Ding Dong, VF is Dead! And Doug Phillips is a Tool - Part 3

[thoughtful]

Wait, so the horror is not that Doug runs a drug cartel, killed someone, encouraged an abortion, or slept with men, but that he didn't sufficiently condemn a woman for something?

How predictable.

The Covenant and the creepy camping trip move strike me as much more frightening, but he only seems to mention those in passing. :wtf:

[Want More Babies]

Anyone else wonder why Laralee Seargeant over at Plymouth Rock Ranch stopped blogging a few years ago? I wonder if they still go to Boerne Christian Assembly. They had boys in that age group.

Michael Billings had a book out that was sold on VF. Doug also posted about him on his blog visionforum.com/hottopic/blogs/dwp/2007/11/3118.aspx but that has been scrubbed. Here is part of that post:

"Michael Billings was a bright shining star in our lives. He was my student, my assistant, my comrade, and a spiritual son. There is no way I can describe the sense of loss and mourning we are all experiencing now. But this loss is made joyful through the certain hope of God's absolutely perfect timing, the incredibly singular and ongoing spiritual impact of the life of this man of principle on so many others, and the unshakable confidence in the fact that Michael is not only in the presence of his many heroes (the Martyrs, the Apostles, and the Reformers), but with the love of his life - Jesus Christ, the Messiah....

On Thursday, I spent the day with Michael. We had breakfast, lunch, and dinner together. We taught a class to our interns. We sat in a beautiful garden, graded papers and tests, and spoke of life and future plans. Michael left the next day for Dallas with a large contingent of Vision Forum men in order to attend a theological conference and listen and learn from one of his heroes, Dr. R.C. Sproul, Sr. The last sermon Michael ever heard was delivered Saturday night by Dr. Sproul and concerned the glorious hope of the Cross in light of the doctrine of justification.

Michael was a devoted and faithful churchman who loved the fellowship of the saints at Boerne Christian Assembly where he worshipped, and who insisted on leaving Dallas early Sunday morning to attend the meeting of the church. On his way home, he pulled out of a dangerous intersection and was hit by a car, killed instantly and ushered into the presence of his Creator, the Lord Jesus Christ.

He leaves behind his father and mother, Dr. and Mrs. Michael Billings, as well as sisters Jaimie Billings and Jennifer Grady. Also to be remembered at this time are his devoted nephews and nieces, into whose lives Michael poured so very much - Dillon, Dakota, Justice, Isaiah, Gabriel, Liberty, and Isobeleh. Please pray for our staff at this time of mourning. More importantly, please remember Michael's family - especially his dear father and mother who devoted so much of their lives to preparing Michael to be a great warrior for God.

Michael was the oldest young man I have ever met and the single most passionate champion of truth to emerge from the ranks of the Vision Forum students. He died without regret, justified, uncompromising - a righteous man if ever we knew one.

"The LORD gave, and the LORD hath taken away; blessed be the name of the LORD" (Job 1:21).

Mourning, Broken-Hearted, But Praising the Lord Jesus Christ Who gives Eternal Life to Those Who Believe, I am."

Your Persevering Friend in the Cause of Christ,

Douglas W. Phillips

[fuglyexfundy]

It is interesting that Doug thought so much of her brother and family in general. While I don't rule out blackmail or her having something on Doug, there is such a thing as compassion for a troubled person.

Look I would love to stick it to Doug, and he may definitely be at fault here, but I also don't like T.W.

Everything Eston writes has to be looked at closely and through the lenses of Fundie bullcrap. This woman may not be preying on the innocent the way he makes it seem.

When you boil down T.W.'s slut shaming:

- The woman in question lost her brother in a car accident in 2007.

- After his death, her behavior changed and she stopped keeping an appropriate "distance" from men in the church.

- She was caught in flagrante delicto with a young man of 18 (over the age of consent) and the relationship seems consensual, he sneaked out to visit her home. His Dad tracked him down with a GPS installed in his truck and caught them together.

- She repented, but continued to flirt with men other than her husband.

- Doug told people not to gossip about her.

- Church members started to block her from their homes.

- She flirted with VF interns. T.W. claims she stalks them. How?

- Are they under 18?

- Were her flirtations in fact unwelcome?

- What power did she have over the interns that they could not tell her to leave their manly space?

- She committed the horrible crime of invading VF Intern male territory and going rock climbing in a skirt.

- A VF intern was shocked at the sight of her legs and tried to remonstrate with her. (Good boy. He told her that her behavior was unwelcome! That takes it into the realm of sexual harassment for the first time.)

- She continues to make men uncomfortable and "seduces" many of them. No indication as to how. Is she just flashing her ankles? Wearing low cut clothes?

- Or is she touching them? Has she tied them up and raped them?

- What power does she have over them that they cannot just tell her to go away?

- Church members ask Doug to discipline her. He tells them to piss off.

- Church members decide to leave because of the harlot in their midst.

- She is still part of the Church.

Let's assume TW's post is true for a second. Where was the compassion shown to that pregnant young girl that was slut shamed from the pulpit? I've been called out fro the pulpit as an adult, so I could only begin to imagine a scared young girl might feel like. I personally don't care who sleeps with whom and how often so long as everyone is of legal age. Doug's alleged compassion is not consistently delivered to his flock. I'm not heartless, and I'll admit I've done irrational things while grieving. But I have to wonder about the moral fiber of those around her. No one talks to her directly as far as we know. I see no confrontation from the members with respect to her behavior or compassion for her situation as you said earlier. Doug is still an asshole.

Of course, if none of this is true, or it's mostly false. That poor woman and her family. I hope she can defend herself.

[debrand]

Wait, so the horror is not that Doug runs a drug cartel, killed someone, encouraged an abortion, or slept with men, but that he didn't sufficiently condemn a woman for something?

How predictable.

The Covenant and the creepy camping trip move strike me as much more frightening, but he only seems to mention those in passing. :wtf:

Yes! The Covenant and end of the world prophecy should have been covered more in depth but it was barely touched upon.

I came out of lurkdom to ask on Jen Gems about the secret meeting.

[DomWackTroll]

Jen has referenced "men in black" who acted as security for Doug Phillips is a tool. I can't speak about BCA, but in People's Temple, there were armed security guards during services, harsh public discipline sessions, and the "White Nights." PT members were also forced to sign false confessions where they admitted to things like child molestation and murder, which could be sent to the police in case they tried to leave. Based on what I'm reading, I think Doug Phillips is a tool took some pages from the Jim Jones cult leader playbook.

And I don't doubt they did. But would an eighteen-year-old Peter Bradrick, standing outside the doors of a convention center in broad daylight, scare you because he was wearing a black suit? What is he going to do to you at a homeschooling convention in front of hundreds of people, beat you over the head with a copy of So Much More? Was anyone really afraid that Nathaniel Darnell would follow them back to their house and paw through their garbage for evidence of their sins? Does Caleb Hayden make a habit of threatening people in dark alleys?

Yes, Doug has hurt, exploited, and abused many, many people. But that doesn't change the fact that Jen Fishburne and "T.W. Eston" are very paranoid, unstable people who thrive on controversy and drama.

[hoipolloi]

Eston's latest is just so bizarre. Maybe it makes sense in fundie land & maybe we shouldn't be surprised that it's all about a bad woman enabled by Bad Doug.

Thanks, DWT, for adding some context re: death of the woman's brother. I certainly remember the paroxysms of grief at Doug's Blog and at the blog of his erstwhile sycophant, Nathaniel Darnell (perseveronews.com/?s=Billings&x=-2090&y=-270). Just way, way out of proportion, even considering the decedent might have been a good friend and a great guy. Given the way these guys felt, why would anyone be surprised at a sibling going off the rails after the death of a brother?

[thoughtful]

But would an eighteen-year-old Peter Bradrick, standing outside the doors of a convention center in broad daylight, scare you because he was wearing a black suit? What is he going to do to you at a homeschooling convention in front of hundreds of people, beat you over the head with a copy of So Much More?

:lol:

Hey, he's pretty scary in your avatar. But mostly I'm afraid I'll die laughing looking at his Manly Confidence Level.

