Fundy Reaction Responses to Smuggar's Guilty Verdict

[Beermeet]

2 minutes ago, EmiSue said:

Does anyone know where this was said? I couldn't find the source in a quick Google search. 

If Anna did say this, hopefully it's on film.  Because considering what's going on, and what happened previously, those children need help.  The trial and conviction happened but, that's it huh?  Guilty doesn't mean Anna and the kids will be looked into. Josh is away and that is excellent.  It's just...idk.  I can't find the words. This thought drove it home for me.  I think I was fooling myself that his kids were off limits because it's too horrible.  I'm sick, physically sick. I'm needing a break now.  Be well everyone ❤

[Not that josh's mom]

If I remember either Josh or Anna said that she takes care of input and he takes care of output. Nursing and diapers was my opinion. In retrospect, poor choice.

[onekidanddone]

5 hours ago, SassyPants said:

And TBH, one can not dismiss the Duggars’ faith and then complain when the Duggars do the same to others’ faiths. I refuse to become the Duggars. They are allowed to believe what they want, and while I do not have to respect those beliefs, and I don’t, they are free to have those beliefs. I also have that same freedom. However, I will work hard to make sure they are not allowed to legislate their beliefs into laws.

I can’t call them fake Christians as it isn’t my place to decide who is Christian and who is not. 

It would be like a non Jew saying I’m a fake Jew because I eat pork and drive on Saturday.

[EmCatlyn]

1 hour ago, Natalie22 said:

I believe this is what happened.  The church was expanding and so the duggars sold their house to them thinking they'd be done building the TTH.  They weren't making progress fast enough, so the church allowed them to stay in the house until they needed to demolish it.  When that happened they moved into another rental scheduled for demo.

That sounds right.  My question remains: were they paying rent or just living there (or in the other soon-to-be-demolished house) for free?  Given what we know of these people, I wouldn’t be surprised if they can brag about not paying rent because they were living for free in those properties.

1 hour ago, QuiverFullofBooks said:

They lived in the Johnson Road house for several years. It was adequate for them at the beginning, and way too small at the end. That’s where the molestations took place. Jim Bob sold it to the church (First Baptist, now Cross Church), and the church originally said that they could stay until they finished building the new house, but they took an unreasonable amount of time, and the church kicked them out.

They obviously needed to rent, since the big house was almost done, but no landlords wanted way too many kids and counting. Finally they found a house that was going to be torn down soon that they could rent. They lived there during “16 children and moving in.” That’s where people get the idea that they lived in a crappy little rental house. Meanwhile, the church tore down the old house, and Jim Bob took the kids to watch (which was filmed). Oddly, the church never built over it; you can still see the foundation.

In other words they mooched off the church until the church got tired of it, and then they rented a house that was substandard.

[Giraffe]

Now that he's been convicted I wonder if Anna regrets her youngest's name.

[3KidsAndStopped]

1 minute ago, Giraffe said:

Now that he's been convicted I wonder if Anna regrets her youngest's name.

I sincerely hope so. This and a thousand other regrets that act as rocket fuel to get herself and children as far away from Josh and the Duggars as possible. Preferably in the real, non ATI world.

[EmCatlyn]

47 minutes ago, Womble said:

It seems weird that Josh is the only one in his family like this. What made him like this?? And what should have been done after the early incidents? I agree his family did not handle this well, but I’m struggling to see what could be done. I’m not apologising for his family and all their issues, but in reality what can be done with someone like this?

Get him help.  The first time he got caught or the first time he confessed, take him to a professional counselor.  Pray with him, pray for him, but tell him he can control himself and not do things like that.

Get his sisters help. Don’t make excuses for him, but don’t shame him and shun him.  Tell him that you are there to help him even though you won’t tolerate his hurting others.

If it happens again, especially if he attacks one of the younger ones, get him into a good secular program.

Maybe it will work.  Maybe it won’t.  But if they’d done all this or some version of it, they would have done all they could.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

1 minute ago, 3KidsAndStopped said:

I sincerely hope so. This and a thousand other regrets that act as rocket fuel to get herself and children as far away from Josh and the Duggars as possible. Preferably in the real, non ATI world.

