Josiah Duggar Courting - Part 2

[IReallyAmHopewell]

She loves theater....tv show not being part of the deal could make her change her mind. Though what sort of a career she might think she'll get out of Reality show, I'm not sure. Maybe she could do a naked free birth on as a Very Special Episode--that might get her noticed.

As weird as Gothard's teachings are though, the "sin" could infect all of them--that might be more of the reason JB/M are pursuing the privacy thing. There's a LOT of kids to be married off. The are the "brand" Ambassadors for Gothard and need the kids to marry "right minded" cult members people.

[HarleyQuinn]

Marjorie is also still a child, so her parents could make her break it off. If she wanted to resume courting after she turned 18, would the Duggars allow it or consider it "defying her parents?"

[December]

If she does go on to marry Josiah, if I were her, I'd keep my maiden name.. just sayin'.

Haha, I'm sure that'd go well in their culture/area :roll:

If I had a dollar for every time someone random person gave me or my husband snark about our different last names... can't imagine the trouble a Duggar relation would get!

[unforgiving]

Hi, I'm new, but I just had to say.....

If Marjorie cares at all about Josiah and, more importantly herself, she should AT THE VERY LEAST put this relationship on hold until Josiah seeks professional therapy from a properly trained clinical psychotherapist.

Josiah, along with all of his siblings (including Josh) have suffered years of emotional abuse, neglect and manipulation (not to mention the physical/sexual abuse that has gone on in that house) at the hands of their asshole parents. At this stage, and without alot of ongoing therapy, I doubt any of them are capable of going on to form healthy adult relationships, and the abuse they have suffered at the hands of Boob and Michelle will continue to affect the rest of their lives.

If she breaks of this courtship, I wouldn't judge her!

[Firiel]

Hi, I'm new, but I just had to say.....

If Marjorie cares at all about Josiah and, more importantly herself, she should AT THE VERY LEAST put this relationship on hold until Josiah seeks professional therapy from a properly trained clinical psychotherapist.

Josiah, along with all of his siblings (including Josh) have suffered years of emotional abuse, neglect and manipulation (not to mention the physical/sexual abuse that has gone on in that house) at the hands of their asshole parents. At this stage, and without alot of ongoing therapy, I doubt any of them are capable of going on to form healthy adult relationships, and the abuse they have suffered at the hands of Boob and Michelle will continue to affect the rest of their lives.

If she breaks of this courtship, I wouldn't judge her!

Plenty of people who were abused are able to form healthy, adult relationships. It's best to get therapy to work through past abuse, of course, and past abuse will likely affect one's relationships in some way (more for some than others, I suspect), but someone who was abused is not automatically doomed to a life of unhealthy relationships without years and years of therapy.

[unforgiving]

Plenty of people who were abused are able to form healthy, adult relationships. It's best to get therapy to work through past abuse, of course, and past abuse will likely affect one's relationships in some way (more for some than others, I suspect), but someone who was abused is not automatically doomed to a life of unhealthy relationships without years and years of therapy.

That's true. But, in the case of the Duggar offspring, this is all they have ever really known. The emotional abuse and brainwashing they have suffered has been a part of their life, day in day out, since birth. It does appear to have outwardly affected some of them more than others, but I always thought that Josiah seemed to be one of the ones more affected by it, because he doesn't seem to fit the typical "fundie male mold" (speculation, of course, from watching the show). Josiah is actually one of my faves, and I hope that his future is a really happy one, whether or not Marjorie ends up being in it.

[Furbabies]

Haha, I'm sure that'd go well in their culture/area :roll:

If I had a dollar for every time someone random person gave me or my husband snark about our different last names... can't imagine the trouble a Duggar relation would get!

I can relate. When we bought a condo the paperwork said two single pl persons. It's a good thing though... because divorce.

[OodOnTheLoo]

That's true. But, in the case of the Duggar offspring, this is all they have ever really known. The emotional abuse and brainwashing they have suffered has been a part of their life, day in day out, since birth. It does appear to have outwardly affected some of them more than others, but I always thought that Josiah seemed to be one of the ones more affected by it, because he doesn't seem to fit the typical "fundie male mold" (speculation, of course, from watching the show). Josiah is actually one of my faves, and I hope that his future is a really happy one, whether or not Marjorie ends up being in it.

Ugh. No way would Marjorie expect him to get counseling. She's ATI even with the skinny jeans, even with the big personality and somewhat better education.

I don't think she will be a doormat though, and Josiah knows that too and that makes me like him more. I hope they stay together but I hope they have a long engagement (and sneak off for some sweet fellow shipping).

Lastly, I'm sure this has been discussed but I missed it. A few years ago Josh was asked who would be the next sibling to get married and he said Josiah. So many questions. Why Josiah? Why not Jana, JD, Jill, Jessa, Jinger Joe....? Why, why, why?

[lookinggoodforjesus]

^

I always wondered about that comment of Josh's too. Why Josiah? Is it because his parents were eager to get rid of him? Is that what marriage meant to Josh at that time? It just meant that your parents wanted you out of the house? Is Josiah particularly flirtatious? Did he express desire to get married as soon as possible?

Despite it being kind of a joke and a spontaneous comment, I feel like there's more to it. Spontaneous comments are usually the most telling. Still, it was likely a random comment. If I do remember, I think he was only asked which boy would be married next, but not 100% on that

Wow sorry for that speculation

[Arete]

Oh FFS! They are 17 and 18 years old. They have no business getting married right now. If she breaks it off, she'll be doing both of them a favor.

[lascuba]

Chances are good that Marjorie and her family are so steeped in ATI that they're of the "molestation among siblings is not that big a deal" camp, so the point is probably moot, but...

Yes, Josh's actions, and more importantly, the way Jim Bob and Michelle handled it, is absolutely a good reason for Marjorie to end things or for her parents to force it, assuming Josiah agrees with all the bullshit his parents and sisters peddled during that interview. Does he think that sexual abuse among siblings happens in 2/3 of families so it's not that bad? Does he think that touching over clothes is just curiosity over girls? Does he think that molesting one's sisters while they're sleeping isn't that serious since the victims don't even know it's happening? Does he think touching under the clothes for just a few seconds is so unimportant that it only merits one quick mention and should be ignored when talking about the ramifications of Josh's actions? Does he think it was ok for jim Bob and Michelle to do nothing except maybe pray and beat Josh when they first found out about what he was doing, that they let the abuse continue for several months until Josh confessed again? Does he think it was appropriate for his parents to forgo real, psychology help for Josh and instead send him to do hard labor?

Those questions need to be asked, because how Josiah answers will say a lot about what he would do if something similar were to happen with his own children.

[singsingsing]

I do believe that there are exceptional 17/18-year-olds who are fully capable of getting married and making it work. I also believe that there are unexceptional people of the same age who get lucky, and their marriages work not because they're particularly mature, but due to a combination of compatibility, personality, and circumstance. What I'm trying to say is that, while generally I'd agree that 18 is way too young to marry in this day and age, it has to be viewed on a case by case basis. Unfortunately Josiah and Marjorie are steeped in an incredibly unhealthy belief system and both are, to some extent, victims of a repressive cult. Just based on that, I can't imagine it would be a good idea for them to get married any time soon... but really, would the situation be much different if they were 24 and 25? They might end up with 3 or 4 fewer kids, but I doubt they'd have made great leaps in maturity or preparedness for marriage.

[actuallyjessica]

i saw a comment from a serious leghumper that said basically "the reason bad things are happening to the duggars is because josiah is courting marjorie and she wears pants" and more stuff about god punishing them and for them to seek the lord to end this.

[SassyPants]

I do believe that there are exceptional 17/18-year-olds who are fully capable of getting married and making it work. I also believe that there are unexceptional people of the same age who get lucky, and their marriages work not because they're particularly mature, but due to a combination of compatibility, personality, and circumstance. What I'm trying to say is that, while generally I'd agree that 18 is way too young to marry in this day and age, it has to be viewed on a case by case basis. Unfortunately Josiah and Marjorie are steeped in an incredibly unhealthy belief system and both are, to some extent, victims of a repressive cult. Just based on that, I can't imagine it would be a good idea for them to get married any time soon... but really, would the situation be much different if they were 24 and 25? They might end up with 3 or 4 fewer kids, but I doubt they'd have made great leaps in maturity or preparedness for marriage.

Last 1 heard a child in the US could cost their parents nearly 1 million to raise to adulthood. Even for the lackluster Duggars, it would have to cost nearly 10-20% of that...3 or 4 more is a huge deal.

[Fascinated]

i saw a comment from a serious leghumper that said basically "the reason bad things are happening to the duggars is because josiah is courting marjorie and she wears pants" and more stuff about god punishing them and for them to seek the lord to end this.

Well, there we have it. All speculation regarding letter writers and police report legalities etc. may now cease. Because, and I'm no sleuth, but didn't all the shit hit the fan shortly after pant-wearing Marjorie arrived on the scene? We should all be ashamed of ourselves for missing this obvious connection. :roll:

[HWest]

Oh FFS! They are 17 and 18 years old. They have no business getting married right now. If she breaks it off, she'll be doing both of them a favor.

The voice of reason.

[singsingsing]

Last 1 heard a child in the US could cost their parents nearly 1 million to raise to adulthood. Even for the lackluster Duggars, it would have to cost nearly 10-20% of that...3 or 4 more is a huge deal.

1 million dollars for what, though? Once you've already got a couple kids, the costs are going to go down. You've got clothing, furniture, toys, etc. that you can re-use. If you're seriously attempting to be frugal, there's a lot of cost-cutting you can do that the average parent might not bother with. If you're not enrolling your kids in sports, art classes, etc. you're saving money again. These fundies can usually find other members of their church to teach their kids music, babysit and so on for cheap. The mother's staying at home, so there's no need for daycare. And then if you're not sending your kids to college, or if you're refusing to help pay for it, that's a huge chunk of money saved.

[silverspoons]

1 million dollars for what, though? Once you've already got a couple kids, the costs are going to go down. You've got clothing, furniture, toys, etc. that you can re-use. If you're seriously attempting to be frugal, there's a lot of cost-cutting you can do that the average parent might not bother with. If you're not enrolling your kids in sports, art classes, etc. you're saving money again. These fundies can usually find other members of their church to teach their kids music, babysit and so on for cheap. The mother's staying at home, so there's no need for daycare. And then if you're not sending your kids to college, or if you're refusing to help pay for it, that's a huge chunk of money saved.

I have read these estimates for years and recently tried to add up what I think my cost was when I was thinking of moving and my kids are getting older. The largest expense is housing, It cost in my market an extra 35k to get a house with 2 extra bedrooms and a playroom and 30k to buy in the best school district. I thought about the private music and art lessons, camps, sports, furniture, clothes, and over 14-16 years for 2 kids would be 30k. Medical know from taxes 22k for 2 kids over 16 years including delivering them. Even nickel and diming food, school projects and gifts I can't come near 100k a kid and my kids have not wanted for anything. I guess the add in ivy league college and bill the kids for 1/4 of the car, electricity and gas? Both my kids have full scholarships and honestly it was not as hard as I thought but it took parental involvement and time. My daughter won a national science completion which was a bit stressful with so much travel and my son who struggled at 2 subjects we just meet with his teachers and stayed on top of every test and big assignment and made school his only priority and he got straight A's and a full scholarship. I found it crazy how some of my neighbors said their kids had to work part time grocery and fast food jobs in order to pay for their car and gas and didn't t get the grades for our state's scholarship program. So the kids make about $150 a week for a year to pay for a car and miss out on a 60-80k scholarship?

[RosyDaisy]

The secular CC my niece attends requires only a GED and passing the entrance exam. My nice graduated from a public high school and has a diploma, not a GED.

[FloraDoraDolly]

i saw a comment from a serious leghumper that said basically "the reason bad things are happening to the duggars is because josiah is courting marjorie and she wears pants" and more stuff about god punishing them and for them to seek the lord to end this.

Good grief, some of those leghumpers really are insane! At the time Josh molested five girls, Josiah would have been a six-year-old little boy and Marjorie was an even younger child who hopefully was not spending time at the Duggar house then. Unless Josiah and/or Marjorie were the ones who leaked the story to the media, this has nothing to do with them!

[shedemei]

I hope they don't break off their courtship. Neither of them deserve to pay for their parents' and brother's sins and they have every right to love each other and be happy.

[FloraKitty35]

Well, there we have it. All speculation regarding letter writers and police report legalities etc. may now cease. Because, and I'm no sleuth, but didn't all the shit hit the fan shortly after pant-wearing Marjorie arrived on the scene? We should all be ashamed of ourselves for missing this obvious connection. :roll:

According to that "logic" pants wearing women should have the same "superpowers" as the evil gays. As a bisexual pants wearing woman where are my superpowers?

[RosyDaisy]

There is money to be made in HVAC in the rural south. Three guys I went to high school with have businesses in rural areas, and are making a good middle class living. Hell, one is my go to man when I have A/C problems that my husband can't fix.

[justoneoftwo]

I have read these estimates for years and recently tried to add up what I think my cost was when I was thinking of moving and my kids are getting older. The largest expense is housing, It cost in my market an extra 35k to get a house with 2 extra bedrooms and a playroom and 30k to buy in the best school district. I thought about the private music and art lessons, camps, sports, furniture, clothes, and over 14-16 years for 2 kids would be 30k. Medical know from taxes 22k for 2 kids over 16 years including delivering them. Even nickel and diming food, school projects and gifts I can't come near 100k a kid and my kids have not wanted for anything. I guess the add in ivy league college and bill the kids for 1/4 of the car, electricity and gas? Both my kids have full scholarships and honestly it was not as hard as I thought but it took parental involvement and time. My daughter won a national science completion which was a bit stressful with so much travel and my son who struggled at 2 subjects we just meet with his teachers and stayed on top of every test and big assignment and made school his only priority and he got straight A's and a full scholarship. I found it crazy how some of my neighbors said their kids had to work part time grocery and fast food jobs in order to pay for their car and gas and didn't t get the grades for our state's scholarship program. So the kids make about $150 a week for a year to pay for a car and miss out on a 60-80k scholarship?

I have often wondered about the numbers given, supposedly without paying for education it costs $250,000-$500,000 per child to raise a kid. But if you look at the breakdown a bunch of that is for housing, what are kids adding when it comes to housing? And transportation? What additional expenses are there, sure a bit more driving, but only a small amount. . . If anyone knows how they come up with these numbers I would love to find out.

[Toothfairy]

i saw a comment from a serious leghumper that said basically "the reason bad things are happening to the duggars is because josiah is courting marjorie and she wears pants" and more stuff about god punishing them and for them to seek the lord to end this.

okay. I've seen some stupid comments from the thumpers but really? Wtf? Are they this delusional. :angry-banghead: :cray-cray: