John Piper: Should Women Be Police Officers?

[DomWackTroll]

Well, it’s complicated-- but no!

It’s okay for them to be civil engineers, see, but only super-secret civil engineers. Shhh! “A woman who is a civil engineer may design a traffic pattern in a city so that she is deciding which streets are one-way and, therefore, she is influencing, indeed controlling, in one sense, all the male drivers all day long. But this influence is so non-personal that it seems to me the feminine masculine dynamic is utterly negligible in this kind of relationship.â€

But if the men know you’re making decisions and stuff, forget it! “On the other hand, some influence is very directive and some is non-directive. For example, a drill sergeant might epitomize directive influence over the privates in the platoon. And it would be hard for me to see how a woman could be a drill sergeant — hut two, right face, left face, keep your mouth shut, private — over men without violating their sense of manhood and her sense of womanhood.â€

desiringgod.org/interviews/should-women-be-police-officers

Unsurprisingly, Doug Wilson agrees with him because Deuteronomy:

dougwils.com/s7-engaging-the-culture/carve-outs-and-ghettos.html

[FundieWatcher]

This is so strange. Why would they even bother mentioning something about female police/soldiers to their readers when they don't believe women should ever be working outside the home? I'm pretty sure how you feel about female's in the army is a foregone conclusion. It is fairly safe to assume how their followers feel about anyone working for the government as well. I think they are just trying to stir the pot, get shares, start fights, etc...

[imokit]

What if the woman who is a civil engineer is working up the career path and gets a male subordinate?

What about nurses? They're a good female job, but if they have male patients then they tell them what to do in terms of meds, getting out of bed etc

I suppose these questions are why its easier to just keep them home...Now must remember to feel sensitive regarding male co-workers' masculinity when I ask them to do things for me at work tommorow :nenner:

[clueliss]

:disgust: And I'll leave it at that.

[blessalessi]

These people are total arseholes.

[Rubaiyat]

May I humbly suggest that, if the very people who spend such a tremendous amount of effort justifying, analyzing, arguing, etc...their existence down to such a degree, spent a leetle less time doing that, they would have much more energy to devote toward both a healthy sense of self, and healthy relationships with others.

That was a LOT of commas.

My point is, if I had to go on this roller coaster of effort for every damn thing in my life, I'd be ever more exhausted than I am now! I have no time to be happy! To delight in my children! To delight in my spouse! To delight in delicious food (mmmm...fooood)! I'd be angry, and frustrated, and insecure, and....well, there's the rub, isn't it?

Dudes, mellow. Stop worrying about your "manhood" and start enjoying it. I guarantee the only people questioning your manhood, are those having to listen to you pontificate at length about it!

[salsa]

May I humbly suggest that, if the very people who spend such a tremendous amount of effort justifying, analyzing, arguing, etc...their existence down to such a degree, spent a leetle less time doing that, they would have much more energy to devote toward both a healthy sense of self, and healthy relationships with others.

That was a LOT of commas.

My point is, if I had to go on this roller coaster of effort for every damn thing in my life, I'd be ever more exhausted than I am now! I have no time to be happy! To delight in my children! To delight in my spouse! To delight in delicious food (mmmm...fooood)! I'd be angry, and frustrated, and insecure, and....well, there's the rub, isn't it?

Dudes, mellow. Stop worrying about your "manhood" and start enjoying it. I guarantee the only people questioning your manhood, are those having to listen to you pontificate at length about it![/quote]

Of course you can "humbly" suggest anything you want, but I prefer boldness. :)

... and the bolded was brilliant - I think you know what I mean ;)

edited because I didn't recognize the clever double entendres the first time and wanted to give kudos.

[DomWackTroll]

Meanwhile, Tim Bayly is freaking out over the female Army Rangers:

“Yes yes, America: in time, men will be giving birth while their strong ugly wives count the minutes between contractions and hold their husband's hand. And a month later, Mr. Mom will be off in the break room pumping. It's all so wonderful! By the way, ain't it a good thing the Church in her worship has repudiated the Holy Spirit's commands concerning feminine hair length and head coverings? That alone could have been a show-stopper keeping our daughters from pursuing excellence in Rangers School.â€

baylyblog.com/blog/2015/08/news-flash-ranger-female-grads-were-absolutely-physical-studs

[DowntownAbbey]

I always find it amusing when one of fundies' biggest fears is revealed to be treated the same way they treat women.

[salex]

I always find it amusing when one of fundies' biggest fears is revealed to be treated the same way they treat women.

I have been thinking about this more and more lately--how would the men feel if we switched out the roles in the bible they were told their whole lives that they are automatically inferior to women because God says so....

