The stoopyd! Eet berrnz! (sex ed in Utah)

[Jessica]

http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/politics/5 ... n.html.csp What a great idea. Let's keep all the sheltered, ignorant Utah kids even more sheltered and ignorant than they already are! Welcome to Utah, where it's better to drop out of school at 15 to have your baby and try to support it while working at Burger King than it is to be proactive and use birth control!

[Confused_by_religion]

"We’ve been culturally watered down to think we have to teach about sex, about having sex and how to get away with it, which is intellectually dishonest," said bill sponsor Rep. Bill Wright, R-Holden. "Why don’t we just be honest with them upfront that sex outside marriage is devastating?"

They make sex sound like an awful crime. I doubt this strategy works.

[Swamptribe]

Sigh, sadly, the only thing we learn from history, is that people forget history. Back in the 'good ole days' when sex ed was not taught in school, kids were still having sex.

[FireIsCatching89]

*headdesk*

I can't even...

My brain just imploded from the Stoopid. But as one who was not too long ago a teen (I'm only 22), I can say that a lot of teens hve sex. A LOT. And unless someone is there to tell them to use condoms/bc/std testing services, a lot of them won't do it. Seriously. We need to put our morals aside and put the health of our children first.

[MollySee]

*headdesk*

I can't even...

My brain just imploded from the Stoopid. But as one who was not too long ago a teen (I'm only 22), I can say that a lot of teens hve sex. A LOT. And unless someone is there to tell them to use condoms/bc/std testing services, a lot of them won't do it. Seriously. We need to put our morals aside and put the health of our children first.

I was taught proper sex education.. and I am proud to say that I have never accidentally gotten pregnant (I'm 23) ! If I hadn't been educated properly it would have been easy for guys to manipulate me into having unprotected sex... Teens don't always make the best choices. They're impulsive and horny.... they need to know how to be SAFE!

[dairyfreelife]

*headdesk*

I can't even...

My brain just imploded from the Stoopid. But as one who was not too long ago a teen (I'm only 22), I can say that a lot of teens hve sex. A LOT. And unless someone is there to tell them to use condoms/bc/std testing services, a lot of them won't do it. Seriously. We need to put our morals aside and put the health of our children first.

Just turned 23 so same age pretty much. Yes, there are a lot of teens who have sex, but just as many don't. However, regardless of whether a teen does or does not have sex, almost everyone eventually does at some point in their lives so it's best to learn early how to care for yourself and prevent STDs and unwanted pregnancy. It's not just about the teenage years, but health for the rest of their lives.

[freejoytoo]

In the nearly 23 club!

I knew a lot of teenagers who had sex, even though I wasn't one of them. So glad we had a decent sex ed so that when the time came that I had sex I didn't wind up pregnant or with an STI, and that none of my friends got pregnant at 16!

[Jessica]

It's not just about the teenage years, but health for the rest of their lives.

THAT. Girls always hear about getting cramps during their period. But without a good sex ed class, how will they know if their extremely painful periods aren't a sign of endometriosis or something worse? How will a girl know if her discharge is just normal cervical mucus or a sign of cancer? Most people I know never got this information from their parents and if schools don't do a good job, where are they going to learn? Yeah, the internet, but how will they know to look in the first place? If something's uncomfortable but they think it's normal and just learn to deal with it, why would they bother going to the doctor to have it checked out?

[pomology]

Just turned 23 so same age pretty much. Yes, there are a lot of teens who have sex, but just as many don't. However, regardless of whether a teen does or does not have sex, almost everyone eventually does at some point in their lives so it's best to learn early how to care for yourself and prevent STDs and unwanted pregnancy. It's not just about the teenage years, but health for the rest of their lives.

True. What you learn is high school generally isn't necessarily relevant to your present life at that age. It's to prepare you for the rest of your life. Hell, I had to take civics in 8th grade, when it was a good four years before I would reach the age of majority and most of what I learned would directly apply to my life. Even when I graduated from high school I was barely a week over 18. I wasn't taught about how government worked because it would be relevant to my life at 13, but because it would relevant at a later date, but I would already be done with school by the time it became relevant.

Sex ed IS relevant to many high school kids. But even if it isn't, it's important to know. Like, if you don't learn about birth control, how are you going to use it when you're married (I'm currently ignoring those crazy people like frothy who think that nobody should use birth control)? If you don't learn about emergency contraception, how would you be able to deal with protecting yourself from pregnancy if you are raped?

[keen23]

Just turned 23 so same age pretty much. Yes, there are a lot of teens who have sex, but just as many don't. However, regardless of whether a teen does or does not have sex, almost everyone eventually does at some point in their lives so it's best to learn early how to care for yourself and prevent STDs and unwanted pregnancy. It's not just about the teenage years, but health for the rest of their lives.

I've got 10 years on you both. But in my high school experience, I'd think that less than 20% of my peers were virgins upon high school graduation (personally, I knew of 2). And that number was probably less than 2% after age 20. Teens will and do have sex. Hormones are powerful things.

[freejoytoo]

I think maybe four people out of my year were virgins when we left.