She can take a page out of the Bates book when they renamed Michaela.  They can go and change one letter (because changing one letter is the only thing TN would let them do for free?  Did anyone ever fact check that?  Sounds crazy.) then call her that as well as alternately another version of her new name, so as an adult she can go by another version of the name her parents never named her the first time (choosing the prettiest IMO of the above.)

Or Anna could be a decent person and change it to something that won't be a source of shame for her in their community and the outside world.

 

[3KidsAndStopped]

2 minutes ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

Or Anna could be a decent person and change it to something that won't be a source of shame for her in their community and the outside world.

 

I would love it if she committed the ultimate act of defiance and changed it to a non M. 

[RosyDaisy]

2 hours ago, TuringMachine said:

Hey Jim Bob, did you know you have daughters too? Daughters who might be hurting right now because private, traumatic parts of their lives have been shared publicly. Again. Things you said under oath that you didn't remember happening to them. 

I ask cause it seems like you might have forgotten who the victims are here. And it's not your son.

He doesn't care.  He blames them.  "Alice" and "concernedmom" said as much.

[Father Son Holy Goat]

4 hours ago, MamaJunebug said:

Lutheran Church Missouri Synod.  They have a good collection of explanations of their theology on their site & I’ll try to link it here. 
ETA the link: https://resources.lcms.org/reading-study/what-about-pamphlets/

I haven’t been an active member in ages. If you don’t find anything on the site feel free to ask, and I’ll see if I can help you find it. I still need to read the reformed theology description much more closely. However on my first read, it seemed unexpectedly foreign to how I’d been taught. 
Happy reading! 

I was raised Lutheran Church Missouri Synod (I pronounce it Misery Synod). So much bad juju there, I’m now ELCA in one of their more liberal congregations and so much happier.

[Father Son Holy Goat]

44 minutes ago, Giraffe said:

Now that he's been convicted I wonder if Anna regrets her youngest's name.

What’s wrong with Madyson? 
 

I’m not big on Madyson or Madison or Mackenzie for that matter but it’s not unusual.

Edited December 12, 2021 by Father Son Holy Goat

[clueliss]

3 minutes ago, Father Son Holy Goat said:

What’s wrong with Madyson? 
 

I’m not big on Madyson or Madison or Mackenzie for that matter but it’s not unusual.

Ummmm Joshgate 2.0 was Joshly getting putted for having an Ashley Madison account.  I seem to recall the ads said something about have an affair (and would run during repeat episodes of 19 kids and counting).  So the Madison/Madyson name falls into the unfortunate category because the poor child is stuck with a reference to one of her father’s scandals.

[justmy2cents]

1 hour ago, Not that josh's mom said:

If I remember either Josh or Anna said that she takes care of input and he takes care of output. Nursing and diapers was my opinion. In retrospect, poor choice.

That was Jessa talking about Ben.

[kachuu]

4 minutes ago, clueliss said:

Ummmm Joshgate 2.0 was Joshly getting putted for having an Ashley Madison account.  I seem to recall the ads said something about have an affair (and would run during repeat episodes of 19 kids and counting).  So the Madison/Madyson name falls into the unfortunate category because the poor child is stuck with a reference to one of her father’s scandals.

I laugh because I literally just put those two things together 😅😂

[QuiverFullofBooks]

2 minutes ago, justmy2cents said:

That was Jessa talking about Ben.

It’s a family thing. Originated with JB&M and the 2nd gen also said it, starting with Josh and Anna.

[Daisy0322]

On 12/10/2021 at 1:08 PM, Cam said:

The Seewald statement doesn’t say that they were shocked or surprised when the charges were filed. They knew the case against Josh was not just possible but also probable. They’re glad the justice system finally nailed him and he will be punished. Their talk of the “unfathomable grief and pain” of Josh’s wife and kids is letting us know Anna is taking it very hard. Maybe even possibly finally letting the truth sink in that she married an axe murderer a pedophile. Who knows what went on between the sheets with Anna and Josh. He could have insisted she call him Daddy and use baby talk and other disgustingly creepy things that sicken her now.

I’m guessing Anna is questioning everything she has done in the last 15 years or she’s HEAVILY medicated so she doesn’t 

[HerNameIsBuffy]

Just now, Daisy0322 said:

I’m guessing Anna is questioning everything she has done in the last 15 years or she’s HEAVILY medicated so she doesn’t 

I hope there is someone with the Ms who can maintain emotional equilibrium for a while.

