Bringing Up Bates & Other Bates Family Doings

[freethemall]

are there still no full episodes up online anywhere? come on fjers with cable, can't someone film it and put it on youtube for the rest of us!

[calimojo]

Sorry, but I am still back on Lawson's mowing business. I get that this could be a decent money maker, but isn't tuition to Crown over 10K per year? Plus cars are several thousand, and each shopping trip to the grocery store is several hundred bucks. We have no idea how much he has loaned Gil. It still just seems like a lot of money for him to have loaned and covered for his family. And I don't think they ever show anything about the lawn business on TV, do they?

On the show, he said he is running a landscaping company. So I wonder if that means he does other stuff besides mowing? Maybe he does some landscape design?

Even if you are not a Lawson fan, I think it really is pretty impressive that he has had that business grow enough that it helped support his family, and pay for tuitions and such. He seems to be a very responsible kid.

[LittleOleMe]

Sorry, but I am still back on Lawson's mowing business. I get that this could be a decent money maker, but isn't tuition to Crown over 10K per year? Plus cars are several thousand, and each shopping trip to the grocery store is several hundred bucks. We have no idea how much he has loaned Gil. It still just seems like a lot of money for him to have loaned and covered for his family. And I don't think they ever show anything about the lawn business on TV, do they?

On the show, he said he is running a landscaping company. So I wonder if that means he does other stuff besides mowing? Maybe he does some landscape design?

Even if you are not a Lawson fan, I think it really is pretty impressive that he has had that business grow enough that it helped support his family, and pay for tuitions and such. He seems to be a very responsible kid.

I don't think he loaned the entirety of the money for Zach's car or Erin's tuition. She did get some sort of scholarship and since she was working (i.e. giving piano lessons) she was able to pay for some of it herself. I think there's a clip somewhere about him loaning one of them $1000, but I could be wrong about that.

I'll agree that it's pretty impressive he has been able to support his family, especially since he shouldn't have to do it at all. He's clearly very responsible and reliable. He can manage money well. In the aspects of being a good provider, he's a catch.

ETA: Lawson loaned Zach $1000 and Erin $2000. He's loaned his father $5000. He said he didn't mind bc he didn't need the money. (I remember that now that I'm reading it) So I wonder if it will stop when he does get married and have a family???

http://abcnews.go.com/US/tennessee-fami ... d=14364190

[calimojo]

Thanks for clarifying. I thought he had actually paid her full tuition, which even if it was just 10K per year, would be 40K for all 4 years and that would be a lot of money for him to have made free and clear.

Too bad he isn't a better singer, because I think he seems like a hard worker, who would be willing to train with someone and try to improve his skill. He seems pretty sincere, but not sure he has that special spark that it takes to make it.

[Milly-Molly-Mandy]

So lawson isn't a good singer? I'm tone deaf so can't tell

[calimojo]

Well, I am not an expert, but to me, he was just average at best. But I am not a fan of country music, so maybe I am not the best judge. If he did a decent job singing the National Anthem then that would be a good sound, because I have always heard that is a challenging song.

Tonight's episode was kind of a yawner. Chad certainly has endeared himself to the whole family.

[eh02]

CC is a little under $4000/semester if you're not living on campus, from what I remember on the site. That's not including books or materials. There are also some additional scholarships available - not sure if the Bates kids qualify for those, but there were quite a few worth $500-1500/year. I feel pretty certain Gil would have found a way to get the price knocked down a bit.

~$10,000/year is not bad for someone who isn't paying rent. If they were making $10/hr working 20 hours a week, that would likely cover almost everything if the rest of their bills were low. And $10/hr might even be a low estimate for piano lessons and lawn mowing (which of course is seasonal, but with the music too...).

While the classes at CC are probably...not especially rigorous compared to most schools, Erin probably had to do a lot of out of class practice, so 20 hours a week of work might be pushing it. But I was in a difficult undergrad program maxing out at 18 hours a semester, spending a lot of time in labs, and working 25-30 hours a week for several years in undergrad - it's tough, but definitely doable if you have the focus, at least when you're single and young. Erin comes across as an overachiever to me, so I would guess she probably worked pretty hard to make as much as possible to pay her way.

Plus, once she was in a courtship, she probably talked with Chad about it and knew they'd be able to pay off the loans to Lawson with Chad's income, so it wouldn't be too risky.

[EmmieJ]

Re loaning money to family/charging interest: For smaller amounts, my sibs and I never charged interest. Over the years, we've loaned back and forth. But my oldest sister loaned me a significant amount when I bought a house, and I used a mortgage calculator and paid her back with interest. My parents have never borrowed from any child. I find it ridiculous and crappy that Gil borrows money from his son rather than earn enough to pay his own bills.

[Pretzel]

I would never, ever charge interest from a family member. I wouldn't loan money to a family member that I don't like AND know is untrustworthy, fwiw.

I don't mind the loaning money back and forth. That's what a family is there for.

Btw, I don't know how much money the tree business brings in but I think it's a little harsh to assume that Gil doesn't really work /work hard. We don't really know so I'm a little reluctant with my judgment.

Sometimes you work hard and still have to borrow money from someone at one point. I know quite a few people who loaned money from their children. Neither feels like it's the way it should be done as a general rule but it was the best option back then.

So, I don't mind the Bates children loaning money back and forth and I don't mind them loaning money to their parents. As long as they weren't forced to I don't see a problem.

[Fundie Bunny]

So lawson isn't a good singer? I'm tone deaf so can't tell

Is not like he is bad singer, but his music is terrible. Kind of blring

[doubleT]

Watched the episode last night and really can't find anything to snark on. Well, I take that back ... Callie with no shoes on raking and being around the little boys using hoes. :o

I like Lawson's voice. Not sure about the song, didn't really get to hear much of it.

He does seem to have some talent and he certainly has drive. No chaperone (other than film crew) when he went to Nashville either.

I think the garden was probably a producer idea, but the little kids were excited and cute about it. We will probably never hear about it again.

[feministxtian]

Regarding credit unions:

There is a network available for MOST credit unions. They're part of the Credit Union Service Center network. My car is financed through a credit union in VA and I can make the payment in person here in NV. The credit union I bank with is not in the network but they have locations worldwide (Navy Federal). I opened that account in AZ, have my direct deposit going to it, there's 2 branches here in NV that are local to me...There's at least one branch near any military installation.

[Mama Mia]

I would never, ever charge interest from a family member. I wouldn't loan money to a family member that I don't like AND know is untrustworthy, fwiw.

I don't mind the loaning money back and forth. That's what a family is there for.

Btw, I don't know how much money the tree business brings in but I think it's a little harsh to assume that Gil doesn't really work /work hard. We don't really know so I'm a little reluctant with my judgment.

Sometimes you work hard and still have to borrow money from someone at one point. I know quite a few people who loaned money from their children. Neither feels like it's the way it should be done as a general rule but it was the best option back then.

So, I don't mind the Bates children loaning money back and forth and I don't mind them loaning money to their parents. As long as they weren't forced to I don't see a problem.

I agree. And I think the way it's mostly been portrayed regarding giving his parents money, is that Lawson sometimes buys the groceries for the family. Considering he's still living at home, I don't see why he shouldn't be pitching in.

I know there is talk about Gil giving talks about providing for a large family with no steady income. But I wonder if anyone knows if the talks are about providing without working, or about being self-employed -- because there is a huge difference between the two.

Tree work is at the top of the hierarchy of outdoor work. They seriously make big money for each job. For example -- we had trees that were falling on cars during storms in my old condo complex -- just getting the worst couple of trees cut down, and a bunch of others topped off, and heavy branches trimmed cost almost $10,000. I'm sure its less where they live, but cost of living is less to. IIRC it was 2 or 3 guys, and it took them less than a week. We also had to pay for eucalyptus trees to be topped -- those are over a thousand per tree.

[formergothardite]

I not personally heard Gil's talk because I am not paying IBLP any money, but from what I remember from discussing it with people who have watched it, he talks about quitting his good paying job, and not to worry about not having a regular job or regular income because other God(other people) will just give you stuff. So keep popping out babies to build an army for God and people will just give you stuff. And then there were stories about people giving them stuff when they couldn't afford to care for their children because Gil and quit his job and didn't have a steady income.

It reminds me when I had to listen to an IBLP tape about why health insurance was bad and if you just trust God and go to the ER you don't need it. Trusting God means getting people to feel sorry for you and pay your medical bills.

I think Gil could make a good bit of money with a tree service, but I get the John Shrader vibe from him and that he would rather have people just give him stuff and use that as proof that God approves of his lifestyle.

ETA: The name of his video is How to Support a Family of 19 Without a Salary. He and Kelly have made a lot of video lectures for IBLP and I would love to compare the IBLP version of their family to the "Aren't we a normal Christian family" reality television version. They also give a speech called The High Price of a Sensual Girl. :angry-banghead:

[DuggarsTheEndIsNear]

I honestly have no problem with Gil borrowing money, so long as its paid back. My dad borrows from me when money is tight and he always pays me back. But I can do the same if I need. Family is family. And once you're earning money, there's no reason you shouldn't be helping out if it's needed.

