Lori Alexander 16: Protecting Men's Jobs from the Assaults of Women

[KDA]

Where I live, babies are delivered predominantly by highly trained (4 years University obtaining a Bachelor of Midwifery degree) midwives. Obstetricians are only brought in for complications, usually.  Lactation consultants are all women. Babies get given free routine checks by Plunket Nurses up until they are 5 years old - all the Plunket nurses are women. They're specially trained in pediatric nursing. Right now, my youngest child is at Kindergarten - with all female teachers. If Lori had her way all these jobs would have to be done by men. Maybe it's just me, but I would be really uncomfortable with a man delivering my baby (I birthed two of mine at home, 2 in the maternity unit, staffed completely by women/midwives).

Also, my doctor is a woman. I'm just really uncomfortable discussing certain topics with a male doctor. 

I absolutely disagree that ALL jobs can be done by men. Some of them definitely need a woman's touch.

[KDA]

I'm also really not sure why Trey, who claims to be a Christian man, would think it acceptable to address people without using basic courtesy? Most of the men I know are real "blokey blokes" and they always use their manners. Trey comes across as incredibly arrogant, rude and misogynistic. For a Christian man to be complaining on a blog for women that he got hauled over the coals because he is rude and disrespectful, is shameful.

[December]

6 hours ago, AlwaysDiscerning said:

Right, let those heathen "throw away" women become doctors. That is the tone that has. Sounds like she just has a controlling husband.  Its the sexual repression again too. Assuming that if you see a naked man or woman you must automatically make it sexual.

Lori's response:

Never pondered it? LOL. As we all know I am sure she has woman doctor and nurses for all her medical conditions. 

 

Yeah, the argument that women should see women doctors because godliness, but women doctors are ungodly does not hold water. I guess the conviction can't be that strong -- or the denial is just that much stronger. Also, the tacit implication of that whole discussion seems to be that male doctors aren't able to treat female patients in an appropriate, professional manner equal to how they treat male patients. Which is just gross. 

I wonder what their take on having a male nurse would be -- they dislike women in the workplace, but nursing has traditionally been a female role... 

[polecat]

6 hours ago, AlwaysDiscerning said:

My husband thinks the medical field is not for women since they can be exposed to naked men, or inappropriate behavior by men. But, he does not like for me to be treated by men- only women, unless it is an extreme situation or there are no women specialists available. I’ve tried to gently let him see that this thinking contradicts himself, but he just says, let the unchristian women work in the medical field.

 

Is he aware that male medical professionals can also be exposed to nude women and women behaving inappropriately? 

And isn't Lori constantly going on about how little control men have over their eyes and groinal areas?

So if women shouldn't be exposed to naked men, then men REALLY shouldn't be exposed to naked women. 

(Never mind that medical nudity -- or nudity in a medical environment -- is not even remotely sexy, and any medical professional with even the slightest understanding of appropriate ethical and professional boundaries is going to be crossing any lines).

[TeddyBonkers]

Oh, poor Trey! I got all sorts of sad for him, reading about how he had to work with those women and their emotions, in an office environment for over 8 hours a DAY. 

 See this? It's the world's smallest violin, playing "My Heart Bleeds For You".

Before I had children with Mr. Bonkers, I worked in a male dominated field for MUCH longer than 8 hours a day. Office environment? Please. Try combat environment. Tears? Yeah, try crying in front of a drill sergeant and let me know how that works  out for you.

I had my chest grabbed (completely by accident-it was dark) during a shake down for ammo during a night fire exercise. Didn't give the sergeant any flack for it. I've heard all sorts of four letter words, and said most all of them myself. I hump my own gear and expect no one else to do it for me. 

Dick.

[lilwriter85]

28 minutes ago, December said:

Yeah, the argument that women should see women doctors because godliness, but women doctors are ungodly does not hold water. I guess the conviction can't be that strong -- or the denial is just that much stronger. Also, the tacit implication of that whole discussion seems to be that male doctors aren't able to treat female patients in an appropriate, professional manner equal to how they treat male patients. Which is just gross. 

I wonder what their take on having a male nurse would be -- they dislike women in the workplace, but nursing has traditionally been a female role... 

