March for life 2016

[Toothfairy]

6 hours ago, ShepherdontheRock said:

Misogynoir is cray.

Also, am I the only one who finds "I love you and your baby too?" creepy af?  Also the irony of "the root cause of abortion is selfishness" when these pro-life people are like "I CAN'T HAVE A BABY WHY WON'T YOU CARRY IT TO TERM SO I CAN ADOPT!!!" You know, because it's a woman's responsibility to carry a baby so you can have a kid.

Also, the "It's science!" is total BS, because I think there's no consensus on when it's considered "life." That's a philosophical question, often due to your religion. Leave your pseudoscience bullshit out of it.

You know what infertility  is hard. But adoption isn't a cure for infertility. The line for an infant can take years. Infants are in high demand. Shaming women for aborting just because you can't concieve is wrong. Woman are not incubators. I remember  reading an article about an infertile  couple crying about all the babies, I mean fetuses that were aborted. They cried that that could've been their son or daughter. Adoption isn't all sunshine and rainbows either. Domestic adoption is corrupt and there are tons of money involved. It's supply and demand. 

Btw a real adoptive couple wouldn't stand outside an abortion clinic shaming women. http://thefederalist.com/2015/08/12/infertile-couple-experiences-the-planned-parenthood-videos/

 

 

[Toothfairy]

5 hours ago, Mercer said:

I really hate when people treat placing a baby for adoption like it's this simple, easy thing.

Yes, sometimes it is the necessary outcome for the mother and child, but that doesn't mean it's rainbows and sunshine to give up your child for someone else to raise. At best the decision usually comes with a lot of sadness and regret, and at worst it can come with deep permanent trauma and/or a massive amount of coercion and pressure from other people. It also has a major impact on the child's life and future, and can have a deep emotional effect for the child too.

Acting like adoption is an easy breezy solution instead of abortion is not realistic and is not fair to a woman in a crisis pregnancy situation. Adoption is complicated and difficult - which doesn't automatically make it the wrong choice, but which means it's not the simple right choice for everyone either.

Exactly. I wish people would stop linking abortion and adoption. It's not the same thing. I also wish adoptive parents and birth families would stop using their child to push their views. Foster parent  imo should know better. Children in foster care face horrific abuse/neglect

A lot of adoptees  hate being used in the prolife movement. Whenever they speak up they're shut down. During national adoption month in November, they created a hash tag called flip the script. Their feelings are very raw and personal. There's also blogs and articles about adoptees and their feelings of being adopted. There's a lot of grief and abandonment. Steve Jobs  is often the face of the prolife movement. However a lot of people don't know his adoption  story. They don't know the feelings he has as an adoptee. A birth mother placing her child for adoption faces a ton of emotions. It's not easy to just hand your kid that you've carried for 9months over to strangers. Then hearing your child you gave birth to calling another  woman Mom. Having no say in their life. I wish people would understand  this. 

And any one of us could've been aborted not just adoptees. My mother could've aborted me, even if it wasn't legal back then. And your mother could've aborted too. 

5 hours ago, Catey said:

Agree with that @Mercer.

It seems to me that it is way more about making sure that the heathens that have "chosen" to get Pregnant are justly punished for their mistake. The thought that a woman is able to engage in any type of sex that she wants to and that she no longer is required to walk around a stained women with a scarlet letter just gulls them..

The thought that it may be a matter of her NOT wanting to be pregnant is just written off as selfishness. There are so many different reasons a woman may not want to be pregnant that there is no use in even going there, it all boils down to people wanting to control other people and make them live according to their moral standards.

They can march all day long, It is STILL legal.

43 years. You would think they would get that abortion isn't going anywhere. But I'll just let them continue to act like fools and waste their money/time. 

[47of74]

22 hours ago, slickcat79 said:

 

These folks from Nebraska got stuck on a bus overnight in PA as well.

