Josiah Duggar is courting

[gustava]

No offense to Miss Jackson, but her book was self-published. I wouldn't assume that the fact that her family PAID to publish her book means that she's ever earned 1 cent of that payment back, or that she has any literary talent.

From Amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/Greatest-Book-You ... 1467595020

Paperback: 276 pages

Publisher: Marjorie Ellen Jackson (November 26, 2013)

Amazon is a venue for self=publishing. That she did so at a young age is encouraging.

[DGayle]

The more I think about it, the less goofy fundie it seems, and more outright sinister.

I hope I'm not crossing an FJ line by implying that JB is kinda shady as a parent but if I am I'm sorry.

I think a lot of us agree with you.

[NewSeasonOfLife]

My sister got married at 18, pretty much to the first guy she met at college (she literally met him on the first day of class, got engaged at Thanksgiving, married in June.) Had a daughter at 19. Divorced him quite dramatically at 23. She was nuts about him pre-wedding, but she will now be the first to tell you that she did it basically to break away from my parents, who are the most meddling fundie-lites in creation and who would have gladly married her off to her main HS boyfriend when she was 16.

And to give you hope that yes, even then it can work out in the end, she finished her undergrad online after my niece was born, got her grad degree shortly after her divorce, went on to get her PhD and is now a published author (in a non-self-published way) and a very high up civilian job in the military. And she never did get sucked back in by my parents.

FYI, one of my grandmothers married at 14 and the other at 15. One was married 60 years when her husband died, the other 45. One grandmother seemed happy and is still grieving, but the other one (the one who married at 14) flat-out said that she married young to get away from her dad, and that when my granddaddy died she would never date again because she was done with men. And she never has, even though she got lots of requests for dates.

[twinmama]

The ages make me sad, but the idea of Josiah getting away from the Duggars makes me very happy. I hope years from now he's had enough time away from them that he is finally happy (as he doesn't seem too happy with the Duggars and they seem to keep sending him away).

[DGayle]

That is not adult life. That is learning how to function by oneself

Which is adult EXPERIENCE, as I said. It's not an adult LIFE yet, but it's progress toward getting there.

[twinmama]

My gut reaction to hearing the news? Oh no. Just...nope. :(

"It's been going very well," Josiah tells PEOPLE. "I met Marjorie a few years ago, when I was taking Spanish lessons at her house and I was very impressed with the way she was with her siblings and her love for the Lord."

Not exactly the words of a man who is smitten.

In his defense, that "her love for the lord" business is the only way he knows how to express positive feelings toward someone he has a romantic relationship with. That is what they all say. He can't say "I find her super hot and I can't wait to make out with her!" or whatever a normal 18 year old would say. Wonder if she'll be a pregnant teenager, even if she's married... oy.

[VooDooChild]

Ah Geeeezzz!! :pull-hair:

Way to hobble your kids JimBoob. Ass!

I just don't know what to say about this. If this show tanks, will these kids have a chance? I hope JB has invested the TLC money and not just sat on it. With the way his uneducated unemployed family is growing I hope he has thought about how the kids will be supported in the future.

I hate that man and his bitch wife.

[twinmama]

From Benjermin's Facebook:

"Josiah is courting y'all!"

Josiah isn't courting us, you idiot! You can't call yourself a "writer" while making idiotic grammatical errors like that. Commas are important; use them. :angry-banghead:

[16strong]

What makes me so sad is that neither of these kids get a choice. Josiah HAS to get married and do odd jobs for his dad, and she HAS to have a million babies. There is no other option. And since the Duggars are on TV, the kids likely don't get the choice to remain unmarried for life, because it would look bad. I mean, check out Jim Bob all up in JD's grill about getting married. I suspect the only reason he leaves Jana alone is because she does so much work around the house.

That said, I'm fine with Josiah getting married young, if that's what he REALLY wants to do. I am not okay with an underage girl being put in the position of feeling like she has to marry the first guy that comes along. It just feels... manipulative and dirty. I've known underage people that wanted to get married, but they had options to choose otherwise and were walking into a stable living situation with good finances and jobs. Big difference.

[twinmama]

Because there's not. At 18 i am studying, going out and living life. In 2 years time, i will be doing exactly the same. I can't imagine getting married right now, and much less having kids

The craziest thing is that when I was 18 (I'm 35), I had had experiences, been places by myself, been away from my parents for college for a little bit... but I still felt like a total child. NO WHERE near marriage, for at least 5-10 years. (and I hadn't had a boyfriend or sex of any kind or even a kiss at 18) Josiah HASN'T been away from family, places by himself or away at college, but is on his way to marriage! That is the scary thing to me. He HAS to still feel like a child, since he's never known anything else, his life is the same as when he was 10.

