Michael and Brandon Keilen Part 3

[elliha]

If I would describe the feeling of the plastic speculums I would say they kind of feel the way they look really. The closest thing I can think of is the inside of a mussel shell. I am sure they can hurt if you are really tense or have some kind of condition causing pain but they don't seem to do so if your vagina is healthy. I agree that a good doctor or midwife can really make an examination easier too.

[ColeJo]

Last year, I had my first ever gynecological exam. I was diagnosed with PCOS when I was 11 or 12. I wanted to make sure things were okay structurally since I get labs done on the regular. The transvaginal ultrasound hurt, the pelvic exam hurt, and I didn't get a pap done so I can't comment on the speculum. My midwife felt that since I wasn't sexually active, the pap wasn't necessary this year.

I couldn't sit back comfortably to relax which didn't help.

[just_ordinary]

On 6.2.2018 at 12:09 AM, ColeJo said:

Last year, I had my first ever gynecological exam. I was diagnosed with PCOS when I was 11 or 12. I wanted to make sure things were okay structurally since I get labs done on the regular. The transvaginal ultrasound hurt, the pelvic exam hurt, and I didn't get a pap done so I can't comment on the speculum. My midwife felt that since I wasn't sexually active, the pap wasn't necessary this year.

I couldn't sit back comfortably to relax which didn't help.

Why did she think the pap wasn’t necessary? You can get all sorts of tissue alterations without a HP infection that are not going to be diagnosed otherwise. Did she at least check the ph level?

[Marly]

On 6-2-2018 at 12:09 AM, ColeJo said:

Last year, I had my first ever gynecological exam. I was diagnosed with PCOS when I was 11 or 12. I wanted to make sure things were okay structurally since I get labs done on the regular. The transvaginal ultrasound hurt, the pelvic exam hurt, and I didn't get a pap done so I can't comment on the speculum. My midwife felt that since I wasn't sexually active, the pap wasn't necessary this year.

I couldn't sit back comfortably to relax which didn't help.

I can imagine that gynecological exams are (/can be) very uncomfortable when you haven't been sexually active yet. I think doctors should definitely take that into consideration before they start their examinations.
I haven't really thought about this before, but are there for instance smaller tools available in such cases? I mean, I can imagine that if they have to examine young girls (say, girls aged 10-15 years old, maybe even younger in case of sexual abuse), they don't use the big tools they would use on fullgrown adults. Maybe something like that could be an option for women who haven't been sexually active as well. Knowing that it is a possibility and that they can opt for this might help them to relax a bit more. Speaking from my own perspective and experience, if I would have needed a gynecological exam before I became sexually active, I would have been very worried about the possible (and in my head likely) painfulness of the examination. I mean, I wasn’t even able to use the smallest sized tampons then because inserting them hurt too much, so knowing that I’d be subjected to a gynecological examination and knowing what tools they use for that, would have very much impeded my ability to relax.
Also, smaller tools might not only be useful/beneficial/preferable for gynecological examinations of young girls and non-sexually active women, but for women with vaginusmus as well. I can’t imagine doctors (are able to) use normal gynecological tools in that case.

[QuiverDance]

On 1/28/2018 at 2:44 PM, meee said:

They told me to preemptively take Tylenol before doing an HSG. It wasn't that bad, just uncomfortable.

This was also my experience. I also got pregnant a couple of months after it!

[JillyO]

Because of this thread, I've been reading up on pap smears on Wikipedia, and I am absolutely baffled by the differences between countries. In Germany, the recommendation is to get pap smears every 6 to 12 months due to their low sensitivity (high instance of false negatives). I've had my first pap test the first time I went to the ob/gyn at 17 and then at every visit (once every six months if you're on the pill and once a year if you're not, barring any health issues).

By contrast, in the US it's not recommended to start pap smears before 21 and in the UK before 25, and screenings are only every three to five years. Apparently the reason for the significantly less frequent pap tests (aside from costs) are that they lead to unnecessary procedures (because of false positives, I assume).

So weird. So confusing. WHO IS RIGHT?

[just_ordinary]

7 minutes ago, JillyO said:

Because of this thread, I've been reading up on pap smears on Wikipedia, and I am absolutely baffled by the differences between countries. In Germany, the recommendation is to get pap smears every 6 to 12 months due to their low sensitivity (high instance of false negatives). I've had my first pap test the first time I went to the ob/gyn at 17 and then at every visit (once every six months if you're on the pill and once a year if you're not, barring any health issues).

By contrast, in the US it's not recommended to start pap smears before 21 and in the UK before 25, and screenings are only every three to five years. Apparently the reason for the significantly less frequent pap tests (aside from costs) are that they lead to unnecessary procedures (because of false positives, I assume).

So weird. So confusing. WHO IS RIGHT?

It gets even more confusing when one source talks about high instance of false negatives and than the other about unnecessary procedures because of false positives. I would rather have a second test after a false positive than an undiagnosed condition though. 

