Lori Alexander- the Mindless Mentor: Part 8

[IntrinsicallyDisordered]

Lori is the only person I read about here that makes me want to go to her site and leave a barrage of cutting comments.  She's so mean she makes me want to be mean in response.  I hate it.  She's beyond awful.  Such a nasty, small minded woman with control (and anger) issues.  Maybe it's because she seems to lack any kind of love at all.  I even believe that Nicole Naugler loves her kids, in her way, even as she is neglecting them.  Lori is empty and her husband is a monster and I am glad their kids are grown and out of there, and hope the damage doesn't extend to the grandkids.  But of course it will.

[SweetFellowshipper]

My dad is a gambling addict (been in GA for many years, good on him) and my mom caught him and made him get treatment. He is grateful to her for it, not emasculated. Wonder what Lori would say about that? A man being the one with a spending problem? Would my mom not have been "submissive" enough for her because she stopped him from spending all their money and ruining his life? Oh, that's right, she'd just delete it. 

[polecat]

Lori says in today's "study":

Quote

What good is teaching the Word if women are in rebellion to their husbands, have rebellious children, and empty homes? It's meaningless because there are too many women blaspheming the Word by disregarding these important commands that are the building blocks of any family and church. If you aren't being taught in your church, gather a few of the women together in your home, even if it is once a month, and begin teaching them Created to Be His Help Meet. When you teach it, you become more and more convicted about all of it since you must be a model to those you teach. This is good and way more important than any Bible Study you might attend.

 

 

 

Boy, talk about blasphemy. Now studying the Pearls is more important than studying the Bible. This woman needs to get bucked off her high and mighty "Horse of Truth." 

[OnceUponATime]

52 minutes ago, Loveday said:

You understand her perfectly. Lori thinks CTBHHM is more important than the Bible. Can someone get a screen cap of this before Ken realises what she's said and zaps it? 

Along with Titus 2:3-5, Lori has turned the Pearls, and their books, into her idols. 

To the bolded: your wish is my command

Spoiler

As to her claim, maybe she said it because she's just an easy to sway female and didn't get Ken to check over her post before publishing it. Clearly her emotions and feelings are leading her astray if she is putting CtBHHM above the Bible.

[Loveday]

Just now, OnceUponATime said:

To the bolded: your wish is my command

  Hide contents

As to her claim, maybe she said it because she's just an easy to sway female and didn't get Ken to check over her post before publishing it. Clearly her emotions and feelings are leading her astray if she is putting CtBHHM above the Bible.

Blessings on thee for that screencap.  I tried, but I couldn't seem to get it to save anywhere. Old computer, inept user. 

[Pammy]

What's dribbling out of Lori's keyboard today? Here's my translation:

'I went to lots of bible studies, but I somehow didn't learn that being meek and gentle, and prioritizing others above myself are primary Christian values. Whoops. The truth is that women have to to be an underclass, or we will obviously treat others with nothing but pride and contempt. (I never did get the hang of basic interpersonal respect.) Darling Debbie taught me the role of my lord-husband, so I redirected my pride and contempt towards other women, reserving only passive aggression for my husband. 

God wrote the whole bible to teach men, and three verses on the topics to teach women: just stick to those and stop branching out into regular Christianity by studying the rest of the bible. It's not for you! House-wifery is better than bible study anyways. 

Rebellion! Blasphemy! I can't tell the difference between active and passive voice, and I have no idea what my favourite words mean in either Greek or English! And I don't care! It would be wrong for me to study even the 3 women's verses properly.

I (heart) Debbie. You should host your own Debbie-study to replace women's bible study for your church, just like me.'

[Hisey]

On 5/3/2016 at 0:51 PM, iweartanktops said:

Yep. If my fiancé couldn't be around pretty women, he probably wouldn't even have a fucking job! Funny, we acknowledge beautiful women when we're out together. He met my best friend and commented later that she has beautiful eyes. I agreed. Somehow he managed not to try to get in her pants or ask if we could leave because he can't control himself. I don't understand all of these holy fundies who have zero self control or trust in their own self restraint. 

Don't even get me started on the breasts comments! I'm on my Kindle, otherwise I'd have a lot to say about that!

It's not even about self-control, sometimes. Just because someone has beautiful eyes, doesn't automatically mean you want to jump their bones. Men are capable of admiring women without the accompanying need for sex. The whole thing is so insulting to men. 

[molecule]

Oh, this post....I don't even know where to start.

