Counting On - Part 6: Benye Wants to Give the Gospel to the "Inner City"

[EyeQueue]

9 hours ago, nickelodeon said:

Girlfriend... you've got your own miserable marriage to focus on! Leave those kids alone!

I totally heard this set to PInk Floyd music ("Another Brick in the Wall"):

"Hey! Anna! Leave those kids alone!"

8 hours ago, Buzzard said:

Looks like the "fancy potatoes" have made it into a TLC promo.  Posting the link from a secondary page to keep TLC from getting direct hits.

 

I don't know. After watching this, Jessa's "She wants that" didn't read so much trying to speak *for* Joy, but rather encouraging her (albeit in a snarky kind of way) to maybe step out of her comfort zone and try the demi glace.

RE: What several commenters have said about about how the ignorance here isn't very snark-worthy: That brings up the issue that's been raised over and over again. At what point should adults who have been raised in such a closed/cult environment be held accountable for their own ignorance?

We know they use the Internet--whether it's Smartphone-based or not. There are opportunities to look up some of this stuff there.

We know they have been in at least semi-ritzy restaurants on their world-wide adventures. At least one of the restaurants they ate at in England looked pretty upscale.

We know Anna has been exposed to DC, and probably ate at a number of upscale restaurants, so probably knows a bit by osmosis from those experiences.

It all came off to me as just being purposefully "cute"--to seem cute and ignorant because wimminz aren't supposed to know anything.

A what point do we stop letting these grown women off the hook for that?

[EmCatlyn]

10 hours ago, Fundie Bunny said:

So, like a rosary? 

Rosaries are one type of prayer beads.   Chaplets are another type of prayer beads used by Catholics.  (As a kid I called chaplets "rosaritos" because many are smaller than rosaries, but I think the correct term in Spanish for chaplet, is "corona de oraciones" or "guirnalda.")  Incidentally, Protestants have gotten into rosaries in recent decades.  I have an Anglican rosary and I have seen Lutheran and Methodist rosaries. 

Muslim prayer beads are called or referred to as dhikr (I think that is how it is spelt) and the Buddhists have beads (or a devotion with beads) called Mala.

There are a lot of different styles depending on religion, the particular devotion, etc..  For instance, Muslim prayer beads have the beads sliding loosely on the cord instead of knotted or linked into place like Catholic prayer beads do.

I agree that they are not ornamental jewelry, but people do wear prayer beads, sometimes as indication of devotion.

[Mothership]

On April 20, 2016 at 8:33 PM, Yaoichan12 said:

Idk if the weird hand waving has been brought up anymore since the first time, but I looked around online and cannot find anything about that sort of waving. 

What I did find is this "To beckon someone, extend the arm, palm down and move the fingers in a scratching motion." 

This is from an etiquette guide for Guatemala to BECKON someone. I found that this is also used in Central and South America to wave or beckon but palm down 

Responding really late, as I"m just catching up on the thread.

The hand waving is a thing.  When I've traveled to Guatemala (although, I believe, they'e in El Salvador), we were told that waving is being very provocative and suggestive (e.g. soliciting).  The other sign that is not appropriate is the "okay" sign as that was the equivalent of flipping off. 

[EyeQueue]

One other thing occurred to me wrt the Duggars and food. Do you all think that once they started having regular episodes on TLC that craft services was a thing in their house, like with the Gosselins? I would think if that were the case, this would have introduced them to new foods that were not previously in their culinary repertoire.

And I think we've seen at least some evidence of this with some fancier nosh trays present in some of the Today show announcement epis, yes?

ETA: Just wondering, because if this is the case it might speak more for the "purposefully ignorant/keeping up the 'aw, shucks' hick bit for their fan base."

[Mothership]

9 hours ago, Buzzard said:

I'm thinking the "fancy dinner" is really a late lunch. Look how bright it is outside.  This would have been shot in the winter and theres no way it was that bright during normal dinner hours.

I ate there last fall.  There's no way they were there for a dinner--too crowded and they don't need the TLC publicity to keep the place booked.  I'd guess a very early (5pm-ish) dinner (most people would have cocktails outside ahead of time)

ETA:  "Chasing the Cow" for a thread count?

 

[shesinsane]

I've never been to a spa, are you supposed to wear clothes under the robe? It reminded me of kids playing spa  - although maybe that's something the girls used to do and what they were going for?