[Want More Babies]

I found this cached copy from Doug's blog written in 2012. That said, his sister had to be quite a bit older than he was from the picture Jen posted of her on her blog. Something seems *off* though. I can't pinpoint what it is but it just doesn't add up in my mind.

Michael Billings (1988-2007) Remembered: A Bright Shining Star in the Kingdom of God

“Precious in the eyes of the Lord is the death of his saints.†(Psalm 116:15)

Yesterday marked the fifth anniversary of the passing of Michael G. Billings, a spiritual son to me and a young man who changed our lives through his passion for the law of God, his intensity in pursuit of the knowledge of God, and his kindness as a Christian man.

The brief life of Michael was a testimony to honor, discipleship, vision, diligence, integrity, study, and dominion. It was also a testimony to the type of mature Christian love and relationships rarely evidenced in the sons of our present generation.

Michael was my student, my friend, my yoke-fellow, my spiritual son, and for two years he served along side me in the ministry of the Lord at Vision Forum Ministries where he distinguished himself in every way as the single most devoted student of God’s Word ever to grace the doors of our ministry, as a leader, and a man of unassailable integrity.

Michael first came to Vision Forum as a promising intern, but he quickly distinguished himself and ultimately joined our staff on a full-time basis. He was known to everyone as a passionate Christian, an honoring son, an indefatigable student of the Word, a brilliant thinker, and the man we all believed most brimming with potential.

Michael served Vision Forum as our Home School Conference liaison and as my personal teacher’s aide for the 2007 intern class. Michael’s passion was teaching and Christian discipleship — and he did both very well. He assisted me with my classes on the apologetic methodology of Dr. Greg Bahnsen and Dr. Cornelius Van Til. But Michael was a noteworthy teacher in his own right. For his last two months, Michael taught courses on systematic theology to our interns, drawing heavily from two books, The Attributes of God and The Sovereignty of God, by A.W. Pink. His courses were remarkable for their precision, their passion, their thoroughness, and their focus on studying the character of God so that the students might learn to love Him better.

The Thursday before his passing, I spent the day with Michael. We had breakfast, lunch, and dinner together. We taught a class to our interns. We sat in a beautiful garden, graded papers and tests, and spoke of life and future plans. Michael left the next day for Dallas with a large contingent of Vision Forum men in order to attend a theological conference and listen and learn from one of his heroes, Dr. R.C. Sproul, Sr. The last sermon Michael ever heard was delivered Saturday night by Dr. Sproul and concerned the glorious hope of the Cross in light of the doctrine of justification.

The following morning, Sunday, November 4, 2007, as Michael sought to make it to the meeting of the saints at Boerne Christian Assembly, a car crash claimed his life.

Yet Michael’s testimony still brightly shines among God’s people five years after his death.

It is my belief that Michael was not only the most promising and exceptional young man of his generation, but that God raised him as a present day Timothy, a Josiah, a Samuel, and an Ezra — all wrapped up into one sparkling personality, one focused man.

Like Timothy, he was taught the Scriptures early from his youth as his mother opened up the Word of God and literally poured her life and her soul into training a warrior for Christ. He knew that the Scriptures were the power of God unto salvation. And he was one of whom we could say, as did Paul to Timothy: “Let no man despise thy youth, Michael Billings.†And he loved the Church like Timothy loved the church; and he was early about the business of advancing the kingdom of God.

But he was not only like Timothy, Michael was like Samuel. Again, consecrated by his mother for temple service in the early days of his life. She who walked beside him, along with her husband who stood leading the charge in the call for the family, always bringing Michael to meet the great men of the day; always bringing Michael out to hear the messages that were being preached. There was young Michael at age seven standing next to the preachers of the day, reciting, memorizing; always there, always learning, always with the sense, “I must prepare for greatness for the kingdom of God. I must use my life for the kingdom of God. I must invest my life for great things.†He was a consecrated son.

Michael was also like Josiah. He delighted in opening the lost book of the Law. And when the Scriptures were opened to him, and when he would learn from the great treasure-trove of God’s wisdom that had been hidden to this present generation, Michael would rejoice, and he would mourn simultaneously. He would grieve at the lostness of the present generation and he would rejoice in the blessed hope of obedience to the Law of God.