 

I hate, hate, hate it. They take the same total lack of fucks they give about all babies once they're born, and heap an extra layer of bullshit on it. Not only do they not provide any useful services to a poor black mother, but they will consider her nothing more than a welfare queen who doesn't deserve help. They will spend every other breath justifying racism and police brutality towards African Americans. But we're supposed to believe that they care about black communities? Give me a fucking break.

The buses from where I live finally got home this afternoon. 

Yeah that entire reich to life movement turns my stomach.  They give zero fucks about almost any human life one it exits the vagina.  Only if the life can get them votes to they give a shit.  After justifying racism and police brutality these are the same people who want to carpet bomb other countries and send other people's children off to fight wars of aggression all over the world.  These are the same people who don't give a good goddamn about the environment either.

I believe I said it before, but one of the most liberating things about leaving the Catholic church was no longer having to pretend that I like these reich to life folks or even want to be in the same room with them anymore.

[Dollypeeps]

2 hours ago, Toothfairy said:

 

I find this offensive that they think it's that easy to get a baby that way. Try this in the UK and you'd be arrested. I'm sure it's the same in America. 

 

[Catey]

Yes that must work really well. I know that if I was thinking of putting a child up for adoption those people with their awesome judgement would be just the kind of family I would want my baby to grow up with.

Would never have to worry again....

[NachosFlandersStyle]

My mom works at a Catholic school and some of the more conservative teachers have been emailing around pics from their bus that got stranded. I guess to pass the time, they had the priest set up an altar by the side of the road and say Mass in the snow. I can't hate on the kids too much; they're young and I knew plenty of people like that in high school who have since grown out of those ideas. But I've got to say, being stuck in the freezing cold with a bunch of social conservatives listening to Mass sounds like a deep circle of hell. I cringed so hard I practically pulled a muscle when my mom showed me the pics. I've been thinking about my lapsed Catholicism more than usual lately, so I guess it's a good thing that there's an annual event highlighting everything that stinks about the Church.

Also: I can't find the source right now as I'm on my phone, but that stat about 80% of abortion providers being in black neighborhoods is total bs. Black neighborhoods are actually under-served. And seriously, fuck all the white-bread suburbanites who are suddenly so concerned about the well-being of the black community-- as long as they can blame everything on black women and their sexual freedoms.

[47of74]

My mom works at a Catholic school and some of the more conservative teachers have been emailing around pics from their bus that got stranded. I guess to pass the time, they had the priest set up an altar by the side of the road and say Mass in the snow. I can't hate on the kids too much; they're young and I knew plenty of people like that in high school who have since grown out of those ideas. But I've got to say, being stuck in the freezing cold with a bunch of social conservatives listening to Mass sounds like a deep circle of hell. I cringed so hard I practically pulled a muscle when my mom showed me the pics. I've been thinking about my lapsed Catholicism more than usual lately, so I guess it's a good thing that there's an annual event highlighting everything that stinks about the Church.

Also: I can't find the source right now as I'm on my phone, but that stat about 80% of abortion providers being in black neighborhoods is total bs. Black neighborhoods are actually under-served. And seriously, fuck all the white-bread suburbanites who are suddenly so concerned about the well-being of the black community-- as long as they can blame everything on black women and their sexual freedoms.

Yeah probably after an hour with some of these reich to life types I'd probably get out and start walking home.

[bewilderedandbemused]

A co-worker ran into a harried looking guy over the weekend who was accompanying 3 buses of teenage girls that traveled to DC for the protest.  They got stuck in DC (to be fair, better there than on the highway somewhere). Apparently he didn't seem to be having much fun being crammed into a hotel with the girls for 3 days. *smirk*

[Gobbles]

Germany: Like someone else said, you have to pay for the pills.

BUT: The pills are for free until you are 20. That prevents teen pregnancies I think. Also teenagers over 14 can get them without the parents knowledge/consent if the doc agrees with it. At 16 you can get them without any problem. 

Condoms: No knowledge. But I guess the health office has some and obviously places for gay people. My 84 year old Grandpa recently got some free condoms while walking past the university area. He had no idea about it and walked around with a huge bag with condom advertisement. My Grandma was not amused because the whole village saw him, haha!

[slickcat79]

On 1/25/2016 at 7:44 PM, Catey said:

Yes that must work really well. I know that if I was thinking of putting a child up for adoption those people with their awesome judgement would be just the kind of family I would want my baby to grow up with.

Would never have to worry again....

And of course, finding someone to adopt the baby does nothing for other potential issues that may cause a woman to seek abortion:

• pregnancy will endanger her life or health
• the baby has a condition incompatible with life
• she is dealing with addiction or must take a medication that is contraindicated during pregnancy
• she is poor and uninsured, and cannot afford prenatal care
• she was a rape victim, and is further traumatized by a resulting pregnancy
• she works at a job that is difficult or impossible to do while pregnant, and risks becoming unemployed
• she will be kicked out of her home if her parents/guardians find out she's pregnant
• she is in an abusive relationship and risks further abuse from her partner

And that doesn't even touch the mental and emotional minefield that surrounds adoption and its aftermath, even when adoption is the right choice. To coerce someone into giving up their baby to you makes you a terrible person.

 

[usedtobenice]

Plus, what if she just doesn't want to be pregnant?

[samira_catlover]

On 1/26/2016 at 0:58 PM, slickcat79 said:

And of course, finding someone to adopt the baby does nothing for other potential issues that may cause a woman to seek abortion:

• pregnancy will endanger her life or health
• the baby has a condition incompatible with life
• she is dealing with addiction or must take a medication that is contraindicated during pregnancy
• she is poor and uninsured, and cannot afford prenatal care
• she was a rape victim, and is further traumatized by a resulting pregnancy
• she works at a job that is difficult or impossible to do while pregnant, and risks becoming unemployed
• she will be kicked out of her home if her parents/guardians find out she's pregnant
• she is in an abusive relationship and risks further abuse from her partner

And that doesn't even touch the mental and emotional minefield that surrounds adoption and its aftermath, even when adoption is the right choice. To coerce someone into giving up their baby to you makes you a terrible person.

 

*snort* Well, if you're going to be all PICKY, now....

[AlysonRR]

On 1/26/2016 at 9:58 AM, slickcat79 said:

And of course, finding someone to adopt the baby does nothing for other potential issues that may cause a woman to seek abortion:

• pregnancy will endanger her life or health
• the baby has a condition incompatible with life
• she is dealing with addiction or must take a medication that is contraindicated during pregnancy
• she is poor and uninsured, and cannot afford prenatal care
• she was a rape victim, and is further traumatized by a resulting pregnancy
• she works at a job that is difficult or impossible to do while pregnant, and risks becoming unemployed
• she will be kicked out of her home if her parents/guardians find out she's pregnant
• she is in an abusive relationship and risks further abuse from her partner

And that doesn't even touch the mental and emotional minefield that surrounds adoption and its aftermath, even when adoption is the right choice. To coerce someone into giving up their baby to you makes you a terrible person.

 

• she has other children to parent and doesn't want to risk them losing their parent due to her death from pregnancy risks

[samira_catlover]

How about "married couple who had a Major Contraceptive Failure, and who KNOW they would be totally lousy parents, so please, no babies"?

I've had to deal with the shock of a broken condom, and local hospitals not willing to do emergency post-coital contraception. (It ended up with a 40+ mile drive to a university hospital, and, thank goodness, no pregnancy.) (For medical reasons, hormonal BC was not an option. REALLY had to clobber my gynecologist to do a tubal ligation when in my early 20s---with the additional insult of needing to get my dear husband to sign off that it was OK. I wonder if a urologist/comparable would demand that a male seeking a vasectomy would hold a comparable standard.)

It seems that a single woman who carries to term and puts the newborn up for adoption is a total hero (especially if she's white, and the father is also white, and there's a chance for a cute Gerber baby). Does anyone have a story about a married woman in these modern times (i.e., pre-orphanages) who gave up, GASP, a "legitimate" baby?

[bashfulpixie]

4 hours ago, samira_catlover said:

How about "married couple who had a Major Contraceptive Failure, and who KNOW they would be totally lousy parents, so please, no babies"?

I've had to deal with the shock of a broken condom, and local hospitals not willing to do emergency post-coital contraception. (It ended up with a 40+ mile drive to a university hospital, and, thank goodness, no pregnancy.) (For medical reasons, hormonal BC was not an option. REALLY had to clobber my gynecologist to do a tubal ligation when in my early 20s---with the additional insult of needing to get my dear husband to sign off that it was OK. I wonder if a urologist/comparable would demand that a male seeking a vasectomy would hold a comparable standard.)

It seems that a single woman who carries to term and puts the newborn up for adoption is a total hero (especially if she's white, and the father is also white, and there's a chance for a cute Gerber baby). Does anyone have a story about a married woman in these modern times (i.e., pre-orphanages) who gave up, GASP, a "legitimate" baby?

Actually, yes.  A friend of mine and her husband decided early on no kids.  They love their fur babies, but they also love to travel at the drop of a hat and neither work conventional schedules.  Plus, both have huge families, so they get their baby fix and then send them home.  Anyway.  When he went to get a vasectomy at 27, they made his wife sign paperwork stating that yes, she knew and yes, she approved even though they didn't have children yet.  So at least in Florida, it's a two way street.

[patsymae]

On January 26, 2016 at 0:58 PM, slickcat79 said:

And of course, finding someone to adopt the baby does nothing for other potential issues that may cause a woman to seek abortion:

• pregnancy will endanger her life or health
• the baby has a condition incompatible with life
• she is dealing with addiction or must take a medication that is contraindicated during pregnancy
• she is poor and uninsured, and cannot afford prenatal care
• she was a rape victim, and is further traumatized by a resulting pregnancy
• she works at a job that is difficult or impossible to do while pregnant, and risks becoming unemployed
• she will be kicked out of her home if her parents/guardians find out she's pregnant
• she is in an abusive relationship and risks further abuse from her partner

And that doesn't even touch the mental and emotional minefield that surrounds adoption and its aftermath, even when adoption is the right choice. To coerce someone into giving up their baby to you makes you a terrible person.

 

Thanks for pointing that out. Surrendering a child for adoption doesn't make you not a parent, it makes you a parent who is separated from his/her child. What they are really saying is 'don't abort; just turn yourself into a petri dish."

[QuiverDance]

On ‎1‎/‎17‎/‎2016 at 4:52 PM, 47of74 said:

 

I wonder how many of these high school students are truly committed to the cause or are doing this to get a discounted trip to DC?  And I wonder how many of these students will still be in the reich to life camp ten years later?

As a Catholic School teenager, I once won a pro life essay contest, complete with a trophy with a naked baby on it. 

My opinion, now that I am allowed to have my own, has changed. 

I was just really good at arguing a point...  Always have been.

I can remember having conversations in high school and college with my girlfriends about what we would do if any of us got pregnant.  We had plans for pooling funds, traveling to New Orleans, cover stories, EVERYTHING ready just in case.  In high school, we had zero access to real birth control other than condoms, unless we had parental consent and involvement.  Buying condoms was a huge issue because we were afraid of being seen by people who knew our parents.  It was a HUGE problem.  And its a wonder there were not more unplanned pregnancies in that group.  I, for one, stayed celibate until I was on birth control (which my Gyn rx'ed to "regulate" my cycle), but even then, my mother (I think, sadly, with good though control-freakish intentions) attempted to convince me that the BC pills I was prescribed were for menstrual regulation and NOT birth control.  To which my response was, Ummmmm.... You do realize you didn't raise me to be a fucking moron, right?

[samira_catlover]

OK, am going to go on VERY public record here.

Just putting in sperm doesn't make you a father. Gestating to 40 weeks (more or less) does not make you a mother.

When the rubber meets the road, the mom and dad (or mom and mom, and/or dad and dad--pick your combo)--the PARENTS are the ones who raised the Kidlings...who went through nightmares, teething, picky eating, tantrums, FirstPuppyLove, sports practice (with/without being cut from the team), and a whole lot of otherstuff.  I'm talking about the loving, caring people who actually showed up, suited up, and did their best. (Special big bouquet for fostering families!)

