New swag from the Botkinettes!

[Marian the Librarian]

After months of radio silence, there are four new MP-3 files from A-S and E - the first two are free!!!

westernconservatory.com

"It's Not About Staying at Home"

If you think God’s plan for young women is all about being modest, keeping pure, staying home, preparing for marriage, and waiting for Prince Charming… you will not like this message. But...

If you’re tired of a small and fruitless vision for single womanhood, and are wondering if God might want more from you…

If you’re frustrated with a lack of fruitfulness, real-world involvement, and opportunities to grow, be stretched, and exercise your gifts…

If you’re sick of legalism, idolatry, formulas, movements, bandwagons, Christian-subculture trends and man-made rules, and just want to get back to God’s timeless principles for young womanhood…

Or if you’re just trying to figure out what you believe and why…

…take a step back with Anna Sofia and Elizabeth, away from the narrow applications and movement trends, and reexamine the baseline biblical principles that should form the foundation of our vision of single womanhood. Discover a robust vision of spreading the gospel, serving the saints, reaching out to the poor and needy, being full of good works, exercising your gifts, strengthening your arms, working with your hands, making the most of your single years, seeking first the Kingdom of God, and more!

In this message, the Botkin sisters reexamine hot button issues like a father’s authority, marriage, singleness, college, jobs, ministry, giftedness, Phariseeism, pursuing fruitfulness rather than just safety, serving our families vs. serving other people, why feminism is not the big enemy, and of course, “staying at home.†Prepare to be more excited about being a single Christian young woman than you’ve ever been before!

"Good Girls and Problem Guys: Taking the Moral High Ground With Men Who Are in Sin"

You’re a solid young Christian woman. You’re committed to purity and wholesome relationships. You don’t hang out with “bad†guys. And you suddenly find yourself dealing with a guy who’s trying to play you, manipulate you, use you, entice you, or even abuse you. What do you do?

It’s dangerously naïve to deny that predators, manipulators, abusers, playboys, wolves, stalkers, and creeps haunt every circle – as do good guys simply having a hard time mastering their sin nature. And though we’re never responsible for sins men commit, it’s time to know our own power to resist and rebuke evildoers.

Drawing lessons from how Abigail and Bathsheba each responded to the same godly man when he was off the path, Anna Sofia and Elizabeth clear away legalistic relationship rules and formula-based approaches to “purity,†and focus on how to become a woman with the confidence to put the fear of God into men who are in sin. Hear straight talk on self-defense, dealing with a flirt, how not to be a doormat, a woman’s rights and recourses for resisting, combating manipulation, becoming spiritually strong, and the gospel’s hope for moving on from our own past mistakes.

"How to Develop Your Gifts Within the Family Economy"

Have you ever struggled with purpose and fruitfulness? Yearned to use your single years more fully? Wondered how God wants to see you developing your gifts and using them for Him? Questioned how principles of home-based womanhood can really work out practically in tough financial situations and a failing economy? Then this talk was given for you. In this inspiring, practical, and game-changing message by Anna Sofia and Elizabeth Botkin, discover the missing keys to a vibrant, fruitful (and economically viable) life.

"Adventurous Femininity"

If you've ever felt frustrated by a mold of "biblical" femininity that seems small, weak, mousy, or useless, maybe it's time to re-examine what characteristics God praises in a woman, and the forgotten reason God created woman in the first place -- to stand at man's side in adventure, discovery, progress, dominion work, and spreading the gospel. In this inspiring, humorous, and life-changing message by Anna Sofia and Elizabeth Botkin, get challenged to go beyond your comfort zone; be introduced to a handful of adventurous heroines from history; be encouraged to embrace a more full-orbed picture of biblical womanhood; and prepare to have all your stereotypes of femininity smashed (with a tent-peg).

Methinks #2 might possibly be a veiled response to the DPIAR scandal...

[DomWackTroll]

"...to stand at man's side in adventure, discovery, progress, dominion work, and spreading the gospel..."

Funny, I don't recall them standing at Isaac's side when he was gallivanting all over the world making his "documentaries." I recall them sitting at home in front of their computer screens.

And their attempt to distance themselves from Doug is laughable.

[FundieWatcher]

Too little, too late. It is just lip service, trying to react to the recent scandals and address their relationship status.

I wonder if they give real ideas on how to help the poor. I mean, I imagine becoming a public health doctor or nurse is out. And of course teaching and social work in schools with high poverty isn't going to happen. They can't be preachers. And certainly they would never join the Peace Corps or AmeriCorps, etc...You need education and life experiences to help people recover from drug/alcohol addiction. So how do they help?

