Who, if anyone, is good enough for Jana?

[SassyPants]

Other than Jill, I do not really think any of the kids believe the BS drivel that JB has been spouting all these years...some might be brainwashed and others might repeat the party line as to not make waves. Jill I think is the one who truly believes.it.all.

I think that both JD Jana learned long ago that you attract more negative attention in Duggarville if you're controversial, so they choose to remain quiet.

Perhaps Josh and Jessa needed any kind of attention they could get, so they acted out.

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

Or maybe Jana doesn't seem particularly close to her sisters because she's a closet bitch. Maybe she isn't courting because whenever the camera is off she's busy getting the little kids to bring her Bon bons and paint her nails - and she doesn't want to give up her life of leisure. Maybe the Tinkertoy house is extra miserable right now because they have to deal not only with the Josh fall - out - but because they are stuck at home walking on eggshells to avoid dictatorial Jana's wrath.

Could be. We really don't know. :twisted:

Well, the kids did say that you know you're in trouble when Jana gets involved...

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

Completely Off Topic:

I've read quite a bit about the Tudors - specifically Henry VIII. It was my understanding that Catherine Parr wasn't actually arrested or really interrogated. A document for her arrest was apparently signed and found by one of her servants. When she found out she went into hysterics and was seen by Henry's personal Doctor because he was concerned about her. Someone (possibly the Doctor) advised her to immediately become a meek and obedient wife to save herself - she did and Henry decided against having her arrested or interrogated.

(And if I remember correctly, didn't Henry annul more than two marriages? I was pretty sure he annulled his marriage to Anne Boleyn and Catherine Howard before they were executed, but I could be wrong)

As for the last part, I agree. Harry showed poor judgement in that instance. Same with the whole partying naked in Vegas thing. People attempting to compare him to Josh Duggar are kind of making me roll my eyes right now. A really bad choice of costume is not nearly the same as sexually abusing children or incest.

Two things completely off topic:

1. Are you a whovian? I ask because "doctor" was capitalized every time you used it, and my phone autocorrects "doctor" to "Doctor" all the time because of how often I say "the Doctor."

2. I kept reading this as if she was seen to by the Doctor, and I just couldn't imagine the Doctor giving anyone the advice of saying meek and obedient ;)

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

I'm always amazed, though I do it too, by how many personality traits we imbue into these people that we only see brief images on a tv show. For example Cathy how many posts out there about how she won't put up with her grandson being raised this way or that way. Where did people get that from?

The kids are cute now and fun to insert personalities into, but when they get older and are allowed to have Instagrams, I fear many people here will be way disappointed.

It's not even just personalities they project, people here project their own reactions onto the kids. Look at how many people are ABSOLUTELY CONVINCED that Josiah was devastated and then abused after finding out about pregnancy 20. Or, how many people expected Jinger to make a run for it as soon as she turned 18 because she was a sassy teenager and everyone here likes to think they'd run if they were a Duggar. Or how many people believe that Jessa threatened to elope if she hadn't been allowed to marry Ben, which JB didn't approve of. Or how many people believed that Jessa would have never made it to the altar because she didn't want to be forced into a marriage.

And, you can already see people being disappointed by the older kids not being who they were "supposed" to be. Or, how many people are in such denial that they're still projecting personality traits that don't fit the personalities exposed through the social media accounts.

[Ella]

About Harry... considering that much of the royal family were unabashed supporters of Hitler and the Nazis (look it up) and the fact that this party took place two weeks before Holocaust Remembrance Day, yeah, bad move for a 20 year old man who was then third in line to the throne.

Don't marry him, Jana. Run!

[Anny Nym]

@Ella...

Please take your complimentary CatsWoLookLikeHitler T-Shirt and your Godwin Point cookie and leave it to that, okay? Just.leave.it.to.that!

Seriously, what is up with some people to boil everything down to "that" topic. I makes me wince to he point to bite my flocati carpet...

And now I hope for more comments on Henry the 8th, Jana and the Doctor, because that´s what I come for here.