[Frumpalicious]

I'll be 22 in a few months. As for the sex thing, yeah. My peers and I were a very horny bunch. In fact, I didn't know of any virgins except for one girl in my biology class. I myself, I didn't end up losing mine until a few months ago.

My sex ed was quite lacking, unfortunately. We got the whole "save it 'til marriage, it belongs to your spouse!!!!1!" spiel from a group that came to talk to us. Fortunately for those of us who took health sciences, we learned quite a bit about sex, possible STIs, and methods of birth control. Of course, that wasn't in the written curriculum. We are an abstinence-only district, so that bit of reading was "optional". As in "read this, write a summary, and we'll discuss it later in class".

[freejoytoo]

That sounds like a very moral slant. I thought there was a separation of church and state in the US?

Kind of ironic that in the UK, which is in theory a Christian country, is obliged to teach sex ed coherently without any kind moral slant at all. No one said anything about waiting until marriage.

[anniebgood]

I'm 58 and there were at least 2 girls who were pregnant in my 8th grade class. That was in 1967. Sex happens. It would be nice to teach young women and men too, that there are easy ways to prevent pregnancy. Get over that old myth that it doesn't feel the same with a condom on, cover it. I went on the pill at 18 and stayed on it till I was 33 and trying to get pregnant.

If the newspapers would do a little digging, they'd see the 18 year olds at Burger King all washed out and tired from trying to be a mom and working a minimum wage job. I'd wager they'd also find a lot of back door sex in the state house too. Oh wait, Mormons... they don't' have sex outside marriage do they? /sarcasm.

When will this nation pull it's collective head out of it's ass and see reality like the rest of the world? People laugh at us for being prudes, yet we produce more porn films for sale and rent in the San Fernando Valley than most small countries budgets. Hypocrites.

/rant over.

[alphaeta08]

That sounds like a very moral slant. I thought there was a separation of church and state in the US?

Kind of ironic that in the UK, which is in theory a Christian country, is obliged to teach sex ed coherently without any kind moral slant at all. No one said anything about waiting until marriage.

Oh, they can get away with a lot without actually talking about God! We had a group come in and do abstinence talks from about seventh to tenth grade, and it was always a wait until marriage message. I'm also 22, and while I'd say over half of my class was having sex, a lot weren't. Not that it mattered, because the school wasn't allowed to talk about birth control, etc, to us.

[JemimaPuddle-Duck]

THAT. Girls always hear about getting cramps during their period. But without a good sex ed class, how will they know if their extremely painful periods aren't a sign of endometriosis or something worse? How will a girl know if her discharge is just normal cervical mucus or a sign of cancer? Most people I know never got this information from their parents and if schools don't do a good job, where are they going to learn? Yeah, the internet, but how will they know to look in the first place? If something's uncomfortable but they think it's normal and just learn to deal with it, why would they bother going to the doctor to have it checked out?

If only it were so. I doubt that many sex ed classes are going to help women recognize endo or anything else when so few doctors even recognize it. My friend actually "learned" in nursing school that pregnancy CURES endometriosis. Talk about "the stupid, it burns". Oy.

Also, for everyone acting like sex ed helps girls not be stupid enough to get pregnant, I had quite a comprehensive sex ed both from school and home, and despite protection, I still got pregnant at 17. It happens.

[Daenerys]

*headdesk*

I can't even...

My brain just imploded from the Stoopid. But as one who was not too long ago a teen (I'm only 22), I can say that a lot of teens hve sex. A LOT. And unless someone is there to tell them to use condoms/bc/std testing services, a lot of them won't do it. Seriously. We need to put our morals aside and put the health of our children first.

I'm 20 and I agree. Personally I'd just like to give every 13 year old girl an implant, I have one and they are AMAZING. Parents really need to wake up and realise that kids are having sex and that they always have done!

[freejoytoo]

Oh, they can get away with a lot without actually talking about God! We had a group come in and do abstinence talks from about seventh to tenth grade, and it was always a wait until marriage message. I'm also 22, and while I'd say over half of my class was having sex, a lot weren't. Not that it mattered, because the school wasn't allowed to talk about birth control, etc, to us.

So on what basis are they advising you to wait until marriage other than religious?

I don't think our classes had any kind of moral slant at all. We were taught that you can get pregnant the first time, you must ALWAYS use a condom and that's it good to have another form of BC because condoms can split.

We were shown this :lol:

...our sex ed WAS more complex than that, but that video was pretty funny!

[2xx1xy1JD]

...and this is part of the reason that the teen birth rate in the U.S. is over ten times higher than that of the Netherlands.

