Grandduggar # 3 on the way? Pictures.

[SunnyAndrsn]

Will this work? It is of a very good friend of ours and bonus, Max looks just like my boy pug.

MVm0fplJ204

Two enthusiastic thumbs up. Max is very cute. Thanks!

[PBrooke]

I'm currently trying to imagine the reaction a group of men would have if a 35 year old man in that group said, "I prefer to be called a boy. I don't want to grow up."

I'm getting something along the lines of "What the fuck is wrong with you?!" And I somehow don't think people would be as open to asking "what's the big deal?" if the situation were reversed.

Michael Jackson.

[Haligh the Liar]

better than wench, hag, whore or republican.

And being hit over the head with a crate of Duggar DVDs is better than being eaten by a bear, but that doesn't mean I'd like either.

PS While I personally disagree with many tenets of the party, I think it's fairly insulting to say Republican is an outright insult.

[madpsych78]

PBrooke wrote:

Michael Jackson.

This says it all. :character-michaeljackson:

[Shana]

Has a borderline addiction to polish, I'd die if anyone knew how many bottles I really own. I have on a supper sheer pink glitter by OPI that would be nice on them. Unfortunately it's named Teenage Dream from the Katy Perry collection, far too defrauding and maybe a bit too glittery.

You've got to check out Ruby Slippers... I am obsessed!

[keeperrox]

I love a little bit of glitter! Here's my favorite every day polish...

[amster]

Make no mistake about it, women are STILL being thought of and openly referred to as "girls" in the workplace.

Is it as prevalent as when your Dad was in business? No. But it's still there to a degree, and like a virus, whenever something is still lurking, there's a decent chance it will flare back up. And it does effect things like equal pay for equal performance and equal opportunity for promotion. So when people like reds who claim to be women say things like "I'd rather be considered a girl!", it pushes buttons and tempers rightfully flare. Many of us have worked hard to be taken as seriously as men in our professions, and this "but I'm really just a girl" shit is both appalling and maddening.

So because you have worked hard at being taken seriously, the rest of us who are indifferent about whether we get called girls or women don't have the right to an opinion, because it disagrees with yours?

I think of myself as a girl. I am not the youngest, but I am the only female in my department. People often apologise for 'lumping me in with the guys' because I am female. It's not until they bring attention to it that I even notice. I still don't care. You could call me Sally or Molly or Tabitha for all I care. If people don't know they are offending you, why get mad? I really don't understand why it's so offensive to some people.

[AudreyE]

So because you have worked hard at being taken seriously, the rest of us who are indifferent about whether we get called girls or women don't have the right to an opinion, because it disagrees with yours?

I think of myself as a girl. I am not the youngest, but I am the only female in my department. People often apologise for 'lumping me in with the guys' because I am female. It's not until they bring attention to it that I even notice. I still don't care. You could call me Sally or Molly or Tabitha for all I care. If people don't know they are offending you, why get mad? I really don't understand why it's so offensive to some people.

No, the problem is that you girls aren't even trying to understand that point. This is not about preference (e.g. which sparkle nail polish to wear). The point is that you would not want to be called girl - none of you would want to be called girl - if you were old enough or unlucky enough (or both) to truly grasp the way this was used against working women for decades.

I guess it's a good thing that younger women today don't understand, but it also means we're in danger of losing things without appreciating the significance until it's too late.

If you want to call yourself girl, or your friends are your "girlfriends," then, really, I couldn't care less. If you think it's appropriate for a male boss to call all the women who work for him "girls" when he calls your male peers "men," then you're eyes aren't very open.

[apple1]

Way back I wrote-

What's wrong with being called a woman?

Wow. :roll: I came back and the thread was pages and pages longer. Do I get a gold star? Maybe a gift certificate for a pedicure? ;)

[apple1]

The point is that you would not want to be called girl - none of you would want to be called girl - if you were old enough or unlucky enough (or both) to truly grasp the way this was used against working women for decades. ... If you think it's appropriate for a male boss to call all the women who work for him "girls" when he calls your male peers "men," then you're eyes aren't very open.

THAT.

signed - 59 year old working woman

[freejoytoo]

Women my age are complaining about the fact that they have too much choice. I even saw an article in a magazine saying about how life was simpler fifty years ago. It made me want to cry. Women would rather have no choice than too much of it?

