Michael (Bates) Keilen Bump Watch

[BeccaGrim]

18 minutes ago, faraway said:

Yeah, I mean we saw Erin & Chad go to the doctor who clearly was able to help them. I bet it's less accepted in the fundie world to have the man be the cause for fertility issues though.

It would still be her fault somehow. Its always the woman's fault. They put Josh Duggar in sex rehab but trust me somehow its Anna's fault in their world. 

[faraway]

Yeah, like she doesn't make his sperm feel comfortable enough! 

[BeccaGrim]

3 minutes ago, faraway said:

Yeah, like she doesn't make his sperm feel comfortable enough! 

God forbid she has an inhospitable uterus... 

[faraway]

Those are the worst! Never make anyone feel at home...

[VelociRapture]

On May 4, 2016 at 3:37 PM, faraway said:

Yeah, I mean we saw Erin & Chad go to the doctor who clearly was able to help them. I bet it's less accepted in the fundie world to have the man be the cause for fertility issues though.

There could be a difference between Erin's issue and someone not being able to conceive at all. 

With Erin she could conceive easily, but couldn't sustain the pregnancy - meaning, in their views, there was a life that needed saving. Going to a Specialist because a couple can't get pregnant on their own could be seen as interfering with God's will or something really stupid like that.

I do think a visit with a doctor would likely be fine - just that maybe some families might not be cool with IVF or other interventions like that. Maybe someone with more knowledge on the topic can give a better answer.

 

[faraway]

Yeah, that's exactly what I mean. I think not being able to conceive would totally catapult fundies out of their comfort zone and put them in a tough spot. I'm sure a spermiogram is not Gothard-approved...

While I don't wish infertility on anyone, seeing a fundie couple go through treatment to get their blessings and admit that science helped them would be priceless!

[TShirtsLongSkirts]

1 hour ago, faraway said:

While I don't wish infertility on anyone, seeing a fundie couple go through treatment to get their blessings and admit that science helped them would be priceless!

I'd love that too! I cant see it happening though. I'd see it more as they'd get a lot of help from fertility doctors and professionals and then if they did get preggo be all "oh God has blessed us!" and not actually be thankful to the scientists and doctors that made it happen. 

[BeccaGrim]

On 5/6/2016 at 4:13 PM, TShirtsLongSkirts said:

I'd love that too! I cant see it happening though. I'd see it more as they'd get a lot of help from fertility doctors and professionals and then if they did get preggo be all "oh God has blessed us!" and not actually be thankful to the scientists and doctors that made it happen. 

You would think it would lead them to adoption. If God is saying 'no' to babies (and science is bad) wouldn't it then make sense for them to adopt?  Get their 19 that way? And by the way, this is all skeptical. We have no idea why M is not pregnant or if she is. 

[JesusCampSongs]

2 hours ago, BeccaGrim said:

You would think it would lead them to adoption. If God is saying 'no' to babies (and science is bad) wouldn't it then make sense for them to adopt?  Get their 19 that way? And by the way, this is all skeptical. We have no idea why M is not pregnant or if she is. 

Even if their beliefs allowed it (see: Gothard's whole thing about adopted children being tainted by the sins of their original parents), I don't think adopting would be a viable option for most fundie families:

• adopting from foster care would involve a level of government scrutiny they probably wouldn't accept (not to mention the long odds of them passing a homestudy),
• private adoptions are hellaciously expensive (plus they'd have to convince agencies/birthmothers of their fitness),
• and international adoptions are not only hellaciously expensive, but they've been further restricted each year due to concerns about human trafficking/baby selling. 

 

[Palimpsest]

30 minutes ago, JesusCampSongs said:

Even if their beliefs allowed it (see: Gothard's whole thing about adopted children being tainted by the sins of their original parents), I don't think adopting would be a viable option for most fundie families:

• adopting from foster care would involve a level of government scrutiny they probably wouldn't accept (not to mention the long odds of them passing a homestudy),
• private adoptions are hellaciously expensive (plus they'd have to convince agencies/birthmothers of their fitness),
• and international adoptions are not only hellaciously expensive, but they've been further restricted each year due to concerns about human trafficking/baby selling. 

 

Wait a minute!  Holy over-simplification!

While some strides have been made in controlling this we are not there yet.  Not all Fundies as we define them on FJ are Gothardite! Or Duggars.  Or Bateses. Yes, Gothard (see IBLP/ATI) was/is against adoption (parental sins).  Some IBLP/ATI Gothardites have still adopted.

This is why we want people to read more widely on FJ to see how HUGE this problem is in reality.  And how may of these Fundie families are grabbing children for Jesus.  It goes way beyond the TV families.  Extreme Fundamentalist families have been adopting children. locally and internationally, in droves.

They fundraise on a regular basis to adopt babies for Jesus.  

-  See "The Child Catchers: Rescue, Trafficking, and the New Gospel of Adoption"  by Kathryn Joyce.

-  See multiple threads on Quiverfull of Snark tagged under adoption. http://www.freejinger.org/forum/325-adoption/

- Google Hana Alemu Williams.  That story should break anyone's heart.

- and check out how many private adoptions take place among Fundie families with very little oversight.   The late blogger rather unfairly known here as "Lazy Lyndsie" has a tragic story.  Not just for her but also for the children she adopted - against all common sense and the norms of adoption regulations.

[faraway]

Very good post Palimsest!

While Gothard was/is against adoption, some families clearly affiliated with ATI have adopted (f.ex. the Salyers & the Youngs). Also, if it was considered so bad, the Duggars wouldn't talk about it all the time. I hate to say it but I'm sure Benessa want to adopt.

[infooverload]

The Duggars on one of their episodes had a fellow fundie family visit who had several adopted children and some of the children were disabled. I do find it interesting there has been no discussion about her upcoming graduation. Things have been rather quite.

[BeccaGrim]

Is this route Jessa and Ben are using?

[choralcrusader8613]

2 hours ago, infooverload said:

The Duggars on one of their episodes had a fellow fundie family visit who had several adopted children and some of the children were disabled. I do find it interesting there has been no discussion about her upcoming graduation. Things have been rather quite.

Yes, I remember them! Those are the Vanderhoffs, for anyone interested in learning more about them.

[Palimpsest]

20 minutes ago, choralcrusader8613 said:

Yes, I remember them! Those are the Vanderhoffs, for anyone interested in learning more about them.

I haven't a clue who they are but I found this.

 

[HereticHick]

I'd like to congratulate Michaella on this mild Instagram comments smackdown to the supercreepy Bates stalker, Becky M:

 

"becky_m2001You and Brandon have been heavily on my thoughts and in my prayers lately. I'm not sure why. I do hope everythng is OK and you're simply not posting because you're busy. I will continue to pray for you both!! @brandon_michael_jn15

ponapy89@becky_m2001 why do you assume there's something wrong with them? - leave them alone she is not there to please you with pictures everyday is she

brandon_michael_jn15@becky_m2001We are doing splendid. Thanks for the prayers." 

 

I wish Michaella had throw a "Bless Your Heart" in there as well.

 

[TShirtsLongSkirts]

27 minutes ago, HereticHick said:

I'd like to congratulate Michaella on this mild Instagram comments smackdown to the supercreepy Bates stalker, Becky M:

 

"becky_m2001You and Brandon have been heavily on my thoughts and in my prayers lately. I'm not sure why. I do hope everythng is OK and you're simply not posting because you're busy. I will continue to pray for you both!! @brandon_michael_jn15

ponapy89@becky_m2001 why do you assume there's something wrong with them? - leave them alone she is not there to please you with pictures everyday is she

brandon_michael_jn15@becky_m2001We are doing splendid. Thanks for the prayers." 

 

I wish Michaella had throw a "Bless Your Heart" in there as well.

 

Fundies can be fantastic at shade - have to give them that. Remember Erin to Lawson "stay on your page"?!

[infooverload]

She honestly seems happy based only on what she presents publicly. The response was to the point and I am sure she is used to hearing similar sentiments on the regular. Can I just say I am more annoyed no one ever says "hey how's the studying going? Are you excited for graduation? A way to focus on an ongoing goal and to value her as a whole person. Not just a uterus waiting to be filled because she has expressed a joy for children.

[faraway]

These dramatic leghumpers are the worst, I would write back "From now on I'll be praying for you too".  Michael does seem genuinely happy. I also believe she wants to be pregnant and they're probably still in the "whenever the lord decides" thinking. If nothing happens after a substantial amount of time, it will probably become way more difficult...

[BeccaGrim]

2 hours ago, infooverload said:

She honestly seems happy based only on what she presents publicly. The response was to the point and I am sure she is used to hearing similar sentiments on the regular. Can I just say I am more annoyed no one ever says "hey how's the studying going? Are you excited for graduation? A way to focus on an ongoing goal and to value her as a whole person. Not just a uterus waiting to be filled because she has expressed a joy for children.

I'm going to go do so now that you mention it. 

[Kak]

"We are doing splendid".

Good grief. SOTDRT strikes yet again.

[HarleyQuinn]

On 5/4/2016 at 10:32 AM, QuiverDance said:

Maybe her headship is not on the 19 kids train.  

Her headship doesn't look to be on the sex train in general. 

[imokit]

Lets give Michael a brake, she's been married less than a year.  Infertility officially gets diagnosed after 1 year of regular birth control free sex.

If she and Brandon do have infertility, there are fundy approved ways depending on the cause - I know that Kelly has been honest about taking hormones in the past (which in my book is just as much "leaving it up to god" as birth control is)...

[faraway]

I know about the 1 year rule, but honestly, with these hyper-fertile fundies, who are also at the most fertile age, it's hard to look at it that way. All the other married girls got pregnant in a blink of an eye.

[VelociRapture]

1 hour ago, faraway said:

I know about the 1 year rule, but honestly, with these hyper-fertile fundies, who are also at the most fertile age, it's hard to look at it that way. All the other married girls got pregnant in a blink of an eye.

Fertility is different for each and every couple. One Bates sibling getting pregnant fast doesn't mean the others will too. It also doesn't mean they won't face other fertility issues either - such as the ones that the Paines faced. Additionally, they may not be hyper-fertile. We can't know because it's far too early in their marriages to tell - and even then, refusing to use any form of contraception can give the appearance of hyper-fertility.

And to be fair, age is absolutely no guarantee. Statistics aren't either. As a healthy 27 year-old with a healthy 28 year-old husband the odds I would have a miscarriage were around 10-15%. I miscarried anyway. I conceived again the very next cycle and, so far, things are progressing well. But still. Numbers mean nothing once you're on the wrong side of them.

All that to basically say: no one knows what's going on other than Brandon and Michael. I suppose the topic is open to debate due to the fact that the family got famous off Kelly and Gil's need to constantly bone for Jesus... But it is premature to be discussing any fertility issues they may be facing.