(CW: CSA) Josh & Anna 47: Serial SM Commenter Anna Silent on Family Posts Lately. I Wonder Why?

[Alisamer]

I remember watching A Room Wth A View (with Julian Sands) in school, but they got a version with the nudity edited out.

[BlackberryGirl]

In 9th grade my mom was the chaperone when we got to see a live performance of Romeo and Juliet in Cleveland. I remember a couple of the boys crying their eyes out on the way home. I saw the Zefferelli version a year later. 

i was immersed in Shakespeare from birth, saw Macbeth (the Maurice Evens version) when I was maybe 3. We used to play Birnam Wood when I was a kid, you grab branches and walk down a hill. I’ve read about half the plays and seen 14 of them. Thank you Kenneth Branagh! 

[arareyeah]

Oh the Zefferelli version is the one with Olivia Hussey, right? My mom loved it and she was super excited when they put in on HBO (I think? kinda forgot) when I was a teenager. I watched it with my mom multiple times whenever it's available. I think she's (Olivia Hussey) the prettiest Juliet ever.

[Destiny]

1 hour ago, arareyeah said:

Oh the Zefferelli version is the one with Olivia Hussey, right? My mom loved it and she was super excited when they put in on HBO (I think? kinda forgot) when I was a teenager. I watched it with my mom multiple times whenever it's available. I think she's (Olivia Hussey) the prettiest Juliet ever.

That version and seeing the play made me a lifelong fan of Shakespeare. I'm not an OMG superfan, but if there's a play to be seen, I will go out of my way to do so. I will never ever try again to read it though.

[Bobology]

I'd like to know just how Josh managed to start looking at pornography. Like, did a friend whisper to him to look up such and such? Did he start by looking up "bad" words such as f***, sh*t  and pee-pee holder* and from there learned new words which eventually led him to pics and videos?

Even if Josh managed to use a writer and tell his story I wouldn't be able to believe what was written because he (and they) are such liars for the lord.

*And speaking of "pee-pee holder" I wonder at what age the boys were allowed to hear/know/use the term penis? For those of you who aren't aware, "pee-pee holder" was how at least one young Duggar boy described his penis. I think it was in a court document from an interview?

[Mama Mia]

1 hour ago, arareyeah said:

Oh the Zefferelli version is the one with Olivia Hussey, right? My mom loved it and she was super excited when they put in on HBO (I think? kinda forgot) when I was a teenager. I watched it with my mom multiple times whenever it's available. I think she's (Olivia Hussey) the prettiest Juliet ever.

I loved the Olivia Hussey version. I was teeny-tiny when it came out and for some reason my grandma took me to see it — she was so beautiful. I can’t say it made made me a big Shakespeare fan, but definitely loved the costuming of the era and the flow of the words

I also loved the Baz Luhrmann modern version. I wouldn’t think of Clare Danes as a Juliet, but she was wonderful. Very powerful. 

[feministxtian]

1 hour ago, Bobology said:

*And speaking of "pee-pee holder" I wonder at what age the boys were allowed to hear/know/use the term penis? For those of you who aren't aware, "pee-pee holder" was how at least one young Duggar boy described his penis. I think it was in a court document from an interview?

If I remember right, Jill and Derrick were teaching Israel and Sam the proper names for their body parts. Yay Jill on this one too. 

[Freejin]

I have a question. Presumably there is some form of compulsion inherent in people who look at CSA material. Once they are in prison with no access to that material, what happens? Does the compulsion channel in another direction? Another fixation? 

[Hera]

1 hour ago, Bobology said:

*And speaking of "pee-pee holder" I wonder at what age the boys were allowed to hear/know/use the term penis? For those of you who aren't aware, "pee-pee holder" was how at least one young Duggar boy described his penis. I think it was in a court document from an interview?

Honestly? Probably never. I know grown ass man and women who were raised SBC, so not actually fundy, who squick out over the words "penis" and "vagina" (or, gasp!,  "vulva") and use euphemisms for sexual organs even as adults.   

ETA: I also wonder how a 10-12 year old Josh would know how to look up porn, secretly, on a family computer...

Edited December 21, 2021 by Hera

[LilMissMetaphor]

Much Ado About Nothing (Kenneth Branagh, Denzel, Keanu) I must have seen a billion times, but also super good is Joss Whedon's black and white version (Nathan Fillion as Dogberry!) if you can find it.

 

[Magenta]

1 hour ago, Freejin said:

I have a question. Presumably there is some form of compulsion inherent in people who look at CSA material. Once they are in prison with no access to that material, what happens? Does the compulsion channel in another direction? Another fixation? 

I doubt it.  Unless there is some sort of active attempt to curtail said predilection, it's not going anywhere.  Prison is prison.  There's lots a person can't do but people manage to find ways to approximate their interests. 

[scoutsadie]

1 hour ago, LilMissMetaphor said:

Much Ado About Nothing (Kenneth Branagh, Denzel, Keanu) I must have seen a billion times, but also super good is Joss Whedon's black and white version (Nathan Fillion as Dogberry!) if you can find it.

 

The Kenneth Branagh/Emma Thompson version of MAAN is one of my all-time favorite movies. Michael Keaton's Dogberry makes me laugh so hard. Oddly, I didn't love Whedon's version, though I wanted to.

On 12/20/2021 at 8:46 AM, backyard sylph said:

discussed why the language was used, a bit of history of the time periods, and some tools of rhetoric. I found all of that terribly interesting. But it made me far less convinced than ever about any of it being the "inerrant" word of God. The final nail...let's say in the coffin. 

This was me in seminary (Lutheran pastor school). I got deconstructed but never reconstructed.

20 hours ago, louisa05 said:

The Folger Shakespeare Library has great curriculum material for teaching it as theatre. 

One of my favorite places in D.C. In the before times, I would go to the Folger Theater at least once a season. Saw an amazing in-the-round performance of Richard III there (though I think he got a bad rap from the Bard).

[feministxtian]

2 hours ago, Hera said:

Honestly? Probably never. I know grown ass man and women who were raised SBC, so not actually fundy, who squick out over the words "penis" and "vagina" (or, gasp!,  "vulva") and use euphemisms for sexual organs even as adults.   

My very Catholic mother NEVER used the proper terms for genitalia. To this day I feel very uncomfortable using the proper terms. It was insinuated that using the proper terminology was just not done. 

[Heidijoey]

Honestly? Probably never. I know grown ass man and women who were raised SBC, so not actually fundy, who squick out over the words "penis" and "vagina" (or, gasp!,  "vulva") and use euphemisms for sexual organs even as adults.   
ETA: I also wonder how a 10-12 year old Josh would know how to look up porn, secretly, on a family computer...

This makes me think of the King of the Hill episode where Peggy has to teach sex Ed

[Mrs. Kravitz]

2 hours ago, LilMissMetaphor said:

Much Ado About Nothing (Kenneth Branagh, Denzel, Keanu) I must have seen a billion times, but also super good is Joss Whedon's black and white version (Nathan Fillion as Dogberry!) if you can find it.

 

On YouTube at some point (might still be there?) there was a recorded version of a live showing of Much Ado starring David Tennant as Benedic and Catherine Tate as Beatrice. That one was really good too. 

[Destiny]

36 minutes ago, scoutsadie said:

The Kenneth Branagh/Emma Thompson version of MAAN is one of my all-time favorite movies. Michael Keaton's Dogberry makes me laugh so hard. Oddly, I didn't love Whedon's version, though I wanted to.

Have you seen the David Tennant / Catherine Tate version? It's probably my favourite of all of them.

Crossposted with @Mrs. Kravitz. Great minds think alike!

Edited December 21, 2021 by Destiny

[neuroticcat]

I think it’s possible Josh could have stumbled across something, like a pop up ad or sidebar, accidentally been exposed, and then curiosity sent him looking. He also could have watched something the secular world wouldn’t necessarily consider porn (a sex scene in a movie or lingerie ad) that got through their lame filters and then he gradually sought out more. More likely, in my opinion at least, someone (either a peer like a friend or cousin or an older person like a predator) introduced him to it. I understand that’s fairly common for first exposure to porn for tween/teen boys and it can escalate pretty quickly into a compulsive cycle. 
 

If the AMA is reliable and it seems to be, by the time he was in his late teens he was able to access thousands of images.

Edited December 21, 2021 by neuroticcat

[noseybutt]

2 hours ago, Freejin said:

I have a question. Presumably there is some form of compulsion inherent in people who look at CSA material. Once they are in prison with no access to that material, what happens? Does the compulsion channel in another direction? Another fixation? 

It depends.

Some users end up with CSAM not because they have pedophilic attraction per se, so much as they are extensive users of porn and are looking for novelty.  They often rely on the porn/masturbation to reduce anxiety and, when their preferred coping mechanism is removed, their anxiety shoots up. Some gravitate to other forms of sex, some go the alcohol/drug route, some get suicidal. A few use it as an opportunity to learn or find more adaptive strategies. 

For those where the CSAM meets a paraphilic attraction, those guys tend to approximate. IME prisoners are adaptive and have endless ways of approximating what they want. It can happen through artwork, flip books, role playing, verbal sex (like phone sex without the phone), etc. Prison economies are lean and there is much that can be had for relatively small amounts of currency.

[EmmieJ]

33 minutes ago, Destiny said:

Have you seen the David Tennant / Catherine Tate version? It's probably my favourite of all of them.

Crossposted with @Mrs. Kravitz. Great minds think alike!

*heading off to search you tube*

[onekidanddone]

How much is known about what Josh was up to after the abuse of Joy and before he married Anna? 

I can’t see him stopping viewing porn and I really believe he was able to get around any software designed to block content. 

The fact that he kept living in that house with his victims enrages me. None of the other kids were safe until he married and moved out and JimSlob gaslighted everyone for all those years. 

[Cam]

Maybe initially Josh looked up “how are babies made?” to learn what was really going on in his parents’ bedroom. Kids are usually curious about that and it could be enough to flash a pornographic image on the computer screen.

Edited December 21, 2021 by Cam

[Dandruff]

17 minutes ago, onekidanddone said:

How much is known about what Josh was up to after the abuse of Joy and before he married Anna? 

I can’t see him stopping viewing porn and I really believe he was able to get around any software designed to block content. 

The fact that he kept living in that house with his victims enrages me. None of the other kids were safe until he married and moved out and JimSlob gaslighted everyone for all those years. 

I wonder whether earlier collections of porn featured adults.  I would think so, since it's supposed to be difficult to access illegal (CSA) stuff, but at some point he apparently figured it out.

[imokit]

1 hour ago, onekidanddone said:

How much is known about what Josh was up to after the abuse of Joy and before he married Anna? 

I can’t see him stopping viewing porn and I really believe he was able to get around any software designed to block content. 

The fact that he kept living in that house with his victims enrages me. None of the other kids were safe until he married and moved out and JimSlob gaslighted everyone for all those years. 

My understanding is the midwife's son who did the ask me anything on reddit, was saying that in the period after Joy's attack and pre Anna, the Duggars donated a load of their old computers to the midwife for her kids. The AMA kid then found porn on them and this was reported to the Duggars but nothing happened.

I think this was in that time frame but I'm not sure.

[Freejin]

1 hour ago, imokit said:

My understanding is the midwife's son who did the ask me anything on reddit, was saying that in the period after Joy's attack and pre Anna, the Duggars donated a load of their old computers to the midwife for her kids. The AMA kid then found porn on them and this was reported to the Duggars but nothing happened.

I think this was in that time frame but I'm not sure.

It’s so interesting to me that a child as sheltered as him could even figure all this out. I grew up in a mainstream household. Watched regular PG13 and R movies. Used the internet without supervision. I would never in a million years have known how to figure any of this out. 

[PreciousPantsofDoom]

3 hours ago, EmmieJ said:

*heading off to search you tube*

It's not MAAN, but I absolutely love the Catherine Tate/David Tennant sketch within which Catherine (as the incorrigible Lauren Cooper,) delivers an entire Shakespearean sonnet then tells David Tennant to "bite me Alien boi! The whole sketch is perfection Imo. 

*I'd link it, but I never seem to get around to learning how to do that on my phone. It's the one where David Tennant is Lauren's new English teacher. (she isn't botherethed though. ) 

Edited December 22, 2021 by PreciousPantsofDoom
Riffles