[EmCatlyn]

1 hour ago, Not that josh's mom said:

If I remember either Josh or Anna said that she takes care of input and he takes care of output. Nursing and diapers was my opinion. In retrospect, poor choice.

I remember that, but I didn’t take it as “he loves to do diapers.”  I took it as “a good husband/father does this when the baby is newborn to help out his wife since she is the only one who can nurse the baby.”  I didn’t believe Josh was really changing more than a few diapers here and there.  He was just saying this for the show (the way JB pretended to explain the facts of life at one point).

[neuroticcat]

1 hour ago, Not that josh's mom said:

If I remember either Josh or Anna said that she takes care of input and he takes care of output. Nursing and diapers was my opinion. In retrospect, poor choice.

Yes, they have all said this, Jessa, Ben, and Jim Bob as well. I think it’s something of a line they say to make a joke and show what good fathers they are because they don’t leave it all to the mom. 🙄I don’t think it had strange connotations - just felt like usual Duggar corny lines to me.

[EmCatlyn]

1 hour ago, onekidanddone said:

I can’t call them fake Christians as it isn’t my place to decide who is Christian and who is not. 

It would be like a non Jew saying I’m a fake Jew because I eat pork and drive on Saturday.

You can certainly call someone on not living by the teachings they claim to accept.  I wouldn’t say they are “fake” Christians, but I would say they are hypocrites about their faith.

The funny thing about a lot of these “Christians” is that they are very quick to claim that those who do not practice their form of Christianity are not really Christians.

[Giraffe]

24 minutes ago, HerNameIsBuffy said:

I hope there is someone with the Ms who can maintain emotional equilibrium for a while.

That would be great. Sadly I assume the oldest two are now in charge of day to day caring for all the other kids and taking care of the house too while Anna concentrates on bonding with the newest M. 

I'd love to know how Josh's absence has been presented to the M kids. My guess is it was minimized as much as possible but that the kids have heard rumors from their various relatives around their same ages which would make the whole thing even worse. 

Edited December 12, 2021 by Giraffe

[EmCatlyn]

32 minutes ago, justmy2cents said:

That was Jessa talking about Ben.

Wasn’t it Josh and Anna giving advice to Jessa and Ben first?

[HerNameIsBuffy]

3 minutes ago, Giraffe said:

That would be great. Sadly I assume the oldest two are now in charge of day to day caring for all the other kids and taking care of the house too while Anna concentrates on bonding with the newest M. 

I'd love to know how Josh's absence has been presented to the M kids. My guess is it was minimized as much as possible but that the kids have heard rumors from their various relatives around their same ages which would make the whole thing even worse. 

On of the unsubstantiated rumors floating around is that they're telling the kids dad has to go away to become like the apostle Paul and this is God's plan ...

Then when Jing and Jeremys statement referenced Paul it makes me wonder if this one is true.

[neuroticcat]

1 minute ago, EmCatlyn said:

You can certainly call someone on not living by the teachings they claim to accept.  I wouldn’t say they are “fake” Christians, but I would say they are hypocrites about their faith.

The funny thing about a lot of these “Christians” is that they are very quick to claim that those who do not practice their form of Christianity are not really Christians.

I’ve read Stroop’s argument before about there not being any fake Christians. I think I understand the argument, but it’s coming from a solid exvangelical emptythepews perspective. The argument says that the core of Christianity’s teachings are toxic, so Christians shouldn’t be able to distinguish between belief subsets. That’s an opinion, for sure, but I think many Christians would disagree and feel it’s important to make these distinctions between applications of Christianity that are “false teachings” and orthopraxis. I understand many would still find orthodox Christian teaching toxic, too, but that’s an outsider value judgment. In general, I don’t think it’s required for Christians to adopt the terminology outsiders want them to use. 

With the Duggars I think it’s important to distinguish that they hold fundamentalist Christian beliefs - many with which majority of Christians disagree - AND separately belonged to a cult that used Bible verses to support a narcissist’s psychosis. For a long time I didn’t know that IBLP isn’t a church or denomination - it’s a training program that draws from a lot of fundamentalist denominations. While there is plenty to critique about fundamentalist Christianity, I think the rotten core of their beliefs is IBLP.