[FloraKitty35]

Henry the 8th was indeed the first divorced head of the Anglican Church (Church of England). He divorced twice, had two of his wives executed, one died, and the one that "survived" was arrested and interrogated at one stage with the potential aim of getting rid of her for being too Lutheran/Reformed. He sure went through them! So Prince Charles will not be the first divorced head of the Anglican Church.

R.e. the Prince Harry thing, one of my friends went to the same uni, and went to several of the same parties. Apparently the whole point is to wear the most obnoxious costume you can - he said that P.H.'s wasn't anywhere near as controversial as some of the others - one he has particular respect for was an aborted fetus, done rather graphically.

Not that it's a smart idea to dress up as a Nazi when you're in the line for the English throne. It was bound to be photographed, and he should have realised that.

Especially given the fact that most of his paternal ancestors (excluding Queen Elizabeth the Queen Mother) were Germans or at least of German descent. And they have downplayed that for about 100 yrs.

[VelociRapture]

Two things completely off topic:

1. Are you a whovian? I ask because "doctor" was capitalized every time you used it, and my phone autocorrects "doctor" to "Doctor" all the time because of how often I say "the Doctor."

2. I kept reading this as if she was seen to by the Doctor, and I just couldn't imagine the Doctor giving anyone the advice of saying meek and obedient ;)

:lol:

I've actually never watched an episode of Doctor Who!!! I think I capitalize that specific word because its a title or something. I don't know, I've always just made the "D" capital.

About Harry... considering that much of the royal family were unabashed supporters of Hitler and the Nazis (look it up) and the fact that this party took place two weeks before Holocaust Remembrance Day, yeah, bad move for a 20 year old man who was then third in line to the throne.

The only British royal I am aware of (at the moment) who actually showed a good deal of support for the Nazi regime was King Edward VIII - the man who adbicated before WWII in order to marry Wallis Simpson. The Queen's parents hoped to avoid War (a common sentiment not only among the aristocracy, but among most politicians at the time) and sent birthday messages to Hitler right before the outbreak of the War. After the war began though, the royal family showed a great deal of support for their country and strength by refusing to leave London during the bombings.

So no. I don't believe that much of the British royal family were supporters of the Nazis. I believe they had extended family who were supporters, but I don't think its fair to judge the whole family based off the beliefs of others - I wouldn't want to be judged by some of the things my family says or does. If you have more information regarding additional members of the British royal family supporting the Nazis then please point me in the right direction (I do like to learn, so I would appreciate it).

Especially given the fact that most of his paternal ancestors (excluding Queen Elizabeth the Queen Mother) were Germans or at least of German descent. And they have downplayed that for about 100 yrs.

The German branch of the family comes from Queen Victoria's marriage to Prince Albert. Prince Philip is also of German descent, though I believe he is Greek by birth. Many of Philip's relatives were Nazis, but were not members of the British royal family.The family started downplaying the connection during WWI due to anti-German sentiments in Britain.

I don't see why their being of German descent should matter much. Harry is not directly descended from anyone who was a member of the Nazi party. He is related to the King and Queen of England who bravely decided to keep their family in London despite the bombings and his Grandmother (the Queen) drove ambulances during the War. I also believe his Grandfather fought for the Allies as well. So why should he be made to feel extra shame just because he happens to have German ancestry? Should I be made to feel that way because I'm a quarter German, even though my Grandfather fought for the U.S. and my family were all already in the states before the War began?

Yes, he made a really bad decision. I don't think anyone would argue that. He was born into a powerful family and he is well aware that the eyes of the world are fixed on him. He should have known better. I refuse to judge him based off this one incident though.

[VelociRapture]

It's not even just personalities they project, people here project their own reactions onto the kids. Look at how many people are ABSOLUTELY CONVINCED that Josiah was devastated and then abused after finding out about pregnancy 20. Or, how many people expected Jinger to make a run for it as soon as she turned 18 because she was a sassy teenager and everyone here likes to think they'd run if they were a Duggar. Or how many people believe that Jessa threatened to elope if she hadn't been allowed to marry Ben, which JB didn't approve of. Or how many people believed that Jessa would have never made it to the altar because she didn't want to be forced into a marriage.