[twinmama]

Did anyone read the comments? A lot of snarking on Jana. Hold out, Jana. I think now I have the biggest hopes for her, but perhaps they are misplaced. I really want to see her head to college but don't know if that was a internet rumor.

But a girl wearing jeans with a small for fundie family may be the best option he can get away with. With only 5 perhaps he is getting more love from her mother than he experienced from his own mother. I can only hope that he will get some loving family into the mix as I think Jessa has with Guinn.

I can't imagine Jana heading to college or anything remotely interesting. But what I do see her doing is turning down guy after guy because maybe she doesn't want a million kids and realizes the only way to avoid that is to not marry at 20. Hopefully once she's a bit older, she'll find someone she loves and marry and have the size family she wants, not the size she thinks she has to have.

[16strong]

Jana has done herself a big favor by waiting as long as possible. She has cut the number of kids she'll likely have down by several. I hope she continues to hold out. Every year not married is another baby she won't have to have. The best thing she can do is continue to make herself indispensible in running the house so they won't give her shit about being single.

[Justme]

I think Si should move in with her family, ah/la/Ben! :whistle: If this is what they truly want, I hope it works out for them. I hope they can limit children for several years until they can get on their feet. :fsm:

[veron1que]

Jana has done herself a big favor by waiting as long as possible. She has cut the number of kids she'll likely have down by several. I hope she continues to hold out. Every year not married is another baby she won't have to have. The best thing she can do is continue to make herself indispensible in running the house so they won't give her shit about being single.

If Jana holds off until 28 to start courting, she likely won't have her first kid until near 30. And then even if she did have Michelle's super fertility she'd have a max of 11 kids. If she had a fertility something like Anna's she'd end up with more like 4-6 kids.

Or maybe Jana's childfree and has sworn off marriage to avoid it. 8-)

[Chubbi]

Jana has done herself a big favor by waiting as long as possible. She has cut the number of kids she'll likely have down by several. I hope she continues to hold out. Every year not married is another baby she won't have to have. The best thing she can do is continue to make herself indispensible in running the house so they won't give her shit about being single.

I didn't look at this way, but it's definitely an interesting point.

When I first watched the Duggars, I was definitely like, "oh poor cinder-jana" and to a certain extent, I still feel that way, but OTOH I can see what you mean.

She just has to balance this carefully - making sure she has a way out when the TLC money stops flowing, because I highly doubt that Boob has invested it in anything that's not rental property, and how much money can he be making off of them if he's loaning them out like candy to the J'kids? He may be a shrewd real estate guy but he doesn't seem like the type to know much about ETFs or mutual funds.

[tabitha2]

If there is silver lining it is that they have known each other from childhood and Marj and family know exactly what she is getting into... since I don't get the impression her folks would force her into anything she is uncomfortable with she is evidently prepared for skirts only and all you can bare children. The uncanny resemblance to his oldest sisters and Anna that get me :lol:

[LongDogMom]

Not to mention, Josiah has no real world experiences, and neither does she. And their reasons for liking each other seem to fall flat -- her love of the lord? She respects his family? That's a good place to start when you're making friends, but not when you're listing them as reasons to get married.

That's always the reason they seem to give...the other person's "love of the lord" and blahblahblah. It's all so superficial. The Duggars justify the courtship rules by saying that without any physical stuff they get to know each other on a deeper level, but that is such crap because they are never, ever alone to talk about deeper stuff. Everything they say and do is monitored and they are likely on their best behaviour in front of the other person's family. How is that getting to know them on a deeper level?

To me, a deeper level is talking about your dreams and fears and stuff that's hurt you in the past, etc. I seriously doubt any of them talked about stuff like that during their courtships. They really don't get a chance to see what they are like it different situations, under stress, and so on. Plus they are so rigidly controlled religiously, that if they had doubts at all, I suspect they would be way too scared to share those in case the other person told someone else they said they had doubts!

I can't even imagine! I am so different than who I was at 17, or even 19, that it's like I'm a different person. Ditto for my kids! They are 24 and 26 and they are still changing and figuring out who they are and what they want...but they are much further along than they were at 17 or 19 and have had a whole lot more experiences going away to university, getting a degree, living on their own, one performs in two bands on a regular basis, the other just went back to school to get a second degree because he now realizes that it's more what he is interested in (although he can combine it with his other degree later). Point is...they are still changing and growing and learning. Neither of them is in a rush to get married or have kids because they know they aren't stable yet and are still in flux themselves and they both want to be more mature and settled before they take on that responsibility. I can't even imagine them getting married and maybe having kids in their teens!