Responsible parenthood is TOTALLY not for sissies, and I salute people of whatever flavor who take up this challenge...for the pure love of children. Children, as sentient things, each are special---NOT as suburban trophy things, or a sign that you are copulating and fertile, or for you to live out your fantasies.

For myself: I am WAYYYY much more than a freaking life-support-unit for cells. (OK, given my age and being way post-menopausal, that's pretty academic.) Children--beloved, special, wildly-desired beings, with existences of their own, and flaws/problems/whatever---are far too special to be dumped off just for the sake of BabyMakers (any persuasion). 

[patsymae]

2 hours ago, samira_catlover said:

OK, am going to go on VERY public record here.

Just putting in sperm doesn't make you a father. Gestating to 40 weeks (more or less) does not make you a mother.

When the rubber meets the road, the mom and dad (or mom and mom, and/or dad and dad--pick your combo)--the PARENTS are the ones who raised the Kidlings...who went through nightmares, teething, picky eating, tantrums, FirstPuppyLove, sports practice (with/without being cut from the team), and a whole lot of otherstuff.  I'm talking about the loving, caring people who actually showed up, suited up, and did their best. (Special big bouquet for fostering families!)

Responsible parenthood is TOTALLY not for sissies, and I salute people of whatever flavor who take up this challenge...for the pure love of children. Children, as sentient things, each are special---NOT as suburban trophy things, or a sign that you are copulating and fertile, or for you to live out your fantasies.

For myself: I am WAYYYY much more than a freaking life-support-unit for cells. (OK, given my age and being way post-menopausal, that's pretty academic.) Children--beloved, special, wildly-desired beings, with existences of their own, and flaws/problems/whatever---are far too special to be dumped off just for the sake of BabyMakers (any persuasion). 

Totally disagree. Carrying and birthing a child by definition makes you a mother--maybe not the kind of mother some people think you should be, but a mother nevertheless.

Nannies and guardians also raise kidlings, go through nightmares and teething, deal with tantrums, and so on. How much time did Queen Elizabeth spend sitting up nights with a teething child or dealing with tantrums? Not much, I'm willing to guess, but does that mean she is not her children's mother? Of course not.

People can also become legal PARENTS (to use your caps) -- good, bad, or indifferent--through adoption. That does not negate the fact that the child (leaving aside the murky waters of non-related surrogacy for now) has another set of PARENTS, not a "sperm donor" and a "gestator."

Actually, though, IMO you are making a pretty good argument against carrying to term in order to have the child adopted--it's not "the loving alternative," it's the "understand you are merely a 'gestator'" alternative. Framed in those terms, I think that would make carrying to term in order to provide a child to adopters that much less appealing.

[Swamptribe]

If they are sooo big on adoption, then why don't they adopt one of the thousands of children who are stuck in foster care in their home state.  I believe there are something like 8,000 foster children eligible for adoption in my state alone.

 

(and , is there anyway to reply to a thread without having to quote.  It won't let me reply without quoting.  The board is acting a bit squirrely)

[hauntedoklahoma]

Re: signing off on someone else's medical procedure... that grosses me out regardless of who is getting permission. I can't imagine 1) marrying a guy when we are so incompatible that we hadn't discussed children previously (and come to an agreement we could both be happy with), 2) saying that "hey, it's okay, I got permission to do what I want with my body," or 3) signing said permission slip for theoretical husband saying that he has his blessing to snip if that's what he wants. Marriage =/= bodies becoming joint property.

[Coconut Flan]

I'm not having a problem.  If you get a quote box in your reply that you don't want, try to highlight it and delete as I just did with your extra one. 

[Loveday]

5 hours ago, QuiverDance said:

As a Catholic School teenager, I once won a pro life essay contest, complete with a trophy with a naked baby on it. 

 

I can't get past the fact that something like this even exists.