Rape Is Just A ‘Learning Experience’

[doggie]

I think she regrets interviewing this asshat.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2014/12/12 ... iew-video/

On Tuesday, author Susan Patton – aka the “Princeton Mom†– joined CNN host Carol Costello for a discussion about rape – which actually ended up being an infuriating train wreck that even Costello didn’t want to be a part of.

The segment began with Patton defining the modern portrayal of rape as no big deal because rapes are usually not committed by complete strangers sexually assaulting women at gunpoint. Patton claimed that because women could just “get up and leave†a familiar face if things were going in a forceful direction, rape allegations meant far less than they did before. The author said:

“What makes this so particularly prickly is the definition of rape. It no longer is when a woman is violated at the point of a gun or a knife. We’re now talking about or identifying as rape what really is clumsy hook-up melodrama or a fumbled attempt at a kiss or a caress.

This is with a friend, this is in your own home.â€

Costello, clearly more reasonable and well-versed in the societal issues surrounding sexual assault, informed Patton that the majority of rapes – not fumbled kiss or caresses – are inflicted upon women by people they already know. This should have turned on a lightbulb, but Patton’s statements continued to get more ridiculous.

“It makes one wonder, why do you not just get up and leave? Or why do you not as a woman tell a man who’s making advances that, ‘You know what, stop, leave.’â€

She clearly doesn’t understand that you can’t just ‘ask’ a rapist to leave. Regardless of whether the perpetrator is a friend, loved one, or acquaintance, they are still a rapist if they are trying to sexually assault you. Asking them to kindly leave you alone is not going to work.

Patton also revealed that although she has spent time talking to victims, she didn’t always believe their stories – all the while denying that she was victim-blaming:

“There’s rape, and then there’s rape. I believe that she experienced something that she regretted. I believe that she got very drunk, and had sex with a man that she regretted the next morning. To me, that’s not a crime. That’s not rape. That’s a learning experience.

I’m not blaming victims, but when women accuse men of rape, when in fact, it was sort of a fumbled attempt at — when they have what I call regrettable sex, mistake sex.â€

Costello, who is actually a domestic violence survivor, argued with Patton throughout the entire segment, providing statistics and factual information from rape counselors and victims themselves. Unfortunately, it was no match for Patton’s misogynistic attitude. Exhausted and disgusted, Costello wrapped up the interview – but not before Patton could drop this gem:

[anjulibai]

Wow...

[polecat]

What makes this so particularly prickly is the definition of rape. It no longer is when a woman is violated at the point of a gun or a knife.

This has never been the definition of rape, afaik. Rape is having sex with someone against their will. It doesn't require a gun or knife. It doesn't even have to involve force. It's having sex with someone who doesn't want to have sex with you.

I wonder how she could dismiss such a betrayal by someone who is a friend just because, oh, hey, it's a friend, so no biggie. :?

[DGayle]

Regrettable sex isn't rape. Regrettable sex is consenting, then the next morning, wishing you hadn't for whatever reason. It sucked, you had a lapse in good judgement, you both drank and had beer goggles on (no, not all drunk sex is rape), whatever. RAPE includes an element of force, whether physical, coercion, whatever.

How frightening that Patton doesn't get it.

[ViolaSebastian]

Why can't Princeton keep this unfortunate woman from using its name? I'd be terribly embarrassed if I were on the Princeton administration right now.

[anjulibai]

“It makes one wonder, why do you not just get up and leave? Or why do you not as a woman tell a man who’s making advances that, ‘You know what, stop, leave.’â€

Isn't that kind of the point? Women do say stop, leave, no, don't, and the rapist doesn't.

I mean, does she think saying stop always works? How can see be so stupid?

That's the entire freaking reason we call it rape!!! :sick:

[salex]

If she thinks it would require a knife or gun for a man to overpower a woman, she must be very tall, very ripped, very strong and very--- stupid.

[thoughtful]

Unbelievable. After watching the video, I have to say that it was even worse than it appears in print.

For anyone wondering about that last quote that didn't get into Doggie's post:

Costello, who is actually a domestic violence survivor, argued with Patton throughout the entire segment, providing statistics and factual information from rape counselors and victims themselves. Unfortunately, it was no match for Patton’s misogynistic attitude. Exhausted and disgusted, Costello wrapped up the interview – but not before Patton could drop this gem:

“I didn’t say it was your fault, I said you could have prevented it.â€

:angry-banghead:

I wish there was a "patience and courage with asshole interviewees" journalism award -- I'd give one to Carol Costello.

[GolightlyGrrl]

How did a mind-numbingly stupid woman like Susan Patton get into Princeton?

[anjulibai]

How did a mind-numbingly stupid woman like Susan Patton get into Princeton?

I think it was her kids that were at Princeton. I'm not sure if she actually went there.

[doggie]

Unbelievable. After watching the video, I have to say that it was even worse than it appears in print.

For anyone wondering about that last quote that didn't get into Doggie's post:

:angry-banghead:

I wish there was a "patience and courage with asshole interviewees" journalism award -- I'd give one to Carol Costello.

