Anna T vs. overpopulation

[pimpom]

I know it's neither nice nor intelligent to get angry with people just because you disagree with them, but....but....but...HELLO ARE YOU BLIND WOMAN?

ccostello.blogspot.com/2011/08/overpopulation-scruples.html

[debrand]

ccostello.blogspot.com/2010/04/today.html

For the mobile phone users :)

First, and most importantly, I don’t worship nature; I’m coming from the premise that even if nature could benefit from there being less people on the planet, it doesn’t mean we should restrict our population

:?: I'm sorry. Is she saying that even if the world is overpopulated, no one should restrict their family size?

[demgirl]

That's exactly what she's saying. :roll:

[Joykins]

I wish people who write like this wouldn't write about "nature" like it is this thing separated from their lives that only exists in national parks or remote areas, or for us only to exploit ("subdue").

We are absolutely dependent on "nature." It is in our best interests not to exploit nature to the point where it has trouble sustaining us properly, or behaves is a way that threatens our way of life. The idea is to "benefit nature" in a way that benefits us. A lot of people just see "benefit us." (and for these fundies, "us" is a very small group).

Overpopulation at this point in time is often a regional issue but still we are stressing the carrying capacity of the earth too strongly. The end result of overpopulation, even regionally is "nature" taking a hand-- droughts, epidemics--and when that stress gets too much, resource-driven wars. Which will eventually fix the overpopulation problem.

On the bright side, there really aren't enough natalist fundies to overpopulate anything but a small city.

[EllieCee]

WAT.

I can't even...I'm not going to try to post up an argument, I'll get too angry.

This reminds me of when I used to go to Catholic school, they had a pro-life group come in. The speaker gave us nearly the same speech this woman did. Then, she proceeded to tell us that overpopulation was a myth, and to not listen to those "murderers" when they try to use nature to excuse murder. I thought I was alone in thinking it was bullshit, until the girl beside me whispered "What the fuck?" under her breath.

[Guest Anonymous]

WAT.

I can't even...I'm not going to try to post up an argument, I'll get too angry.

This. She exhausts me. :angry-banghead:

I wonder what she will do if any of her children decide to leave the faith and move in with Grandma?

[ElphabaGalinda]

I don't understand how she can bring not worshiping nature into this. I mean fine, but everyone needs nature to survive. And yeah, not everywhere is overpopulated. But why does she think people don't want to live in certain parts of Russia, for example? Because the natural environment there (ya know, nature!) doesn't support people living there, unless they seriously manipulate it, and even then there's not much you can do with antartica. It's that attitude common with fundies where they think all people need is space. Sure let's stack children on shelves, all they need is space! They forget that even in sparsely populated areas, there are only a certain number of resources.

[bicyclecat]

Wow, a fundie who doens't understand where trivial little things, like food, come from.

SOTDRT, for the win!

[BlackHawk]

I think these people need go back and read their Bibles... Ezekiel 34:2-4 and Jeremiah 2:7 for starters. God commanded we take CARE of the Earth. Why can't people understand this?

Ugh people annoy me today.

[lilwriter85]

I don't understand how she can bring not worshiping nature into this. I mean fine, but everyone needs nature to survive. And yeah, not everywhere is overpopulated. But why does she think people don't want to live in certain parts of Russia, for example? Because the natural environment there (ya know, nature!) doesn't support people living there, unless they seriously manipulate it, and even then there's not much you can do with antartica. It's that attitude common with fundies where they think all people need is space. Sure let's stack children on shelves, all they need is space! They forget that even in sparsely populated areas, there are only a certain number of resources.

Exactly. Some areas can't the best places for people to live due to the environment and lack of resources in some locations. I also hate when fundies really think people just need space. I hated the comment that Jim Bob or Michelle made about fitting people into Jacksonville.

[slickcat79]

Second, I am under the impression that “we are not having children because we are thinking about the planet†is only ever stated by people who wouldn’t want to have a numerous family anyway, for reasons that have to do with their personal convenience rather than with the environment. How many people who are thus choosing to have fewer or no children, are also making an effort towards living simply and sustainably? What else are willing to “go without†for the sake of the environment – cars, new clothes, travelling? Or are they ready to give up only that which they do not value anyway?

Lots. I don't have kids because I don't want them. I'm not prepared at this point in my life to give a child what they need and deserve, so I'm not having any. If anyone asked me why I don't have kids, that's what I would tell them. The environmental concerns weigh in somewhat, but that's not my primary motivation. If someone actually gives "stress on the environment" as the number 1 reason that they are personally not having kids, you'd better believe that they are living sustainably. Obviously, some people are just liars or hypocrites, but many people who are genuine environmentalists will not choose to have their own kids; many may also choose to adopt children for that reason. Those people do exist.

When talking to a Jew, overpopulation is a rather sad joke, when you remember that around one third of our number was wiped out in the Holocaust a couple of generations ago. Add to this the threat of assimilation and intermarriage, and you’ll see than unfortunately, it doesn’t look like our ranks are going to swell anytime soon. Thus, as a people, we must rejoice in every Jewish child that is born.

And here's the crux of it for Anna T. Not to make light of the Holocaust, but those babies only really matter to fundies if they are being born into like-minded families. She actually refers to assimilation and intermarriage as a "threat" instead of a choice that some people might make voluntarily. Plus having more babies will not immediately solve supposed population shortages; babies and children will be a drain on resources until they reach adulthood. If they really wanted to solve the "aging population" problem, they should advocate for the expedited immigration of young adults. That way they have to prove their employability before becoming citizens, and they can join the workforce immediately. Of course, those people might be catholics or muslims or otherwise "brown" people, so we can't have that :naughty:

[YPestis]

The arguments fundies typically make is all about 'look how much space we have!!!'. They don't seem to understand the concept of sustainability.

Why is that?

My parents grew up in China during a famine. If everyone was to spread out evenly throughout the country, there would be PLENTY of space for people....yet for some reason no one wants to live in parched mountainous regions where nothing can be grown, or venture to underdeveloped regions where simple roads and electricity are unheard of and arable land nonexistent.

Gee, all that land supporting 25% of the world's population yet only 7% of the world's arable land. The resultant food shortages and overusage of natural resources have led to environmental consequences that people suffer to this day.

How would fundies like to explain the "myth" of overpopulation in these places?

[bananacat]

You don't have to worship nature to want it to exist for future generations. They have so many arrows so that they can take over the world in a few generations, but at the rate they're going, there'll be nothing left to rule over. I guess a lot of them are expecting the Rapture to happen within a generation (just like previous generations thought), but it seems like a big risk to not bother caring for you home on the hope that the Rapture will take you away.

[debrand]

Also, what happens when a human is on every square foot of land? Will they suddenly decide to stop having children or will they continue to populate the world until we stand shoulder to shoulder?

[bicyclecat]

How would fundies like to explain the "myth" of overpopulation in these places?

Well, China is a communist country. And Communists are also Godless. If Communists simply believed in God, like they do, they'd also have a Costco to purchase shelves at and know how to make their children survive on a potato and some lettuce every day.

[doggie]

why is everyone surprised when fundies deny reality. their whole lives are about denying reality. We can't have that still thing getting in the way of their beliefs.

[Angri-la]

Is it possible to ban me from threads about Anna T, the Pearls,and 7x Sunday? I cannot police myself, and my husband thinks I should be able to control my own internet usage. He is so wrong and will not let me submit!

ETA: a comma.

[Boogalou]

Wow. I have never read Anna T's blog before now so I have to ask, is English not her first language or does she just really suck at writing?

Someone needs to get a message out to all the fundies that overpopulation does not mean that we are running out of land and it does not mean that certain countries and groups of people have declining populations. I like how she has to specifiy that she doesn't "worship" nature when her whole posts is basically giving nature the middle finger and an "eff you".

[slickcat79]

LMAO boogalou...I luvvvv your avatar! :lol:

[aggythenostic]

Eh, Jew here. It's all about birthing more Jews, but I think it's slightly different from Christian Fundieworld. It's more like, "There will never be enough of us to avoid being wiped-out and fight back!" So she has a vaguely valid point about passing on her heritage [although for the love of God, we do NOT need more right wing Israeli Jews. Thank you]. On the other hand, my mother was a real life Holocaust Survivor. She ended up with two children. She did not feel the need to repopulate the earth to make up for the Nazis. WTF? It's not like those particular people will be reborn, you know.

Anna T. is very very young, and so she knows it all. It's senseless to argue with her. The only thing she has is her ideology, and she's not letting go of it for a little thing like logic.. ;)

[bananacat]

Also, what happens when a human is on every square foot of land? Will they suddenly decide to stop having children or will they continue to populate the world until we stand shoulder to shoulder?

Then we should still have more babies because we can stack up for miles before the air gets too thin to breathe. We could also easily sit on top of the ocean with just a flotation device, and there might be some underground caves we can cram into. If you don't stack your kids 10-high on your shoulders, then you must be some evil hippie environment-worshiper.

[Dinorah]

It's funny how she doesn't seem to be aware that what's not beneficial to nature might not be beneficial to her either on the long run-

Btw, she had a new post on homeschooling, where it seems to occur to her that there might be some slight issues if her kids are the only one to be homeschooled were they live. I don't get why she's so bent on homeschooling, considering it's not a Jewish thing, even in ultra-Orthodox circles? I also wonder how she plans to do it considering how easily she gets tired.

Oh and the analogy between exposure to organized systems and exposure to candy is ridiculous.