Turpins 2- California Torture House (Graphic content discussed)

[Nikedagain?]

11 hours ago, Sideways said:

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I have watched this video 4 times now. Each time I just cry like a baby. I don't think that any family we have discussed has ever had such a profound affect! (Even the Nogs, who I am VERY concerned about all the time) These children just seem so awkward and sweet, so eager to please. Ugh. I'd really like 10 minutes alone with Louise. And I'm a dyed in the wool pacifist. 

[lilwriter85]

I agree with others, not all homeschooling parents isolate their kids. I know two homeschooling families that had their kids in outside activities. One family was fundie lite with three sons. The sons played in soccer leagues participated in a bike and hiking club, and went to space camps in Florida for several summers. There were involved in activities at their church too.

The other family were liberal Buddhists. One of their kids did attend school because of a developmental delay. I knew the mother through cat and kitten fostering. We fostered for the same shelter and I hung out their house a bunch of times. The homeschooled kids did community theatre, youth sports, they took language classes that were taught by private tutors, and were in a homeschool co-op group.

The isolated homeschooling families are definitely out there and I think money sometimes plays into why the kids are isolated. I have worked with a guy whose stepdaughter is an ATI homeschooler. She only has three kids and they tried to adopt from agencies a few years back. They couldn't raise money for agency fees and their files and applications got pulled in part because the stepdaughter's husband has a shaky work history. They have constant money struggles which has led to their kids not doing a lot of activities and also their involvement with ATI has turned off people at the mainstream Baptist church they attend. The stepdaughter allowed her oldest kid who is a teen to have a job. He said there were issues at first because the girl had to work with non-religious people and her boss was Jewish. 

 

[BlackSheep]

It's galling that prison life will offer more for Monster 1 and 2 than they gave to their children. The differences are immense. Three meals a day, reasonably clean accommodations, regular (daily?) opportunities to shower, education and vocational training, the ability to have contact with the outside world (letters and visits), the ability to purchase snacks and creature comforts at the commissary, counseling, medical and dental care, and oversight to assure that prisoners are treated humanely. Did I miss anything?

They wouldn't provide these essential things to their children, and so taxpayers have to foot the bill for these deranged parents get them. Frustrating.

[EyesOpen]

5 minutes ago, BlackSheep said:

It's galling that prison life will offer more for Monster 1 and 2 than they gave to their children. The differences are immense. Three meals a day, reasonably clean accommodations, regular (daily?) opportunities to shower, education and vocational training, the ability to have contact with the outside world (letters and visits), the ability to purchase snacks and creature comforts at the commissary, counseling, medical and dental care, and oversight to assure that prisoners are treated humanely. Did I miss anything?

They wouldn't provide these essential things to their children, and so taxpayers have to foot the bill for these deranged parents get them. Frustrating.

I feel like this has affected my human mercy. I want these people to be sentenced to suffer and that’s not me...

[unsafetydancer]

@EyesOpen I feel the same way. Normally I am the first person to get angry at people who bang on about life in prison being too "nice" for the prisoners but with this pair, I really wish there was a way they could be made to suffer as much as those kids suffered.

[Beermeet]

32 minutes ago, Nikedagain? said:

I have watched this video 4 times now. Each time I just cry like a baby. I don't think that any family we have discussed has ever had such a profound affect! (Even the Nogs, who I am VERY concerned about all the time) These children just seem so awkward and sweet, so eager to please. Ugh. I'd really like 10 minutes alone with Louise. And I'm a dyed in the wool pacifist. 

My sentiments exactly.  I also feel for the Elvis impersonator.  To have met them now knowing and to have everyone see your face tied into this would disturb me very deeply.  Clearly an innocent but, still.  You know?

[Chocolatecheesecake]

Hey! I'm sorry if this has already been discussed, I didn't read alle the pages. But what gets me the most about this case is, that it wasn't just one monster doing this to the kids, it was two! What are the chances of two people marrying, who are both so incredibly sadistic, so insane? The percentage of the population of people capable of doing something like this must be tiny! (At least I hope so!) Do you think they were sadistic towards their childrem from the very beginning? And if so, do you think it was planned or "just happened" over time? But how could it just happen for BOTH parents? 

[Dandruff]

1 hour ago, Chocolatecheesecake said:

Hey! I'm sorry if this has already been discussed, I didn't read alle the pages. But what gets me the most about this case is, that it wasn't just one monster doing this to the kids, it was two! What are the chances of two people marrying, who are both so incredibly sadistic, so insane?

Monsters of a feather flock together?

1 hour ago, unsafetydancer said:

@EyesOpen I feel the same way. Normally I am the first person to get angry at people who bang on about life in prison being too "nice" for the prisoners but with this pair, I really wish there was a way they could be made to suffer as much as those kids suffered.

I don't see any way they could suffer as much as their kids did, but I wonder whether they might be put in solitary.  I imagine that other prisoners might not respond well to their presence. 

[FecundFundieFundus]

2 hours ago, Chocolatecheesecake said:

But what gets me the most about this case is, that it wasn't just one monster doing this to the kids, it was two! What are the chances of two people marrying, who are both so incredibly sadistic, so insane? The percentage of the population of people capable of doing something like this must be tiny!

The phenomenon is called folie à deux (shared psychosis syndrome). Same thing with serial killers who end up working together. What the fuck kind of conversations lead to that decision? 

[ILoveJellybeans]

1 hour ago, Chocolatecheesecake said:

Hey! I'm sorry if this has already been discussed, I didn't read alle the pages. But what gets me the most about this case is, that it wasn't just one monster doing this to the kids, it was two! What are the chances of two people marrying, who are both so incredibly sadistic, so insane? The percentage of the population of people capable of doing something like this must be tiny! (At least I hope so!) Do you think they were sadistic towards their childrem from the very beginning? And if so, do you think it was planned or "just happened" over time? But how could it just happen for BOTH parents? 

I think it just happened over time. Theyre obviously both complete sadists to consider locking their kids up, tying them to their beds in their own excrement for days at a time, buying food and then eating it in front of them as they starve, but abuse generally escalates over time. They are both monsters, and maybe that's why they were so attracted to eachother (and maybe he thought he could use her, theres nothing normal about someone in their twenties who wants to marry an uneducated 16 year old-either they got married straight away, or he was dating her when she was like 15). I guess there is someone for everyone, even monsters. Even serial killers find their match.

It wasn't always this bad, at one point, the oldest went to school. One of her former classmates said she was always that weird kid who smelled bad and wore dirty clothes, so neglect was present even then. There are also reports of someone being friends with the oldest three kids at the age of about 10, they acted strangely, the house was disgusting and she was only allowed in the kitchen, but they were at least allowed outside to play. I heard the chaining started a few years before, started out with tying them up with rope, but some of the kids learned to escape it so they bought chains. Apparently they've not been to the doctor in over 4 years. Surely things have gotten worse since then, because a doctor would surely notice how emaciated they are. I think it started out as spankings and neglect, but escalated over time. Also although they weren't traditionally fundie, they are a large family of Christian homeschoolers, so probably felt better with that crowd than with normal people, and their advice is usually "spanking is the only way to raise a child. If it isn't working, youre not hitting them hard enough". Not to mention the increased stress of having kids keep coming, meaning less money to go round, more chaos, noise and attention needed, the money troubles/bankruptcy but the parents didn't want to give up their lifestyle, probable marital issues (what healthy couple renews vows so often?).

I hope one day, the kids can get an apple pie, baked just for them and can eat as much of it as they want. So cruel of their parents to buy it to eat it in front of them as they starve.

[BlackSheep]

34 minutes ago, ILoveJellybeans said:

I hope one day, the kids can get an apple pie, baked just for them and can eat as much of it as they want. So cruel of their parents to buy it to eat it in front of them as they starve.

Yes! Apple pie, all they want, with heaps of Cool Whip. I'm the type of person who likes some pie with my Cool Whip.

Once they can consume a typical diet, they will finally know how it feels to have a full belly. That sated, contented feeling.

And how it feels to have energy - not just to move, but to think. The brain needs nutrients as much as any other part of the body does.

[Hisey]

9 hours ago, Petronella said:

Actually, there are plenty of kids who find the long hours of school socially draining, who appreciate time to daydream, read, focus on projects. You can have great friendships without being in a large group 8 hours a day/5 days a week. Sometimes friendships even thrive better in smaller groups and one on one.

There is a wide variety in how homeschooling is practiced. There are a lot of options between "in a group of thirty+ children all day five days a week" and "home with mom, has no friends."

