Is something wrong with Erin Bates?

[808s&Heartbreak]

Why does she talk like a 12 year old? I know she went to college and was crazy sheltered, but damn. She must've experienced some serious development stunting, none of the other bates kids seem like that.

[singsingsing]

What do you mean? She has a high girly voice and a pretty intense Tennessee accent but other than that she sounds normal enough?

[jerkit]

Yeah, I don't see that. She's sort of childish, but not in a Pris "is there something wrong with her" kind of way.

[Firiel]

I thought for sure this would be asking if Erin is infertile because she hasn't announced another pregnancy. I was prepared to roll my eyes. But this calls for at least three eye rolls. :roll: :roll: :roll:

[Closed Womb]

I think that fundies believe that soft, submissive, childlike voices are attractive. So, it could be learned. But, I teach at a major public university and I can assure you that some people just speak like that. Either way, it's not representative of a disorder.

Honestly, I'd take that voice any day over vocal fry, the current affectation young women (and a few men) strive for.

[eh02]

I actually think Erin has her shit together more than most female fundies her age and is pretty emotionally mature. She seems focused and driven when it comes to the things that are important to her.

I don't think she sounds childish personally - definitely nothing like Priscilla. I'd say all of the adult Bates women are better at stringing together an intelligent sentence than most of the Duggars. (Unless you meant that you think their accent makes them sound unintelligent or childish, but that's ridiculous IMO)

[Georgiana]

People tend to mimic the speech styles of the communities they belong to/identify with. This is more than just regional accent, because different groups within one region will have quite different speech styles (think socio-economic groups, racial/cultural groups, etc. etc.).

Erin belongs to a group where almost ALL of the women speak in this manner. She doesn't do it because she's dumb. She doesn't do it because there is something wrong with her. She does it because that is how women from her cultural group talk. Similarly, someone who speaks in African American Vernacular English is not dumb, uneducated, or anything else. They simply belong to a group where this speech style is used, and prefer to express themselves in a manner that is familiar and identifies with their own cultural identity.

To give another example, women in my linguistic region speak at the base of our register(low) and tend to have slightly "gravelly" sound production with minimal inflection. To outsiders, this sounds "sad, depressed". But I don't talk that way because I am sad or depressed, that is simply how women from my region talk. I CAN standardize, speak higher, add inflection to my speech, etc., but generally I don't. Language is a huge part of cultural identity, and I don't like to talk like someone I'm not.

[realist51]

To give another example, women in my linguistic region speak at the base of our register(low) and tend to have slightly "gravelly" sound production with minimal inflection. To outsiders, this sounds "sad, depressed". But I don't talk that way because I am sad or depressed, that is simply how women from my region talk. I CAN standardize, speak higher, add inflection to my speech, etc., but generally I don't. Language is a huge part of cultural identity, and I don't like to talk like someone I'm not.

Georgiana, What part of the country are you from? I find this topic fascinating, but I can't place the region/vocal quality you're talking about. I'm thinking central mountains or southern midwest.

[ILoveJellybeans]

No, I don't think so. Shes fine. I don't think theres anything wrong with her, its just her accent.

[Georgiana]

Georgiana, What part of the country are you from? I find this topic fascinating, but I can't place the region/vocal quality you're talking about. I'm thinking central mountains or southern midwest.

Northwest! Specifically an urban, Seattle dialect :) I can't find the article that specifically talks about the hallmarks of female speech, but I'll keep looking. It was fascinating as the author hypothesized that Northwest urban women speak low in order to sound more educated, be taken more seriously, and seem more powerful...a direct contrast to the childish/high style espoused by many fundies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacific_Northwest_English

EDIT: I found one that references it. The original article is no longer online, but it is reprinted here (CASCADIA 5EVA!)

http://republic-of-cascadia.tripod.com/ ... glish.html

EDIT2: It talks about creaky voicing but doesn't talk about why women especially prefer it (besides the 14 vowels)

[acheronbeach]

If you watch her hair tutorials on Youtube, she sounds quite normal and adult to me, in tone, confidence and vocabulary. Way more normal than a lot of the fundie women we discuss - I'm side-eyeing Michelle and Priscilla.

