"Damn immigrants need to learn proper english!"

[holierthanyou]

Since she's brought out sexist and racist hissyfits already, my money is homophobia should hit us next. Any other guesses/bets?

eta: I just looked at her most recent post of the past hour. She really is the stereotype of a fundy, no?

[xReems]

Since she's brought out sexist and racist hissyfits already, my money is homophobia should hit us next. Any other guesses/bets?

eta: I just looked at her most recent post of the past hour. She really is the stereotype of a fundy, no?

Maybe she'll throw a hissyfit over grocery stores who hire adults with Down Syndrome to bag groceries since they take a while and it's cutting away from her precious time. Oh wait, they should be conditioned to bag groceries quicker to avoid problems. That's what she would say.

[fakepigtails73]

I second asking. I have a few friends that physically looks Hispanic but can't speak a word of Spanish. With one couple there tends to be a few second looks as he (who looks Hispanic) can't speak a lick, but she (who is a stereo-typically looking white girl) is fluent.

That reminds me of one of my good friends whose name and surname are Russian and Serbian respectively, due to his father being from Serbia (his Mom is Québécoise). He doesn't speak neither Russian or Serbian, but every week at work someone on the phone when learning his name will start try to converse in either languages. He replies that he does speak 2 languages which are French and English, but not the other ones. fun times! :dance:

The late Tejano singer Selena couldn't speak spanish until her late teens; at the beginning of her career she learned her Spanish lyrics phonetically (I saw her biopic with J.Lo on tv the other day while having too much free time).

[BlackHawk]

That's largely the case, although many English speakers find the Romance languages easier to learn than German, probably because they no longer have cases and English no longer has cases, so the grammar is more similar.

But yes, the person who speaks Italian, Portuguese, Spanish, French, Walloon, Sicilian, Picard, and Catalan has accomplished a very different thing from the person who "only" speaks Russian, Basque, Japanese, and Navajo.

Mind, they both speak more languages than I do, so who am I to judge?

This is always interesting to me. I speak French fluently, but Spanish... I can't learn more than basic elementary Spanish no matter how hard I try. I was however able to learn Basic+ Russian (I can hold a decent conversation, but I'm no where near fluent or even semi fluent) rather easily. I can READ Spanish rather well, but actually saying the words or holding a conversation with someone is really hard for me. I do wonder if it's a mental block sometimes!

I find language fascinating and try to learn as many as I can at least in the basic sense. I fail miserably at this, but it's still fun to pop up with random words that make me realize how much I've retained in my life.

[formergothardite]

Now she's back to posting in other threads like nothing ever happened. Rinse, repeat, redo.

I really don't understand people who do this at all. People can forget and forgive one giant hissy fit, but after that everyone is going to remember that you are the one that wanted those damn immigrants to learn to speak better before they dared to get a job.

[Guest Anonymous]

Maybe she'll throw a hissyfit over grocery stores who hire adults with Down Syndrome to bag groceries since they take a while and it's cutting away from her precious time. Oh wait, they should be conditioned to bag groceries quicker to avoid problems. That's what she would say.

Maybe when will team up with J-watcher, our other resident troll who will be wanting pre-employment sterilisation to be part of the working conditions of those learning disabled adults, before they get allowed in the real world to pack grocery bags and, you know, maybe one day have sex....

[Guest Anonymous]

Since she's brought out sexist and racist hissyfits already, my money is homophobia should hit us next. Any other guesses/bets?

eta: I just looked at her most recent post of the past hour. She really is the stereotype of a fundy, no?

You lose. I actually do have gay friends.

[Guest Anonymous]

She also has a whole bunch of publicly viewable geneology posts and information. Literally, the woman has her entire family tree posted online.

Yes I do, and I even posted the links to where my family tree information is posted. And by having it posted online, I was able to contact the family of my long lost Aunt. Anyway....is there something racists or sexist about being a genealogist?

[NurseNell]

Literally, the woman has her entire family tree posted online.

Strange but true.