On the Always Learning blog, Lori did a few posts regarding nurses. In one post, she said that she was against women with school age/teen children working as nurses. She said that men, women without children, or women with grown children should be the ones working as nurses. The problem with Lori is that some men and women just don't want to work in healthcare for different reasons. A male friend of mine considered going into nursing, but decided against after doing the research into training/education and the work work environments. 

47 minutes ago, KDA said:

Where I live, babies are delivered predominantly by highly trained (4 years University obtaining a Bachelor of Midwifery degree) midwives. Obstetricians are only brought in for complications, usually.  Lactation consultants are all women. Babies get given free routine checks by Plunket Nurses up until they are 5 years old - all the Plunket nurses are women. They're specially trained in pediatric nursing. Right now, my youngest child is at Kindergarten - with all female teachers. If Lori had her way all these jobs would have to be done by men. Maybe it's just me, but I would be really uncomfortable with a man delivering my baby (I birthed two of mine at home, 2 in the maternity unit, staffed completely by women/midwives).

Also, my doctor is a woman. I'm just really uncomfortable discussing certain topics with a male doctor. 

I absolutely disagree that ALL jobs can be done by men. Some of them definitely need a woman's touch.

I have never been pregnant, but several friends and relatives of mine went with female obstetricians or midwives because they felt more comfortable with women guiding them through their pregnancies and delivering their babies. I can sort of get where you're coming from. I would love to read Lori's take on female OB/GYNS and midwives. She would likely bash them for being out of their homes and working.  But, I don't think Lori will ever address that topic. It would kind of be like how Zsu and PP trashed working women and said that male OB/GYNS were perverts. Yet, Zsu was comfortable with midwives who are technically working women giving her prenatal care and delivering her babies.

[onemama]

7 hours ago, Imrlgoddess said:

I notice Lori & crew never give credence to the men who wish they could be home more with their babies. That's one thing I heard a lot with the offshore men, they missed a lot of birthdays, concerts, & firsts bc they were gone so much. But I guess "real" men... command men... Don't worry about their wives children. 

Very good point. I guess they put it down to him "laying down his life" for his family and expect all that more submission and obedience from the wife in return. 

[onemama]

7 hours ago, KDA said:

Maybe it's just me, but I would be really uncomfortable with a man delivering my baby (I birthed two of mine at home, 2 in the maternity unit, staffed completely by women/midwives).

I delivered all three of mine in hospital and I'm very grateful that the staff involved in my children's births were all female. I did need stitches for a bad tear after giving birth to my firstborn and the surgeon was a man. After over 30 hours of labor with no pain relief, I just couldn't care less. I puffed at the gas and air and was relieved when the ordeal was over and I could go to my little cubicle with my tiny son. 

Quote

I absolutely disagree that ALL jobs can be done by men. Some of them definitely need a woman's touch.

I agree, and some of the best teachers, nurses, doctors and therapists I've met are women.  I certainly want to see a female gynaecologist.  

The thing is, women have always worked and offered services to people other than their families.  I speak three languages and use that knowledge to help kids who struggle with learning those languages at school.  Why shouldn't I use those gifts?  My students' parents are so happy to see their children regain confidence where they had lost it! What would anyone gain from me saying "sorry, I want to follow god's ways so I can't help you out any more?"

[Petronella]

I chose a woman OBGYN for my first pregnancy, assuming that a woman would be more understanding about the challenges of pregnancy. THIS WAS NOT THE CASE. Some people are empathetic and other are not, regardless of gender.

[RosyDaisy]

My modesty standards don't apply when it comes to my health. I'm more concerned about my health than a male dooctor examining me.

[KDA]

15 minutes ago, RosyDaisy said:

My modesty standards don't apply when it comes to my health. I'm more concerned about my health than a male dooctor examining me.

Oh absolutely!! It's nothing to do with modesty, for me. I've been examined by plenty of male doctors. A male surgeon did my tubal ligation, and I was tended to by a male nurse. I don't have a problem with male medical staff at all. But for me, probably because of my history, I prefer for my regular doctor, the one who does my cervical smears and diagnoses/talks to me about all my issues, to be a woman. I've been scared of men since I was 2. By scared, I mean hide under the bed and scream when men arrived at our house - scared. I'm still fearful of most men when I first meet them, even though I know that most men are good men.  When I'm talking about my neurological disorder and depression and anxiety, post natal depression, and "women's issues", I'm just more comfortable with a woman.  That's why Lori's "all jobs can be done by men" irritates me. I like being able to choose a woman GP - it's part of that "freedom of choice" thing my Great-great Grandmother fought so hard for.