[August]

People tend to mimic the speech styles of the communities they belong to/identify with. This is more than just regional accent, because different groups within one region will have quite different speech styles (think socio-economic groups, racial/cultural groups, etc. etc.).

Erin belongs to a group where almost ALL of the women speak in this manner. She doesn't do it because she's dumb. She doesn't do it because there is something wrong with her. She does it because that is how women from her cultural group talk. Similarly, someone who speaks in African American Vernacular English is not dumb, uneducated, or anything else. They simply belong to a group where this speech style is used, and prefer to express themselves in a manner that is familiar and identifies with their own cultural identity.

To give another example, women in my linguistic region speak at the base of our register(low) and tend to have slightly "gravelly" sound production with minimal inflection. To outsiders, this sounds "sad, depressed". But I don't talk that way because I am sad or depressed, that is simply how women from my region talk. I CAN standardize, speak higher, add inflection to my speech, etc., but generally I don't. Language is a huge part of cultural identity, and I don't like to talk like someone I'm not.

Which region is it? I get them relatively iften on call center calls and it drives me crazy. They sound like they checked out three hours ago and I'm interrupting reals housewives or something. Worst customer service accent EVER.

ETA. Interesting, I wouldn't characterise the Seattle accent as inflectionless at all.

[Walking Cat Bed]

Northwest! Specifically an urban, Seattle dialect :) I can't find the article that specifically talks about the hallmarks of female speech, but I'll keep looking. It was fascinating as the author hypothesized that Northwest urban women speak low in order to sound more educated, be taken more seriously, and seem more powerful...a direct contrast to the childish/high style espoused by many fundies.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pacific_Northwest_English

EDIT: I found one that references it. The original article is no longer online, but it is reprinted here (CASCADIA 5EVA!)

http://republic-of-cascadia.tripod.com/ ... glish.html

EDIT2: It talks about creaky voicing but doesn't talk about why women especially prefer it (besides the 14 vowels)

One of my grad school friends is studying vocal fry! She talks about it a lot on her blog: beyondthefourthfloorblog.com/2014/06/06/vocal-fry-hireability/

[Georgiana]

Which region is it? I get them relatively iften on call center calls and it drives me crazy. They sound like they checked out three hours ago and I'm interrupting reals housewives or something. Worst customer service accent EVER.

ETA. Interesting, I wouldn't characterise the Seattle accent as inflectionless at all.

It's not inflection-less, but compared to other dialects (Southern CA, Southern US, etc) there tends to be less inflection. When I first moved to LA for school, I was amazed at how far people's voices go up and down.

Also, there's diversity among dialects! Especially in Seattle, there is a difference between how people with Seattle native and non-native parents talk. And the lack of inflection could be specific to the neighborhood I grew up in, as I do know of another area (which is wealthier) that has more inflection. And age tends to impact things as well!

In fact, lack of inflection could even be contained so narrowly as to say that it is only found in people from the same neighborhood as me, who went to private high schools within a certain radius, and were exposed either as children to grunge-Seattle. Aka it is specifically my peer group, but not characteristic of the accent as a whole. I'm not sure, but I do know that ALL my non-Seattlite friends comment on it when they come up to visit!

[realist51]

I raised my kids in Southern California; and I must say, the vocal fry has to be the WORST vocal affectation. (And now I have to listen to it all the time.)

[DGayle]

I raised my kids in Southern California; and I must say, the vocal fry has to be the WORST vocal affectation. (And now I have to listen to it all the time.)

It's grating, and honestly, if I was hiring, and the choice was between someone who sounded like nails on a chalkboard, or someone who didn't, I'd go with the person who doesn't make me involuntarily cringe my way into a migraine. I'm sure someone's going to think I'm a vocalist asshole for that, but I don't care. Apparently I'm not the only person annoyed by this trend.

My natural speaking voice is a lot like Erin's. When I was working in business, I learned to adopt a mature sounding voice. The movie Anchorman has a scene where Veronica says she's going to work on her non-regional dialect. Part of business is accepting some level of conformity when you're in the workplace. Off the clock, I can sound like a kid all I want, but when I was on it, I needed to sound like a grown up right on down to ditching words that weren't professional.