There's nothing strange about that. My family tree is on line too, along with thousands of others. I use ancestry.com, all living members in a family tree can only be accessed by the tree owner but everyone who's dead can be viewed. Those of us into genealogy share with one another. Once you back 3 generations you have hundreds of shared ancestors. Get back to colonial times and we almost all share ancestors.

[fakepigtails73]

Absolutely!

As I said, my French reading ability is near-fluent (just had to use it today to read a Quebec court order). Same alphabet, and there is a lot of shared or very similar vocabulary. My reading ability in Hebrew isn't nearly as good, because it's a different alphabet. As well, because of my French knowledge, I was able to travel in Italy, despite the fact that few people spoke English, since I could figure out the basic meaning of things that were written.

Do you really find English easy to learn? I find that other languages tend to have fewer exceptions to the rules. My kids, who learned English and Hebrew reading at the same time, found it easier to learn Hebrew for this reason.

One thing I'll say about learning languages is that you really learn about language structure. When I talk about grammar, I automatically think of the terms in French, because I spent more time learning French grammar than English grammar.

Hum, why do I find English easier to learn ?... I learned to speak it in one summer (at age 7). Compared to German which I learned in college, now that one was HARD. I have to take into account that I could easily open the TV and watch something in English, go to a bookstore and buy English books, etc, whereas German? No German TV station here (at least on basic cable), and good luck finding German-language books easily in this city...I think it's now a bit easier with the internet and electronic books though.

Comparing my learning Eng. and Ger., I guess that what made Eng. the easier of the two was being able to retain it well, which was due to the vast array of cultural products available.

I admire everyone that speak more than 1 language. Here we had many Vietnamese and Cambodgian refugees that came in the late 1970s ("boat people"). Imagine, arriving in a foreign country with the clothes on yr back, not even $2 in yr pockets and unable to speak either French or English! My family sponsored a Cambodgian family in 1979 (2 adults, 3 kids) and now the parents own a dry cleaning store, the eldest daughter is a biologist, the other daughter is a teacher and their son is a lawyer. A year after they arrived we helped them move to Jonquières, in the Saguenay region...I'm always happy to hear from them every couple of years. To be honest I dunno if I could be as brave and resourceful as they were.

At least the Indian Subway worker in the OP isn't sitting on his butt, blogging about his 14 kids and begging for readers' $$!

[holierthanyou]

You lose. I actually do have gay friends.

LOL :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Having "gay friends" doesn't make you non-heterosexist. I assume you also have friends with darker skin tones than yours, but you still say racist shit. I assume you have friends that are women, but you're still sexist.

Your lack of logic is... truly astounding.

Do you really not wonder why EVERYONE here is telling you that you are wrong and need to check your racist attitudes???

[NurseNell]

Yes I do, and I even posted the links to where my family tree information is posted. And by having it posted online, I was able to contact the family of my long lost Aunt. Anyway....is there something racists or sexist about being a genealogist?

I am now in touch with an 80 y.o. man in Germany whose grandfather was my great grandmother's brother. It was so exciting to hear from him. He found me through a genealogy post I made 10 years previously. I've now been able to fill in lots of blank spaces and learned why my great grandmother left Germany.

[Guest Anonymous]

Maybe she'll throw a hissyfit over grocery stores who hire adults with Down Syndrome to bag groceries since they take a while and it's cutting away from her precious time. Oh wait, they should be conditioned to bag groceries quicker to avoid problems. That's what she would say.

Wrong. I have a cousin with downs syndrome who used to work at a store until he had to quit for health reasons.

[Guest Anonymous]

You lose. I actually do have gay friends.

Okay, LOLing for real. Be a bigger cliché. Maybe she's a college student majoring in Sociology and this persona has been adopted for a project? I wish I could think so but sadly I think she is actually this closeminded and willfully clueless and hurtful.

geniebelle, people tried to be somewhat gentle and explain to you in small words why what you said was problematic but you weren't having it so then they got snarky. You were racist all over this thread and at least twenty people told you so. If you don't want to be a racist, and you don't want people to see you that way, why won't you consider that you need to do some self-examination?

[formergothardite]

Genie, it was explained to you very clearly why what everyone else was saying is totally different than what you are saying. Do you get it or is this going to be like your sexist views where it takes multiple threads to get the point through to you?

[BlackHawk]

Wrong. I have a cousin with downs syndrome who used to work at a store until he had to quit for health reasons.

You know, I typically stay away from trolls, but here we go.

Just because you have someone who is something doesn't mean you can't have a prejudice against them. It seriously doesn't. We see women in the fundie groups who are truly sexist. Being a woman doesn't mean you can't hate women. Having a gay friend doesn't make you not a homophobe... having a cousin with downs doesn't mean you aren't prejudice against people with mental handicaps. It doesn't. Look up the "Sha-nay-nay defense"... you are a classic example.

And if you refuse to look it up, here's how it goes. "I can't be racist, I have a black friend!"... no really, you can.

Please, take this moment to learn... use FJ like some of us have to challenge our norms and become better people. It really does work, I promise. Let this be a learning experience for you to become a better person. For that to happen you have to stop being so defensive and be able to admit when you may be wrong. Look in to the things people here tell you, LEARN how your words and actions can be seen as racist or sexist or whatever. Do your research and walk away a better person. Don't be afraid to say you were wrong, that you are sorry, and that you've learned. Don't be afraid of being wrong. It gets you a lot further in life... seriously it does. Let yourself become a better person because of your relationships with people. Let yourself be a better person by admitting you didn't realize what you said or did was so harmful to others. It makes you a better you, and makes you a better person for society. It's not failure, it's knowledge. It's useful and powerful.

Seriously think about it.

[pomology]

I understand it can be annoying to keep asking "what?" if you can't understand them. However, it's not as easy as you think. It is just plain biology that by the age of 16, your accent is your accent pretty much for life. Your mouth has already formed around the sounds you make on a daily basis in your native language. Learning a foreign language after the age of 16, you will NEVER develop a foreign accent to native level. You want to learn Spanish and French? That's great...but no matter how long and hard you study, no matter how fluent you get and how great your accent can be, it will never be perfect. Hence, you go to Spain or France, there will always be people asking YOU "what?" because your accent will be in the way.

I believe the primary example of this is Henry Kissinger (who I happen to abhor) and his younger brother Walter. Henry has a prominent German accent. Walter doesn't. The ages they were when they came here were just different enough for that to happen. Also, talk about heavily accented English... I may despise Henry Kissinger, but the man was our freaking National Security Advisor and Secretary of State. Are you going to tell me that he's not really American because he has an accent?

[Guest Anonymous]

This isn't a race issue it's a language barrier issue. You're assuming I hate someone who doesn't speak English very well, and that is not at all what I'm trying to say. You're also assuming I expect people to be able to speak English fluently. Again, that's not what I'm saying. What I am saying is that since English is the majority language in the U.S., people should be able to speak English in an understandable way. I also believe that if I move to non-English speaking country, I should be able to speak that language in an understandable way.

Now it seems you not only think I'm sexist and racist, but you also think homophobic and biased against people with Down's Syndrome or any other impairment. That is laughable. But you know what, the people who compared the tolerance of extreme Gothardism and FJ may actually have a point....attitude wise that is. Buy, oh well, this is a snark board, and at the end of the day, I don't waste my time worrying about what random people on message board think.

Oh, and FYI....there will be no lengthy apologies, because on this issue, I don't feel that I'm wrong.

[pomology]

I have no problem understanding various American accents, and maybe that's because of my job. The accents I have a problem understanding are thick accents by immigrants who haven't learned how to effectively communicate in English...primarily people from India, the Middle East, and Eastern Europe (ironically though my primary care doctor is from India, and one of my managers at work is is originally from Sudan, and I don't have a problem understand them). I have absolutely nothing against people of different ethnic/racial groups. In fact I love learning about different cultures. I just feel that if they are going to live and work in the U.S. (not tourists), then they need to learn how to effectively communicate in English, and you don't have to give up your accent to do that. As I said before if I were to move to a foreign country I would be expected to learn the language of that country instead of doing the Jim Bob Spanglish thing.