[formergothardite]

I don't have a problem borrowing money from family or even an adult living at home pitching in to help buy groceries, but Gil seems to have made a career out of not working and people giving him stuff because they feel sorry for the kids. He is really just another version of John Shrader, Gil just stayed in America and didn't go inflict himself on another country.

[Georgiana]

I honestly have no problem with Gil borrowing money, so long as its paid back. My dad borrows from me when money is tight and he always pays me back. But I can do the same if I need. Family is family. And once you're earning money, there's no reason you shouldn't be helping out if it's needed.

I think, though, that the difference is that Gil quit jobs that would have adequately supported his family in order to do what he wanted. I have no problem with people falling on hard times and helping out, especially if it is family. But I do have a real problem with people just not trying and expecting me to bail them out.

I mean, hey, if you need a little bit here or there, that's cool. Things happen.

But I think the issue here is that Gil, like some others we snark on, left a well paying job to do something else and just expected other people (including his own son) to help him make ends meet. Nope. If you're an adult and the head of a family, you need to do whatever you can to make sure you can meet your expenses. And if you can't meet your expenses, then you can't quit your job. If he was trying his darndest and just couldn't get a better job, I don't think as many would have an issue.

[formergothardite]

The lesson all fundies men who are lazy and don't want to be Job Type People is that you need a ton of kids.

John Shrader - ton of kids gets lots of stuff.

Gil Bates - ton of kids gets lots of stuff.

David Rodrigues - ton of kids, gets less stuff, but still is getting stuff for free.

XGay Greg - no kids. no stuff.

[whoviana]

It is even atrocious from an able bodied and minded(?) parent of just a few kids to quit working paying jobs and become a grifter and live off of the kids once they can apply for assistance. Making kid after kid after kid in every 1.5 years is really the icing on the cake.

[formergothardite]

I just realized while scrolling through the lectures Gil and Kelly made for IBLP that while the one about raising a mega-family without a salary was made in 2010, almost all the rest were made in the last year. That means they were made after Gil had been provided with information about Bill and his relationship with teen girls. I think that makes it pretty clear that instead of moving away from the cult they are getting deeper in it.

[Joan of Snarc]

The lesson all fundies men who are lazy and don't want to be Job Type People is that you need a ton of kids.

John Shrader - ton of kids gets lots of stuff.

Gil Bates - ton of kids gets lots of stuff.

David Rodrigues - ton of kids, gets less stuff, but still is getting stuff for free.

XGay Greg - no kids. no stuff.

If only XGG had not gotten that vasectomy! I'm sure he would have impregnated D² just many, many times by now! And he could have had that motor coach!

:auto-layrubber: :auto-mysterymachine:

Of course, if all her pregnancies last 18 months, that could slow down the child army assembly line a bit. Still, no worries. Just trust in the report of the Lawd!

:pray:

[RosyDaisy]

So Chad is now the family handyman. Looks like Gil took a play out of JB's playbook. Ugh!

[freethemall]

Not sure if anyone else wrote to UP asking them to post episodes like I did (still waiting on those streaming links for us non-cable folk!), but they just sent a response:

{L_OFFTOPIC} :

Thank you so much for taking the time to write. Some of you have been inquiring about how you can watch Bringing UP Bates, if you don’t have cable. Although UP is widely available on cable and satellite providers across the country, we are not currently available via any of the online outlets (Hulu, Netflix, Roku, Google Play etc.). However, stay tuned as new viewing outlets will be coming soon.

Ugh someone with cable on FJ, just film it and put it on youtube for the rest of us!!

[indifferent]

Ugh someone with cable on FJ, just film it and put it on youtube for the rest of us!!

Yes pls :pray:

[calimojo]

I just realized while scrolling through the lectures Gil and Kelly made for IBLP that while the one about raising a mega-family without a salary was made in 2010, almost all the rest were made in the last year. That means they were made after Gil had been provided with information about Bill and his relationship with teen girls. I think that makes it pretty clear that instead of moving away from the cult they are getting deeper in it.

Where can we see those links?

And I would suggest that people submit respectfully worded questions about this to Kelly. The reason I say respectfully worded is so that there is a chance that she will not become immediately defensive.

I know she won't post them, but I do think she is at least reading most of what is sent to her on there.

I think if she got lots of them from different people, it would be good. Then perhaps, a thread could be put up here with questions we have asked kelly and why don't they answer. Maybe one of those gossip sites would pick up on it, and then maybe a more legit site would pick up on it?

I don't think that we personally have the power to change Gil and Kelly, but I do think we can and should raise these questions. And maybe someday down the road, one of them would actually try to answer.