Medical standards are so different in every country. I often wonder how much is due to the costs. I mean no system wants to burn money for unneeded treatments but on the same side a pap is surely less expensive than proper cervical cancer treatment especially when nobody coughed it in an early stage.

[candygirl200413]

@Marly All of this!! I'm a virgin and I believe they used the smallest on me but that still wasn't helpful and I told them (the PA's at my office) that I was one even though I assumed I wasn't getting the exam done on my first appointment ever. 

[singsingsing]

9 hours ago, just_ordinary said:

Why did she think the pap wasn’t necessary? You can get all sorts of tissue alterations without a HP infection that are not going to be diagnosed otherwise. Did she at least check the ph level?

I've never been sexually active and according to my doctor I don't need a pap test. Don't they test pH level through urine sample?

[Rosalie]

1 hour ago, JillyO said:

Because of this thread, I've been reading up on pap smears on Wikipedia, and I am absolutely baffled by the differences between countries. In Germany, the recommendation is to get pap smears every 6 to 12 months due to their low sensitivity (high instance of false negatives). I've had my first pap test the first time I went to the ob/gyn at 17 and then at every visit (once every six months if you're on the pill and once a year if you're not, barring any health issues).

By contrast, in the US it's not recommended to start pap smears before 21 and in the UK before 25, and screenings are only every three to five years. Apparently the reason for the significantly less frequent pap tests (aside from costs) are that they lead to unnecessary procedures (because of false positives, I assume).

So weird. So confusing. WHO IS RIGHT?

And in Norway, it’s not recommended to start pap smears before 25, screening every third year. But if positive test, one will be scheduled for new test some months later. 

Cervix cancer is luckily a very slow growing form of cancer, I think that’s the reason for pap smear only every third year. 

[Melissa1977]

@JillyO in Spain pap test was reccomended once a year but these days it's done every two/three years because this cancer is really slow. I suspected this decision was because public healthcare cuts, but I talked to a private doctor who also says 2 or 3 years is enough, based on new research.

[Rosalie]

5 minutes ago, Melissa1977 said:

@JillyO in Spain pap test was reccomended once a year but these days it's done every two/three years because this cancer is really slow. I suspected this decision was because public healthcare cuts, but I talked to a private doctor who also says 2 or 3 years is enough, based on new research.

Quote

International studies have shown that three-yearly screening can reduce the life-time risk of cervical cancer with more than 80%.(1)  A single Pap test can reduce the risk of cervical cancer during the next 5 years by 50%.(2) As no screening test can be 100% effective, there will always be some cases that occur despite adequate screening. However, women who develop cervical cancer despite regular screening participation, have a lower mortality of the disease, mainly because the disease will usually be detected at an earlier stage.

https://www.kreftregisteret.no/en/screening/Cervical-Cancer-Screening-Programme/Frequently-asked-questions1/Benefits-and-harms-of-screening/

[Granwych]

On ‎1‎/‎30‎/‎2018 at 3:48 PM, Rosalie said:

I prefer male doctors before female doctors when it comes to examinations of the lady parts, as imo they tend to be more careful and afraid of causing pain than female doctors.

The female ob/gyn where I go has no qualms about cranking up the Pitocin during inducements.  Thank Rufus I had the sweet new guy who refused to do that.

11 hours ago, Marly said:

Also, smaller tools might not only be useful/beneficial/preferable for gynecological examinations of young girls and non-sexually active women, but for women with vaginusmus as well. I can’t imagine doctors (are able to) use normal gynecological tools in that case.

There are pediatric speculums available.

[JemimaPuddle-Duck]

All of my children were born via c-section, but I’ve been sexually active for years, of course, and I still need a smaller speculum. I wish more doctors and midwives were sensitive to how uncomfortable an exam and pap can be. 

 

Before my HSG, I was told to take Advil because I would probably feel some discomfort. I’m so glad some of you didn’t find it bad, because for me it was extremely painful! My doctor got the clamp on my cervix while the radiologist was supposed to be walking in and got held up. That was super fun. The clamp was way worse than the dye flushing through my tubes, and that was bad enough. In hindsight, I should have expected bleeding, but because no warned me, (and I was still pretty young at the time and didn’t do my own research back then) I was pretty alarmed when I stood up and blood ran down my legs. The techs were so sweet; they cleaned my legs and got me a pad, but I really wish I would have been better prepared. The whole experience was slightly traumatizing. If I ever had to do something like that again, I think I’d ask for a Xanax or Percocet. 

[miss_batson]

Michael and Brandon on ice-skating date. Is it just me, or there is something wrong with her make up?  

 

[Seculardaisy]

@miss_batson it kind of looks like she’s been going tanning and wearing those eye goggles? She kind of just has the Trump white eyes, tan face look going on.

[miss_batson]

1 hour ago, Seculardaisy said:

@miss_batson it kind of looks like she’s been going tanning and wearing those eye goggles? She kind of just has the Trump white eyes, tan face look going on.

Yeah, i also think it could be from tanning.. It seems i was sooo wrong thinking her olive tan is natural. 

[HereticHick]

27 minutes ago, miss_batson said:

Yeah, i also think it could be from tanning.. It seems i was sooo wrong thinking her olive tan is natural. 

She could also just be flushed from the cold

[freethemall]

On 1/15/2018 at 11:36 PM, just_ordinary said:

Guys, what the hell? I knew health insurance is bad in the USA but I thought if you have one that the things it covers are paid for. Do I get something wrong? If my husband and I will be diagnosed with infertility there is a huge amount of treatments that are fully covered. They are limited in number though. There are no infinite tries on ICSI for example (think it is 3-5?) but you are at least able to go down that route if you must. 

Our health insurance system is a big ole mess, even with the improvements from Obamacare. Not all plans are created equal, you basically have to shop around and choose based on how much you're willing to pay per month which can determine your deductible. Most plans now at least cover preventive care and maternal care, but infertility does not fall under these. Many plans have strict policies related to how they cover various treatments. I saw this via a friend of mine who went through IUI (artificial insemination) and then IVF. She could only get the IVF after 6 failed IUIs or her insurance wouldn't cover it. She still ended up going through a mess to get her IVF covered, for which she had to prove infertility. And this was with good insurance, I can only imagine if she didn't have a good plan she'd be paying a lot out of pocket.

[JillyO]

On the second picture, it sure looks to me like she has white-ish eyeshadow all around her eyes.

Also, how can you ice-skate in several inches deep snow? Is that a thing? I'll freely admit that I've never done it myself (too scared the ice will crack), but every time I've seen it, the ice had been cleared of snow.

I'm so confused.

 

[Seculardaisy]

1 hour ago, JillyO said:

On the second picture, it sure looks to me like she has white-ish eyeshadow all around her eyes.

Also, how can you ice-skate in several inches deep snow? Is that a thing? I'll freely admit that I've never done it myself (too scared the ice will crack), but every time I've seen it, the ice had been cleared of snow.

I'm so confused.

 

That is weird lol. I live in Michigan. I’m very familiar with snow (you should see the massive pile of it we have right now) but like you said, we usually clear the ice.

[Rosalie]

No problem going ice skating if snow is fresh and light, and I think it looks that way on the picture. Pro: The ice is not too fast, and it doesn’t hurt as much if/when you fall on your tush. Con: If your BF is a speed monster (as mine), he’ll soon get a bit bored. 

[bananabread]

Just wanted to add this to the OBGYN exam discussion:

You don't need to be a virgin to be small/"tight" down there! Just like penises come in all shapes and sizes, so do vaginas; they just tend to get "looser" when you're aroused. I've been sexually active for years and I still cannot comfortably use tampons or get a pelvic exam without crying and bleeding. My fiance messed around with a virgin before we met. When he and I first became sexual (I was not a virgin), he was SHOCKED by how "tight" I was. He legitimately thought that virgin = super tight and that not-virgin = never tight again. It blew his mind that I could be so much smaller than a girl who had never even been kissed before. Ridiculous! Yet another reflection of stellar sexual education.

[lumpentheologie]

On 2/7/2018 at 11:42 AM, JillyO said:

Because of this thread, I've been reading up on pap smears on Wikipedia, and I am absolutely baffled by the differences between countries. In Germany, the recommendation is to get pap smears every 6 to 12 months due to their low sensitivity (high instance of false negatives). I've had my first pap test the first time I went to the ob/gyn at 17 and then at every visit (once every six months if you're on the pill and once a year if you're not, barring any health issues).

By contrast, in the US it's not recommended to start pap smears before 21 and in the UK before 25, and screenings are only every three to five years. Apparently the reason for the significantly less frequent pap tests (aside from costs) are that they lead to unnecessary procedures (because of false positives, I assume).

So weird. So confusing. WHO IS RIGHT?

I asked my doctor about this when I moved back to the US from Germany and she said that it's not false positives that they worry about, but unnecessary treatment and stress on the patient from very common abnormalities that will most often resolve themselves without medical intervention, especially in younger women.

Now that I'm over 30 they do an HPV test in addition to the pap smear, since being older makes you more likely to develop the cancer. But they don't do that on younger women because HPV is endemic in sexually active women in their 20s and most of the time it doesn't cause any harm and the body clears it in a few years.

Maybe they also assume that older women are likely to have fewer sexual partners? Here they only recommend regular testing for chlamydia and gonorrhea until age 25. 

10 hours ago, miss_batson said:

Michael and Brandon on ice-skating date. Is it just me, or there is something wrong with her make up?  

 

To me it looks like she's been skiing or otherwise out on the show for a while wearing ski goggles. Wouldn't the ones for tanning be smaller than that?  

[Kangaroo]

She's either gotten burnt/tanned on her face while wearing glasses or sunglasses, or she's wearing makeup around her eyes that is reflecting light. I've seen photos of some celebrities wearing stuff that makes it look like they've never seen a mirror, but it's just the way this makeup looks under flash.

The powder could be in the concealer Shea wearing under her eyes.