God has made it abundantly clear in His Word what He wants women being taught. He wants them to be taught to be sober, love and obey their husband, love their children, be chaste, discreet, and keepers at home. 

While it may be true that God wants women to be taught this . . . 

The blame lies in the churches of today, namely the older women in the churches. Yes, preachers should be preaching this and some do but way too few. I don't hear many famous women teachers and "preachers" teaching other women what matters to God either. 

 . . . that doesn't mean that these things are all that matter to God.

I am not against Bible Studies but all Bible Studies and teaching for women should clearly teach Titus 2:3-5. Women wouldn't be so lost and looking for fulfillment and meaning in all the wrong places if this was consistently taught. 

This makes no sense. Back in the good old days when Lori claims that women were taught correctly, women still sought fulfillment in other things, which gave rise to the feminist movement that she thinks is at fault for all that is evil in today's world.

What good is teaching the Word if women are in rebellion to their husbands, have rebellious children, and empty homes? It's meaningless because there are too many women blaspheming the Word by disregarding these important commands that are the building blocks of any family and church.

This right here ^^^ is the big problem I have with Lori. She elevates Titus 2 above all else in the bible. She deems helpmeeting and homekeeping as the arbiters of salvation. I have a friend who has earned a graduate degree in theology. She divorced her husband due to verbal abuse (or "abuse," as Lori would say) and has been a single mom for quite a few years. She is a scholar and a feminist. She is a social justice warrior, taking homeless people into her home to feed them and give them a warm place to sleep for the night. She engages the outcast in conversations and truly listens and hears their hearts. She goes into difficult places and does hard work to support women who are abused and living in poverty. She feeds children whose parents cannot do so--and she herself has required the use of food stamps and subsidized housing at times in order to keep her own kids fed and sheltered, with help from the sporadic jobs she's done when she is able to. 

Lori would look at her and point to divorce, going to college, working, living on the public dime, and doing anything outside the home--yet the truth is that my friend does far more for Jesus and with Jesus than Lori can even imagine. Matthew 25:40 says "And the King shall answer and say unto them, verily I say unto you, inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me." My friend does what Jesus himself commanded us to do. Lori says that a commandment from Paul is more important.

Okay, sorry for the vent. Lori riles me up in a way no other fundie ever has. I am so frustrated with her.

 

 

[Hera]

On 5/30/2016 at 8:27 AM, Pammy said:

Today's news flash from Lori:

"If you hit your kids early and often, responding with casual violence to the smallest offenses, they become seriously less irritating! It's almost like they are terrified to bother their parents at all. That's how I solved my anger problem, and you can too! Plus, there's the bonus of the kids never being visibly angry either. How proud I am of my accomplishment!"

This is a joke, right?

[Hane]

Lori's drivel about spendthrift wives spikes my blood pressure. Even when I was a little kid in the '50s, I'd see that tired trope on sitcoms and get angry. My mom was very thrifty and an excellent money manager. The other moms I knew were, too. When our daughters were little, I was talking with a fellow divorced mom, and exclaimed over how much more financially comfortable each of us felt on her own. We didn't have to worry about someone blowing the household budget on cars, stereo equipment, and musical instruments. It was particularly significant in her case: she had three kids and received only sporadic child support.  And, after two marriages that went south, I learned that no man could support me anywhere near as well as I can support myself.

Fuck you, Lori.

[Koala]

Quote

 I don't hear many famous women teachers and "preachers" teaching other women what matters to God either. 

Lori: Decider of "what matters to God"

Quote

 Most of the Bible Studies today seem to be studying some of these popular female preachers' and teachers' materials who teach some things that aren't biblically correct and they have no thought or problem at all about standing behind a pulpit and having men in the audience. No thank you.

Wonder if she has any clue how transparent she is....

She reminds me of a small child whose friend got something she wanted, so she stamps her foot and insists she never wanted it in the first place.  Wouldn't even have it...not on a silver platter! But the truth is, Lori absolutely craves popularity, and she highlights that fact when she mentions those horrible, no good, very bad, "popular" women teachers/preachers, on an almost daily basis.

[Loveday]

Well, this comment is full of awesome.