Abstinence-only can only work in fairly closed societies. If you look at Saudi Arabia, or at the Duggars, or at Satmar Hasidim, then yes, they do have very low rates of unwed teen pregnancy. They also have extremely limited contact between the sexes, an extremely strong religious atmosphere, a very strong emphasis on modesty, very limited exposure to mainstream media and an extreme degree of control over unmarried girls. If you don't have - and don't want - that entire package, abstinence-only isn't effective. There are too many contradictory messages. On TV, in movies, in music videos, etc., people are clearly having sex without getting pregnant. At one point in history, sex and pregnancy were clearly linked in people's minds. Now, they aren't. I also doubt that any developmentally-normal American high school student actually manages to graduate without ever hearing about sex. In other words - kids are getting a "sex education" even if it's not on the school curriculum. It's just that it may consist of schoolyard rumours, MTV, books/magazines, porn, friends, partners, etc. who may encourage sex without providing any accurate information about the risks and how to avoid them.

Is there any way for the average kid to learn that Vaseline breaks down the latex in condoms? Or that not every woman has the same fertile period every month? Or that some antibiotics can reduce the effectiveness of the Pill? Or that you can't trust that the guy will pull out? Or that magic fairies won't stop you from getting pregnant?

[Jessica]

If only it were so. I doubt that many sex ed classes are going to help women recognize endo or anything else when so few doctors even recognize it. My friend actually "learned" in nursing school that pregnancy CURES endometriosis. Talk about "the stupid, it burns". Oy.

RE: endo - The school might not say "Here are the signs and symptoms" but hopefully they'd say something like "It's common to have pain with your period but if you are having extreme pain you'll want to see a doctor".

[freejoytoo]

...and this is part of the reason that the teen birth rate in the U.S. is over ten times higher than that of the Netherlands.

Abstinence-only can only work in fairly closed societies. If you look at Saudi Arabia, or at the Duggars, or at Satmar Hasidim, then yes, they do have very low rates of unwed teen pregnancy. They also have extremely limited contact between the sexes, an extremely strong religious atmosphere, a very strong emphasis on modesty, very limited exposure to mainstream media and an extreme degree of control over unmarried girls. If you don't have - and don't want - that entire package, abstinence-only isn't effective. There are too many contradictory messages. On TV, in movies, in music videos, etc., people are clearly having sex without getting pregnant. At one point in history, sex and pregnancy were clearly linked in people's minds. Now, they aren't. I also doubt that any developmentally-normal American high school student actually manages to graduate without ever hearing about sex. In other words - kids are getting a "sex education" even if it's not on the school curriculum. It's just that it may consist of schoolyard rumours, MTV, books/magazines, porn, friends, partners, etc. who may encourage sex without providing any accurate information about the risks and how to avoid them.

Is there any way for the average kid to learn that Vaseline breaks down the latex in condoms? Or that not every woman has the same fertile period every month? Or that some antibiotics can reduce the effectiveness of the Pill? Or that you can't trust that the guy will pull out? Or that magic fairies won't stop you from getting pregnant?

That's not an effective form of pregnancy anyway, you can get pregnant from pre-cum.

[2xx1xy1JD]

That's not an effective form of pregnancy anyway, you can get pregnant from pre-cum.

Exactly - but I wouldn't expect that a guy trying to get a teen girl to have sex with him would mention that. Proper comprehensive sex ed might.

As well, instead of a fatalistic "all contraception could fail", you could have actual instruction on how to make it less likely to fail, along with tips for doubling up methods to really reduce the failure rate. For example, condoms can fail and the pill can fail, but the odds of both failing at the same time if used properly are fairly remote.

As for the whole "age appropriate" garbage:

- the teen preg. rate in Utah continues to rise, so clearly teens ARE having sex

- school is supposed to provide skills for life after high school. I'm not sure that it's totally age-appropriate to having teens building bridges or climbing high mountains, but schools teach trigonometry.

[freejoytoo]

I don't know why the US doesn't look to countries like the Netherlands. They teach comprehensive sex ed from an early age and boom, lowest teen pregnancy rate in Europe. It's depressing that in one of the most developed countries in the world there is also the highest teenage pregnancy rate in the west because adults are too scared to teach children about safe sex.

[alphaeta08]

So on what basis are they advising you to wait until marriage other than religious?

I don't think our classes had any kind of moral slant at all. We were taught that you can get pregnant the first time, you must ALWAYS use a condom and that's it good to have another form of BC because condoms can split.

We were shown this :lol:

...our sex ed WAS more complex than that, but that video was pretty funny!

They did all the "demonstrations" we talk about here, like making a heart out of paper and tearing it up, basically the "giving away pieces of your heart" concept. We didn't even really talk about STD's, or at least I don't remember it. They just threw a bunch of statistics at us, had us practice saying "no" in about 2859 different ways, and talked about how sex is AWESOME, but only if you're married. Then we signed the purity pledges. The funniest part was the anonymous Q&A, because we all felt too guilty and embarrassed to ask real questions, plus the girl doing the talk was a virgin. Nice. :lol: So, technically no God, but same message.

[freejoytoo]

Wtf? And this was in a PUBLIC school? Your sex ed sounds misinformed and extremely misogynist - I assume guys didn't have the hearts talk.

Sounds like they were trying to repress you. My school might have had its pitfalls but there was no 'have sex and DIE' talk, and certainly no ripping up of paper hearts! Although maybe that was to do with our teachers telling us how they had enjoyed casual sex prior to marriage :lol: