rom. 8). It has been such an encouragement to meet these three young men of God and we do hope that the Lord might bring them back to Kokomo for another visit in the future."

And here's Ryan Ringwald tossin' the disc in happier times.

Baylor University Lariat - Disc golf gaining fans

Rattling chains is music to any disc golf lover's ears. The sound signals to the player the disc made it in the basket -- hole completed.

"You look at the goal and assess what kind of disc you need," Raley said. "It's a lot more than just throwing a Frisbee."

Disc golf is quickly gaining popularity with college students. This fall, Baylor added the sport as an intramural.

"The feeling you get after 18 holes (of disc golf) is comparable to watching someone you love succeed in life," Ryan Ringnald, a Fort Worth sophomore, said.

Disc golf is popular among young people because anyone can play, regardless of his or her athletic capabilities. The game only requires accuracy and a swift glide of the hand.

According to Ringnald, disc golf also doesn't carry the stuffy reputation of polo shirts and khakis often associated with traditional golf.

"Disc golf at the end of the day, is more of a hippy sport," Raley said. "You can wear what you want."

Fort Worth sophomore Ryan Ringnald flings a Frisbee into the goal Tuesday afternoon at Cameron Park.

Wow, that's really profound - playing frisbee is so good, it's like watching someone you love succeed in life. And that, my friends, is about as cheap as it gets.

Ryan was a competitive tennis player, nationally ranked. His sister was Miss Forth Worth Teen USA.

Cousin Lance Ringwald was a US Team gymnast.

What happened to Ryan??

[gulag]

"We're Going to the Scaffold"

We’re going to the scaffold

We’re marching to our song

We’re going to the gallows

We’re marching side by side

For we’ve tasted of our sentence

As we press toward glory land

When crucified we shall be

Our life in Christ we’ll heed

O, worthy is the Lamb

To serve Him in our death

Let billows come o’er our heads

Let fires of perils be had!

To resist the devil’s advance

We’ll walk in Christ alone!

Let God to the glory be

In the cross our boasting we!

Till our lives be wrought in Thee

Till dying our joy shall bring!

Till glory’s shores our eyes shall see

Till we’ll sing to our Great King!

By Cory McLaughlin.

This guy:

HcMDT4iJ_UU

An interesting piece of artwork (?) by one of the church members. Seems to go with the song. I think those are little dead people stick figures...

[ladyamylynn]

God, his hairline. I can't even...

[gulag]

God, his hairline. I can't even...

Well...it's Godly?... Kind of a reverse monk's tonsure, maybe? A modified NBA basketball star haircut - less worldly, more 'big boy'?

Interesting stuff, that early male pattern baldness...that one little chunk is tenacious.

[byHisgrace58]

So I guess my camo pants and snake boots are really unacceptable? And wearing jeans and capris to church? Wow!

[byHisgrace58]

Ok, I have been keeping up with the Rick Ross forum and it seems the group is getting permission to preach on a local college campus. If you guys get a chance. Could you read and possibly offer advice? The students seem to be getting some pretty wise counsel from someone name corboy. I want to comment but am still feeling the sting of condemnation...

[apple1]

Ok, I have been keeping up with the Rick Ross forum and it seems the group is getting permission to preach on a local college campus. If you guys get a chance. Could you read and possibly offer advice? The students seem to be getting some pretty wise counsel from someone name corboy. I want to comment but am still feeling the sting of condemnation...

I went to that forum and read the postings.

I agree with those who said do not engage. I doubt that they will be effective with 99.99% of those who hear them. Most people react negatively to being screamed at, and even more negatively to being screamed at with the you're-going-to-hell message. Aside: Back when (MANY years ago) I was in college, there were always those who came on campus with the screaming-you're-going-to-hell stuff. I walked the long way around to avoid them if at all possible, and as a Christian I found myself extremely embarrassed by that kind of (IMO) misrepresentation of my faith.

I imagine this will become another video posted on the website. I cannot imagine the thought process that finds a purpose in these activities, or a purpose in putting the video up.

One can only hope that none will fall prey to their brainwashing.

[byHisgrace58]

A lady just came up to me at church and told me she had seen a documentary about cults that included The Church of Wells. I have searched and googled and bing'd and find NOTHING! If anyone sees or finds anything, please let me know.