And, you can already see people being disappointed by the older kids not being who they were "supposed" to be. Or, how many people are in such denial that they're still projecting personality traits that don't fit the personalities exposed through the social media accounts.

I think what bothers me most about that tendency is the fact that people are kind of doing exactly what they hate Michelle and JimBob for doing - they're telling the kids how to feel and act. I know its not exactly the same because we aren't their parents and its likely the kids will never see the stuff posted here. . . but still. How can you criticize the parents for brainwashing their kids and then turn around and put your own traits or beliefs onto the kids?

[Firiel]

Speaking of Prince Harry, I just started watching the ill-fated, poorly conceived reality show "I Wanna Marry Harry" last night. (DON'T JUDGE ME).

Maybe Jana disguised herself as a sexy but obnoxious typical American twenty-something and was actually one of the contestants on the show!

[Rajah061014]

Speaking of Prince Harry, I just started watching the ill-fated, poorly conceived reality show "I Wanna Marry Harry" last night. (DON'T JUDGE ME).

Maybe Jana disguised herself as a sexy but obnoxious typical American twenty-something and was actually one of the contestants on the show!

That was was such a guilty pleasure for me. It's absolutely ridiculous that those idiots fell for the whole thing. Quite the self-esteem boost.

[VelociRapture]

Speaking of Prince Harry, I just started watching the ill-fated, poorly conceived reality show "I Wanna Marry Harry" last night. (DON'T JUDGE ME).

Maybe Jana disguised herself as a sexy but obnoxious typical American twenty-something and was actually one of the contestants on the show!

I think I love you. Quite possibly the best thing I've read all day. :lol:

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

I think what bothers me most about that tendency is the fact that people are kind of doing exactly what they hate Michelle and JimBob for doing - they're telling the kids how to feel and act. I know its not exactly the same because we aren't their parents and its likely the kids will never see the stuff posted here. . . but still. How can you criticize the parents for brainwashing their kids and then turn around and put your own traits or beliefs onto the kids?

Oh I completely agree. I'm also always so pissed off when I seeeness comments about how the Duggar children aren't behaving as they "should" be and the expected behaviors are the ones everyone hates the Duggars thinking that people should have. Like "Jessa is an obnoxious, loud bitch. She needs to learn to keep quiet and keep sweet."

[Tiny Bubbles]

The only British royal I am aware of (at the moment) who actually showed a good deal of support for the Nazi regime was King Edward VIII - the man who adbicated before WWII in order to marry Wallis Simpson. The Queen's parents hoped to avoid War (a common sentiment not only among the aristocracy, but among most politicians at the time) and sent birthday messages to Hitler right before the outbreak of the War. After the war began though, the royal family showed a great deal of support for their country and strength by refusing to leave London during the bombings.

So no. I don't believe that much of the British royal family were supporters of the Nazis. I believe they had extended family who were supporters, but I don't think its fair to judge the whole family based off the beliefs of others - I wouldn't want to be judged by some of the things my family says or does. If you have more information regarding additional members of the British royal family supporting the Nazis then please point me in the right direction (I do like to learn, so I would appreciate it.

It has been a while since I read up on the Royal family during WWII, but I do recall that there are many apologists for the Duke of Windsor and his wife Wallis. It seems to me that there were also documents released a few years ago, after a 50-year post-war privacy ban had expired, which suggest that the Nazi party courted the Duke and Wallis after the abdication by dangling the carrot of a return to the throne in the event of a German occupation of Britain.

It remains an open question, as far as I know, of just how far their behavior went toward what would have been considered treasonous.

I also seem to recall that Hitler considered Queen Elizabeth (the "Queen Mum") to be the most dangerous woman in Europe - that in spite of her soft, smiley exterior, she was a woman of steely resolve, gifted with a remarkable understanding of public relations - someone Hitler recognized as highly dangerous to his efforts.

Before it was obvious what Naziism was all about, there were many around the world who admired its ideals, including some within the British aristocracy. Fans of large families will enjoy reading about the Mitford sisters, especially Diana (who married neo-Nazi Oswald Mosley) and Unity, who went to Germany to worship Hitler. Whew, that family makes the Duggars look positively mainstream!

Eeeep, sorry for the wall of text. Typing this has reminded me of old interests. I must go find my Sisters: The Saga of the Mitford Family by Mary Lovell for a re-read.

[VelociRapture]

It has been a while since I read up on the Royal family during WWII, but I do recall that there are many apologists for the Duke of Windsor and his wife Wallis. It seems to me that there were also documents released a few years ago, after a 50-year post-war privacy ban had expired, which suggest that the Nazi party courted the Duke and Wallis after the abdication by dangling the carrot of a return to the throne in the event of a German occupation of Britain.

It remains an open question, as far as I know, of just how far their behavior went toward what would have been considered treasonous.

I also seem to recall that Hitler considered Queen Elizabeth (the "Queen Mum") to be the most dangerous woman in Europe - that in spite of her soft, smiley exterior, she was a woman of steely resolve, gifted with a remarkable understanding of public relations - someone Hitler recognized as highly dangerous to his efforts.

Before it was obvious what Naziism was all about, there were many around the world who admired its ideals, including some within the British aristocracy. Fans of large families will enjoy reading about the Mitford sisters, especially Diana (who married neo-Nazi Oswald Mosley) and Unity, who went to Germany to worship Hitler. Whew, that family makes the Duggars look positively mainstream!

Eeeep, sorry for the wall of text. Typing this has reminded me of old interests. I must go find my Sisters: The Saga of the Mitford Family by Mary Lovell for a re-read.

Translation: The Queen Mum was a motherfucking bad ass! :lol:

In all seriousness though, I did know that the Duke and his wife were courted by the Nazis. I don't know how true it is, but I've read somewhere that the Nazis may have planned to place the ex-King back on the throne if they had managed to actually take Britain - what that would have meant for Edward's brother and his family is up to debate, but I don't think it would have been anything good and I don't know whether Edward would have been able to protect them.

One book that really interested me and taught me a lot about American attitudes before the war was, "In the Garden of Beasts" by Erik Larson. It tells the story of the American Ambassador to Berlin and his family before the outbreak of WWII - what they witnessed and how American officials in DC basically ignored their warnings because the Germans owed American banks a huge amount of money (and they didn't want to risk non-payment by pissing them off). So I'm not surprised that there were people in other countries, including Britain, who seemed to take a similar view on Hitler and Nazism.

[Tiny Bubbles]

Translation: The Queen Mum was a motherfucking bad ass! :lol:

In all seriousness though, I did know that the Duke and his wife were courted by the Nazis. I don't know how true it is, but I've read somewhere that the Nazis may have planned to place the ex-King back on the throne if they had managed to actually take Britain - what that would have meant for Edward's brother and his family is up to debate, but I don't think it would have been anything good and I don't know whether Edward would have been able to protect them.

One book that really interested me and taught me a lot about American attitudes before the war was, "In the Garden of Beasts" by Erik Larson. It tells the story of the American Ambassador to Berlin and his family before the outbreak of WWII - what they witnessed and how American officials in DC basically ignored their warnings because the Germans owed American banks a huge amount of money (and they didn't want to risk non-payment by pissing them off). So I'm not surprised that there were people in other countries, including Britain, who seemed to take a similar view on Hitler and Nazism.

Oooh, completely agree, VelociRapture - good book!!

[MichellesCrunchyHair]

Lol! I think a good number of people have a kid that they secretly cheer for. Thinking about it, I can see why people do that. You watch these kids grow up for ten or so years - its tough for people not to become attached to one or two of the kids. Jana seems easy enough to like because she's pretty, doesn't seek out the spotlight, and is on the quieter side (compared to Jill and Jessa). . . but that doesn't mean what we see of her (or the other kids) on the show is accurate. I think people just want someone to cheer for so badly that they'll overlook some aspects - like the very real possibility that Jana and all the other kids are just as Fundie as their parents.

*sigh* That explains it for me as well. At first, I just watched the show casually and thought that they were a nice, charming (if slightly odd) family. Around that time, Jessa posted that rant equating abortions with the Holocaust, and I was jolted from my warm fuzzy imaginary world. Even after the realization that I strongly disagree with them on basically everything, I think I still root for Jinger. That's probably because she hasn't said anything hateful that I'm aware of. Cue someone pointing out something terrible she's said in 3... 2... 1...

[justoneoftwo]

*sigh* That explains it for me as well. At first, I just watched the show casually and thought that they were a nice, charming (if slightly odd) family. Around that time, Jessa posted that rant equating abortions with the Holocaust, and I was jolted from my warm fuzzy imaginary world. Even after the realization that I strongly disagree with them on basically everything, I think I still root for Jinger. That's probably because she hasn't said anything hateful that I'm aware of. Cue someone pointing out something terrible she's said in 3... 2... 1...

I think every show needs heroes and villains. Without it there is just nothing to connect to.

[VelociRapture]

*sigh* That explains it for me as well. At first, I just watched the show casually and thought that they were a nice, charming (if slightly odd) family. Around that time, Jessa posted that rant equating abortions with the Holocaust, and I was jolted from my warm fuzzy imaginary world. Even after the realization that I strongly disagree with them on basically everything, I think I still root for Jinger. That's probably because she hasn't said anything hateful that I'm aware of. Cue someone pointing out something terrible she's said in 3... 2... 1...

:lol: :lol: :lol:

I don't know anything specific to ruin it for you - but I have heard one of her favorite pastimes is handing out Jebus stuff to innocent victims random bystanders. That seems more obnoxious than offensive though.

[MichellesCrunchyHair]

:lol: :lol: :lol:

I don't know anything specific to ruin it for you - but I have heard one of her favorite pastimes is handing out Jebus stuff to innocent victims random bystanders. That seems more obnoxious than offensive though.

I just poked around on the internets and couldn't find anything really objectionable. Like you said, her discussing handing out Jebus stuff with Bin is annoying, but not really quite offensive. Still rooting for Jinger until evidence dictates otherwise! :whistle:

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

I just poked around on the internets and couldn't find anything really objectionable. Like you said, her discussing handing out Jebus stuff with Bin is annoying, but not really quite offensive. Still rooting for Jinger until evidence dictates otherwise! :whistle:

The way I see it, none of those kids is going to be what we wish of them. None of them. They're all equally brainwashed, and none of them are going to get married to anyone who challenges their beliefs.

[SassyPants]

The way I see it, none of those kids is going to be what we wish of them. None of them. They're all equally brainwashed, and none of them are going to get married to anyone who challenges their beliefs.

Eh, Josie is 5 and her dad will be 50 in 3 weeks.

Plenty of time for most of those kids to deprogram and lead independent, productive lives.

[ShepherdontheRock]

Rooting for all the non Josh kids equally.

Though anything could happen, I think with which kid is gonna break off, we should expect the unexpected. So, maybe it could be Jinger or Joy, but I wouldn't rule out any of the howlers or lost girls just yet...

[Emelsu]

I don't know if this has already been talked about since I didn't look at every page...But what if the reason Jana hasn't been in a relationship is because she can't have children? It's extremely important to the Duggars for married couples to have babies. That is the main reason for marriage in many super Christian households. If she is unable to have kids for whatever reason she might not be allowed to marry. And if she has been taught that marriage is for reproducing then she might believe it as well and agree with her parents.

I don't know. Just a thought.

[jqlgoblue]

I don't know if this has already been talked about since I didn't look at every page...But what if the reason Jana hasn't been in a relationship is because she can't have children? It's extremely important to the Duggars for married couples to have babies. That is the main reason for marriage in many super Christian households. If she is unable to have kids for whatever reason she might not be allowed to marry. And if she has been taught that marriage is for reproducing then she might believe it as well and agree with her parents.

I don't know. Just a thought.

I don't think she would know if she couldn't have kids. I don't think that doctors visits of that type are likely.

I think it's much more likely she was being saved by JB for someone high up in the cult, as others have suggested (Tim Tebow, ha!). If she does have some say, then it is likely that she hasn't liked any of the options yet... I don't think many get thru the JB filter and I can see the types seeking out the Duggars not being a good fit for her (based on what we do know of her which is she doesn't seem to seek the limelight).

JB will find someone for her, it will happen in "Gods Timing" :p