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      Guest Speaker 1.26.17 @ 8pm eastern   01/22/2017

      I am pleased to announce that we have are going to have a Q&A with an ex-evangelical on Thurs, January 26, 2017 @ 8pm.  The Q&A will last for approximately 1 hour.  I will be setting up a subforum for guest speakers as I hope to be able to get some other folks come talk to us. Our guest on Thurs will be Chris Stroop.  Here is his bio: Christopher Stroop grew up a rank-and-file member of the Christian Right in an Evangelical enclave community, Stroop's childhood social milieu consisting mostly of family and people associated with church and/or Christian school. From about the age of 16, Stroop found himself dealing with an increasingly acute crisis of faith that was not addressed properly by the people he talked to about it, and he was subjected to spiritual abuse. Stroop nevertheless went on to earn a BA in history and German from Ball State University (summa cum laude) in 2003, and then a Ph.D. in modern Russian History and Interdisciplinary Studies in the Humanities from Stanford in 2012. Subsequently, Stroop spent three academic years teaching in the School of Public Policy at the Russian Presidential Academy of National Economy and Public Administration in Moscow, where he kind of sort of almost got in trouble for "teaching Pussy Riot lyrics." Currently, Stroop teaches nineteenth-century European history and Russian Studies classes as a Provost's Postdoctoral Scholar at the University of South Florida and, as a freelance writer and public speaker, speaks out against the abuses of conservative Christianity in general and the the white Evangelical subculture he comes from in particular. You can find many of his writings in this vein on Religion Dispatches. If you would like to support this work financially, please click here (for monthly support) or here (to leave a one-time gift). Stroop's more academic writings can mostly be found here, and you can follow him on Twitter - @C_Stroop.   We are going to use the Q&A forum format.  I will be setting up a special forum just for Chris.  I will open the forum about 15 minutes before the Q&A starts so you can start asking your questions.   We have a few rules.  Failure to follow these rules will get you temporarily placed in the Prayer Closet so we can preview your posts.  If you get put in the PC during the Q&A you will be released once it's over, but lets just follow the few simple rules so none of that is necessary. Rules for Q&A: 1. Be polite.  This is not an event meant for snark.  Chris is taking time out of his busy schedule to talk to us.  He is an expert in the things we discuss here, so let's give him respect, please. 2. One question per post.   Please don't bog him down with a bunch of questions in one post.  We are using the Q&A format so he can easily answer questions.  Putting a ton of questions in one post defeats the purpose.   You can continue discussion on the thread as he answers and ask another question in the same thread if you have one after he answers. 3. Please try to keep thread drift to a minimum during the Q&A.  After it's over, if you want to continue discussion on the topics  and they drift, that's fine. 4.  Be polite! These rules are subject to change as I and the helpmeets think over possible loopholes (cause there is always one person that has to push boundaries)
HereticHick

Bates Wedding Part 2: Zach N Whitney

847 posts in this topic

I think its time for a new thread. If any one can come up with a better name for it, please do!

 

My predictions:

 

1. Gothard will not attend.

 

2. Entire Duggar clan may not attend, either. Perhaps only a vanful of the older kids? And Josh & Anna drive down from Maryland--in matching togs again.

 

3. Whit won't have a modesty panel sewn into her dress.

 

4. If the Duggars do attend, they will not perform.

 

5. Erin will play piano, however.

 

6. Alyssa will be courting by then.

 

7. Michael(a) will be a bridesmaid

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How about "Bates Wedding Part 2: The Weddening"

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I think its time for a new thread. If any one can come up with a better name for it, please do!

My predictions:

1. Gothard will not attend.

2. Entire Duggar clan may not attend, either. Perhaps only a vanful of the older kids? And Josh & Anna drive down from Maryland--in matching togs again.

3. Whit won't have a modesty panel sewn into her dress.

4. If the Duggars do attend, they will not perform.

5. Erin will play piano, however.

6. Alyssa will be courting by then.

7. Michael(a) will be a bridesmaid

My predictions on your predictions

1. Agree about Gothard. I think Erin's wedding was a big deal because the young couple was so attractive and romantic. Zach and Whit, less so.

2. Not sure I agree about this one. Weddings make good ratings, and the Duggars like to be where the ratings are good.

3. Agree. Wear what you like, Whit!

4. I sure do hope they don't "perform."

5. No problem here if she plays.

6. Agreed. Boy, that must make Jim Bob mad!

7. I don't think she'll be a bridesmaid. If she really was too shy to be in Erin's wedding, why would that change a month later? And if if was all a lie and she wasn't a bridesmaid for other reasons, how would it look if she suddenly overcomes her "shyness" and participates in Zach's wedding?

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I hope she doesn't go for the whole modesty panel/t-shirt style wedding dress, maybe just thick straps/cap sleeves? Or even long sleeves a la Kate Middleton? I can't wait to see what she wears though!

I'm not sure about Michaela being a bridesmaid - I believe Kelly when she says that Michaela doesn't want to be in the spotlight, but if this wedding is more low key she might be okay with it, I guess.

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One would assume that Whit's family is doing more planning than the Bates, so maybe this will be a completely different wedding. Do we know where the wedding is being held or anything?

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One would assume that Whit's family is doing more planning than the Bates, so maybe this will be a completely different wedding. Do we know where the wedding is being held or anything?

I get the sense that the Bates are far more involved than her parents. Maybe it's an issue of money, maybe it's an issue of time.

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One would assume that Whit's family is doing more planning than the Bates, so maybe this will be a completely different wedding. Do we know where the wedding is being held or anything?

Same place as Erin's, IIRC from Kelly's comments. Don't forget, Whitney is a local, so this wouldn't be a big deal.

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Whit's dad is a Baptist minister, right? So we can have a tag team ceremony with him and Gil?

So, Erin as a Matron of Honor (and piano player)? Or maybe no Bates as bridesmaids at all--Whit has a number of siblings, doesn't she?

It will be** interesting** if they don't get a fancy foreign honeymoon like Erin & Chad.

What are the odds of Josh and Anna making it to the ceremony on time? I don't think TLC will film this, so I truly won't be surprised if a subset of Duggars attend.

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Same place as Erin's, IIRC from Kelly's comments. Don't forget, Whitney is a local, so this wouldn't be a big deal.

I knew she was a local, I was just hoping for a nicer fundy venue. :whistle:

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Has Kelly said anything about where they are going to live? It just amazes me how Zack/Josh/Chad go from living free, paying no bills to having to support a household. I wonder what booklet teaches them budgeting. Whit works at sonic. What paying job does Zack have? I know he is county commissioner and a volunteer fireman or first responder? Does he work for the tree service too?

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I, for one, believe Gothard will be in attendance. There are plenty of him to go around afterall :lol:

dummy-heads-used-in-escape-plan

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My predictions:

1) Agree with those who say Gothard will NOT attend. Even though Zach grew up IBLP, Whitney did not, and since typically, the bride side of the family plans the wedding, I highly doubt they will have Gothard.

2) The wedding will be fundie-lite and might have dancing. If no dancing, there is a possibility that Zach and Whit might slow dance

3) Whitney's dress will be modest. On her pinterest page, she has been posting modest wedding gowns.

4) No talk of allowing God to decide their family size or submission

5) Duggars will be in attendance, with a camera crew tagging along to film it. Duggars will talk about how "umm different" it was compared to "most wedding we attend".

6) Food will be provided.

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I don't think Gothard will attend, nor do I think that they will invite as many people.

I do think the Duggars will attend. Zach is apparently close with JD (JD helped Zach deal with with the break-up his previous courtship), and several of the Duggar boys were at that guys weekend recently. JD might even be in the wedding party.

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My prediction is that it will be a full on fundie wedding. Whitney has recently converted to skirts-only, and she's probably excited at the prospect of playing fundie bride/wife right now because it's all fresh and new. She will probably go along with whatever Zach's family suggests. I hope I'm wrong, though.

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My predictions:

1) Agree with those who say Gothard will NOT attend. Even though Zach grew up IBLP, Whitney did not, and since typically, the bride side of the family plans the wedding, I highly doubt they will have Gothard.

2) The wedding will be fundie-lite and might have dancing. If no dancing, there is a possibility that Zach and Whit might slow dance

3) Whitney's dress will be modest. On her pinterest page, she has been posting modest wedding gowns.

4) No talk of allowing God to decide their family size or submission

5) Duggars will be in attendance, with a camera crew tagging along to film it. Duggars will talk about how "umm different" it was compared to "most wedding we attend".

6) Food will be provided.

7) Josh and Anna will be late, but will pose for photos in the parking lot with the bride and groom.

8) Alas, there will be no pirates :cry:

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With them being Gothard and her father being a Baptist minister I am going to absolutely no dancing. Is he SB or IFB?

I think the Duggars will be there. Gothard not so much.

The dress might be less modest but still pretty modest.

Josh and Anna will be late and walk in in the middle of the wedding. Josh will wear jeans and no tie.

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My prediction is that it will be a full on fundie wedding. Whitney has recently converted to skirts-only, and she's probably excited at the prospect of playing fundie bride/wife right now because it's all fresh and new. She will probably go along with whatever Zach's family suggests. I hope I'm wrong, though.

I agree. It seems like Whitney is following the Bates' beliefs more and more.

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I think it will be smaller because Zach's bride is not iblp royalty like erins hubby is. Also, remember Whitney is adopted and was adopted as a teen and I don't know what that implies about her situation. They might have tighter reins on their bio kids who were always raised that way but Whitney works and goes to a real college so she is clearly more independent than a typical fundie bride. I still think it will be a popular event with duggars and a tlc film crew. Since its smaller I'm anticipating people coming together to make some sandwiches and side dishes. One can hope.

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I think it will be a much smaller wedding than Erin & Chad's. They may have timed it so soon afterwards to keep the big crowds away. Maybe they'll allow TLC to film it, for the money. No Gothard, no dancing, some food. Maybe a Duggar or two in the wedding party, especially if TLC is there, but Josh won't be one of them. I've always had the sense that Zach and Josh don't get along.

Has Kelly said anything about where they are going to live? It just amazes me how Zack/Josh/Chad go from living free, paying no bills to having to support a household. I wonder what booklet teaches them budgeting. Whit works at sonic. What paying job does Zack have? I know he is county commissioner and a volunteer fireman or first responder? Does he work for the tree service too?

Good questions...I'm sure Zach expects to be the breadwinner. I don't think he'd be 'allowed' to marry without having a home and income with which to provide. The cost of living must be relatively low there, but he still needs to have a paying job. Could be he's still working with Gil at the tree business. I'd be surprised if Whit continues to work - maybe part-time, but only until she's pregnant (which could be from 5 minutes to a couple of months).

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With them being Gothard and her father being a Baptist minister I am going to absolutely no dancing. Is he SB or IFB?

I think the Duggars will be there. Gothard not so much.

The dress might be less modest but still pretty modest.

Josh and Anna will be late and walk in in the middle of the wedding. Josh will wear jeans and no tie.

I wouldnt be surprised to see the dress "repurposed" for this wedding.

Erin will be pregnant

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I wouldnt be surprised to see the dress "repurposed" for this wedding.

Erin will be pregnant

I hope not.

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I hope not.

Me, too. It may be unrealistic but I hope for each of the newly married couples to wait to begin their families and to space out their pregnancies.

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I am curious to see if Michael is more involved in Zach's wedding. I am convinced there is more than mere shyness going on with her dropping out of Erin's wedding.

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