I feel sorry for all these kids. They are so sheltered and restricted and there is so much out there in the world they will never get a chance to see or try or experience...unless they break away, which isn't likely to happen for most (especially if they have a bunch of kids right away).

[LongDogMom]

The one thing I was surprised about is Duggar construction? Poor Josiah. he used to do Josh's books at the car lot and wanted to be an accountant and now he is a construction worker?

Jim Bob and Michelle don't seem to give a rat's ass about what the kids want or are interested in. Most parents would be thrilled if they had a child that wanted to go into accounting. It's a good solid job with lots of work available. I don't understand why they wouldn't encourage it unless it's the whole IBLP thing about the man needing to be at home so only family run businesses are okay or something. But still! My uncle was a CPA and he worked from home. I think it's really sad that they ignore things the kids say and do nothing to encouage or support them when stuff like that comes up. :-( Seems like the kids get forced into whatever is around the JB feels is appropriate at the time. And the girls don't even have that much choice.

I think it's interesting that they never come out and say that. They dance around the issue of college and university degrees and what the kids want to be and making the girls stay at home and be mothers. They never say they force them to do that, but essentially that's what they do. They just try to project the illusion that the kids have choices and can go off to college if THEY (the kids supposedly) wanted to do so. I don't buy it for a second!

And now it looks like Josiah will be in construction and working for his Dad until the end of time.

[Rachel333]

I think it is so weird that they only get an instagram account when they start courting. Have they given a reason for that?

[veron1que]

I think it is so weird that they only get an instagram account when they start courting. Have they given a reason for that?

No. Apparently, it's one of the few things you are allowed to do during courtship.

[gezykah]

Has anybody stared taking bets yet on what sized house they'll get? I haven't had a chance to read the entire discuss yet but the first think that came to mind when I heard the news was what type of house they'll be given since they are in no way prepared to start a life together independent of their families. I'm guessing it will be slightly bigger than the Jessa/Ben, Josh/Anna house but nothing like the Jill/Derick house.

[Lucy H]

H

Omg she wears pants :o She's not a fundie? Sounds like she doesn't sit on her ass waiting for prince charming. If Josiah and his gf marry they will be teen parents. :o How in the hell can an 18yo evil no job, education, or skills support a family or a wife?

And Jana is watching her younger siblings get married and move out before her.

He could always join the military but I know that forbidden in Duggarland.

[Cleopatra7]

If Jana holds off until 28 to start courting, she likely won't have her first kid until near 30. And then even if she did have Michelle's super fertility she'd have a max of 11 kids. If she had a fertility something like Anna's she'd end up with more like 4-6 kids.

Or maybe Jana's childfree and has sworn off marriage to avoid it. 8-)

I'm beginning to think that Jana just doesn't want to go the quiverfull mom route and being a permanent SAHD is preferable to her. It reminds me of how until recently nany Catholic women would become nuns not because they had a "vocation " but because they wanted some measure of freedom to do what they wanted without being constantly pregnant or dealing with the possibility of dying in childbirth. For Jana, who has already raised a bunch of her siblings, it may be better to just stay at home. The howler and the Lost Girls can take care of themselves for the most part and even Josie doesn't need constant attention unless she has another medical emergency.

[tabitha2]

You can still be plenty fundie if you wear pants or even shorts. She will almost certainly give them up when and if they wed.

[veron1que]

I'm beginning to think that Jana just doesn't want to go the quiverfull mom route and being a permanent SAHD is preferable to her. It reminds me of how until recently nany Catholic women would become nuns not because they had a "vocation " but because they wanted some measure of freedom to do what they wanted without being constantly pregnant or dealing with the possibility of dying in childbirth. For Jana, who has already raised a bunch of her siblings, it may be better to just stay at home. The howler and the Lost Girls can take care of themselves for the most part and even Josie doesn't need constant attention unless she has another medical emergency.

I think you might be onto something. I am the closest to the Jana of my family (though I don't have near the responsibility she has). I'm the most skilled in homemaking and do the most of the household work (my mother is disabled...what's your excuse, :? Michelle?).

Anyways, my point is I don't hate doing the bulk of the cooking, cleaning, and organizing around my parent's house nor do I suffer for it. No, it's not my favorite thing and I have plans to go to medical school and travel the world, but I'm happy to move home after college for a few years. I know many people on this forum think Jana is a slave and must be miserable, but I think she's happy enough and could be satisfied never marrying.