That's just how it is.

[fun2beme]

My voice is naturally high and "chipmunk-y," nothing I can do about it but when I meet people in person for the first, who I've only communicated with over the phone, they're always surprised that I'm well past my 20s.

Ironic topic because I was listening to the Alvin & the Chipmunks' Christmas song today and remembering how my friend's husband used to ask me over and over to do the "I still want a hoooola hoop" line.

[Pretzel]

My voice is naturally high and "chipmunk-y," nothing I can do about it but when I meet people in person for the first, who I've only communicated with over the phone, they're always surprised that I'm well past my 20s.

Ironic topic because I was listening to the Alvin & the Chipmunks' Christmas song today and remembering how my friend's husband used to ask me over and over to do the "I still want a hoooola hoop" line.

{L_MESSAGE_HIDDEN}:

My voice is generally not pleasant. But it gets worse when I get excited or worked up about something. Someone once told me in my face that I sounded like nails scratching a black board. Like I have any control over this.

My solution has been to coerce myself into speaking low and hushing myself. I try to avoid intonation when I remember.

It's not fun to be bullied because of something you can't change (or of anything else).

Just leave Erin alone. In the fundie spectrum, she's a normal girl.

[RosyDaisy]

People tend to mimic the speech styles of the communities they belong to/identify with. This is more than just regional accent, because different groups within one region will have quite different speech styles (think socio-economic groups, racial/cultural groups, etc. etc.).

Erin belongs to a group where almost ALL of the women speak in this manner. She doesn't do it because she's dumb. She doesn't do it because there is something wrong with her. She does it because that is how women from her cultural group talk. Similarly, someone who speaks in African American Vernacular English is not dumb, uneducated, or anything else. They simply belong to a group where this speech style is used, and prefer to express themselves in a manner that is familiar and identifies with their own cultural identity.

To give another example, women in my linguistic region speak at the base of our register(low) and tend to have slightly "gravelly" sound production with minimal inflection. To outsiders, this sounds "sad, depressed". But I don't talk that way because I am sad or depressed, that is simply how women from my region talk. I CAN standardize, speak higher, add inflection to my speech, etc., but generally I don't. Language is a huge part of cultural identity, and I don't like to talk like someone I'm not.

I agree. I live in northern AL, have a very strong southern redneck accent, and I am college educated. My accent is part of my culture as well. At work or in a professional setting I speak more clearly so others can understand me, but I still have a southern accent.

[nelliebelle1197]

Love it when people start annoying topics then disappear, don't you?

[polecat]

One of my grad school friends is studying vocal fry! She talks about it a lot on her blog: beyondthefourthfloorblog.com/2014/06/06/vocal-fry-hireability/

Just dropping in to say I <3 that blog. Super interesting! Thanks for sharing!

[HereticHick]

Love it when people start annoying topics then disappear, don't you?

Yes, indeedy. I certainly inferred that the original poster was implying that strong Appalachian accent=mentally challenged.

Bless Her Heart.

[FeministShrew]

I'm an Upstate South Carolina native. I have a very soft, high-pitched voice, & a strong accent. On the phone people think I'm a little girl. In person sometimes people just can't hear me speaking. It's annoying, frustrating & embarrassing.

My ex-fiance's mother & sister have "normal" voices & not much regional accent. They're Southern Baptist. Both of them use that whiny little-girl voice around the dad. Annoyed the shit out of me. They would be speaking normally, he'd walk in & they'd start cooing. I was feeling particulary bitchy one day & commented on it. Uncomfortable silence.

[RosyDaisy]

Southern, country, redneck, Appalachian accents do not mean lack of intelligence. However, I do find the Bates kids lacking in education. It's not because of their accent. It's because of SOTDRT and lack of true life experiences like going to college, getting real jobs (not the ones the supposedly do per Kelly's blog), and living on their own.

[Rescinded and Mended]

Most fundie girls and women sound younger to me. Not developmentally off, but like they are anywhere from 10-13 instead of 18-25. Erin sounded like that to me in her wedding episode.

But I figured that had more to do with the fact that they all hear so much of the baby talk and "keep sweet" tone of voice from their mothers while growing up than anything else.