[gulag]

PHILADELPHIA (AP) — A fundamentalist Christian couple who relied on prayer to cure their dying toddler must take their remaining children for medical checkups as part of their sentence in the boy’s death, a judge ruled Wednesday.

Herbert and Catherine Schaible, who belong to First Century Gospel Church in Philadelphia, previously were convicted of involuntary manslaughter and child endangerment in the pneumonia death of their 2-year-old son, Kent.

Common Pleas Court Judge Carolyn Engel Temin said that, as adults, the couple is entitled to follow church teachings shunning medicine, which is seen as a lack of faith in God.

But the law says parents may not make that decision for their children.

“The welfare of the child is more important than the religious freedom of the parents,†Judge Temin said.

Read more: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/201 ... z2Rng5CiDD

This time, the little boy's name was Brandon. He was 8 months old when he died in his home Thursday after days of labored breathing, fitful sleep, crying, and diarrhea, a prosecutor said.

"When you were asked by police why you didn't call a doctor, you both responded, separately, with the same answer," Common Pleas Court Judge Benjamin Lerner said during a probation-violation hearing, referring to sealed statements the couple made to police.

"Because we believe God wants us to ask him for healing," Lerner quoted from the statements.

It is unclear from Glackin's comments and court records how often probation officers saw the children.

At the 2011 sentencing, Assistant District Attorney Pescatore requested close monitoring of the family, since the parents told an investigator that they would make the same decision if another of their children had become ill.

On Monday, she said that's exactly what happened.

"We're back here again," she said, "and another child is dead."

http://articles.philly.com/2013-04-23/n ... t-schaible

FJ topic - Praying your child to death/Violates Probation (Merged)

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=17083

[byHisgrace58]

Makes me absolutely sick in spirit...

[gulag]

The church's pastor said in 2010 that the couple had never received medical care themselves beyond the help of a lay midwife who attends home births.

The Schaibles did take their children for medical checkups as required by their probation, according to Jayaraman, the defense attorney. Jayaraman said that Brandon was checked by a doctor when he was 10 days old, but she did not know whether the child had seen a doctor since.

"Nobody argues that these aren't very loving, nurturing parents," she said Tuesday. "Whether their religion had anything to do with the death of their baby, we don't know."

[byHisgrace58]

An RN just commented on the blog post "The Death of Faith" on Liberty for Captives. Good word.

Also, I haven't posted on the Rick Ross forum in months and put something up on Wednesday. It was removed pretty quickly. I must have hit a nerve with someone. I almost feel honored...:)

[gulag]

Also, I haven't posted on the Rick Ross forum in months and put something up on Wednesday. It was removed pretty quickly. I must have hit a nerve with someone. I almost feel honored...:)

I saw that! Not to dis the very religious-sounding family members, but I can't help but notice that Rick Ross is allowing only those types of comments. Comments that questioned or went a little deeper or talked about Church of Wells leaders/motivation were removed or commentors banned. Huh. Interesting and weird. I don't know what to make of that. Do you think Sean Morris and Cory threatened Rick Ross with a lawsuit? Or the 50-page paper scared him?

[byHisgrace58]

Who knows!? It only takes one person complaining and they remove it and/or them. It just proved to me how biased it is.

On another note, an old friend is working at SFA in Nacogdoches where they are doing their preaching. She said they are drawing crowds but it is groups who are rebuking their message. She said the campus police are keeping a pretty close eye on them. They seem to be stationed right outside her building and she told me you can hear them screaming. Such a sad sad thing...

[gulag]

They made campus news: Controversial evangelist group sparks conversation

http://www.thepinelog.com/controversial ... YW8XqKeZlc

"it's pretty scary too...especially with the crowds stopping to see what's going on"

yBqFugN67FE

These young college students at SFA are defending their right to speak. Even though what they're doing is annoying and disruptive. Gotta admire that.

Comments from YouTube:

Eric Corriz 1 week ago

This comment has received too many negative votes

Praise the Lord.

Blessed are they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. Blessed are ye, when men shall revile you, and persecute you, and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake. Rejoice, and be exceeding glad: for great is your reward in heaven: for so persecuted they the prophets which were before you.