If you were speaking the language of the land you'd be speaking Cherokee (I believe the Cherokee originally inhabited Alabama [?]) or some other native tongue, not English.

[Guest Anonymous]

I have read the comments, and do not believe anything I have said on this thread is racist. So, if you're waiting for me to admit otherwise, then you might as well wait for Hell to freeze over. I said this was a language barrier issue not a race issue. They are not the same thing.

[pomology]

And that grammar is just as intelligent and complex as the prestigious one, too.

I've heard that way out, in some Aboriginal schools, they have bilingual programs. One language - the way they speak English, the other language - standard Australian English. That way, it's not even approached as 'today we'll teach you how to speak English PROPERLY', but 'here are two perfectly equally valid ways of speaking; we'll teach you the one that most people in power use, but you can do maths just worrying about understanding the maths itself'. Apparently it works quite well, but I'm not familiar with any studies showing that.

Yeah, they have (or had at one point) similar things with Ebonics in the United States. It was pretty cool.

[Guest Anonymous]

I have read the comments, and do not believe anything I have said on this thread is racist. So, if you're waiting for me to admit otherwise, then you might as well wait for Hell to freeze over. I said this was a language barrier issue not a race issue. They are not the same thing.

And people say that the Confederate battle flag isn't racist all the time, but you agreed in another thread that it is. You saying something doesn't make it the truth. Again, at least twenty people have told you what you said was racist. If you persist in ignoring that then you are choosing to be racist and hurtful on purpose.

[pomology]

I have read the comments, and do not believe anything I have said on this thread is racist. So, if you're waiting for me to admit otherwise, then you might as well wait for Hell to freeze over. I said this was a language barrier issue not a race issue. They are not the same thing.

Issues that are construed as language issues are often just racist issues with a nicer label. I'm not saying that because I want to prove you're racist, either. I'm saying that because that is something I studied when I took linguistic anthropology.

[icecreamycakeycake]

This isn't a race issue it's a language barrier issue. You're assuming I hate someone who doesn't speak English very well, and that is not at all what I'm trying to say. You're also assuming I expect people to be able to speak English fluently. Again, that's not what I'm saying. What I am saying is that since English is the majority language in the U.S., people should be able to speak English in an understandable way. I also believe that if I move to non-English speaking country, I should be able to speak that language in an understandable way. Now it seems you not only think I'm sexist and racist, but you also think homophobic and biased against people with Down's Syndrome or any other impairment. That is laughable. But you know what, the people who compared the tolerance of extreme Gothardism and FJ may actually have a point....attitude wise that is. Buy, oh well, this is a snark board, and at the end of the day, I don't waste my time worrying about what random people on message board think.

Oh, and FYI....there will be no lengthy apologies, because on this issue, I don't feel that I'm wrong.

Think about the contradictions in your statement. How do you KNOW these people aren't in process of LEARNING and IMPROVING their english? You just ASSUME they have chosen to ignore being able to communicate effectively in this country because YOU (spechul snoflayke) have trouble understanding them. My MIL is an adult ESL teacher in So cal, and let me tell you, 15 years ago she had full time work through the school district and now she struggles every year to retain a class schedule to accomodate all the students that WANT to improve their communication skills. Resources are limited. People are calling you out on your blatent racism because you are looking at someone with brown skin, that needs to repeat themselves, and PRE-JUDGING them as a person who just plain isn't interested in learning English, and woes you, it's darn inconvenient. You are an entitled bitch, and the pure definition of an "ugly american"

[formergothardite]

I have read the comments, and do not believe anything I have said on this thread is racist. So, if you're waiting for me to admit otherwise, then you might as well wait for Hell to freeze over. I said this was a language barrier issue not a race issue. They are not the same thing.

I think you said something like this in the sexiest thread too. Except with a lot more cussing.

What makes it a racist issue is that you are picking certain countries and saying those people's accents are bad and they need to change.