[polecat]

3 hours ago, RosyDaisy said:

My modesty standards don't apply when it comes to my health. I'm more concerned about my health than a male dooctor examining me.

 

I'm with you. I had two male OBs and was completely happy with both of them. My third was delivered in a teaching hospital, and the delivery room/OR was full of people: the OB, residents, students, a doula and a doula-in-training and I don't even know who else. All my modesty standards went out the window. I wish I'd sold tickets to the grand (re)opening of my uterus. I have a female GP now and am happy with her, too. I don't care what gender a doctor is as long as they can do the job. But I get that comfort levels are pretty individual.

 

11 hours ago, polecat said:

any medical professional with even the slightest understanding of appropriate ethical and professional boundaries is going to be crossing any lines).

 

Ugh, too late to edit this, but it should have said isN'T not IS. 

[Koala]

Today's post is right on schedule.  Sorry to quote the same thing 2 days in a row, but when you read what she posted this morning, you'll understand why I have to. 

Lori Alexander:

Quote

Our culture spends a lot more time encouraging us to adorn our fading exterior rather than our eternal interior. As godly women, we must care a whole lot more about our inward beauty rather than our outward beauty. 

Quote

We must learn to adorn ourselves by living in subjection to our husbands rather than wasting a lot of time and money beautifying our outward appearance.

Oh, really?

Lori Alexander (quoting on her blog):

Quote

 

Christian women need to be told the truth about men ~

Men are attracted to youth and looks. This is normal. Men are not evil, base or perverted for being attracted to youth and beauty. Young Christian girl, if you are not getting approached or asked out, it’s probably because you’re not attractive enough, you’re not nice enough or you’re not available enough. You need to work on this. You need to lose weight, grow your hair out, wear nice clothes and some decent makeup. You might be a b****, and if you are, you need to be nicer. If you really want to find a man and marry, then you need to get serious about it while you’re young. 

 

Lori Alexander:

Quote

There are so many beautiful women who would love to be married but are heavy and out of shape.  I posted that first paragraph which was written by a man to try and persuade young women who are looking for a husband to begin eating healthy, working out, join Weight Watchers, whatever it takes to look better. 

Lori Alexander: A study in contradictions

 

 

[freealljs]

All of my OB/GYNs have been male. 

When I was giving birth to my DD, I needed an emergency c-section. I didn't care who saw my private parts in that OR.  I only cared that my DD was born healthy. 

[onemama]

I just read the "A Day, No Years, Without Men In The Workforce" post.  I've stared at the title and, for the life of me, I don't get it! What's she trying to say? 

I get that there are fields that are dominated by men. And there are fields that are dominated by women. What's the percentage of female vs. male nurses? And female vs. male elementary and middle school teachers?  And social workers? Or caregivers? 

I know Lori would do away with teachers, social workers and caregivers, but... well, that aside, these jobs are being done mostly by women, right? Suppose all those women just walked away from their jobs. What would her dear male doctors do without the army of nurses running up and down hospital halls, tending to all the business that doctors don't personally tend to? 

I think most mothers spend all the time they can with their younger children. Most mothers I know took long maternity leaves (which should be available to every single parent, time off to spend with young children), and went back to work very gradually.  Most mothers I know are very involved in the lives of their children. I know fathers who are involved too, fathers who don't jump for every promotion while their kids are little because they want to have time for their families.  Not everyone is a slave to money, or status, or whatever.  But there's the reality that not every job pays enough to support a family. Not every couple wants to have as many children as nature allows, and there's more than one "right" way to provide for a family. 

 

[AlwaysDiscerning]

A few new men have popped up on facebook saying how much they love Lori's page because it shows godly women still exist. Lori's response is again about the remnant.  The are also talking about how they can't figure out how to walk in high heels. Good grief! Its not that tricky. I would think they would hate women wearing flat shoes as that is more masculine. 

Lori:

Quote

Finally, growing older shouldn’t cause us distress since it is part of God’s magnificent plan for us! Gray hair and wrinkles are fine. I know. I have them and you know what, I can still enjoy life!

I don't see any gray hair on Lori. She clearly must dye it. Or what she has a few strands, so of course its easy to deal with now. 

[Red Jumper]

@Koala perhaps we are not reading it correctly: If you will not find a husband because your are missing beaut but should care about inner beauty one could read that single women are "internally ugly" (please insert here words like bitch or stronger).

I do agree with your reading, she is simply spinning it to the direction she needs it. But the alternative reading is equally disgusting.

[polecat]

7 hours ago, Koala said:

We must learn to adorn ourselves by living in subjection to our husbands rather than wasting a lot of time and money beautifying our outward appearance.

 

 

7 hours ago, Koala said:

Men are attracted to youth and looks. This is normal. Men are not evil, base or perverted for being attracted to youth and beauty. Young Christian girl, if you are not getting approached or asked out, it’s probably because you’re not attractive enough,

 

This is seemingly a contradiction, but in Lori's world, I can see how it might not be. You have to be young and hot to catch a man, but to KEEP a man, you only have to play silly little passive-aggressive "submission" games. Otherwise, you'd age out of the whole marriage thing, and your husband would be out chasing younger women as soon as your four kids flew the nest ... 

[lilwriter85]

7 hours ago, onemama said:

I just read the "A Day, No Years, Without Men In The Workforce" post.  I've stared at the title and, for the life of me, I don't get it! What's she trying to say? 

I get that there are fields that are dominated by men. And there are fields that are dominated by women. What's the percentage of female vs. male nurses? And female vs. male elementary and middle school teachers?  And social workers? Or caregivers? 

I know Lori would do away with teachers, social workers and caregivers, but... well, that aside, these jobs are being done mostly by women, right? Suppose all those women just walked away from their jobs. What would her dear male doctors do without the army of nurses running up and down hospital halls, tending to all the business that doctors don't personally tend to? 

I think most mothers spend all the time they can with their younger children. Most mothers I know took long maternity leaves (which should be available to every single parent, time off to spend with young children), and went back to work very gradually.  Most mothers I know are very involved in the lives of their children. I know fathers who are involved too, fathers who don't jump for every promotion while their kids are little because they want to have time for their families.  Not everyone is a slave to money, or status, or whatever.  But there's the reality that not every job pays enough to support a family. Not every couple wants to have as many children as nature allows, and there's more than one "right" way to provide for a family. 

 

I've said this before but I don't think Lori realizes how much society benefits from working women. Her concern is about the men. I doubt that she would ever try to imagine how hospitals would run if suddenly all the female nurses, doctors, therapists, nurse's aides, administration staffers, and other female employees quit their jobs to stay at home. In Lori's post, she quoted the author mentioning male emergency workers. Lori probably hates female firefighters, cops, and EMTs/paramedics. She probably doesn't realize that there are women working as emergency dispatchers and in other support roles for law enforcement and emergency services.  I don't know the percentages of women dispatchers or in support roles, but without those women agencies would be stretched out more than probably already are.  If Lori is put into a nursing home years from now. I can imagine how much she will hate the fact that working moms would be tending to her.

[Imrlgoddess]

As a general rule, historically, females outnumber males. (I know it's geographical & right now in the US males are the higher denomination)  

What would be her fix for those moments in our population where the women outnumber the men? Make sure to crank out more male babies & put them to work at soon as they are capable? What would happen if there weren't enough eligible males to fill all those jobs we are stealing out from under them? Oh I forgot, science is an ebil feminist construct. 

Going back in my kitchen now. 

[KDA]

I know Lori and her followers hate women in male-dominated jobs, but I was talking to a male corrections officer earlier today (prison guard in a mens maximum security prison) and he said that women corrections officers are so important for two reasons: firstly, it helps teach these men, many of whom are in jail for crimes against women, how to treat women with respect, and to accept women being in authority and learn how to deal with it. Secondly, women are usually really good at communicating and rather than using force or brute strength to get the male prisoners to cooperate, the women are able to (usually) encourage cooperation with a softer approach.

The man I was talking to is in a senior corrections role within the prison, he's been a prison guard for 20 years so I imagine he knows what he's talking about, In his opinion, having a mix of both men and women prison guards is ideal, in both men's and women's prisons. 

As a Christian, Lori would have to be in support of rehabilitation for criminals, surely? How, then, would she get around this issue?

[lilwriter85]

5 minutes ago, KDA said:

I know Lori and her followers hate women in male-dominated jobs, but I was talking to a male corrections officer earlier today (prison guard in a mens maximum security prison) and he said that women corrections officers are so important for two reasons: firstly, it helps teach these men, many of whom are in jail for crimes against women, how to treat women with respect, and to accept women being in authority and learn how to deal with it. Secondly, women are usually really good at communicating and rather than using force or brute strength to get the male prisoners to cooperate, the women are able to (usually) encourage cooperation with a softer approach.

The man I was talking to is in a senior corrections role within the prison, he's been a prison guard for 20 years so I imagine he knows what he's talking about, In his opinion, having a mix of both men and women prison guards is ideal, in both men's and women's prisons. 

As a Christian, Lori would have to be in support of rehabilitation for criminals, surely? How, then, would she get around this issue?

My guess is that Lori would come up with a plan like this

1) Having godly Christian men who were raised in two parent homes work in prisons. Lori has trashed men who were raised by single moms or stepdads and said that they are weak. She said that about Bill Clinton and Barack Obama on her past blog. She ignores the facts that Clinton had a stepfather and other men around during his childhood and Obama's grandfather helped raise him. In Lori's view, the ideal men to work in prisons would men from straight two parent couple homes.  She would push the same for women's prisons.  She would say that women shouldn't be working in any capacity in prisons. So all psychologists, administrators, medical staff, and teachers would have to be men.

2) She would probably push heavy religious education in prisons. Now, religious services/educations and chaplains are already available in prisons. Lori would push it more and would try to require all inmates to attend religious services to be rehabilitated. No women pastors would be allowed in the prisons.

[smittykins]

And psychology=evil secular humanist nonsense.

[KDA]

43 minutes ago, lilwriter85 said:

My guess is that Lori would come up with a plan like this

1) Having godly Christian men who were raised in two parent homes work in prisons. Lori has trashed men who were raised by single moms or stepdads and said that they are weak. She said that about Bill Clinton and Barack Obama on her past blog. She ignores the facts that Clinton had a stepfather and other men around during his childhood and Obama's grandfather helped raise him. In Lori's view, the ideal men to work in prisons would men from straight two parent couple homes.  She would push the same for women's prisons.  She would say that women shouldn't be working in any capacity in prisons. So all psychologists, administrators, medical staff, and teachers would have to be men.

2) She would probably push heavy religious education in prisons. Now, religious services/educations and chaplains are already available in prisons. Lori would push it more and would try to require all inmates to attend religious services to be rehabilitated. No women pastors would be allowed in the prisons.

I think you're probably right with regards as to Lori's "solution". However, I don't think it would be particularly successful. Especially male-only staff in a women's prison - many women are in prison because, at some stage of their life, they've been abused by men. Therefore they're not going to be particularly receptive to male psychologists etc. and won't respond to treatment as well as they could. Here, there is a huge emphasis on "rehabilitation" in our prisons. I don't know how successful we are at it, but surely if that is our goal, we owe it to prisoners to give them the best chance of success, which means access to both male and female staff?

Church in prisons is not the only (nor even the most successful way) to rehabilitate prisoners. 

Lori's world just isn't going to work. I don't actually think she's thought her world-view through and realised just how unrealistic and problematic it is. This is yet another reason why she should not be a mentor. Not only are many of her teachings damaging and dangerous, some of them don't even make any sense.

[Red Jumper]

 

Quote

As a Christian, Lori would have to be in support of rehabilitation for criminals, surely? How, then, would she get around this issue?

8 hours ago, lilwriter85 said:

My guess is that Lori would come up with a plan like this

1) Having godly Christian men who were raised in two parent homes work in prisons. [...]

2) She would probably push heavy religious education in prisons.

I can't Lori is in support of rehabilitation. I wouldn't surprise if she would be a strong advocate for death sentence for many crimes.
She would be throwing the first stone and/or hand one to Ken and tell him to throw it.

To me she is everything a Christian should not be: unforgiving, holier-than-thou attitude, scripture -twisting, hypocrite, lying, sadistic , self-obsessed, unsympathetic, ... No-one should be like that. Striving to become a better person is in the core of every religion, including Christianity. I cannot see she is even trying.

Persons like that are hellish prison masters and even worse regulation setters. I am pointing to the dark times of inquisitions /witch hunts.