The Pope Visit and the Fundies (MERGE ALL POPE VIST THREADS)

[ChestHugger]

Another "gem" from the fundie on Facebook I follow:

Lolz. I really don't understand the logic. What is he teaching that is so sinister? Feeding the hungry and protecting the vulnerable? Got it.

[Jana814]

Just have to slip in a quick interfaith joke.

What do you say when the Pope is visiting the US on Yom Kippur?

Good yontiff, Pontiff.

Good one!!

[HerNameIsBuffy]

Well, the Roman Catholics aren't something. I'm not sure what, but I stumbled across the Canons of the Council of Trent the other day and, well...

And so on and so forth extensively...

Looks like I'm getting accursed several times over :P

I came across that when skimming through the book 'Popery as It Was and as It Is', which I found reproduced at revolutionforjesus.com/2015/08/25/popery-as-it-was-and-as-it-is-2/ which is the blog of a creationist cosmologist.

I don't know what any of this means. As to the bolded is the inference that you also don't believe that Catholics are Christians?

I totally get disagreement with faith, or specific faiths, I totally get thinking that some belief systems are a load of crap and don't bat an eye...but that some protestants (plenty of fundy lites buy into this as well) don't consider Catholics to be Christian baffles me. The definition of Christian is "a person who has received Christian baptism or is a believer in Jesus Christ and his teachings." Love them or hate them how do you not sort Catholics into that house when dividing people up? Belief in the divinity of Jesus? Check. Baptism? Check.

Protestant sects broke off because they believed Catholics were doing Christianity wrong...not because they thought Catholics hadn't heard of him. He's the guy on the cross behind the altar - kind of hard to miss.

[Mary C Doates]

Still waiting for the Seewalds to weigh in on this. I'm sure they view Pope-apalooza as as sign of the impending Apocalypse.

[FoxyMoxie]

Many non-Catholics believe in sacramental confession, it's not unique to Catholics.

[quiversR4hunting]

Many non-Catholics believe in sacramental confession, it's not unique to Catholics.

Even the Duggars with their prayer closet.

However, a priest won't give you a Pearl punishment like Me'chelle and Jboob

[CyborgKin]

I don't know what any of this means. As to the bolded is the inference that you also don't believe that Catholics are Christians?

I totally get disagreement with faith, or specific faiths, I totally get thinking that some belief systems are a load of crap and don't bat an eye...but that some protestants (plenty of fundy lites buy into this as well) don't consider Catholics to be Christian baffles me. The definition of Christian is "a person who has received Christian baptism or is a believer in Jesus Christ and his teachings." Love them or hate them how do you not sort Catholics into that house when dividing people up? Belief in the divinity of Jesus? Check. Baptism? Check.

Protestant sects broke off because they believed Catholics were doing Christianity wrong...not because they thought Catholics hadn't heard of him. He's the guy on the cross behind the altar - kind of hard to miss.

My point was more that the Catholics (or at least the Canons of the Council of Trent, which were a reaction to the Reformation) are pretty clear that Protestants are accursed (anathema) and, well, not Christians. So if the Catholics say the Protestants aren't Christians, it's no wonder why the Protestants don't care much what the Catholics think about anything.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

My point was more that the Catholics (or at least the Canons of the Council of Trent, which were a reaction to the Reformation) are pretty clear that Protestants are accursed (anathema) and, well, not Christians. So if the Catholics say the Protestants aren't Christians, it's no wonder why the Protestants don't care much what the Catholics think about anything.

I get why they don't care what Catholics think. I get why people couldn't care less what any of faith thinks of theirs (that's healthy imo) but that wasn't the question. You said, "the Catholics aren't something, I'm not sure what."

What aren't they?

I think the Duggar beliefs are ridiculous and dangerous, but I wouldn't say they aren't Christian. If they believe Jesus was divine and the Son of God they're Chrisitan no matter how batshit crazy I think they are.

I just would like to know what you meant by that.

And fwiw the sentiment about Protestants all being heretics has changed considerably since the mid 1500's. The Vatican and laity alike consider Protestants to be Crhsitians. There are major doctrinal differences to be sure, but whether they fall under the umbrella of Christinanty isn't in dispute as long as the whole Jesus is divine criteria is met.

The Protestant reformation wasn't welcomed by the Church so im sure tempers were running high at the outset. Similarly the British back in the late 1700's weren't big fans of the whole American uprising, but I don't think they still consider us traitors to the crown. Fortunately people adapt.

[Grimalkin]

My point was more that the Catholics (or at least the Canons of the Council of Trent, which were a reaction to the Reformation) are pretty clear that Protestants are accursed (anathema) and, well, not Christians. So if the Catholics say the Protestants aren't Christians, it's no wonder why the Protestants don't care much what the Catholics think about anything.

I have never in my life heard of a Catholic who denies protestants are Christians.I know some hardcore catholic history buffs too.

[CyborgKin]

Fair point, the Catholics and Protestants really don't need me restarting ancient wars. :oops:

[Crocoduck]

And my personal favorite line today

:pink-shock: Somebody needs to get back on their meds.

As for the Catholicism is secretly Muslim arguments - did they ever hear of the Crusades?

[Imagine20]

Well, the Pope IS the Anti-Christ, at least to the WELS Lutheran Synod.

I'm getting sick of the crazy just to be crazy faction in the US. It's getting to be a bit much.

[FoxyMoxie]

Non-Catholic Christian =/= Protestant. There are others eg the Orthodox too.

[DomWackTroll]

Someone’s working himself into a lather over at the Sharper Iron forums:

If the RCC wants to be accepted as "evangelical," it can start by taking off all those ridiculous costumes, dispense with all that pagan ceremony, take Jesus off a crucifix and present Him as the living Christ. They can quit idolizing the "Eucharist," stop re-crucifying the Savior in the Mass, get rid of the idolatry that permeates its worship, remove all trust in sacraments to gain salvation, stop pronouncing salvation by way of baptism, remove from its nomenclature all idolatrous titles of the Pope, etc., etc. The RCC represents the greatest perversion of the Christian faith and the greatest example of Satanic deceit one could imagine.

sharperiron.org/filings/092415/31323

[sawasdee]

Someone’s working himself into a lather over at the Sharper Iron forums:

sharperiron.org/filings/092415/31323

Jesus Mary and Joseph!

[FoxyMoxie]

IIRC the Mass as sacrifice went out with Vatican II? It's something the Trads are big on bringing back, but is not part of mainstream RC theology anymore.

[laPapessaGiovanna]

IIRC the Mass as sacrifice went out with Vatican II? It's something the Trads are big on bringing back, but is not part of mainstream RC theology anymore.

The last time I have been at the Mass the word sacrifice was still in the liturgy. And Jesus is the agnus dei, the perfect sacrifice.

ETA last time was less than three years ago. Also Vatican II got rid of the most superficial crap, there was no major theological change.

[FoxyMoxie]

Sacrifice is in Anglican liturgy too, I mean the idea that the priest redoes the sacrifice (sorry - redoes is not the best word but I hope you see what I mean!). From what I can tell, the Trads say that this has been removed/watered down to please Protestants.

[anniebgood]

Jesus Mary and Joseph!

And don't forget ALL THE SAINTS IN HEAVEN!

[jaelh]

so i'm just leaving this here cause it's awesome.

http://www.newyorker.com/humor/daily-sh ... o-new-york

[laPapessaGiovanna]

Sacrifice is in Anglican liturgy too, I mean the idea that the priest redoes the sacrifice (sorry - redoes is not the best word but I hope you see what I mean!). From what I can tell, the Trads say that this has been removed/watered down to please Protestants.

The Catholic dogma is that in the moment when the priest consecrates the wine and bread they become the flesh and blood of Jesus offered in living memory of his sacrifice. Maybe the translation from the latin words is not as poignant but the sacrament didn't change since Catholics believe that Jesus himself instituted it in his Last Dinner. Probably traditionalists feel it has been watered down, but you know they are the sort of people who cannot accept any change. What is true is that Pope Benedict XVI (I should check but I think I remember well) with the Apostolic Constitution Anglicanorum Coetibus instituted another rite for the Mass called the Anglican Rite that includes elements of the Anglican tradition for those Anglicans that want to become Catholics without leaving their traditions.

I have found this article on the first such Mass, it's in italian but you can try Google translate.

http://vaticaninsider.lastampa.it/nel-m ... ido-28439/

[Coldwinterskies]

There's a meme going around on Jehovah's Witness social media where they are trying to convince themselves that their stupid magazine had some unique wisdom in foreseeing the Pope's unholy alliance with secular government a few years in advance

(one of the things JWs are big on is the idea that secular government is controlled by Satan and therefore actual Christians should have nothing to do with politics - and of course, like most fundies, they REALLY do not like Catholics)

Of course, anyone with sense knows that this is NOT the first time a Pope has been photographed hanging out on a balcony with the President. In fact, it is very easy to find very similar photos of Pope Benedict that most likely were the actual inspiration for the Watchtower's art.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

Is that the new goal? No one tells me anything.

Oh well, I still have no intention of letting anything interfere with my system of giving zero fucks about what others believe so it's okay that I didn't get the memo.

(I gotta tell you, ideology aside evangelism seems like a lot of work and if I did that who would lay on my couch?)

[Criscat]

Yes. I've heard the whole Catholics are not Christian thing quite a bit. I spent about 5 years in a church that was pretty much fundie-lite. I came from the Catholic Church and most of them pretty much told me Catholics weren't Christian. Interestingly enough, most people couldn't tell me why though. :think: left that one when I realized for them, my being in my thirties and not married was for the most part not acceptable.

I know the pope is part of what they don't like. Heard all the possibilities. Personally, I like Pope Francis, as long as he stays out of politics...the pope discussing climate change was a little much during his visit. However, It is actually quite refreshing to hear a pope talking about taking care of the poor and vulnerable.

[HerNameIsBuffy]

Yes. I've heard the whole Catholics are not Christian thing quite a bit. I spent about 5 years in a church that was pretty much fundie-lite. I came from the Catholic Church and most of them pretty much told me Catholics weren't Christian. Interestingly enough, most people couldn't tell me why though. :think: left that one when I realized for them, my being in my thirties and not married was for the most part not acceptable.

I know the pope is part of what they don't like. Heard all the possibilities. Personally, I like Pope Francis, as long as he stays out of politics...the pope discussing climate change was a little much during his visit. However, It is actually quite refreshing to hear a pope talking about taking care of the poor and vulnerable.

I know off topic, but I have to ask about your username...Tribute to Peter Criss?

(Only Catholic member of KISS - back on topic!)