"lborengasser" wrote:

Quote

I completely agree with your title, "Going to Bible study doesn't make you a godly woman," so I was attracted to this article. But I must respectfully caution you on three points: 
1. Book studies are not Bible studies. If your group is studying "Created to be His Helpmeet," that's not a Bible study. There's a huge difference, even if the book includes much Scripture. We're talking about totally different authors, and the Bible is the only book that is 100% true. Which is why a *BIble* study (Bible only) is the most important study (of any kind) one could attend. No book could ever surpass it. 
2. Therefore, I would be very hesitant to promote a book (any book) to the extent that you're promoting "Created to be His Helpmeet." I would never give a fallible, human author that much credit. 
3. The Titus passage of which you so strongly speak is not the most important passage in the Bible for women or anyone else. There are no passages more important than others. All Christians should study and think deeply about ALL of Scripture. The Titus passage should not be neglected, I agree, but it should also not be held above other passages. Even a passage of Scripture can become a god. 
Having said all of that, I do agree that even going to a *Bible* study (Bible only) does not make anyone godly. Godliness comes from hearing the Word and doing what is says. And, ultimately, godliness comes from God himself. Nothing we do or don't do makes us godly, apart from his power working in us.

She needs to be careful, though. Checking her comment stream, she's making a habit of ever-so-politely disagreeing with Lori. Next thing she knows, Ken will ride in on that white horse of his and chastise her. Or offer to mail her some M&Ms if she'll just send him her address. 

[TeddyBonkers]

2 hours ago, molecule said:

 

 

This makes no sense. Back in the good old days when Lori claims that women were taught correctly, women still sought fulfillment in other things, which gave rise to the feminist movement that she thinks is at fault for all that is evil in today's world.

 

 

This right here ^^^ is the big problem I have with Lori. She elevates Titus 2 above all else in the bible. She deems helpmeeting and homekeeping as the arbiters of salvation. I have a friend who has earned a graduate degree in theology. She divorced her husband due to verbal abuse (or "abuse," as Lori would say) and has been a single mom for quite a few years. She is a scholar and a feminist. She is a social justice warrior, taking homeless people into her home to feed them and give them a warm place to sleep for the night. She engages the outcast in conversations and truly listens and hears their hearts. She goes into difficult places and does hard work to support women who are abused and living in poverty. She feeds children whose parents cannot do so--and she herself has required the use of food stamps and subsidized housing at times in order to keep her own kids fed and sheltered, with help from the sporadic jobs she's done when she is able to. 

Lori would look at her and point to divorce, going to college, working, living on the public dime, and doing anything outside the home--yet the truth is that my friend does far more for Jesus and with Jesus than Lori can even imagine. Matthew 25:40 says "And the King shall answer and say unto them, verily I say unto you, inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me." My friend does what Jesus himself commanded us to do. Lori says that a commandment from Paul is more important.

Okay, sorry for the vent. Lori riles me up in a way no other fundie ever has. I am so frustrated with her.

 

 

Snipped a bit, just for length.

One would think that if "Love the Lord your God" and "Love your neighbor as yourself" were the first and second greatest commandments that Jesus would have mentioned it. Oh, wait.

Molecule, your friend sounds more Christ-like than Lori could ever hope to be. 

[polecat]

1 hour ago, Loveday said:

3. The Titus passage of which you so strongly speak is not the most important passage in the Bible for women or anyone else. There are no passages more important than others. All Christians should study and think deeply about ALL of Scripture. The Titus passage should not be neglected, I agree, but it should also not be held above other passages.

 

Now, now, now,"lborengasser," if this were true, wouldn't there be a verse in the Bible about it? Something that said, oh, I don't know, something along the lines of ... 

Quote

All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work.

 

Oh, wait. 

 

[Iamhispurity]

3 hours ago, molecule said:

Matthew 25:40 says "And the King shall answer and say unto them, verily I say unto you, inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me." My friend does what Jesus himself commanded us to do. Lori says that a commandment from Paul is more important.

Okay, sorry for the vent. Lori riles me up in a way no other fundie ever has. I am so frustrated with her.

Fun theological fact: Titus was written well after Paul died. So it is a forgery. Most modern scholarship recognizes that fact. So she elevates a really unimportant, forged, pretty conservative (Paul was not really conservative, if you know his context and stuff) letter more than Jesus. Go figure.... But she would never know that because biblical inerrancy and all that jazz...

[refugee]

1 hour ago, Iamhispurity said:

Fun theological fact: Titus was written well after Paul died. So it is a forgery. Most modern scholarship recognizes that fact. So she elevates a really unimportant, forged, pretty conservative (Paul was not really conservative, if you know his context and stuff) letter more than Jesus. Go figure.... But she would never know that because biblical inerrancy and all that jazz...

Wow, really? Learned something today. So our former church, which builds its entire understanding of women's spirituality around Proverbs 31 (work-from-home version) and Titus 2, is basing its "theology of women" half on a forgery?

Fascinating. Off to google for more.

[iheartchacos]

Fun theological fact: Titus was written well after Paul died. So it is a forgery. Most modern scholarship recognizes that fact. So she elevates a really unimportant, forged, pretty conservative (Paul was not really conservative, if you know his context and stuff) letter more than Jesus. Go figure.... But she would never know that because biblical inerrancy and all that jazz...

Please, tell me more! I've never heard this.

[Hane]

I was amazed to learn from my minister that Paul was not an arch-conservative.

[Florita]

Lori replies to lborengasser denying she said everything she just clearly said.

Quote

Hi lborengasser, Here are my responses to your 3 points: 

1. I didn't say that studying Created to Be His Help Meet was a Bible Study or in place of a Bible study. It's simply studying a book. 

2. I promote it since it was the book that was the catalyst to changing my marriage and many others. I had read MANY Christian books before I read this one and not one convicted me like this one did. 

3. I never said it was the most important passage in the Bible for women but without it being taught, marriages have crumbled. I wrote, "This is good and way more important than any Bible Study you might attend." God wants women to be submissive to their husbands and all the characteristics in Titus 2:3-5. If these are important to God, these should be important to us. We should be learning the Word from male preachers and teachers and from time in the Word ourselves. If you have read my blog for anytime at all, you will know I teach this over and over again. 

I completely agree with your last paragraph and again, if you have read my blog, you would know this about me. We are the righteousness of God because of what Christ did for us! I speak about being "in Christ" and His power working mightily within us very often!

Translation of the bolded: The problem is you, not me.

[molecule]

I've read that there is evidence both for an against Pauline authorship of Titus, although I admit it isn't something I've paid much attention to recently. It does make me laugh to wonder how Lori would deal with that--although unless she heard it from Michael Pearl or from the Horse of Truth, she wouldn't believe it.

Paul was very radical in his expectations that people in oppressed groups (slaves, women, servants) have any rights at all. He comes across as a misogynist by modern standards, but for his time, he was turning social norms upside down.

[molecule]

The conversation with lborengasser continues.

Lori is challenged for her unhealthy emphasis on Titus 2, and her response doesn't even respond to the comment in a reasonable way. I am surprised she is engaging with this woman.

[Iamhispurity]

8 hours ago, iheartchacos said:

Please, tell me more! I've never heard this.

Well, basically only the Letters to: the Corinthians 1 and 2, Romans, Galations, Phillipians, Philemon, 1 Thessalonican are considered authentic by most modern scholars. 

Especially the evidence againt Tituts being an authentic letter is pretty damning. The writing is totally different from the way Paul usually writes. The letters context indicates it was written some time after 80 AD. Paul died 50 AD. The church discribed in the letter seems more like a church - which happens well after Pauls death. Also the ideas in that letter are pretty different from the ones that are authentic for sure.

The people arguing against it are - for the most part - people who argue for the authenticity of all letters being from Paul. Or they are more evangelical scholars, which means their premise is completely different from most scientific theology. They seem to believe that those differences can be explained by it being written by a secretary of Pauls. But: they are the minority among "liberal" theological scholars. And the inauthenticity of this letter, as far as I know is pretty universally accepted in the theological community that I move in. Then again their authenticity started being questioned by German scholars and I am German. And generally the German theological community is more liberal than huge parts of the American one. But some parts of the American one are way more liberal than most parts here. American scholarship though, often seems to be more hesitant to classify something as forgery. 

[Koala]

Same shit, different day.

Lori:  "Who is more to blame for the destruction of our culture?"

Spoiler

WOMEN!  Duh!

[iheartchacos]

Same shit, different day.

Lori:  "Who is more to blame for the destruction of our culture?"

Spoiler WOMEN!  Duh!

Even Trump agrees!

[docmom]

17 hours ago, Iamhispurity said:

Fun theological fact: Titus was written well after Paul died. So it is a forgery. Most modern scholarship recognizes that fact. So she elevates a really unimportant, forged, pretty conservative (Paul was not really conservative, if you know his context and stuff) letter more than Jesus. Go figure.... But she would never know that because biblical inerrancy and all that jazz...

Way back in the mid-80's I was taught this by one the nation's foremost Pauline scholars.  It's been accepted in academic theological circles for a long, long time.  The professor was a fan of Paul's and did stress that for his time he was a radical thinker. 

The history of the New Testament is fascinating- here's a link to Frontline's "From Jesus to Christ" which goes into some of it: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/story/hypothetical.html