You seem very convinced (from this and previous posts) that homeschooled kids can't grow meaningful friendships, can't have regular activities (our most committed activity meets four times a week), can't participate in sports (for years we were committed to swimming, tennis, and kung fu group lessons and stopped when the kids were sufficiently skilled and no longer interested), can't be part of music groups with peers (orchestra and choir are our two biggest group activities), can't have large social circles with plenty of diversity (and yet somehow our local homeschool community is a mix of Christian, Muslim, Jewish, and atheist, and quite international, as is the community at large). It seems to me that you likely live someplace where the school is the hub of the community and the provider of all extracurricular activities. That is not the case in all places.

School can be great! I just want to assert that homeschooling can also be great. The world is wide. Lots of different ways to be a great parent. Lots of different personalities for kids (not everyone craves being in the midst of a large group all the time, as you asserted above). And lots of different life stages too; one may homeschool for one stage of life but not all the way through. Whatever works best for the child.

Re the Turpins: We live in a no-regulations, no registration country, but we voluntarily registered as homeschoolers and welcomed annual home inspections. Homeschooling being used as a cover for isolation and abuse can't be tolerated. Organizations (like HSLDA) that automatically side with anyone claiming homeschooling against the "evil government" are evil themselves. Kids need protecting (but eradicating/forbidding homeschooling is not the answer).

This case is a horror. Those poor (and very brave!!) kids.

Actually we are close friends with two wonderful homeschooling families, so I know close friendships can develop (their kids are lifeling friends with mine).  I actually envy those kids’ lives, mostly because they’ve never hadto sit for standardized exams. No, I’m not “very convinced “ of anything., except that most kids like to be with other kids more than with their mom or dad all day. 

[lawlifelgbt]

Honestly I read all of these threads, and have some opinions:

1. When I was 21/22 I developed subclinical anorexia (came from overweight to very bottom of healthy weight). For more than six months I ate 600-800 calories most days while also working out, and sometimes one meal a day. And as a normally fed adult, I missed two periods and then they became about half their normal length. I felt dizzy every time I stood up. I couldn't think critically and was only able to work out because I would eat directly before the gym. My metabolism got messed up, and my chest shrunk a lot. I'd often be very cold. When I tried to eat something like cake (the mother of a coworker worked at a bakery and let us eat the aesthetic rejects), or a Starbucks drink, the fat content gave me stabbing pain in my stomach and gall bladder. For up to a year and a half afterwards, I would become nauseous after eating more than a small meal, and had really terrible anemia. Now multiply this by years for growing children, and with the caveat that I was hydrated and had weight to lose in the first place! Can't imagine.

 

2. I now have four cats and foster for a shelter. For several months, my wife and I cared for 12! (Mom cat, litter of 9, and our own two). I often felt we couldn't give them enough attention or time, but even though we were overwhelmed, we did so much better than these people did for HUMANS. The cats got food in a schedule at good intervals and amounts for growth, were allowed to play with each other, bathed whenever they were dirty (every 2-3 weeks or so), and given plenty of toys and water. They had free rein of a small room, and were let out to play once or twice a day. They were weighed, given medicine, and taken to the vet. We made sure no one was falling behind on growth, sick, or being beaten up.

 

And that is us doing a bad job! Seriously, these people.

[Hisey]

5 hours ago, FecundFundieFundus said:

Hear, hear!!

I can't lie; all the bloodthirsty comments calling for torture, death, forced sterilization, etc. turn my stomach. Torture and abuse are evil, that's why we hate what was done to those kids. Committing more evil acts in revenge against evil doers doesn't make it moral... I guess more Quaker rubbed off on my atheism than I thought. Put them in jail where they cannot cause more harm. Get those children help. Change the laws to increase protection for homeschooled kids. 

I think people should channel thei anger into helping abused or neglected kids in their community. Thats what I am doing. I actually signed up with an organization today. 

[Petronella]

39 minutes ago, Hisey said:

Actually we are close friends with two wonderful homeschooling families, so I know close friendships can develop (their kids are lifeling friends of mine).  I actually envy those kids’ lives, mostly because they’ve never hadto sit for standardized exams. No, I’m not “very convinced “ of anything., except that most kids like to be with other kids more than with their mom or dad all day. 

Why do you think that homeschooling inherently means "with their mom or dad all day" and not at all "with other kids"? What an odd and limited viewpoint.

Also, it completely ignores the option of people who enjoy some time in their own company. A kid at home "with Mom" may actually be enjoying some downtime on their own between busy activities (but with adult available if needed). By the way, those activities probably include, y'know, other kids.

(Your false dichotomy also sadly ignores the possibility of kids actually enjoying doing something with their parents. That's not as rare as you seem to think.)

[SilverBeach]

Humane treatment of incarcerated evildoers is a requirement of a civilized society. Doesn't stop me from hating their guts and wishing they wouldn't have such a comfortable existence, with  food,

clothing, and shelter for the rest of their lives at taxpayer expense. Like Charlie Manson. Seems like he didn't really pay for his crimes.  That said, I don't think anybody would really want to see Gilead-type justice. People are angry now, emotions are running high.  

[Bad Wolf]

This has triggered a lot of people in my town. Yesterday. our local news covered the abuse story from 12 years ago here. The sheriff said that it had really affected his officers. So as well as thoughts and prayers for the victims, I am also going to remember the care givers.

[EmCatlyn]

(Hello.  I have been away for a long time, but the Turpin story brought me back.)  

I have read through the two threads, and I don’t think anyone yet has posted that according to the Sunday Chronicle (UK),  Louise Turpin’s sister. Teresa and their half-brother want to adopt the younger Turpin children.

https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/907664/Turpin-family-California-children-torture-reality-TV-show-14-trial-latest-Louise-David

The article also reports what someone reported above about Louise telling her brother that she wanted to have a fourteenth child and that she thought their family could get a reality TV show and make lots of money.

On that subject my first reaction is that the renewal of vows tapes may have been, in Louise’s mind, a sort of audition.  My second reaction is that, sadly, the Turpin parents may still get money from selling their story, giving interviews, etc.   It’s a different kind of “reality,” but she may still get her “show.”

[Curious]

On 1/20/2018 at 6:12 PM, Otto Titsling said:

If anyone is interested, there is a pic on Twitter that identifies the adult children. I saved it, but I'm not sure if I am allowed to post it here. I don't know how to link. 

I searched Turpin family and scrolled down a few times and found it. 

You can post pictures here as long as they are from public sources.  To post a link, just copy the link from your address bar and paste it into your text box here.  The platform will automagically format it and stuff.

[unsafetydancer]

11 minutes ago, EmCatlyn said:

On that subject my first reaction is that the renewal of vows tapes may have been, in Louise’s mind, a sort of audition.  My second reaction is that, sadly, the Turpin parents may still get money from selling their story, giving interviews, etc.   It’s a different kind of “reality,” but she may still get her “show.”

Surely no one would give these horrible people money for their story now. 

[Bad Wolf]

I'm guessing someone will write a book about it like they did with Charles Manson. The parents won't profit from it.

[EmCatlyn]

BTW — What I decided to do about mailing something to the Turpin “kids” was to buy seven picture post-cards from my city and state and put them all in one envelope without any individual names or messages at all.  I wrote simply “Best Wishes from City and State” on each card.

My cover note says that I hope the people helpng the siblings will share the cards with the siblings when appropriate.  If nothing else, the pictures will give them an idea of a wider world than they have experienced.

It occurs to me that others who wanted to show support and not be intrusive might like to do something like this.  It might appeal to some of the “kids” to have picture postcards from different states and countries.  It is the sort of thing they could collect as part of their education now.  But it also gives the subtle message that people care.

Just a thought.

—

Re parents selling their story, I don’t know how the law works on this, but I believe they could get contracts for “in their own words” stories.  And I believe if they publish said story, that gives them rights to some profits if a film is made.  Whether they are allowed to get the money, I don’t know. (Would it be profitting from their crimes?)

 

[KelseyAnn]

13 minutes ago, unsafetydancer said:

Surely no one would give these horrible people money for their story now. 

Wouldn't Son of Sam laws prevent this?

[church_of_dog]

6 minutes ago, Bad Wolf said:

I'm guessing someone will write a book about it like they did with Charles Manson. The parents won't profit from it.

I find myself hoping one or more of the kids will write or cowrite a book someday, much like Jaycee Dugard did.

 

Also, it occurs to me that Louise might have made the comments about wanting a reality show as a part of masking the abuse -- not that she really wanted it or thought it was a possibility, but because it sounded like a good thing to say to her brother, something that implied they were safe/clean/healthy enough to be considered for a tv show.

[FloraDoraDolly]

7 hours ago, libgirl2 said:

A reporter on CNN was just commenting how Louis might use the defense that she was a battered woman. Wouldn't surprise me.

Ugh, some how it wouldn't surprise me.either

Very possible. Does anyone else remember the Lisa Steinberg murder from the 1980s? The adoptive father beat the child to death, but the adoptive mother got off.