Michael was also the young Ezra of our generation. The Scripture says, “For Ezra had prepared his heart to seek the law of the LORD, and to do it, and to teach in Israel statutes and judgments.†Michael prepared his heart to seek the law of the Lord and to obey it with a fervent focus that was palpable. He had an irrepressible zeal to know the truth of God’s Word that was infectious to all those around him.

At the age of nineteen, Michael left this world with a record unprecedented among his noteworthy peers, one which reveals a young man who accomplished more in the few years of his life than a dozen men of our generation accomplish in eighty.

Michael was the oldest young man I ever met. At the age of seventeen, he was at least sixty years old. And by the time he reached nineteen he was a septuagenarian, spiritually, in his mind, in the way he walked. He was a mature man with a mature understanding of relationships, and while many young men were growing sloppy with age, Michael was growing more consistent in his personal piety. He was growing more ferocious in his desire to walk with holiness before the Lord.

Michael walked alone before the Lord in fear and trembling, but he loved the brethren that were around him. Michael pursued an understanding of God and God’s character through the Law. He knew his voracious study was for a purpose; it was to prepare him for battle. He worked hard to find the men who would be wise men, because he knew that wisdom was the principle thing and with all his getting he was to get understanding. He departed early on from the things of childishness and youth and started taking strong meat, as opposed to milk. He invested every moment he had in getting wisdom. He even identified the enemies of Christ. He knew them; he marked their ways, and he kept them in his sights.

Michael’s quest for knowledge was not an intellectual quest, as it is with so many young men, but specifically it was a quest for orthopraxy and orthodoxy to be wed in his life. It was a heart religion that drew him close to God; and he believed God and His Word; and he saw his duty to love God with all his heart, and all his soul, and all of his might. And he was a man who manifested those things through servant leadership.

Michael knew that his generation was a generation in need of reformation. He spoke to us, his friends, his parents, his shepherds, that he wanted to be one of those reformers. He knew the importance of learning principles and standing upon them. He knew character was important from the days of his youth. And he desperately sought to find the forgotten theology of his spiritual fathers of days gone by.

Above all, Michael was serious about valuing the sacrifice that Jesus Christ made for him. He was serious about his relationship and demonstrating gratitude to the God who saved him.

Before they graduate, I require interns at Vision Forum to prepare and preach a sermon. Michael titled his sermon “Life is a Vapor.†And the prophetic words he delivered that day at the age of seventeen encapsulates his life message. Michael declared:

Never think it is a disgrace to serve the Lord God. Never be afraid to do what is right, thus making faith perfect by your works. Satan knows very well that you will make up the next generation. You are the grand object of his attack. He would have you to believe that evil is good, and good is evil. He will exalt the pleasures of wickedness, but he will hide from you the sting. And don’t think — may none of us ever think — that we are exempt from such temptations. For we must remember king David, a man after God’s own heart, was ensnared by such temptations causing his latter days to be full of sorrow. This enemy is working tirelessly for your destruction; he knows that you will either be the blessing or the curses of your day. Yet according to James 1:12, “how blessed are they that endure this temptation,†being steadfast till the end.

Young men, it is appointed a day for you to die, and no matter how strong and healthy you may seem now the day of your death may be very near. “You must not boast of tomorrow, for you do not know what a day may bring forth.†Remember always that tomorrow is the Devil’s day. Satan does not care how spiritual your intentions are, how holy your resolutions are, if only they are determined to be done tomorrow. There is a great cloud of witnesses who time would not allow if I were to name: young David, young Daniel, young Isaac, young Joseph, young Joshua, young Samuel, young Josiah, young Obadiah, and young Timothy — all faithful young men and loyal servants to the Lord of glory.

This message also served as the foundation of fervent counsel Michael shared in word and in print with the young men that he knew. There are many boys in our community who received letters that Michael wrote personally to them. While the letters varied, in each one Michael emphasized that time was short and urged the recipient of the letter to redeem the time. Here’s an excerpt from one letter Michael wrote to a thirteen-year-old boy in San Antonio:

I would encourage you again to heed the hour. There is appointed for you a day to die. You must not boast of tomorrow. Your days are but a brief shadow, a mist that appears for a little while and then vanishes, a story to be told. This life is but leaves in the wind: here for an instant, and then it flees with the rouse of a tempest. It is but a vapor.