(Matthew 5:10-12)

Kristie, you should visit the Web Page of this Church. TheChurchofWells . com

chuckles1954 2 weeks ago

They are not preachers. They are a cult like Westbury Baptists. They preach that they have the only church going to heaven. Anybody that listens for 5 minutes and knows anything about the Bible could figure this out. They have a few students taking 1-2 courses so they can stay on campus. Otherwise they would get trespassing. If they don't stop, they will be removed and won't be able to go to ANY college. Want to preach,..Go to the beer joints.

[byHisgrace58]

Eric Corriz, who commented on YouTube, is a member. Wish these kids who are commenting knew they were only feeding the group's persecution complex...

[byHisgrace58]

Gulag, can you send me the link to that video, please?

[apple1]

An RN just commented on the blog post "The Death of Faith" on Liberty for Captives. Good word.

Also, I haven't posted on the Rick Ross forum in months and put something up on Wednesday. It was removed pretty quickly. I must have hit a nerve with someone. I almost feel honored...:)

Wow.

Your family continues to be in my thoughts and prayers.

[byHisgrace58]

A sermon that's 3 hrs and 47 minutes about fear. How sad...

[gulag]

New written comment:

• What must I do to be saved? Saved from what? What is it you wish to be saved from? Hell? That proves nothing. Nobody wants to go there. The issue between God and man is SIN. Do you wish to be saved from it?
  
  What is sin? Sin is a species of rebellion against God. It is self-pleasing: it is the utter ignoring of God’s claims: being completely indifferent whether my conduct pleases or displeases Him.
  
  Before God saves a man He convicts him of his sinnership. By this I do not mean that he says with everybody else, “O yes we are all sinners, I know that.†Rather do I mean that the Holy Spirit makes me feel in my heart that I have been a life-long rebel against God, and that my sins are so many, so great, so black, that I fear that I have transgressed beyond the reach of Divine mercy.
  
  Have you ever had that experience? Have you seen yourself to be totally unfit for heaven? For the presence of a Holy God? Do you now perceive that there is no good thing in you, nothing good credited to your account, that all the way through you have loved the things God hates and hated the things God loves?
  
  Has the realization of this broken your heart before God? Has it made you mourn that you have so despised His Sabbaths, neglected His Word, and given Him no real place at all in your thoughts, affections and life? If you have not yet seen and felt this personally, then at present there is no hope for you, for God says, “Except ye repent, ye shall all likewise perish†— Luke 13:3. And if you die in your present condition you will be lost forever.
  
  But if you have been brought to the place where sin is your greatest plague, where offending God is your greatest grief, and where your deepest desire is now to please and honor Him; then there is hope for you. “The Son of man came to seek and to save that which was lost†— Luke 19:10. And He will save you providing you are ready and willing to throw down the weapons of your warfare against Him, bow to His Lordship, and surrender yourself to His control.

Ah. I see. Apparently The Big Question is not about going to hell. "That proves nothing. Nobody wants to go there. The issue between God and man is SIN."

I didn't know we were in the business of "proving" something.

"The issue between God and man..." - Didn't know there was an issue.

This part is just crazy. Doesn't make even a tiny bit of sense. I have not the slightest clue what this man is saying or what he means to express:

• Before God saves a man He convicts him of his sinnership. By this I do not mean that he says with everybody else, “O yes we are all sinners, I know that.†Rather do I mean that the Holy Spirit makes me feel in my heart that I have been a life-long rebel against God, and that my sins are so many, so great, so black, that I fear that I have transgressed beyond the reach of Divine mercy.

Nope, doesn't sound like he draws much comfort from his God or his spirituality. Have we had this experience and feeling, he asks? No, I can honestly say I have not.

It makes me wonder if this man has done something really really really bad in his lifetime - that no one knows about, that he got away with - that has worn a hole in his soul and made him genuinely nutso.

[gulag]

A sermon that's 3 hrs and 47 minutes about fear. How sad...

I listened to "Who Would Die Without God." Just wow. Hugo Chavez, Gaddafi, a female journalist that he never identified but twice name-dropped, saying his dad knows her. A Yahoo article. Mispronunciation throughout. A really crude juvenile understanding of world events and leadership.

I don't know what the point of the sermon was.

[byHisgrace58]

Be afraid...be very afraid. The whole premise of their preaching. And yet, the series (totaling almost 18 hrs so far) starts out about perfect love and ends with worthiness.

I am just relieved that I am not responsible for judging others. And, after a bad day, others should be glad that I don't make those kinds of calls!! Kind of like the article I read, "God called and wants His job back."