[reds]

I come from a place where men are not being hired for the same roles and we are starting to discriminate against them. i know alot of bosses who would only hire women for jobs such as heavy machinery operator if they had the choice and will always pick the woman ahead of the man. Why you are asking yourself? Cause women have shown that they are gentler on equipment and having a group of women will reduce the costs for repair and maintence. We have more programs to get women jobs in trades than men. It is common to see women electricians, welders, plumbers. If you dont have to life more than 50 lbs, there is a woman in that position.

It is rare to find a man in banking unless they are over 50. In the past 10 years i think i have seen around 3 male tellers.

Sales people in my office.. 2 women and one man, man is over 60 years old. And most offices around here have more women working in them instead of men.

If a man applied to be a assistant, they would generally ask him what is wrong with him and he wouldnt even get an interview.

They might call me a girl, but i get the paycheck.

[apple1]

I come from a place where men are not being hired for the same roles and we are starting to discriminate against them. i know alot of bosses who would only hire women for jobs such as heavy machinery operator if they had the choice and will always pick the woman ahead of the man. Why you are asking yourself? Cause women have shown that they are gentler on equipment and having a group of women will reduce the costs for repair and maintence. We have more programs to get women jobs in trades than men. It is common to see women electricians, welders, plumbers. If you dont have to life more than 50 lbs, there is a woman in that position.

It is rare to find a man in banking unless they are over 50. In the past 10 years i think i have seen around 3 male tellers.

Sales people in my office.. 2 women and one man, man is over 60 years old. And most offices around here have more women working in them instead of men.

If a man applied to be a assistant, they would generally ask him what is wrong with him and he wouldnt even get an interview.

They might call me a girl, but i get the paycheck.

How old are you?

[reds]

i am 35 years old.

[AKay]

We have some older guys (65+, if not older) affiliated with our company (they don't directly work with us, but we meet with them or take phone calls from them occasionally) and some of them have referred to their assistants/office staff as their "girls", as in, "I don't know how to print that out, I have my girl do it." They sound like such jackasses.

[AudreyE]

I'm 35, but my parents were old enough to be my grandparents, so I saw how they interacted with their friends and contemporaries..

[reds]

I'm 35, but my parents were old enough to be my grandparents, so I saw how they interacted with their friends and contemporaries..

My father is in his 70's. He got over the whole women in the work place when my mother had to work to make the mortgage payments in the 80's economic down turn.

What is see most from him is his racism which is what i seem to see more of in society than sexism. It is something that i am trying to keep my kids away from. My daughter is enroled in a school that is ESL. I think it is good for her to know so many other ethic backgrounds.

[Mama Mia]

The part that is sounding unprofessional to me is the use of the word "my" and then a gender word to describe a co-worker.

I would never say ( and don't recall ever hearing ) "I'll have my girl do it" , but I also wouldn't say "I'll have my woman do it" or "I'll have my boy do it" or "I'll have my man do it" ... all of those sound weird and like you are in a relationship with the person.

I would probably use the name of the co-worker and/or their title. "I'll ask the Office Manager to do it" or "I'll ask Pat, the Office Manager, to do it"

I have had to make more of an effort as I've gotten older to remember that just because I have "kids" in their twenties - that people in their twenties aren't "kids" .- and not use the term "kids" or girls or boys when talking about younger adults if I don't know them well - like not to say "Could you ask that girl/boy where the milk is" if I'm referring to a clerk who is probably pushing 30 :oops:

I'm also old enough to remember when some women I knew would insist on using "womyn" ... I don't know if anyone still does that ? I do see the point of why you wouldn't want to call women "girls" while calling men "men" in a professional setting - I don't hear those terms used in an unbalanced way here ( i.e. you would be just as likely in a non-professional setting to hear "boys" or "girls" when referring to an adult .. and you probably would rarely hear any gender term used to describe a person in a professional setting - if you didn't know the job title you might say "should I ask the person at the front desk" )

I work in a very progressive area, in a very socially aware field, near a university with a reputation of being extremely, extremely to the left -- so I think anyone under 80 who works in the social service/education/government in my area would not use the expression "I'll get my girl to do it" .. it just wouldn't happen - and people would probably look at you like you just dropped in from the set of Mad Men.

[AKay]

The part that is sounding unprofessional to me is the use of the word "my" and then a gender word to describe a co-worker.

I would never say ( and don't recall ever hearing ) "I'll have my girl do it" , but I also wouldn't say "I'll have my woman do it" or "I'll have my boy do it" or "I'll have my man do it" ... all of those sound weird and like you are in a relationship with the person.

I would probably use the name of the co-worker and/or their title. "I'll ask the Office Manager to do it" or "I'll ask Pat, the Office Manager, to do it"

Absolutely, I agree. That was definitely the worst part of it, but then "girl" in addition to that is just....icky.

[meda]

I come from a place where men are not being hired for the same roles and we are starting to discriminate against them. i know alot of bosses who would only hire women for jobs such as heavy machinery operator if they had the choice and will always pick the woman ahead of the man. Why you are asking yourself? Cause women have shown that they are gentler on equipment and having a group of women will reduce the costs for repair and maintence. We have more programs to get women jobs in trades than men. It is common to see women electricians, welders, plumbers. If you dont have to life more than 50 lbs, there is a woman in that position.

It is rare to find a man in banking unless they are over 50. In the past 10 years i think i have seen around 3 male tellers.

Sales people in my office.. 2 women and one man, man is over 60 years old. And most offices around here have more women working in them instead of men.

If a man applied to be a assistant, they would generally ask him what is wrong with him and he wouldnt even get an interview.

They might call me a girl, but i get the paycheck.

As many others have said, ancedata does not equal fact. You may be getting the paycheck, but your also earning less than a man doing the same work. Women may be getting the jobs in your area, and intestingly enough the group hardest hit by the recession has been men without a college degree, but that does not meet that employers are paying the women in those jobs as much as they would pay a man. When employers view their employees as "girls", and pay them accordingly, that's a problem. Language choice is a pretty good indicator of respect.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/freekvermeu ... unctional/

http://usgovinfo.about.com/cs/censussta ... enspay.htm

[MandyLaLa]

Ase many others have said, ancedata does not equal fact. You may be getting the paycheck, but your also earning less than a man doing the same work. Women may be getting the jobs in your area, and intestingly enough the group hardest hit by the recession has been men without a college degree, but that does not meet that employers are paying the women in those jobs as much as they would pay a man. When employers view their employees as "girls", and pay them accordingly, that's a problem. Language choice is a pretty good indicator of respect.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/freekvermeu ... unctional/

http://usgovinfo.about.com/cs/censussta ... enspay.htm

Truth.

Not to mention that it makes sense women would be getting the jobs simply because companies know they can pay a woman less. It's a smart business decision.

If men really care about loosing jobs to women the best solution would be to stand with women (and minorities) and demand equal pay for equal work regardless of gender (or race).

[reds]

that is the beauty of the trades. It is all government mandated. If you are a apprentice, your wage is based on a percentage of what a journeyman makes. The journeyman rate is set by the company. Dont like the rate, find a company that will pay more. Men and women in the trades are paid equal. A company i use to work for, electrical, the first year apprentices we making more than what the office people were. Didnt matter if the apprentice was male or female and it also didnt matter who got called to work first, it was rotations.

In all times the companies would have to be competitive with each other to get the workers that they need. Lots of spying about what other companies are paying and keeping up so that they dont have more work than workers.

Looking at the stats here there is 8% of women in trades, 26% of all technical jobs are women's.

[MandyLaLa]

that is the beauty of the trades. It is all government mandated. If you are a apprentice, your wage is based on a percentage of what a journeyman makes. The journeyman rate is set by the company. Dont like the rate, find a company that will pay more. Men and women in the trades are paid equal. A company i use to work for, electrical, the first year apprentices we making more than what the office people were. Didnt matter if the apprentice was male or female and it also didnt matter who got called to work first, it was rotations.

In all times the companies would have to be competitive with each other to get the workers that they need. Lots of spying about what other companies are paying and keeping up so that they dont have more work than workers.

Looking at the stats here there is 8% of women in trades, 26% of all technical jobs are women's.

Can we get some links to actual facts on reputable websites versus your thoughts on the subject?

[JuJuBee]

Women my age are complaining about the fact that they have too much choice. I even saw an article in a magazine saying about how life was simpler fifty years ago. It made me want to cry. Women would rather have no choice than too much of it?

I think what some women may be trying to say is that they feel overwhelmed. Perhaps the expectations on them are too high to juggle so many things at once. Perhaps they're not receiving enough help at home from their husband or enough understanding from their boss at work.

[eohiken]

It's funny, I HAVE noticed very few men as bank tellers. And yet, there ARE a bunch of them working in the offices as managers and loan officers. There must be something about that.