Similar to Bria Crawford saying she is going to mentor girls who were sex trafficking victims. How? How are you going to help women become independent and gain job skills?

[socalrules]

They all seem to be saying the same thing. How to stay biblically pure while looking for ways to fill my day since everything I need to know to take care of a household I learned when I was 8.

How many of these cds and books do fundies need that all say the same thing?

[Howl]

or, We're Officially Stay at Home Christian Spinsters & Its Sooooo Awesome. It seems they are coming to terms with their single status being a permanent condition, rather than time spent living at home that will transition to marriage. Sad.

Have you "Questioned how principles of home-based womanhood can really work out practically in tough financial situations and a failing economy?"

Decoded: How to Scam Christians Into Giving You Money, All from Your Home Computer.

[AnnaSofia]

I have to wonder if the months of silence aren't just sheer burnout. They rehash the same topics ad nauseam, only extending the subject matter a bit after they've been tainted by association (Dougie), or in an attempt to maintain a roll within the family brand that they've long grown out of by now. It has to be both exhausting, and humiliating.

[Coco]

Whoo hoo! So they finally decided to acknowledge their idiocy. Way to roll under both sides of the fence you created, girls.

I love the scare quotes around "staying at home".

Hearing this one would be fun, to actually see what they say about college, why feminism is not the enemy, and fathers' authority.

After months of radio silence, there are four new MP-3 files from A-S and E - the first two are free!!!

westernconservatory.com

"It's Not About Staying at Home"

[FundieWatcher]

I'm listening to the first one now. They say they were wrong about a lot. They say they never invented the term "stay at home daughter", their critics did. They say they are sick of being known as the girls who do nothing. They say they don't believe women working is a sin. I don't know if I'll make it through the whole hour but I'm glad they admit they got some Bible stuff wrong. They are still against traditional university education. But they talk about several others ways you can a "home based higher education".

[anjulibai]

Wow, they are certainly changing their tunes. Lovely they admitted they were wrong, but how many young girls' lives did they mess up with their rhetoric?

[Jasmar]

How do those two not choke on their own hypocrisy? It's sickening. And the entire presentation devoted to explaining why Lourdes is ultimately responsible for her victimization is repulsive.

I hope their blessed ovaries rot.

[Miggy]

My attitudes and opinions changed many times from my late teens, through my twenties and to where to Botkins are now. The difference is that I didn't write books or give lectures and let my still-developing-ideas affect the lives of other people.

I will not criticise the Botkins for changing their opinions. I will criticise their parents for putting them out there before they were developed enough to think for themselves or with any life experience!

[DomWackTroll]

It's the half-assed way they admit to being wrong that drives me nuts. "We sometimes put too much of our faith in leaders..."

Um, no... You were the leaders!

[FundieWatcher]

I don't know which one was talking, but one them says she bears more fruit single then she would if she was married. And she will only get married if the man can help her bear even more fruit than she already does.

Many times they address the Doug situation without out right saying it. Including saying fathers should know who their daughters are chatting with in the middle of the night. And that fathers are the ones that are legally (in the Bible) responsible for their daughters staying chaste. And stoning may or not still be acceptable.

[Joan of Snarc]

There's so much use of the phrase "your single years." It's as if they think there will be an end to them.

:lol:

Also, for overuse of the word "fruitful," you FAIL, Botkinettes.

[RosyDaisy]

After months of radio silence, there are four new MP-3 files from A-S and E - the first two are free!!!

westernconservatory.com

"It's Not About Staying at Home"

"Good Girls and Problem Guys: Taking the Moral High Ground With Men Who Are in Sin"

"How to Develop Your Gifts Within the Family Economy"

"Adventurous Femininity"

Methinks #2 might possibly be a veiled response to the DPIAR scandal...

That and maybe they were possible victims of DPIATR, and that's why they moved to Tennessee? Or Daddy Botkin knew all along what was going on with DPIATR, and didn't want his daughters near him.

[DomWackTroll]

I don't think Geoff knew there was any sexual abuse going on, but I think he knew some kind of scandal with Doug was bound to happen sooner or later.

[LilMissMetaphor]

You’re a solid young Christian woman.

Word choice. It's important.

[Howl]

I don't have time or inclination to listen to these two twits, but isn't it more interesting to note what isn't changing in their supposed evolution?

I suspect It is simply more interior decorating rather than moving out of the house (literally), i.e., no real change.

[RosyDaisy]

I don't think Geoff knew there was any sexual abuse going on, but I think he knew some kind of scandal with Doug was bound to happen sooner or later.