I bet she wished she could bang that Woman's head against the desk a few times

[patsymae]

This is such a huge, huge trigger for me (for the obvious reasons), but alas, it's not that unusual, and sadly it's not unusual coming from women.

Not only do they define rape as only at knifepoint, etc., but even with that level of stranger violence, such as in my situation in a home invasion in my own home, I've had women, including some that I considered good friends, tell me "I wouldn't let myself get raped."

Yeah, because it's a choice. And I apparently made the wrong one.

I've had some much younger male friends express to me their astonishment that WOMEN react that way--sort of like, I can understand why men might say that, but WOMEN?

The only thing I can think of is that it's fear. If rape is a choice, then if I chose not to be raped, I won't be. If she got raped because she wore that red dress/had to much to drink/went to a man's home/let him drive me home, and I don't do those things, then I won't be raped.

Dream on.

[Burris]

Excerpt from this thread, as written by Old Sock:

I'm lucky in that I never suffered sexual abuse as a child. If I had, the answer I would have gotten for sharing is that 'we don't talk about those things; it happens to many people; leave it alone.'

I thought the attitude was cultural. Turns out it just boils down to the fact some people are assholes.

About a year ago now, my mother – graduate of the same school of cultural stoicism that created a thing like me – made an admission that caused my blood to run cold. I fear to over-share anywhere, but especially on the internet, but perhaps it is time for anyone thus wronged to stand up and be counted. I wish I could do so under my usual name, but I do not have my mother's permission and my name here is tied to my actual name IRL.

I was borne of a sexual assault – one even US politicians would recognize as “legitimate†rape. My mother thought I would hate her; blame her. I told her I was glad she finally said this thing, so I could assure her it was not her fault – that the perpetrator has 100% of all the blame and none left to go around. In an odd way, it seemed to calm her and now she carries herself a bit differently – just a small fraction taller than she once did.

Was my birth merely a continuation of his crime, I wondered? My mother says no. But I don't wholly believe her. I cannot imagine she would ever say yes.

Look at what silence did to my mother; how it left her prey to a cruel man like the one she married merely because she thought she was damaged goods. And it impacted my life as well, long before I ever realized how or why.

This is not rocket science, Susan Patton:

If a man puts his gross, diseased penis in an unwilling woman's vagina, that is rape. having sex with a heavily inebriated / unconscious woman who dared to drink in her own home allegedly surrounded with friends, the perpetrator is committing rape.

If the woman wakes up and the rapist covers her mouth to finish his work, that's rape.

Sexual conduct with people who do not or can not consent is - everyone say it with me, now - RAPE!

This isn't up for a fucking debate.

It's a testament to a sickness in our culture when an idiot such as Patton gets air time at all.

[Toothfairy]

So I guess if she got rape it will just be a learning experience. Or what if her kids were raped? Or what about childhood rape? Is it just a learning experience? My gosh people can't get any stupider.

[doggie]

So I guess if she got rape it will just be a learning experience. Or what if her kids were raped? Or what about childhood rape? Is it just a learning experience? My gosh people can't get any stupider.

[Burris]

Never say that you will be proven wrong over and over.

[Terrie]

.... So the learning experience is that some people are disgusting and should be not allowed out in public? I feel dirty having read her comments.

[browncoatslytherin]

i think the learning experience is that susan patton is an absolute fucking idiot

[artdecades]

Regrettable sex isn't rape. Regrettable sex is consenting, then the next morning, wishing you hadn't for whatever reason. It sucked, you had a lapse in good judgement, you both drank and had beer goggles on (no, not all drunk sex is rape), whatever. RAPE includes an element of force, whether physical, coercion, whatever.

How frightening that Patton doesn't get it.

[doggie]

well she is back and worse then ever. now sexual assault is just bad manors and we should not teach children to not do it.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2015/01/06 ... ise-video/

Author Susan Patton aka the “Princeton Mom†previously made waves on CNN for referring to rape as “a learning experience.†On Tuesday, Patton delivered another zinger on a Fox & Friends segment, which debated whether or not young children should be educated about rape in schools. Patton’s take? Absolutely not – because sexual assault is really just “bad manners.â€

[bBvideo 560,340:3pmco4gb]

[/bBvideo]

[meep]

{L_MESSAGE_HIDDEN}:

Seriously? I have one family members who was raped twice - once by a stranger at knife point; and once by a family member by sheer bodily force. She doesn't see one as rape and one as not rape. She doesn't see one rape as being worse than the other. Ugh.

[Idolatry]

Why can't Princeton keep this unfortunate woman from using its name? I'd be terribly embarrassed if I were on the Princeton administration right now.

I have no idea. They should have shut it down when that stupid marrying book came out and she went on a press blitz. She did actually go to Princeton, but still, god.

[ExMW]

Dear Lord, that woman is a disgrace for all IPV survivors everywhere.

[eri]

Someone had been listening too much to their fundie MRA hubs.

[Howl]

This woman is doing more damage than she can ever imagine, and her idiocy is just an extension of the "legitimate rape" conversation.

"Princeton" is a gratuitous reference used for leverage to give some legitimacy to her idiotic comments; without it, she'd get no media traction.