Night is falling. . . . You must seize the day.

With friendship and with brotherly love,

Michael G. Billings

Michael’s life message was one of urgency:

Life is a vapor; redeem it for God.

Life is a vapor; love God and fear Him.

Life is a vapor; take dominion.

Life is a vapor; honor your parents.

Michael’s example should spur us on to greater faithfulness. The takeaway from his testimony is this: Study to show yourselves approved unto God, workmen that need not be ashamed, rightly dividing the Word of truth, as Michael Billings did. Walk circumspectly, not as fools but as wise, redeeming the time because the days are evil, as Michael did. Love the Law of God with all your heart in the days of your youth, as Michael did. Rise up, O men of God, and be done with lesser things; give all your heart and soul and strength to serve the King of Kings, as Michael did.

Those who knew Michael and who know history recognize that we were given a gift rare and precious in the example of a man whose passion for the truth of Christ and whose youthful, wise, and righteous zeal according to knowledge stands with the greatest examples of young men we have recorded in the history of the Church.

Michael was a bright shining star in our lives. He was my student, my assistant, my comrade, my spiritual son. I loved him so very dearly.

Michael left this earth on November 4, 2007, but he left it without regret, justified, uncompromising. He was a righteous man if ever we knew one.

May God give all the glory to Himself and His precious Son for the life of Michael Billings — and may we never forget the great gift that the Lord has given us through this son of hope who He placed in our lives for a brief but fruitful season.

As a special honor to Michael’s life and legacy, we are offering four commemorative tracks on BlueBehemoth.com free for download: (1) “Seize the Day†performed by Charlie Zahm; (2) “The Ballad of Billings†performed by George Sarris; (3) “Michael Billings: A Musical Tribute†by Benjamin Botkin; (4) and “Life is But a Vapor†by Michael Billings.

[DomWackTroll]

:lol:

Hey, he's pretty scary in your avatar. But mostly I'm afraid I'll die laughing looking at his Manly Confidence Level.

Touché, thoughtful! :lol:

[DomWackTroll]

I found this cached copy from Doug's blog written in 2012. That said, his sister had to be quite a bit older than he was from the picture Jen posted of her on her blog. Something seems *off* though. I can't pinpoint what it is but it just doesn't add up in my mind.

Oh, it sure does, and I can pinpoint what it is, and it all adds up in my mind. But get back to me when I won't get sued for telling you what it is.

[Jane_Goth]

I found this cached copy from Doug's blog written in 2012. That said, his sister had to be quite a bit older than he was from the picture Jen posted of her on her blog. Something seems *off* though. I can't pinpoint what it is but it just doesn't add up in my mind.

The poor young man was only 18/19 when he died yet Doug makes him sound like a priggish young fogey of 30.

Also I know a few late teens, lovely people, but they are callow youths who are still discovering who they are. They do not have the experience or emotional maturity to be leaders or to putting the world to rights as equals with people in their 40s. It's possible that Michael was this wunderkid of calvinism or Doug Phillips (is a tool) is an emotionally stunted adult with no real idea what a mature person or idea sounds like.

Edited for clarity

[SamuraiKatz]

Read the "bombshell" expose at Jen's Gems. The woman excoriated in this article is as much a victim as her deceased brother. I also think she is being used as a scapegoat. I have more thoughts on this subject...and I will address them later.

One other quick thought. Hero and her family left BCA in January. Maybe Hero didn't realize Doug was having an emotional affair with her?

[Sobeknofret]

OK, just to make it crystal clear for folks picking this up in the middle-- Hero's brother is very much alive and well, afaik. The woman who went off the rails at BCA after her brother's death was not Hero, but the sister of Michael Billings, with whom Doug seems to have had a really rather creepy and inappropriate fixation.

T.W. Eston needs to step up his game if that's his "bombshell" :roll:

[hoipolloi]

It's possible that Michael was this wunderkid of calvinism or Doug Phillips (is a tool) is an emotionally stunted adult with no real idea what a mature person or idea sounds like.