I disagree. Something caused a rift beteen DPITR and Geoff. If I'm not mistaken, didn't Voddie leave around the same time? Given what we know now, I think it's entirely possible. Church gossip spreads faster than germs and wildfires.

[DomWackTroll]

I disagree. Something caused a rift beteen DPITR and Geoff. If I'm not mistaken, didn't Voddie leave around the same time? Given what we know now, I think it's entirely possible. Church gossip spreads faster than germs and wildfires.

I'm not saying it isn't possible, but it's also quite possible that it was simply a personality issue (and a vague feeling of "something's not right here"). Doug wanted to be surrounded by bootlickers like Bradrick, Coghlan, and Sarratt, but Geoff and Voddie are alphas who will never lick anyone's boots. Both Geoff and Voddie sucked up to Doug just long enough to get "famous enough" and then slowly tapered off their interactions with him. If it had been about sexual abuse, I think it would have been a more sudden split. But God knows I've been wrong before when it comes to these freaks.

[uber frau]

I'm not saying it isn't possible, but it's also quite possible that it was simply a personality issue (and a vague feeling of "something's not right here"). Doug wanted to be surrounded by bootlickers like Bradrick, Coghlan, and Sarratt, but Geoff and Voddie are alphas who will never lick anyone's boots. Both Geoff and Voddie sucked up to Doug just long enough to get "famous enough" and then slowly tapered off their interactions with him. If it had been about sexual abuse, I think it would have been a more sudden split. But God knows I've been wrong before when it comes to these freaks.

I agree-I think they would have been out of there like a shot if they'd had any definite evidence. And I think they would have been a whole lot more vocal about it too. I think the spotlight was never big enough for any of them to share for long. I'm sure they all have a history of shedding their 'friends'/collegues/whatever you want to call them when they see fit. DPIAT(&R) certainly does.

I do wonder why G-Bot ever agreed to share it with DPIAT(&R) at all, TBH. I thought he'd made enough of a name for himself before he came back from NZ, unless he came back with his tail between his legs and he felt he needed to reinvent himself.

[danvillebelle]

I'd like to be happy for them that they MAYBE seem to be seeing the light. But I trust them about as far as I can throw them. They're still about scamming Christian women (young or old) out of their money for their so-called expert advice. Same shit, different day.

They did a LOT of damage and that damage is done. What are they going to do, tell every family that owns a copy of So Much More "hey, throw that out, we were wrong"? Recall all the DVDs of Return of the Daughters? I'm sure they're gnashing their teeth over the latter anyway, since DPIAT is on the special features, waxing rhapsodic on Biblical daughterhood.

[FundieWatcher]

They backed the crazy train up, but only a little. 90% of it is more of the same.

They also talk about how misunderstood they were. Well why didn't you correct all these people that misunderstood you? They talk about crazy email questions about modesty, college, work etc. they receive and how their point is constantly missed. Well you have a blog, you couldn't have addressed this issue before?

[louisa05]

My attitudes and opinions changed many times from my late teens, through my twenties and to where to Botkins are now. The difference is that I didn't write books or give lectures and let my still-developing-ideas affect the lives of other people.

I will not criticise the Botkins for changing their opinions. I will criticise their parents for putting them out there before they were developed enough to think for themselves or with any life experience!

Evangelicalism has a weird love affair with very young people dispensing advice about things they know nothing about. The Botkinettes are one example. Or there was very young and single Josh Harris explaining how to (not) date in order to have a successful marriage. I sat through chapel services at Christian school where the speakers were teenage students talking about how they and their peers should interact in the workplace someday or some such thing they knew absolutely nothing about. Then grown adults who should have known better would praise them because "the spirit gave them wisdom" when there was no wisdom involved at all.

It is very strange and I have never figured out why it is so common.

[Marian the Librarian]

I'm listening to the first one now. They say they were wrong about a lot. They say they never invented the term "stay at home daughter", their critics did. They say they are sick of being known as the girls who do nothing. They say they don't believe women working is a sin. I don't know if I'll make it through the whole hour but I'm glad they admit they got some Bible stuff wrong. They are still against traditional university education. But they talk about several others ways you can a "home based higher education".

Bullshit. They may not have invented it, but they've used it plenty. The first instance of its use on their blog:

Answering “The Questionâ€

Posted March 23, 2007

Many of you stay-at-home daughters well know the awkwardness of that moment when a relative or new acquaintance asks that inevitable question, becoming known as “The Question†– “So, what do you do?â€