TLC Documentary on Sexual Abuse

[mrsjupiter]

Yea, Erin giving her own autographed books to an 11 year old survivor as a gift was one of several WTF moments for me. I was fully expecting the gift to be something like an angel statue or a special charm bracelet, something sweet and meaningful. Afterall, they have been in close contact for a long time. Not three (purchase now from my website) promo items that cost her nothing in thought or money or time.

This whole broadcast made me .... dunno.

"This happens in so many families, we are completely normal. Nothing to see here", said every Duggar ever. It confirmed for me that Jill is completely ignorant and Jessa is smug and arrogant.

Let's not forget Jessa's insert of how she's pregnant in the doc.

[Daisy4]

Giving your own autographed books to an 11 year old as a gift? WTF!

This! I thought that was so strange! She was treating the 11 year old like a fan girl. I also thought it was weird that she made such a big deal of her abuser using the "shh" gesture to tell her not to tell anyone and then later in the show she shhhhs her daughter using the same gesture. That stuck me as odd.

[Buzzard]

As an aside, "Erin's law" rubs me wrong. Generally when they name a law like that its for someone who died. Naming it "Erin's" is further self promoting... name it the children's law or something like that.

[Ilovebrownies]

Anyone else getting really burned out by the overuse of the term "safeguards" from the Duggars? It's almost like when they use that term they never really explain what it means, it just sounds good to them as a catch all and it sounds like they mean business. It sounds serious. When they say it and even try to rattle off anything about it, they never clearly outline what safeguards are for them.

There's got to be a better word for this other than safeguards.

Yes, and they talk about it as if it is the cure for sexual abuse.

[PokaDot]

As an aside, "Erin's law" rubs me wrong. Generally when they name a law like that its for someone who died. Naming it "Erin's" is further self promoting... name it the children's law or something like that.

I feel the same way. I found it to be really.....irritating for some reason.

[Idolatry]

People will believe you if you tell, except when they don't, but tell anyway. Erin's law is awesome (although I didn't exactly catch what Erin's law actually is). Tell your kids that touching where your bathing suit covers is bad. And, apparently most important, limit opportunities for abuse by----vague stuff about babysitters, but the Duggars girls definitely agree--safeguards.

This "documentary" didn't say what it is because Erin's law is about ebil public school. Things like molesting happen there, not in homeschooling, obviously.

[HarryPotterFan]

Another key quote from the Jezebel article VR posted:

What message is the network sending when it condemns sexual abuse and the silence surrounding it while continuing to avoid its own responsibility in the Duggar scandal?

This sums up my feelings pretty well.

Part of the special that I did like was when Erin spoke directly to the viewers who are survivors to make it clear that the abuse was not their fault. It is an important message, but then when you contrast that to the Duggars who victim blame...just putting those messages/people together doesn't feel right. I would have loved for the Duggars to have taken the workshop seriously and for their shitty cover-up and ideas to have been directly challenged. Instead we get them smiling like fools. They seem to think if they keep smiling and sweeping this and the other victims under the rug then they will look wonderful and possibly get their show back. (I still don't understand why they don't realize people have a problem with that...) But in reality the only way for Jill and Jessa to get any sort of redemption they have to stop with the fake keeping it sweet garbage and show that they are able to learn something.

[sawasdee]

If either Jill or Jessa had shown any discomfort or even distress rather than inane smiles(or so I gather from Buzzard's awesome recap, and others' summaries) perhaps they could have recouped some measure of credibility with this "documentary'.As it is, I think this is the final nail in the coffin :mrgreen:

[JesSky03]

Sorry, I couldn't figure out how to get the screen shot on here but this is from Erin's Law's facebook page.

Katie Moran

Today at 11:18

Erin, why do you keep deleting posts here?

13Like · Comment

Most Recent

Jessica Teasdale likes this.

Erin's Law Any mention of Duggars gets removed from this page....positive or negative.

Like · Reply · 3 hours ago

Katie Moran Well, I am sorry that your message about preventing abuse was ruined by having the Duggars there to detract from it.

Like · Reply · 5 · 3 hours ago

Erin's Law me too! I was asked my opinion about having them on and I said to not include them it would take away from this documentary and the focus of child sexual abuse prevention. So anytime anyone wants to bring the conversation back to the Duggars whether it is positive or negative I remove it. The focus is child sexual abuse awareness prevention not the Duggars.

[TheJewAmongUs]

Sorry, I couldn't figure out how to get the screen shot on here but this is from Erin's Law's facebook page.

Katie Moran

Today at 11:18

Erin, why do you keep deleting posts here?

13Like · Comment

Most Recent

Jessica Teasdale likes this.

Erin's Law Any mention of Duggars gets removed from this page....positive or negative.

Like · Reply · 3 hours ago

Katie Moran Well, I am sorry that your message about preventing abuse was ruined by having the Duggars there to detract from it.

Like · Reply · 5 · 3 hours ago

Erin's Law me too! I was asked my opinion about having them on and I said to not include them it would take away from this documentary and the focus of child sexual abuse prevention. So anytime anyone wants to bring the conversation back to the Duggars whether it is positive or negative I remove it. The focus is child sexual abuse awareness prevention not the Duggars.

She could just delete the comments without blocking the people. I sent a tweet to TLC and she blocked me on Twitter and Facebook. That's fucking crazy when you're trying to get a law passed.

And sell books and beg people to send you money.

Edited to add - Not to mention, the only reason she got to be in the documentary was because of the Duggars abuse scandal. While I don't agree with the way they participated, it was pretty unrealistic to think that TLC was going to exclude them completely. If she didn't want to be in a documentary with the Duggars, she should have declined. Erin had no problem opportunistically bringing up the Duggars to get her name in the press when this scandal broke. Now she doesn't want to share air time with them? Puh-leeze.

[slickcat79]

Co-signing the ideas that TLC is trying to whitewash any culpability in the Duggar abuse situation, and that the Duggars were probably more heavily featured before Joshgate 2.0.

Things that stood out to me in relation to the Duggars:

-One of the therapists mentioned that it's so important for a parent/family member to trust/support/advocate for a child who comes forward to talk about their abuse. JB&M failed hardcore at that one (and it was not acknowledged in any way).

-A major part of Erin's Law consists of providing age appropriate sexual abuse education, starting with preschoolers. Given the Duggars' obsession with superficial "modesty" and their extreme sheltering of their children, I don't believe for a minute they would be on board with that, even after learning how important it is firsthand.

[Daisy4]

This "documentary" didn't say what it is because Erin's law is about ebil public school. Things like molesting happen there, not in homeschooling, obviously.

Erin's law is trying to make age appropriate sexual abuse education mandatory in every grade in public school.

They said that in the special last night, I'd never heard of it before. I wish they had gone into more detail with examples of appropriate sexual abuse education for a few different ages.

[Daisy4]

If either Jill or Jessa had shown any discomfort or even distress rather than inane smiles(or so I gather from Buzzard's awesome recap, and others' summaries) perhaps they could have recouped some measure of credibility with this "documentary'.As it is, I think this is the final nail in the coffin :mrgreen:

Oh Jill and J'chelle have that fake doe eye concerned look down and they had it out in full force... followed up by those ridiculous "keep sweet" grins.

[PokaDot]

Erin's law is trying to make age appropriate sexual abuse education mandatory in every grade in public school.

They said that in the special last night, I'd never heard of it before. I wish they had gone into more detail with examples of appropriate sexual abuse education for a few different ages.

I'm actually not sure how I feel about Erin's law. I don't mind teachers being trained to watch for signs of abuse, but to mandate that it be taught in every grade? I'm really not okay with that. Especially once you get to HS, there's so much learning that needs to be packed into school. How is it going to be taught outside of health class? How is it presented so kids don't just laugh it off. The fact that people seem okay with this being taught every year in every grade, but sex ed is uncouth just really rubs me the wrong way. But, tbh, the entire law (down to it being named after herself) just rubs me the wrong way.

Not saying it's bad to teach kids that "bad touches" are bad, I just think this law is going about it the wrong way. Especially if parents can't opt their child out of it (for whatever reason-like maybe they want to have that discussion with their child).

I'm also not sure I understand why the Duggar's are so enthusiastic (from an article I read about them and Erin) about it being passed everywhere, considering they think public schools are evil, and that the government telling people what to do is evil.

[Daisy4]

I'm actually not sure how I feel about Erin's law. I don't mind teachers being trained to watch for signs of abuse, but to mandate that it be taught in every grade? I'm really not okay with that. Especially once you get to HS, there's so much learning that needs to be packed into school. How is it going to be taught outside of health class? How is it presented so kids don't just laugh it off. The fact that people seem okay with this being taught every year in every grade, but sex ed is uncouth just really rubs me the wrong way. But, tbh, the entire law (down to it being named after herself) just rubs me the wrong way.

Not saying it's bad to teach kids that "bad touches" are bad, I just think this law is going about it the wrong way. Especially if parents can't opt their child out of it (for whatever reason-like maybe they want to have that discussion with their child).

I'm also not sure I understand why the Duggar's are so enthusiastic (from an article I read about them and Erin) about it being passed everywhere, considering they think public schools are evil, and that the government telling people what to do is evil.

I'm torn on the law also. I plan to teach my children myself anyway do I probably wouldn't mind them hearing it again, but I was curious about implementation.

The duggars has nothing to do with Erin's Law. The discussion of the law was just one part of the special. There was also a discussion of a hotline and discussion of a seminar that you can attend to become better informed on CSA. The Duggars just attended the seminar and talked about that, they didn't talk about anything else in the special.

[Daisy4]

I'm torn on the law also. I plan to teach my children myself anyway do I probably wouldn't mind them hearing it again, but I was curious about implementation.

The duggars has nothing to do with Erin's Law. The discussion of the law was just one part of the special. There was also a discussion of a hotline and discussion of a seminar that you can attend to become better informed on CSA. The Duggars just attended the seminar and talked about that, they didn't talk about anything else in the special.

Sorry, I just saw that you said you read an article about the duggars enthusiasm for the law. My guess is that they well do anything to improve their image.

[Imagine20]

I did not watch, but from what it sounds like Erin had a pretty big roll in this special. If she really didn't want the Duggars to be part of it, wouldn't she have had a say in that? Couldn't she have said, "I'm not doing this if they're involved?"

It sounds like she doesn't want the dialogue to shift to the Duggars because it takes away from her. The Duggars need to be part of the conversation because of what they did wrong. You can't have a special about the 5 steps, but then ignore the white elephant in the room: the family that didn't do anything right. By not confronting them head-on, she's passively endorsing them and that is unsettling.

[Jana814]

I missed the show, but I get the impression that the only reason Michelle horned in on any of this was to ensure that Jessa and Jill stayed on script and didn't suggest any of their own revisions about what happened with Josh. Michelle not only enabled Josh's behavior, she was an accountabili-buddy to her own daughters in the interest of protecting him further.

Agree!

[Jana814]

As an aside, "Erin's law" rubs me wrong. Generally when they name a law like that its for someone who died. Naming it "Erin's" is further self promoting... name it the children's law or something like that.

Agree!

[HarryPotterFan]

Also if Erin's Law mandates that TEACHERS teach about CSA (it should also include sexual assault as a whole, IMO) in order for it to be effective/well done teachers would have to go through an additional training. If they're not experts on the subject matter, how can they sensitively teach it or answer questions? Would teachers be trained in how to respond if the lesson is triggering for a child (like breaking down crying) or the child discloses to them?

ETA: this is more general musings rather than expecting people to be familiar enough with the law to answer.

[Rubyroo]

Yeah, I don't know if teachers are equIpped to handle teaching CSA but I'm all for the school nurse or therapist or social worker being trained in teaching CSA and just going around to all the classes once a year. That makes sense to me. But each teacher teaches differently and sometimes they get off track and don't get to cover all the material. Leaving it up to the teachers seems like a poor choice, they have enough to cover without another lesson (probably outside if their subject area) to throw in.

[anon710]

Thanks Buzzard and everyone else who took one for the team.

Even if I had cable I don't know if I could have sat through it.

I tried the link that TLC has and it didn't work. Maybe that's for the best, for me.

[DeFrauder]

Do you think Erin is hitching her star to the Duggar's so she can gain visibility? If so, that is sad. That didn't work out so well didn't it?

Also, I've been thinking about the subject of pedophilia and, not to derail, but I think the committee that develops the next revision to the DSM should consider lowering the age as long as other conditions are met, such as grooming behaviors, an element of control, repeated abuse, a degree of narcissism, and a very large age difference between victim and perpetrator. I don't like that 16 is the hard and fast number that the committee came up with. It seems arbitrary and I know I am not on the committee but I sure would like to be a fly on the wall when they start discussing ages. Before you think I am too bold, the rules can and do change; once upon a recent past, a DSM committee determined that being LGBT was an illness.

Just wondering because of all the recent attention to the subject.

The DSM is a guideline not a rulebook. Plus, it does not matter. If someone is a pedophile, they will keep being a pedophile after they turn 16.

[Imrlgoddess]

It was hard to find on the TLC website before it aired (I wanted to see what the times were regionally) and there is still no direct link to it. You can search and get the previews...but not clips of what actually aired, or the whole show.

My daughter was confused last night as to why I was frustrated with the show after it was (abruptly) over. I explained the whole dynamic to her, from the Duggar issues all the way to the show being a vague attempt at making light of the situation.

[DeFrauder]

I think the reason the Duggars were on it was because of the molestation that came out. TLC said after the FOX interview they were going to do a special. I think the Duggars were a bigger focus. And then Joshley Madison came out and TLC cut the Duggar trio down to sound bites. I think they should have cut them out completely. They did nothing for the program.

I wonder how they really acted in the seminar. I would love to hear the other participants say if they think they really got it or not. Because we all know TV likes to edit the crap out of everything. We only saw a few snippets of the duggar trio.

I can't wait for Jessa to get her fully functioning adult brain. (reasoning doesn't fully develop until mid-20s - NPR article npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=141164708 ) I wonder if brain development is slower in these fundies than in the mainstream Christian kids or secular kids. That debate is for another day :)

I am going to assert that people who grow up in repressive situations and escape are late bloomers. Entering mainstream society after being a fundie requires re-socialization. Some people handle the transition better than others. Plus their transition from fundie to mainstream is more difficult than the transition from mainstream to fundie. A mainstream person already has the social skills to operate in the world (in general), but chooses to retreat from the mainstream. The raised fundie child has few mainstream skills (in general) when they enter the mainstream. Its an uphill battle.