Bingo.

You're kinder than me - I call Doug Phillips a sociopath.

At best, he may have narcissistic personality disorder: http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/narcis ... N=symptoms

[DomWackTroll]

Read the "bombshell" expose at Jen's Gems. The woman excoriated in this article is as much a victim as her deceased brother. I also think she is being used as a scapegoat. I have more thoughts on this subject...and I will address them later.

One other quick thought. Hero and her family left BCA in January. Maybe Hero didn't realize Doug was having an emotional affair with her?

THANK YOU!!! If Doug was trying to cover up something else, all he had to do was turn on the tears and say something like, "I've been having inappropriate thoughts about Hero for years now... And I think I saw a glimpse of ankle under her skirt... And I think I touched her elbow once... May God and My Dear Bride forgive me!" And then purposefully leak it and watch it distract from the real issue.

[DomWackTroll]

OK, just to make it crystal clear for folks picking this up in the middle-- Hero's brother is very much alive and well, afaik. The woman who went off the rails at BCA after her brother's death was not Hero, but the sister of Michael Billings, with whom Doug seems to have had a really rather creepy and inappropriate fixation.

T.W. Eston needs to step up his game if that's his "bombshell" :roll:

Oh, I think it is a bombshell-- just not in the way Eston thinks it's a bombshell. For people who were around Doug for years, he and Jen can be awfully blind about him.

[nokidsmom]

Yeah, can anyone explain to me why these people act like they're being monitored by the CIA, and like these "covenant contracts" mean anything? No church worth joining is going to care what some nutty cult says about you anyway.

Please understand that I'm not talking about kids who have been raised and brainwashed into this. I'm talking about grown adults who joined BCA and within months realized, "Hey, something's really wrong here." Well, just leave, FGS. "Process" it all later, but for now JUST LEAVE.

That's what amazing about these churches aka cults: how grown adults get sucked into this thinking about things like "covenant contracts" as being in any way binding and that they can only leave if the church leaders grant their "permission" like they are children who have to get permission from a parent. Another way that these groups infantilize their members. More patriarchal bs.

[Marian the Librarian]

And I don't doubt they did. But would an eighteen-year-old Peter Bradrick, standing outside the doors of a convention center in broad daylight, scare you because he was wearing a black suit? What is he going to do to you at a homeschooling convention in front of hundreds of people, beat you over the head with a copy of So Much More? Was anyone really afraid that Nathaniel Darnell would follow them back to their house and paw through their garbage for evidence of their sins? Does Caleb Hayden make a habit of threatening people in dark alleys?

Yes, Doug has hurt, exploited, and abused many, many people. But that doesn't change the fact that Jen Fishburne and "T.W. Eston" are very paranoid, unstable people who thrive on controversy and drama.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

[Palimpsest]

Let's assume TW's post is true for a second. Where was the compassion shown to that pregnant young girl that was slut shamed from the pulpit? I've been called out fro the pulpit as an adult, so I could only begin to imagine a scared young girl might feel like. I personally don't care who sleeps with whom and how often so long as everyone is of legal age. Doug's alleged compassion is not consistently delivered to his flock. I'm not heartless, and I'll admit I've done irrational things while grieving. But I have to wonder about the moral fiber of those around her. No one talks to her directly as far as we know. I see no confrontation from the members with respect to her behavior or compassion for her situation as you said earlier. Doug is still an asshole.

Of course, if none of this is true, or it's mostly false. That poor woman and her family. I hope she can defend herself.

I know I play devil's advocate way too much over Eston. I just dislike people assuming that he is trustworthy when I think he has a major axe to grind and is a patriarcal asshole himself. I doubt Doug has an ounce of real compassion in him.

So, yes, let's assume that everything TW said is true.

Doug Phillips has been tried in the court of public opinion and convicted of:

Blatant hypocrisy. He's publicly shamed women (and perhaps some men, but not so much because Jezebel) for sexual misdeeds when he's had an adulterous affair himself.