They'd be declaring the bible as "written by women" as opposed to inspired immediately...

[teachergirl]

And here is why I have little hope that Jasmine Holmes will be any different than the rest,,,This is who her husband works for so, yeah, apparently Jasmine can be a teacher ( she is working as one now at the Hope Academy) but if she decided she wanted to go off and be a police officer heavens no! John Piper is an ass just like the rest.

[samurai_sarah]

(snip)

But if the men know you’re making decisions and stuff, forget it! “On the other hand, some influence is very directive and some is non-directive. For example, a drill sergeant might epitomize directive influence over the privates in the platoon. And it would be hard for me to see how a woman could be a drill sergeant — hut two, right face, left face, keep your mouth shut, private — over men without violating their sense of manhood and her sense of womanhood.â€

desiringgod.org/interviews/should-women-be-police-officers

Unsurprisingly, Doug Wilson agrees with him because Deuteronomy:

dougwils.com/s7-engaging-the-culture/carve-outs-and-ghettos.html

Whoever that is cannot have met very many women. Off the top of my head, I can think of at least ten women who'd make excellent drill sergeants. And that's just my close friends.

[Jana814]

These people are total arseholes.

Agree!!

[Growelly]

What small penises these men must have.

[DowntownAbbey]

This is generally how I imagine men like John Piper at their computers:

[ILoveJellybeans]

Whoever that is cannot have met very many women. Off the top of my head, I can think of at least ten women who'd make excellent drill sergeants. And that's just my close friends.

Hahahaha yessss, the scariest person I know is a woman who is 5ft tall at most. I would love her to introduce her to these fundie men.

[GenerationCedarchip]

This is so strange. Why would they even bother mentioning something about female police/soldiers to their readers when they don't believe women should ever be working outside the home? I'm pretty sure how you feel about female's in the army is a foregone conclusion. It is fairly safe to assume how their followers feel about anyone working for the government as well. I think they are just trying to stir the pot, get shares, start fights, etc...

John Piper is more fundie-lite than straight fundie, and his writings have reach into more mainstream churches as well. IN conservative, fundie-lite churches, being a SAHM is definitely shown preference. However, they tend to at least accept that most families nowadays are 2 income households and unlike hardcore fundies who would bend over backwards to prevent even a suggestion that a woman might work outside the home, these folks tend to find it permissible. Much ink gets spilled over how to work without sacrificing family life, or on what types of jobs women can have, though.

[16strong]

Hahahaha yessss, the scariest person I know is a woman who is 5ft tall at most. I would love her to introduce her to these fundie men.

I think a lot of smaller women are this way. They're so used to not being taken seriously because of their size that they adopt a take no prisoners attitude.

[Howl]

I suspect these kinds of "women should not be X, Y, or Z" and men should never be in a position subordinate to women means the next step is, a man can refuse supervision by a woman in the work world because of a "sincerely held religious belief."

"Sincerely held religious belief" is a wedge that will be exploited and leveraged as much as possible by religious conservatives.

[dpndetfarm]

Can be yours for three low payments of $19.99. Order before midnight tonight and I will send you my extra special cootie whistle ABSOLUTELY FREE!!!11!!!! You only pay shipping and handling.

[micatite]

I think a lot of smaller women are this way. They're so used to not being taken seriously because of their size that they adopt a take no prisoners attitude.

Uniformly the toughest female teachers I had were the tiny ones (my mother included.) You did not mess around in their classes. Ever. If you did, you would pay the price. I will never forget my Spanish teacher, who was (maybe) 5 feet tall and tiny. Some knucklehead made the mistake of swearing IN SPANISH in her class. She shot up from her desk, stalked over to him and unleashed a tidal wave of Spanish invective that practically knocked the idiota back out of his seat. The rest of us all sat back in silent awe, watching the show for minutes, until she finally wound it up and banished him from class. No idea what exactly she said, but it didn't matter...her point was well made.

[dairyfreelife]

Uniformly the toughest female teachers I had were the tiny ones (my mother included.) You did not mess around in their classes. Ever. If you did, you would pay the price. I will never forget my Spanish teacher, who was (maybe) 5 feet tall and tiny. Some knucklehead made the mistake of swearing IN SPANISH in her class. She shot up from her desk, stalked over to him and unleashed a tidal wave of Spanish invective that practically knocked the idiota back out of his seat. The rest of us all sat back in silent awe, watching the show for minutes, until she finally wound it up and banished him from class. No idea what exactly she said, but it didn't matter...her point was well made.

:whistle: *not me who is 4'11'', never like that, nope* :shifty-kitty: