Jahi McMath back in the news - Part 2

[BrownieMomma]

From San Jose Mercury News

http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_26799085/ ... -be-enough

The court appointed pediatric neurologist, Paul Fisher, is rejecting the latest findings because none of those doctors performed a personal medical evaluation of Jahi. One of the bases for determining brain death is personal examination.

I'm just gonna say - menarche was the last thing I would have expected to happen. I, a lay person with very limited medical knowledge, would not expect her brain and body to manage that.

It's a horrific thought but now we have to hope there is no pregnancy. I would not put it past her mother to attempt that in order to prove Jahi is alive.

It is mentioned in this article that if she is declared alive, and thus a person, the taxpayers would start paying for her care.

[bluebird]

Instead of editing again, since she resides in a facility I believe she would only receive 30.00 for personal needs such as haircuts, clothing, etc. If she lived at home she would receive a full SSI check. For SSDI, she would receive her full benefit however could only keep 30.00 the rest going towards her cost of care.

[browncoatslytherin]

From San Jose Mercury News

http://www.mercurynews.com/ci_26799085/ ... -be-enough

The court appointed pediatric neurologist, Paul Fisher, is rejecting the latest findings because none of those doctors performed a personal medical evaluation of Jahi. One of the bases for determining brain death is personal examination.

I'm just gonna say - menarche was the last thing I would have expected to happen. I, a lay person with very limited medical knowledge, would not expect her brain and body to manage that.

It's a horrific thought but now we have to hope there is no pregnancy. I would not put it past her mother to attempt that in order to prove Jahi is alive.

It is mentioned in this article that if she is declared alive, and thus a person, the taxpayers would start paying for her care.

i highly doubt that we will get an expert to say she is not brain-dead who has physically examined her. that's probably the only way the lawyers can get anything out of an expert without having them agree with that diagnosis.

[VelociRapture]

I can't say why this family is doing this. It's possible it's for money. It's possible that there is a control issue going on. It's also possible that the family truly believes that doing this is somehow helping Jahi. Until I know with absolute certainty why this family is reacting this way, I will give them the benefit of the doubt and offer my condolences.

This is a horrible fate for such a beautiful young person. She had her entire life ahead of her and now she has been reduced to a shell of her former self, confined to a hospital bed as two sides wage war over her body. I honestly hope that someone is able to end this soon and this poor child (and her family) are finally able to find some peace. Nobody, especially a child, should be subject to this sort of treatment.

[BrownieMomma]

I don't quite follow the money trail. Someone is paying private funds but I kinda doubt the mother is living high on the hog because of that. Having the government pay for Jahi's care if Jahi is declared alive is also not going to cause the mother to roll in the dough. It will just keep her from going bankrupt, I imagine.

Nope. I sense a conspiracy theory behind this. I feel this is something more than a grieving unwilling to let go. Lawyers?

Who would benefit from this, really, if she is declared alive? Will this mean more people won't actually die but somehow kept artificially alive on machines until when? How long can a body last, years and years? Who benefits from this?

[DaffyDill]

And at the opposite end of the spectrum is this: http://www.scotsman.com/news/health/mot ... -1-3584615

This mother and father put their childs suffering ahead of their own, and made a selfless, yet agonising decision to end her life. The only issue I have is the way the childs fluids/nutrients were withdrawn, making her death longer and more drawn out than necessary :(

I have a difficult time believing anything Jahi's mother says about her daughters condition, as she has too much of an agenda to push. Surely that child needs someone to represent her best interests, like a guardian ad litem (is that what it's called in the US?), who can be given medical advice from independent consulting doctors, neurologists etc., ensuring all decisions are in Jahi's best interests, and no one elses.

[bluebird]

We occasionally have had hospice cases at work. According to hospice, withdrawing fluids and nutrition makes death less painful because it causes cells to shrink. If a dying individual is conscious and wants liquids, food, etc. Then the rule of thumb is to give it to them otherwise don't push it. What we have seen is when people are actively dying they usually do not want much and eventually want nothing...their bodies no longer need sustenance. Someone who is unconscious/coma would not likely suffer from the withdrawal of liquids/nutrition..so I have been told,I am not a nurse or Dr.

[DGayle]

We occasionally have had hospice cases at work. According to hospice, withdrawing fluids and nutrition makes death less painful because it causes cells to shrink. If a dying individual is conscious and wants liquids, food, etc. Then the rule of thumb is to give it to them otherwise don't push it. What we have seen is when people are actively dying they usually do not want much and eventually want nothing...their bodies no longer need sustenance. Someone who is unconscious/coma would not likely suffer from the withdrawal of liquids/nutrition..so I have been told,I am not a nurse or Dr.

A friend's mother died recently, and she asked a lot right before that why her mom wasn't hungry anymore, what was going on? This makes sense.

[DGayle]

I'm just gonna say - menarche was the last thing I would have expected to happen. I, a lay person with very limited medical knowledge, would not expect her brain and body to manage that.

Her mother says a lot of things, and then shows evidence that proves her wrong. But if they're giving her hormones to try to force her to develop, her body could react to that. If she had a genuine, non-artificially-induced period, I'm pretty sure doctors would be swooping in begging to do brain scans to find the activity in there.

[BrownieMomma]

Her mother says a lot of things, and then shows evidence that proves her wrong. But if they're giving her hormones to try to force her to develop, her body could react to that. If she had a genuine, non-artificially-induced period, I'm pretty sure doctors would be swooping in begging to do brain scans to find the activity in there.

Makes sense. I'm really trying to not be a conspiracy theorist over this, but I do believe that mother would impregnate Jahi if she could find a way to do it.

There are freaks out there who would have sex with that body if it came to that.

[browncoatslytherin]

not to be gross, but...are they sure she's actually menstruating? or is it...erm...leakage...(you know, from a dead body)

[happy atheist]

not to be gross, but...are they sure she's actually menstruating? or is it...erm...leakage...(you know, from a dead body)

I was wondering this, too.

[keen23]

not to be gross, but...are they sure she's actually menstruating? or is it...erm...leakage...(you know, from a dead body)

I thought the same thing.

[browncoatslytherin]

whew, thanks happy and keen. i was worried i was being overly weird thinking about that.

[BrownieMomma]

whew, thanks happy and keen. i was worried i was being overly weird thinking about that.

That was a good point I had not considered.

kinda ewwww... but still, a good point.

I wonder who determined she is menstruating, if Jahi has yet received a personal examination from a doctor.

[DaffyDill]

not to be gross, but...are they sure she's actually menstruating? or is it...erm...leakage...(you know, from a dead body)

I wondered that as well.... :? . You are not alone :D

[Deist woman]

Her body's cells seem to be still functioning normally. She lacks the ability to breathe on her own, or ingest any food or fluids on her own, but her skin and her inner organs are still functioning normally. Other than the brain, I believe the kidneys would be the first to die, and that is only going to happen if she has an even more sustained loss of blood pressure than during her original cardiac arrest. On the order of organs failing, it is brain---> heart ----> kidneys ---> liver. Sounds like they got her resuscitated before the cascade of failure went past the heart. So, I don't think she has any fluid leaking that might be expected from a dead, decomposing body. She has experienced clinical death, not cellular death. She is kept alive by machines but her body cells are not dying.

I don't see any reason why she would not menstruate. Comatose women often menstruate. Some have even become pregnant (thanks to sick bastards that molested them). I know that she is beyond comatose, or vegetative, but since her body has maintained the lower functions, I would expect her to have the normal progression of physical maturity. Some maturity can even be abnormally accelerated. Infant girls on some types of epilepsy drugs develop axillary and pubic hair.

[FJismyheadship]

I have sleep paralysis. I wake up and can't move. Can't open my eyes. Can't talk. Nothing. I am completely aware of whats going on around me, but I cannot "wake up" completely. Sometimes I can force my finger to move just enough to wake me up, but most of the time, I have to wait it out.

I would not wish that on anyone. It is scary. It is terrifying.

If Jahi is indeed aware of whats going on around her but she can't move on her own or talk, or anything like that, it is not fair to her. I imagine it would be worse for her than it is for me because when I have those episodes I at least KNOW I am going to wake up. Jahi might not know that.

Personally, I think I would want to be taken off the oxygen rather than live day in and day out in that "in between" space.

[Coco]

I have sleep paralysis. I wake up and can't move. Can't open my eyes. Can't talk. Nothing. I am completely aware of whats going on around me, but I cannot "wake up" completely. Sometimes I can force my finger to move just enough to wake me up, but most of the time, I have to wait it out.

I would not wish that on anyone. It is scary. It is terrifying.

If Jahi is indeed aware of whats going on around her but she can't move on her own or talk, or anything like that, it is not fair to her. I imagine it would be worse for her than it is for me because when I have those episodes I at least KNOW I am going to wake up. Jahi might not know that.

Personally, I think I would want to be taken off the oxygen rather than live day in and day out in that "in between" space.

That sounds absolutely terrifying. :shock: I don't think Jahi is in that state though, they would know from brain scan activity.

[Cherokee2000]

I have sleep paralysis. I wake up and can't move. Can't open my eyes. Can't talk. Nothing. I am completely aware of whats going on around me, but I cannot "wake up" completely. /// I would not wish that on anyone. It is scary. It is terrifying.

If Jahi is indeed aware of whats going on around her but she can't move on her own or talk, or anything like that, it is not fair to her. I imagine it would be worse for her than it is for me because when I have those episodes I at least KNOW I am going to wake up. Jahi might not know that.

You are right about the cold dead fear of sleep paralysis. I have it too (fortunately it's well controlled with medication).

But the only reason it causes such terror in you and me is that we have brains that can comprehend it. My brain is pretty functional, and FJismyheadship, yours is too. As for the Dead Body Formerly Known as Jahi, there is no brain there. Just cells that are artificially kept going but don't function as a brain.

The last time Jahi would have been capable of feeling the kind of fear that we feel during sleep paralysis was in early December of last year. The only good thing about the Jahi story is that she is literally feeling no pain -- her body does not have that capacity any more.

[Toothfairy]

What are the parents hoping for? What are they trying to prove? I feel bad for this little girl. It's almost been a year and it's still going on

[laura oz]

This just keeps getting more and more nightmarish. It's just horrible. Words are failing me right now. Jesus Christ.

[DGayle]

I don't see any reason why she would not menstruate. Comatose women often menstruate.

She's not comatose. Comatose people still have living brains. Her brain is dead and atrophying. To have a period, you must have a functioning hypothalamus, which is located in the brain. It secretes GnRH, which stimulates the pituitary gland, which is also...and guesses? In the brain. The pituitary releases a couple more hormones, which stimulate follicle growth, which causes production of estrogen. No estrogen? No physical becoming-a-woman development. No living brain? No hypothalamus or pituitary to get you started in Period Road.

[Eater of Worlds]

I don't think she's menstruating. in the sprocket trials website, they had people who know how to read brain images respond in the comments. She's missing the part of her brain that would allow her to have a period.

[Burris]

Wow. Just catching up on what happened. It's truly nauseating..

It's a race to see who'll hit bottom first - the mother, that lawyer, or the, um, "medical" "experts" they managed to find who are basically using a child's body as a medical experiment/sideshow attraction.

This may actually be one of the cruelest hoaxes ever perpetrated on the public and the courts.