Clergy sexual abuse. He's grossly misused his position of power to have an adulterous affair with a young woman in his church. (Perhaps more than one woman. Perhaps not only women.)

Possible statutary rape: He (allegedly) began an affair with Hero when she was under the age of consent. In Texas the age of consent is 17. FYI -- the minimum age is 14 with an age differential of 3 years.

Double standards. He'll publicly shame some women for sexual misconduct but let this particular woman get away with it.

Allowing himself to be blackmailed by this woman. TW hints at this if not actually charging it.

Failing to maintain a safe workplace. This woman (allegedly) blatantly sexually harassed interns in their place of work and he did nothing to stop it.

Potentially turning a blind eye to and/or aided and abetted statutory rape. If the woman is over 20 (and she is) and she had sex with any person under the age of 17.

Spiritual abuse: He runs his cult in such a manner that people, even his co-Elders, find it impossible to stand up to him or leave the church.

That is just off the top of my head and I may think of more.

I have to come back to my misgivings, though. TW is leading a witch hunt here against Doug who richly deserves it. This woman has got caught up in it and is being publicly shamed by TW Eston. Of course, she may be horrible and guilty of all that TW accuses her of doing. However . . . flirting with men and failing to maintain "distance from men" may not be in the best of taste but are not crimes. An older married woman having consensual sex with an 18 year old may be adultery but is not a crime.

I also hate labeling women as cougars. There is still a double standard when it comes to women having relationships with younger men, even when the man is well over the age of consent.

[Bethie42]

"_____ was the oldest young man I ever met. At the age of seventeen, he was at least sixty years old. And by the time he reached nineteen he was a septuagenarian, spiritually, in his mind, in the way he walked. He was a mature man with a mature understanding of relationships, and while many young men were growing sloppy with age, _____ was growing more consistent in his personal piety. He was growing more ferocious in his desire to walk with holiness before the Lord."

This part stuck out at me in particular. It seems strange to favorably describe a young man as a septuagenarian 'in the way he walked'. Does that mean in his spiritual walk, maybe? I don't think it does.

The 'mature understanding of relationships' seems a little out of place. It appears to be linked with a comparison with other young men growing 'sloppy with age' in regards to personal piety. I would not personally describe someone's desire for God as ferocious but maybe that's just Doug for you!

I grew up with Vision Forum catalogs in the house, So Much More, Raising Maidens of Virtue, Beautiful Girlhood and Before You Meet Prince Charming. The teachings of patriarchy seriously screwed me up and I have been out of the belief system since I was 18, but 4 years later I am still dealing with the fallout and in counseling for it. I'd like to state my appreciation for Free Jinger as a forum and for the folks who post here! :)

[Want More Babies]

One also has to take into account what fundies think is inappropriate. For them, playful flirting on the part of a woman is a HUGE NO NO.

[LuvMeSumFundies]

Why did Doug allow J to "act out"?! Obviously she knew something that would possibly devastate "dapper Doug";) perhaps it explains his infatuation with the "spiritual son" M B..... Maybe he wasn't just a brother and mentee to these characters Doug and J.......

Something more is going on.... Alot more! I'm not sure that I trust Jen or Eston, either..... Bits of truth perhaps

[lemonhead]

I found this cached copy from Doug's blog written in 2012. That said, his sister had to be quite a bit older than he was from the picture Jen posted of her on her blog. Something seems *off* though. I can't pinpoint what it is but it just doesn't add up in my mind.

You know, I had a half-sibling that I didn't even know about as a kid. Any family relationships outside of the norm are often covered up or "reinvented" in fundieland due to shaming. It's possible this is something other than a sibling relationship.

[Evil Feminist]

This new story sounds SO bizarre and tabloidish.... I'm a little disappointed in the 'bombshell'

[Palimpsest]

Read the "bombshell" expose at Jen's Gems. The woman excoriated in this article is as much a victim as her deceased brother. I also think she is being used as a scapegoat. I have more thoughts on this subject...and I will address them later.

One other quick thought. Hero and her family left BCA in January. Maybe Hero didn't realize Doug was having an emotional affair with her?

ITA with the scapegoating.

Doug clarified that the relationship with Hero was physical in his second confession.