Chick-fil-A Daddy/Daughter Date Nights

[JenniferJuniper]

(brave newbie's first time post after years of lurking)

I'm not surprised. It's icky, but that's fundie for you.

I boycotted Chik-fil-A about 7-8 years ago after I found out about all of their donations to groups like Focus on the Family. It's just hate thinly disguised as good Christian values. I will not be bought with tasty nuggets!

Welcome!

The concept of a man dating his daughter is creepy to me whether dad is a fundie or not, but knowing Chick-Fil-A's fundamentalist agenda, I don't have much doubt this was created as an attempt to introduce young girls to the culture of paternalism. When they get old enough, another man will romance them with hearts and flowers and replace Daddy as their protector and headship.

This ain't Burger King we're talking about here.

[AmyP]

So you think the term in this context is completely innocuous with no sexual overtones whatsoever, but do you actually believe for a second that Chick-fil-A would arrange “Daddy/Son date night� Would never happen.

Took me a while to even read this topic as the title alone made me slightly nauseous.

I think there is an expectation that mothers and daughters can find many activities to share and likewise fathers and sons. I realize that this is a massive generalization, prone to much error, most likely based on gender roles and all sorts of bias, etc., etc. I'm not advocating this position necessarily, I'm just pointing out that many people believe this. The expectation, inaccurate and flawed as it may well be, is that fathers and sons will bond as they change the oil or enjoy a motorcross event together. These same fathers might be uncomfortable playing barbies or getting a manicure with their daughter. However, the idea of a special lunch or dinner with their little girl probably seems harmless and cute to these hapless fathers who are enslaved by gender roles, and their daughters who don't enjoy motorcross. Hence, the father daughter date idea WHICH PREDATES THE MODERN PATRIARCHY MOVEMENT. I know this because I also predate the modern patriarchy movement and I have know of this idea for a long time.

And by the way, going on a date with your daughter is NOT the same thing as DATING your daughter. For example, if Treemom and I have a lunch date, we are not automatically dating each other (no offence Treemom, I'm sure dating you would be fabulous). No one in their right mind would assume that because two people have set a date to do something special together they must be dating!

While I think the Chik-fil-a thing is a bit tacky, and perhaps not well thought out, I think we all need to let go of our pearls and take a nice deep breath. I don't think that daddy daughter dates at chick-fil-a are a sign that the patriarchal fundy apocolypse is upon us all.

[lilith]

I just asked my eight year old daughter if she would like to go on a date with her step father (who has been her only father figure since she was a pre schooler).

Her answer really sums up why it's icky - " aren't you meant to be going on dates with him? He's not my husband".

Oh, and the graphics on the ad for this event that someone posted upthread show that it's not just nice family fun. Hearts and flowers and colours that we associate with romance and valentines day. If it was a normal kiddy event wouldn't primary colours and clowns or rainbows or something be more appropriate?

[JenniferJuniper]

I think there is an expectation that mothers and daughters can find many activities to share and likewise fathers and sons. I realize that this is a massive generalization, prone to much error, most likely based on gender roles and all sorts of bias, etc., etc. I'm not advocating this position necessarily, I'm just pointing out that many people believe this. The expectation, inaccurate and flawed as it may well be, is that fathers and sons will bond as they change the oil or enjoy a motorcross event together. These same fathers might be uncomfortable playing barbies or getting a manicure with their daughter. However, the idea of a special lunch or dinner with their little girl probably seems harmless and cute to these hapless fathers who are enslaved by gender roles, and their daughters who don't enjoy motorcross. Hence, the father daughter date idea WHICH PREDATES THE MODERN PATRIARCHY MOVEMENT. I know this because I also predate the modern patriarchy movement and I have know of this idea for a long time.

And by the way, going on a date with your daughter is NOT the same thing as DATING your daughter. For example, if Treemom and I have a lunch date, we are not automatically dating each other (no offence Treemom, I'm sure dating you would be fabulous). No one in their right mind would assume that because two people have set a date to do something special together they must be dating!

While I think the Chik-fil-a thing is a bit tacky, and perhaps not well thought out, I think we all need to let go of our pearls and take a nice deep breath. I don't think that daddy daughter dates at chick-fil-a are a sign that the patriarchal fundy apocolypse is upon us all.

The Chik-ees would love nothing more than to kick off a patriarchal apocalypse, that's the point. They make me sick.

As for fathers needing a fast food restaurant to set up a "date" with them and their with daughters because girls don’t play sports and Dads are afraid of Barbie dolls, that simply isn't the 21st century world I live in. At all. Maybe it's a regional thing, but I have 10 year old son and two teenaged daughters and that's not the way things are in my family or our friends' families.

When you go on that date with Treemom, will you make it sweetly romantic, with red hearts and flowers, or will you just go shopping or to a movie and then have lunch? Because if you give her valentines and roses, some people will probably assume you are romantically involved. Not that there's anything wrong with that.

[CanadianHippie]

Oh, and the graphics on the ad for this event that someone posted upthread show that it's not just nice family fun. Hearts and flowers and colours that we associate with romance and valentines day. If it was a normal kiddy event wouldn't primary colours and clowns or rainbows or something be more appropriate?

The part that really got me was "have a special night out".

[Visionoyahweh]

Those graphics are implied incest city. Do not eat at chick-fil-a.

[tropaka]

AmyP - I have called lunches with my children "dates" etc and you are right that in general it's innocuous. What isn't innocuous is the creepy linking of fathers and their daughters with purity etc that exists in some communities. This chain's ownership is actively conservative Christian. If the ad/invite for it wasn't all flowery and valentine-like it would be fine.

I thought I'd posted this upthread but I think it got lost...the whole concept of daughters/sisters "defrauding" their fathers/brothers looks to me like a perfect way to blame victims of incest.

[AmyP]

AmyP - I have called lunches with my children "dates" etc and you are right that in general it's innocuous. What isn't innocuous is the creepy linking of fathers and their daughters with purity etc that exists in some communities. This chain's ownership is actively conservative Christian. If the ad/invite for it wasn't all flowery and valentine-like it would be fine.

I thought I'd posted this upthread but I think it got lost...the whole concept of daughters/sisters "defrauding" their fathers/brothers looks to me like a perfect way to blame victims of incest.

Chick-fil-a is indeed a conservative christian organization, but I see no reason to link the company with patriarchy, the quiverfull movement, courtship, etc. If anyone has direct evidence that the organization is patriarchal and quiverfull I would be very interested to hear it. After all there are plenty of conservative christians in this country that are not partriarchal, fundy, quiverfull, etc. Their daughters wear jeans, date boys, and go to public school. The chick-fil-a people may just be the authors of a particularly tacky promotional scheme, but in the end I bet their main motivation was selling more sandwiches and fries.

[Visionoyahweh]

but in the end I bet their main motivation was selling more sandwiches and fries.

Then why not target the whole family? Why just half?

[lilith]

Then why not target the whole family? Why just half?

I totally agree that their main motive is to sell more sandwiches.

But they are doing it by promoting a particularly repellent idea that they know is attractive to their conservative Christian customer base. A fast food chain using the idea for advertising gives it a level of mainstream endorsement, and probably pulls less conservative families towards to concept by normalising it.

[Visionoyahweh]

Chick-fil-a is indeed a conservative christian organization, but I see no reason to link the company with patriarchy, the quiverfull movement, courtship, etc. If anyone has direct evidence that the organization is patriarchal and quiverfull I would be very interested to hear it. After all there are plenty of conservative christians in this country that are not partriarchal, fundy, quiverfull, etc. Their daughters wear jeans, date boys, and go to public school. The chick-fil-a people may just be the authors of a particularly tacky promotional scheme, but in the end I bet their main motivation was selling more sandwiches and fries.

Chick-Fil-A’s Charitable Arm Gave Nearly $2 Million To Anti-Gay Groups In 2009

WinShape Is Chick-Fil-A’s Charitable Arm. The WinShape Foundation is Chick-fil-A’s charitable arm, created by Chick-fil-A founder and chairman S. Truett Cathy in 1984. WinShape has received a substantial amount of funding from Chick-fil-A: in 2009 alone, WinShape received $7,814,788 from Chick-fil-A Inc. [Winshape 2009 Publicly Available IRS 990 Form via Foundation Center, accessed10/28/11]

WinShape Gave Over $1.7 Million To Anti-Gay Groups. In 2009 alone, WinShape donated $1,733,699 to multiple anti-gay groups:

Marriage & Family Legacy Fund: $994,199

Fellowship Of Christian Athletes: $480,000

National Christian Foundation: $240,000

Focus On The Family: $12,500

Eagle Forum: $5,000

Exodus International: $1,000

Family Research Council: $1,000

[Winshape 2009 Publicly Available IRS 990 Form via Foundation Center, accessed 10/28/11]

Google is your friend.

[Witsec7]

The only reason I wish we had a chick-fil-a locally is so that I could boycott them. And its such a stupid name as well.

[Visionoyahweh]

[AmyP]

Chick-Fil-A’s Charitable Arm Gave Nearly $2 Million To Anti-Gay Groups In 2009

WinShape Is Chick-Fil-A’s Charitable Arm. The WinShape Foundation is Chick-fil-A’s charitable arm, created by Chick-fil-A founder and chairman S. Truett Cathy in 1984. WinShape has received a substantial amount of funding from Chick-fil-A: in 2009 alone, WinShape received $7,814,788 from Chick-fil-A Inc. [Winshape 2009 Publicly Available IRS 990 Form via Foundation Center, accessed10/28/11]

WinShape Gave Over $1.7 Million To Anti-Gay Groups. In 2009 alone, WinShape donated $1,733,699 to multiple anti-gay groups:

Marriage & Family Legacy Fund: $994,199

Fellowship Of Christian Athletes: $480,000

National Christian Foundation: $240,000

Focus On The Family: $12,500

Eagle Forum: $5,000

Exodus International: $1,000

Family Research Council: $1,000

[Winshape 2009 Publicly Available IRS 990 Form via Foundation Center, accessed 10/28/11]

Google is your friend.

So you are saying that since neo-patriarchal quiverful types are anti-gay, and Chick-fil-a seems supports anti-gay organizations, chick-fil-a must be a neo-partriarchal quiverfull organization? Because that is a logical fallacy so huge that even I can identify it! We already established that chik-fil-a is conservative and christian, and you have stunned us all by discovering that they support conservative christian political groups. What does that have to do with patriarchy and pledging your heart to daddy?

[Visionoyahweh]

So you are saying that since neo-patriarchal quiverful types are anti-gay, and Chick-fil-a seems supports anti-gay organizations, chick-fil-a must be a neo-partriarchal quiverfull organization? Because that is a logical fallacy so huge that even I can identify it! We already established that chik-fil-a is conservative and christian, and you have stunned us all by discovering that they support conservative christian political groups. What does that have to do with patriarchy and pledging your heart to daddy?

They also had the Duggars visit their factory....when the kids had chicken pox. Plus they do product placement on 19kac.

You win, I bow to your assholishness. :dance:

[bananacat]

Ok, so some people still use antiquated terms like "lunch date". But how can you see that Valentines and hearts graphic and still claim that this is all innocent? I also hate the general implication that dads and daughters are just sooo different that they need a special event to spend time together because it's not like they could possibly have any interests in common and just be friends.

[Arete]

AmyP,

I have no direct evidence that Chick-Fil-A is directly associated with QF/VF/ATI. However, their involvement with Focus on the Family pings my radar that they are at least fellow travelers around these circles. Vision Forum and ATI are independent organizations with different origins, leadership, etc, but it can't be denied that they overlap and gain leverage when they target things together (i.e. the SAHD philosophy). I also grew up where we had father/daughter and mother/son events at our public school, but this was a time before a lot of dad's realized it was OK to play Barbie's with their girls, and mom's thought the best way to have sons grow to be men was to have them shadow their dads whenever possible. A lot of things have changed.

I don't want to be the woman who cried "Apocalypse, now!", but these people are sneaking into the mainstream, and it it frightens me. Nothing about the C-F-A hearts and flowers ad calms these fears. Not every conservative christian is QF/VF/ATI, absolutely agree. But I suspect C-F-A is capable of multitasking, and can want to make some extra money and advance an agenda at the same time.

[Arete]

Lots of responses since I started writing the above post.

[tropaka]

no one said the chain was Quiverful, did they? They do support some groups that are downright bigoted. It's not necessarily the skirt-wearin', non bc using crowd that's into purity - it's a wider group.

[lilith]

Tried to post pic, but don't know how. Follow link for pic, and feel free to post if you are more tech savvy than me.

[AmyP]

They also had the Duggars visit their factory....when the kids had chicken pox. Plus they do product placement on 19kac.

You win, I bow to your assholishness. :dance:

still not direct evidence of anything but marketing to a huge, receptive target audience. I think anyone can book a tour of the Chick-fil-a factory.

From what I can gather on the internet, Truett Cathy is a member of First Baptist Church, Jonesboro GA. Seems to be a big church that offers a children's ministry, college/young adult group, a preschool, and a state approved kindergarten. Facebook includes images of young people in jeans and shorts enjoying youth group activities. Zhu wouldn't be caught dead in a place like this.

[lilith]

Yet Zsuzsanna used to take her kids to Chick-fil-A before she went all organic because she agreed with their values and wanted to support them.

They market to both mainstream conservative Christians and the fringe, and promoting the ideas of the fringe, like Daddy Daughter Dates, they make them more acceptable to the mainstream.

[AmyP]

no one said the chain was Quiverful, did they? They do support some groups that are downright bigoted. It's not necessarily the skirt-wearin', non bc using crowd that's into purity - it's a wider group.

Perhaps not, but many posts have suggested a fundyesque "let daddy guard your heart/purity type" MOTIVATION for chick-fil-a in this event and have linked it broadly to purity balls and daughters shaving daddies. I do not see any evidence that this motivation is in play here. The concept of a daddy/daughter date is fairly mainstream, and pre-dates the neo-patriarchs. I do think the flowers and romantic valentines day imagery is tacky.

[Witsec7]

CFA had a promotion around Fireproof as well. The lines are blurring.

[JenniferJuniper]

From what I can gather on the internet, Truett Cathy is a member of First Baptist Church, Jonesboro GA. Seems to be a big church that offers a children's ministry, college/young adult group, a preschool, and a state approved kindergarten. Facebook includes images of young people in jeans and shorts enjoying youth group activities. Zhu wouldn't be caught dead in a place like this.

You seem to be under the impression than all patriarchal fundamentalists require their daughters to were frumpers or skirts and not join youth groups. Not so.

In addition to all of the aforementioned associations and anti-gay work, Cathy has been quoted in Forbes Magazine as saying he wants to hire only married workers and believes men who are "sinful" outside of work should be fired.

There's little doubt he's an extremist. And let's face it, you don’t see any other fast food chains closing stores so they can have romantic-styled dates between fathers and daughters.