I'm not surprise J has never heard of a leek, Campbells doesn't make cream of leek.

Is Anna's focus on marriage and child because she has nothing else to talk about? Or because Anna seems to have no idea what life is like outside the Duggar umbrella of protection, nor any desire to find out. It might be "sad" that all the girls got dressed up without any men to look at them, but it's even sadder to not realize people can dress up to make themselves happy. 

If you're a Fundie daughter, there's no reason to ask a guy how he makes his living. If he's talking to you that means he's already told your father what he does and father approved.

[nomoxian]

When I was around 13 or 14, there was a guy in the neighbourhood park who would flash people by opening a long coat. When we got off of summer break and the teacher asked us if anything interesting had happened, one kid piped up about the flasher. The rest of the class was like "I saw him too!" and "OMG me too!" He would flash right by the kids play equipment which was also next to the community swimming pool. 

[EmCatlyn]

10 hours ago, PracticeMakesProgress said:

And...why did she not go home to her OWN family? I mean, yes, I can't apply real-world logic to fundie/TLC-land, but the first place I'd go if my husband cheated on me in such spectacular public fashion would NOT be to his parents and sister(s). Makes me think Anna is a better actress than I've given her credit for. 

My impression is that her parents didn't want her. Her brother offered, but she did not want to break her promise to God (or venture out alone without a husband). The Duggars offered support, and they were fellow-sufferers in a sense.  Also, they had more resources.   

Though I would have taken her brother's offer and left the pig, being that she didn't want to, staying with Duggars may have been her best choice.

[2manyKidzzz]

When Anna was talking about Josh to his sisters whom he molested and going on and on about marriage and children it just had an air of unreality about it to me. Like she is just disconnected. And as we know, she is now in the company of Joshley. It is beyond strange, and beyond horrible for her from my perspective. I don't know, of course, what she is thinking. He cannot have really changed IMHO.

[socalrules]

I haven't watched the episode yet but the whole spa thing. They were completely dressed but wore white robes to have a spa day in a cabin? Did they say why they couldn't just do this at home? Did they actually do anything spa like? 

As to Jana's comment about wanting a guy who didn't have an office job, this screams of Jill and her not wanting Derrick away from her at his accounting job. They actually have no understanding of office jobs because Derrick only worked briefly. It's not normal in their world. The Duggar women were obviously raised to believe that men are away from their families 24/7. It also shows that Jana assumes she will never work, no way is she going to ever go get a job either while married or single. Oh and I will be a snob, damn straight I want to know what your job is, if you have ever been married and if you have kids, prior to us going out. No point in wasting my time with an unemployed guy that lives in his parents' basement that has five kids by three different mothers. 

I now think that there will be a second season. My guess is that TLC is paying bargain basement prices to the Duggars, since the Duggars don't have other options, and they figure that they are making some profit from the few sponsors they have. They are also making th Duggars look like fools in every episode and know that's the only reason people are watching. They have stopped trying to make the Duggars look like Leave it to Beaver, fundy style. 

[Becket70]

4 hours ago, 2manyKidzzz said:

So, J&J are the onlly TLC in that top 50? I am shocked. And the only HGTV show there was Good Bones. So I am double shocked. But some of my fav HGTV shows are in repetitive mode. 

So, yes, maybe another season. But not going to Bear Camp, because those people got trashed at least online for that. 

Though their show seems to be in a holding pattern of an acceptable 1,300,000 viewers, the other shows on TLC do not seem to be faring very well.  Shows that, at one time, had acceptable ratings,  do not even show up in the top 100 anymore.  To my untrained eye, it would appear that a lot of people have decided against watching this network. It begs the question...why keep this one show on the air if you sacrifice the ratings on your other shows? It will be very telling to see what  kind of ratings the return of Sister Wives garners.  Sister Wives has had consistently good ratings in the past and if they do not perform well, TLC will know that people are avoiding their network.  TLC is just one more Duggar scandal away from disaster and I do not understand why they would want to continue with this new iteration of 19 Kids. (I had read that TLC's ratings had gone down 15% since 19 Kids was cancelled...it will be interesting to learn the percentages since J&J premiered)

[Mothership]

When Anna is teasing the others, she seems so relaxed and pretty normal. I found myself wanting to have a real conversation with her.  Then when she gets stuck with  TH women she reverts to awkward and tense and twists her mouths in such a way that it almost goes into spasms.

When the inane TLC producer asked Joy whether she ever got tired of being asked about boyfriends/courting, I was so hoping that she'd answer:  "Yes, you stupid Fuck, quit asking me the same question!"

[EmCatlyn]

9 hours ago, Buzzard said:

I'm thinking the "fancy dinner" is really a late lunch. Look how bright it is outside.  This would have been shot in the winter and theres no way it was that bright during normal dinner hours.

It needed to be a time that wasn't busy, so the camera could be there and all.

[Cleopatra7]

8 minutes ago, socalrules said:

I haven't watched the episode yet but the whole spa thing. They were completely dressed but wore white robes to have a spa day in a cabin? Did they say why they couldn't just do this at home? Did they actually do anything spa like? 

As to Jana's comment about wanting a guy who didn't have an office job, this screams of Jill and her not wanting Derrick away from her at his accounting job. They actually have no understanding of office jobs because Derrick only worked briefly. It's not normal in their world. The Duggar women were obviously raised to believe that men are away from their families 24/7. It also shows that Jana assumes she will never work, no way is she going to ever go get a job either while married or single. Oh and I will be a snob, damn straight I want to know what your job is, if you have ever been married and if you have kids, prior to us going out. No point in wasting my time with an unemployed guy that lives in his parents' basement that has five kids by three different mothers. 

I now think that there will be a second season. My guess is that TLC is paying bargain basement prices to the Duggars, since the Duggars don't have other options, and they figure that they are making some profit from the few sponsors they have. They are also making th Duggars look like fools in every episode and know that's the only reason people are watching. They have stopped trying to make the Duggars look like Leave it to Beaver, fundy style. 

I think one reason why so many people drop out of ATI is that you're not supposed to have an independent life outside of your family. Parents are supposed to be so into micromanaging their families that they have to be around 24/7, which tacitly encourages men not to have real jobs, because that would require being away from home. All of this reminds me of Haredi society, where all the young women want to marry a full-time Torah/Talmud scholar, and a man with a secular job is considered a loser. The J'slaves have a very skewed idea about what to expect from a "godly man." They all probably expect to have huge families, but have given no thought as to how they're supposed to finance this when they want a husband who doesn't leave the house and is probably also a SOTDRT graduate.

[Shadoewolf]

4 hours ago, patsymae said:

"As for not asking what someone does for their job, heck yes I want to know!"

 

Admit I didn't see episode and relying on recap (bless Buzzard). In some other contexts, when you first meet a person asking what they do can be seen as a "what is your social-status" thing. But with the Duggars, "courtship" means that the first time you even talk to someone you are interrogating them about marriage. Unlike even the Bateses, they don't even allow "dating with a purpose," but just, here's the guy, you can email him with your parents and siblings monitoring it, and if you are continued to communicate, it is with the express idea that your "courtship" is just one step on the road to marriage.

 

If you're meeting someone for the first time and just going to coffee or a drink or whatever, like normal people do, maybe the first question shouldn't be "what do you do for a living?" But if you are not allowed to interact with people of the opposite sex as acquaintances/friends/colleagues, and your only interactions are to "court" with a view toward marriage, then yeah, it's really odd to not care what the person does for  a living. As others have said, apparently the only acceptable answer in Duggarworld is "nothing, really."

We'd hung at school and talked, and I knew a little about him as his mom was my instructor (he came to our school at the tail end of my program, I was a student ambassador so..)  It came up while we were on what I guess would be our first date. It came up in conversation.  He knew I was training to be a medical assistant, and I asked him what had made him decide to take massage therapy. He said he'd gotten burned out on cooking in restaurants and wanted a change. So not really in a status kind of way.  But from a Duggar point of view, I'd certainly want to make sure my headship could provide for me and our children. Looking at the Bates, they made good spouse choices and married well.  Derrick dropping his Walmart job (which I believe had to be in part to Jill being clingy and show appearances) and Ben having the windshield job and dropping it, doesn't lend well for possible suitors for the daughters.  If I was a guy and worked hard for my degree and my own money, I wouldn't be willing to drop all of that to jump on the Duggar crazy train.

[SassyPants]

So in the video linked above (the girls walking into the lodge), scallopini morphed into:

Scalloped potatoes-Anna

An onion thing (perhaps scallion???) Jinger or Joy

Squid (perhaps scallops???) Jessa

And when the waiter said thinly cut veal, I wonder if any one of them knew what veal was?

And today's letter is S and the number is 19-

Wonder if they ever got to watch Sesame Street? [Apparently, not.]

 

I think I just figured out why I like Jana. She actually thinks before she speaks and comes off looking less ignorant vs the rest.

 

[ClaraOswin]

My husband said this screen shot from last night's episode looks like Josh in drag. And now that's all I can see!

[EmCatlyn]

1 hour ago, Scottie said:

I totally agree with this, it makes the show utterly boring and patently obvious that they're manufacturing story lines for the show. In the original specials and in the 19KAC episodes the girls were generally portrayed as competent home makers (even if tater-tot caserole and canned green beans are less than savoury) now we have grown women who are unable to make mashed potatoes. Its insulting to the audience, and people can see through it. 

 

What puzzles me is why do they still rank in the top 25 or 50 %?  They are boring and fraudulent and hardly a good example to anyone.  But they still have enough viewers that the show is far from through.

[MarblesMom]

@EmCatlynThe critical thinking types, the "question asking types" are the minority.  (Us)

There are 1000's of leghumpers who STILL think they are golden.

I saw the taking down/shaming of the Bear Cabin, but I have missed any taking down over the restaurant in which they were filmed.  I hope they got the same feedback.

[Scottie]

Just now, EmCatlyn said:

What puzzles me is why do they still rank in the top 25 or 50 %?  They are boring and fraudulent and hardly a good example to anyone.  But they still have enough viewers that the show is far from through.

Oh how I wish I could answer that! My best (and most hopeful) guess is that the majority of people watching are hate watching,  like the people here. I have seen some minimal backlash from leghumpers about the Duggar's,  but sadly there are still some people with their heads firmly in the sand when it comes to this family and remain in denial about the harm they are doing. But all of this has been discussed here before so it's not like I'm breaking new ground. 

[EyeQueue]

10 minutes ago, ClaraOswin said:

My husband said this screen shot from last night's episode looks like Josh in drag. And now that's all I can see!

Why am I all of a sudden reminded of this:

[Bad Wolf]

Mr. Wolf went to the nursery today and came home with ten different kinds of potato seedlings. Wonder if any of them are fancy. I'll let you know when they're grown. Erm, what do fancy potatoes look like?

[MarblesMom]

5 minutes ago, Bad Wolf said:

Erm, what do fancy potatoes look like?

Scallopini?

[EmCatlyn]

4 hours ago, coffeefilter said:

I agree somewhat with what you're saying, but I try not to judge if I see any kids acting up at a restaurant. They may have some diagnosis that is keeping them from being able to "behave". Kids with ADHD/ADD/Autism should still be able to go to a restaurant, IMO. Same for adults with CP for example, sometimes they have spasms or can shout and yell, and Ijust ignore that. I feel they have the same right to be at a fancy restaurant as I do, and they can't help the way they're acting. Not all kids have a diagnosis though, of course.

My 3 year old is a bit hyperactive and I can't really take him to fancy restaurants yet. We've been out for dinner at Pizza hut and local pizzerias and sometimes he sits quietly and eats, sometimes he wants to leave or sit on the floor. He doesn't scream and shout that often though, and if he does, I tell him that we can't stay if he's being very loud. But if he wants to sit on the floor for a while, I let him. He has no hearing on one ear and poor hearing on the other, which he is getting surgery for, but his language is quite delayed and it creates a lot of frustration for him so I pick my fights.

Sorry for the essay, I do agree with you bottom line (screaming kids are a pain in the ass) but its not always because of how adept the parents are.

My son was ADHD and oppositional (still is).  And we walked out of many "family" restaurants and had a lot of meals become "we want it to go," because we had miscalculated and he wasn't behaving.  We did not feel he was entitled to be in a public place where he bothered others.

The truth is that the "difficult" child doesn't really want to be in the public place.  It is the parents who feel that they have the right to have their child with them.  

I would not attribute a child's poor self-control to bad parenting.  I know what it is to have people look down their noses at me because my kid was rambunctious and hyper.  But I do think that parents who don't take their kids outside (or leave them at home) so the kids don't bother others are being selfish.  

 

[Scottie]

6 minutes ago, Bad Wolf said:

Mr. Wolf went to the nursery today and came home with ten different kinds of potato seedlings. Wonder if any of them are fancy. I'll let you know when they're grown. Erm, what do fancy potatoes look like?

Well, they probably won't grow in tot form.